The sweet...followed shortly by the sour

Joined Aug 2005
4 Posts | 0+
Vancouver, WA
I just want to pitch this out since I'm new to the methods of cigar storage, and I'm sure there are some strong and valid opinions out there that are ready to be shared on the subject.

In recent weeks/months, I have ordered quite a few cigars from Cigar.com to fill my new desktop humidor. Since I have some established favorites, I did this to broaden my knowledge a little. Setting up the humidor wasn't difficult and I'm fairly certain I did it correctly (per included instructions - cross referenced to a dozen websites). I also upgraded to a digital hygrometer to minimize calibration issues and used 50/50 PG instead of straight distilled water. All was well for a few weeks...then things went bad...

Before I go any further, let me just say that I had good experiences with these cigars within the first few weeks of delivery, so I know that the problem I'm about to explain is undoubtedly linked to my handling/storage - albeit unidentifiable to me.

All of the cigars (C18, Dunhill, Romeo Y Julieta, Oliva, some real cheapies, etc.) have developed an awful, bitter taste that lingers on my lips (unlit) and completely destroys the flavor when smoked -reminds me a little of how alum would taste if combined with burning tobacco (perhaps irrelevant if you haven't had the pleasure of dealing with straight alum). I have been monitoring the RH and temperature regularly - the former holding 70% (+/- 1%) and the latter ranging from 68 degrees to 72 degrees.

The most common reason for a sour taste that I could find through research was over-humidification. I'm not ENTIRELY sure that my cigars have been at exactly 70% every minute of the day, but I haven't seen whacky spikes and I haven’t noticed soft/damp cigars. The only thing that leads me in this direction is an experience with a Cusano 18 I had recently. The first half was bitter when I smoked it, so I just set it down to extinguish. Out of curiosity, I relit it the next day and to my surprise, it tasted MUCH better. I had initially thought that sitting out at 50% RH and being half smoked may have dried it up, but as time passed, I abandoned this idea.

I know that cedar is employed almost everywhere cigars reside during their lifetime, but I’m beginning to wonder if the cedar is affecting the flavor (for me). All of the cigars I have smoked have been out of their cellophane (naked) in the humidor since arrival and I have had cedar wrapped cigars in the past that have tasted sour to me before (albeit excused as the coincidental “bad one” at the time). Because of this, I have initiated a little experiment that I hope will help rule out some things. I have set aside 4 cigars: 2 in humidor (1 in and 1 out of cello) and 2 in humidity controlled Tupperware (1 in and 1 out of cello). I’m so clueless at this point, I could be barking up the wrong tree.

If anyone has some feedback, it would be greatly appreciated. Perhaps I’m overlooking some simple, yet vital clue that could be the cause of all my problems.
 
maybe you have a fungus problem? the part of your post that is distressing to me is this "The first half was bitter when I smoked it, so I just set it down to extinguish. Out of curiosity, I relit it the next day and to my surprise, it tasted MUCH better" a relit cigar that has sat out over night makes me want to puke.
i dont really know what the problem could be.
 
Did you salt test your Hydrometer? Analog or Digital hydrometer? Analog hydrometer's can be off in some cases (but not limited to) 20+% + or -. That could mean your sticks are at 90% and not 70%.

Regards,
Paul
 
did you salt test the digital hygrometer. Even a digital can be off. It's not from the cedar unless there are chemicals someone spilled on the cedar. Sounds to me like your digi is off and your just over humidified.
 
Sorry, got distracted while writing that. Digital still needs calibrated. Depending on the quality of the digital, could have same issues.
 
More...

Yes, the hygro was salt tested. I know they can have some deviation, but how much variation in RH could cause this particular problem?

Yes, relights generally taste like "puke" and I don't make a habit of it. My point really was that the flavor quality I find in C18s was completely obliterated by the bitter, and after the relight the bitter was gone - revealing something that more closely resembled a non-bitter C18 (I can at least identify the bad flavors generated from a relight and still not taste the bitter). Everything rests on "Better" being relative, admittedly.

