The Classic Cask 18 Year Old Bourbon. Houston, we . . .

[Bloofington]

have a problem.

NO, NOT with the flavor of the bourbon. :neer:

:neer: umpkin: :neer:

HA, HA, made ya look, made ya look,
Inside ya mutha's pocketbook!!! :cryinlaugh: :neer:






:sm_angel:

Okay Bloof, you made us look inside our mother's pocketbooks.

:dunno: :duh: :duh:

I picked up a bottle of The Classic Cask 18 Year Old Bourbon Thursday night, trying deperately to escape a city I had been working and running around in since Wednesday afternoon. NYC is one place I don't like to be on St. Patrick's Day, and I got a generous helping of them on the 9:02 on Track 37 headed out of town last night. They were remarkably well behaved. Not like the years before Giuliani, when stuff could get out of hand.

I had picked up this treat from one of my favorite labels at Astor Wines, a newly discovered haven of my favorite whiskeys for a "walk-out price" of $65.16. I also got to have my first tasting last night after arriving home and getting settled. My initial impression is that it will be competitive for at least a Top 10 spot, and is quite the cousin of it's 20 year old version, which already sits at No. 3 on my Top 25. That one performed the almost unheard of feat of edging out Booker's for a spot on my list. Booker's stayed at No. 3 for a LONG time.

As for my little opening joke, the "problem" is in the typing on the label. And trust me, I can tell that these are computerized, laser printed labels. The Classic Cask has a very striking, if demure and odd looking label presentation. The labels for each batch probably come in sheets and The Classic Cask probably has formats for which they type the dates, batch nos. etc., into a program and it prints out in the exact spot it's supposed to. The labels are subsequently affixed to each bottle.

We're all familiar with simply formatted, laser printer labels that companies use for many purposes, including shipping. Familiar typefaces, the company logo. The Classic Cask has a very wonderful way of incorporating information into their labels that an experienced hobbyist like me is interested in. So, I have no complaint. But what I have a problem with is that there's been a mistake on this bottle's label, which gives rise to questions as to what it actually is.

:cryinlaugh:

The Classic Cask is quite literal in their labeling. On the empty bottle of my 20 year old bourbon, it says it was distilled in 1983 and bottled in 2004. The reason it doesn't say 21 years old is because bourbon is usually distilled late in the year and bottled early in the year. The bourbon was actually probably about 20 years and a few months old, but it's not allowed to be called 21 until at least it's 21st birthday.

But this bottle of supposedly 18 year old bourbon says distilled 1981 and bottled in 2003, which would make it at LEAST 21 years old if we go by what I said in the above paragraph.

SO, either The Classic Cask has just released an unnanounced product, a 21 year old bourbon, or somebody typed 1981 instead of 1984 into the computer program that spits out their labels. OR, as my Sensei, Master Whiskey 13th (out of 12 Dans) Dan, our own Hollowe Pointe, The Whiskey Dogg Detective taught me once, . . .

sometimes they finish aging it a certain amount of time and put it into stainless steel holding tanks until an undetermined future bottling date, which could be YEARS hence. :wink:

For now, it's The Classic Cask 18 year old bourbon, vying for a lofty spot on my Top 25.

 

[Hollow Point]

I thought we covered this before.

It could be an error on their part but it's certainly possible that it is 21 years old. As long as they don't slip up and put dates that = less than 18 years old there is NO PROBLEM, even with Whitney HOUSTON!

Remember the VWFR 13 year old Rye is about 19 years old currently... the Sazerac Rye 18 year old 2004 release is distilled in Spring (I believe) 1984, bottled in Fall 2004 = 20+ years.

 

[The Colonel]

On the bright side, you don't drink the label.

 

[Bloofington]

Well, they should say what it is, so I know what I'm talking about. If it's 21 years old, say so. :grumble:

They probably just typed the label wrong. That's the first time I've ever seen that with them. I expect numeric precision with The Classic Cask. :grumble:

 

[Hollow Point]

Well you have to also consider what MIGHT be more practical on their behalf.

If they have decided to make the 18 year old a standard (continuous) product in their line - I can see this NOT being an error on their behalf. If they plan to keep releasing items sporatically putting the age as is then this is more likely a mistake.