The name may imply that I'm an "idiot" or I'm "foolish", but it was really a reference to something entirely different (no, not the Lone Ranger). Perhaps it's apt under the circumstances – I did ask the question while admitting that I was ignorant on the subject (gotta learn somewhere and sometime).
 
Relatively speaking, this shouldn't appear unless it's been going on for some time keeping in mind it takes cigars in and about 2 weeks to make any adjustment up or down. This is why you will hear many people not getting overly excited with fluctuations for a short period of time. Heat is usually your worst enemy for the fear of beetles, but over humidification usually cause poor burns or no burn, canoeing, and in long term can cause this sourness you speak of. If it was under a month, I can't with confidence say it's over humidification. Are the wrappers bubling, distorting at all? Are the feet larger then normal? Any slight cracking at the foot of the cigar that may be from swelling? These are usually tell tale signs of over humidification.

Anyone else have something I missed? Or am I worng anywhere?

Paul
 
hmm i did smoke a cigar out in the blazing heat the other day and it tasted like junk. This is a cigar i have smoked tons of and love. Something about the outside temp and humidity completely ruined the stick. Just throwing it out....
 
The American Potawatomi translation for Tonto is "wild one", which is more positive than the Spanish translation.
 
just adding.... maybe something you are eating or drinking during or before smokeing? chewing gum etc...
 
I'm taking a wild stab at this with my woodworking knowledge and not cigar knowledge so bear with me... Take a very close look at the cedar. Does it appear to be leaking or "crying." Some cedar just isn't good cedar and its pores clog with its own moisture/sap. If this occurs, it probably wouldn't absorb the humidity as readily. and this might even have saturated into your cigars. Or it could be as simple as you not having your humidor filled properly. It can't be too full otherwise the air won't circulate and the bottom cigars will be drier than the top ones.
 
Not a bad thought quagmire. If the humidor was an inexpensive humidor this could be possible, though in most humidors the spanish cedar is kiln dried, which cooks all the sap out of the wood. That was my understanding, though I could be misinformed.
 
I have personally never seen it in a humidor but I know of supposedly kiln dried cedar that had it. Who makes the humidor or where did you get it? This happens in laminates too so it doesn't even have to be natural. It could be a chemical glue. I'm just going to say the sticks are ruined and to empty the humidor, let it sit open and reseason the humidor and this time use only Boveda packs or beads.

Could the glycol have leaked? I wonder what that would do.
 
That could be it. Did you overfill your humidification device? Did you let it sit after filling it to make sure that it wasn't going to drip? If it did happen to drip onto the cigars it will ruin the flavor not to mention that it isn't very good for your health.
 
iminaquagmire said:
Could the glycol have leaked? I wonder what that would do.

Propalene Glycol is very sweet tasting, much like anti-freeze(ethalene glycol), but not nearly as toxic as anti-freeze. In fact propalene glycol is used as a perservative in some ingestible items, just very small doses.
 
Thank you for all the input. I'll see what I can answer.

I thought that I was eating/drinking something prior and that was influencing the flavor, but I haven't found ANY pattern in what I consume immediately before smoking.

My humidifier has always sat for a good 30 minutes after refilling so as to avoid dripping. I thought about this problem, but as someone pointed out, propylene glycol is sweet to the taste (as is ethylene glycol - pets love it). PG is food grade though, and is used in consumables all the time. With that said, I wouldn't want to drink or smoke any of it if I don't have to.

The cedar looks fine - assuming "crying" would be obvious to the inexperienced eye. The humidor isn't top of the line, but it isn't super cheap.

I have cleared everything out of it at this point, but I probably won't use it again - no use throwing good money after bad. I'll just return to the buy-it-before-you-smoke-it routine and save myself the grief and the money.

Thanks again for the brainstorm.