The disadvantage to the AS IS technique is (1) it requires special (finite) labels, (2) it can require product registration per state etc. If you call it the already registered / labeled 18 year old (no matter that it's 50 years old!) you don't need to jump through any annual legal W~hoops - There It Is!
:idea:

 

[Bloofington]

I know, I know. And I know we covered this already. :grumble: :sm_angel:

If you've ever seen a label on ANY The Classic Cask product (and I think you have), you'll know that these labels are not static (or finite), they are done at the time of the bottling. Either they are run through a laser printer, or put into typewriters and very precisely lined up. That way they can put the exact information on every bottle. And believe me, they DO. I've been through many bottles of their stuff, including having two unopened bottles of the 22 year old rye a few feet away from me. The only thing not finite is the bottle number. They always WRITE that in.

In other words, I don't think they'd put anything but the exact age according to their figuring and numbering methods, because their operation is obviously flexible and simplified enough to give numeric accuracy. Every single bottle I've ever purchased of one of their bourbons or ryes was very precise, and made numeric sense. There's none of that oh, it SAYS 13 years old but it's really taken from some barrels that were 33 years old, a few that were 13 years old, one that was 17 years old, and another barrel from 1791 found in Mt. Vernon under George Washington's old house.

The Classic Cask is very literal and precise with batch Nos., distillation and bottling dates, and I'm sure they MEANT to type 1984 instead of 1981 on the label. I'm going to find out how to contact them about this. Maybe that lady you referred me to knows who to talk to. She's not showing the 18 year old, and the 20's are labeled properly, so I couldn't prove it to her unless I bring my bottle. I'll get to the bottom of this but I've got a lot happening in my life right now. I'm hopping around like a frog on a griddle lately with ever changing work situations, plus I took a bad fall recently.

If The Whiskey Dogg Detective will not investigate this, then his trusty Blond(e) Assistante will. :grumble: umpkin: :sm_angel:

 

[Hollow Point]

The first question is was there any change in plans recently? I haven't investigated anything but I do notice that a lot of the distribution chain has indeed switched recently with Classic Cask - that's why one store carries the ___ but has never seen or heard of the ___ etc. In fact here I see their product in competing distributor's listings - that usually doesn't happen unless changes have occured and one hasn't finished phasing out the remaining product.

From what I understand the 22 year old Rye is DONE (maybe hold on to those). I think there will be a continuous 19 or 21 year old (I forget).

Here let's look at something else here just for comparison purposes. Are you aware that Jefferson Reserve no longer (as of about 4 or 5 months now) states that the whiskey is 15 years old? They now say for consistency they are using 12-17 year old whiskey. What I think is they hope you figure that inbetween 12 and 17 is 14-15... :roll:

To me the real truth is they can't gaurantee as to the availability of 15 year old whiskey on the future market... The best they can gaurantee is suitable for the immediate future is 12 year old whiskey on an ongoing basis. :idea:

Ok if the Classic Cask is moving towards an (on-going) product -which based on certain noticed changes - this could very well be the case... then the age issue you raised can unfortunately make sense. If they make a label that will be consistent as far as the age goes (such as 18 ) then they need to gaurantee that they will have whiskey AT LEAST 18 years or older available CONTINUOUSLY.

Hence they may have 21 year old whiskey suitable right now, but may only feel comfortable gauranteeing that they can turn out 18 year old whiskey year in and year out. Again I point to the Sazerac Rye this year... They could have changed the label and theme (for some additional $$$) registering it as Sazerac Rye 20, but it's not worth it imho.

The above tactics seem more common with warehousers to bottlers - in other words those that don't actually distill and produce whiskey but instead purchase and store it or bottle it from an established distillery.

 

[Bloofington]

Gotcha!!! Yeah, I can dig it. Now I see the whole picture you're trying to describe. Heyyyyy, I know it took four tries but you're addressing a blond(e) here. :cryinlaugh:

And by the way, I was flying through a perusal of web sites the other day and I DID think I saw something pertaining to the Jefferson's Reserve as being of an unspecified age. I wondered about it, but wasn't able to follow up at the time. SO, that means there are changes in the works to my No. 18 bourbon too.

Also good advice on the Classic Cask 22 year old rye. Since the bourbon/rye season will be closing down soon, I'm thinking of not opening either one of those bottles until football season. I've got three bottles of stuff I'm working on right now, including a just opened bottle of Fighting "That Certain Part Of A Man's Body." I may open up a bottle of Jim Beam Black or Baker's before the season ends but that's it.

I just finished a bottle of Pappy's 20 and special bottling of the new Pappy's 15, both gotten from "someone." The other bottle of each will also wait until football season.

 

[Bloofington]

Oh, I MAY have seen the change on the Jefferson's Reserve when I went to Astor Wines the other day to get The Classic Cask 18. I know I saw it somewhere.