# Forum Members' Pipe: Are you IN w/ this pipe?



## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

If we get enough YES votes, lets send the details off to Johs and get cooking on this baby. We're still shooting for that "around hundred bucks, but it'd be nice if it was under, mark".

*The shape up for consideration:* Johs unique bent apple. Pictured below.

*The finish:* Strong preference for smooth. [testing the price waters here]

*The stem:* NO acrylic ferrule (that middle piece) BLACK saddle stem

*The stamping:*
Johs [ in script ]
HAND MADE
IN DENMARK
PUFF 2009
[ the number in the series example: 1/18 ]

This is approximately the size we'd be asking him to shoot for. These specs are from the pipe pictured below.


> Length: 5.10 in./129.54 mm.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Commander Quan (May 6, 2003)

Do you have a closing date for this? I think that's a great shape, but can't commit till after xmas. 

Also just throwing this out there, do we want to make this a 2009 pipe or a 2010? It really doesn't matter either way I'm just thinking out loud.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

I voted "No", but that was because I've really never liked that particular shape. 

However, if the price point is as stated, "around a hundred" I might get one for the curio value as a forum pipe.

Can we have it read "CS/puff 2009???


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

Commander Quan said:


> Do you have a closing date for this? I think that's a great shape, but can't commit till after xmas.
> 
> Also just throwing this out there, do we want to make this a 2009 pipe or a 2010? It really doesn't matter either way I'm just thinking out loud.


I'm going to let this poll go for a week because I know some people don't log in every day. 2009 or 2010 doesn't matter to me.

I don't know when money will change hands at this point, but I'm sure Johs would require $ in hand before he starts carving and stamping pipes for us. Make it a Christmas gift to yourself.


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

You know I am in!


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## Pugsley (Jul 12, 2009)

I voted yes. I like that apple but I'm not married to it, I'll buy the pipe regardless of the final choice. I do, however, think it would be a good idea to put off the purchase until after the Festival of Consumerism is over. Many people are stretched a little thin at this time of year.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

Pugsley said:


> I voted yes. I like that apple but I'm not married to it, I'll buy the pipe regardless of the final choice. I do, however, think it would be a good idea to put off the purchase until after the Festival of Consumerism is over. Many people are stretched a little thin at this time of year.


There's no reason that wouldn't work. I imagine it'll take awhile to make so many pipes, anyhow. So the official purchase can wait a little bit.


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## Blaylock-cl (Apr 28, 2006)

I'd like to see a prototype of the apple shape at the $100 price point first. Some of his "apple" shapes in the $80 range don't look the same as the one pictured above in the $150 range.

Why a black stem? I think we should shoot for something similar to the one in the picture...at least that color. It goes much better with the wood grain in the pipe than the black, IMO.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

The idea was to go simple on the stem to help keep costs down, and focus our dollars on the briar. The other things I see helping in that regard are the bowl height (just over two inches, large but not Giant) and the discount we should get for a group buy.

I know the other apple shapes you're talking about, and I don't want one of those either. I want this one. I know it can't be exact, but it should be damn close. If he can make X number of these close to the pictured shape, his word is good enough for me. But yeah, I wouldn't just say, "bent apple, please" and take whatever.

Personally, I'd be fine with a sandblast or partial sandblast too. I'm wide open on stains as well.


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## David M (Mar 11, 2009)

Wow. This happened kind of quick no?

How much time was spent discussing the shape? 1-2 days?

I know it's gonna be difficult to get to a big agreement but it seems like a little more effort at least in the 'democracy dept.' would be helpful.

Maybe we will be able to bring it down to 3-5 shapes that get significant mention and at that point we can have a vote and have it happen nice and proper.

What do you guys think?


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

Think of my 'no' vote not as a rejection of the shape (I actually like it) but as sort of a 'whoa...slow down' vote.


I'm curious about something, though: what's the point of numbering the pipes? We're trying to get pipes that are pretty much identical and then we're going to purposely differentiate them? I don't get it. Marking it with the year and organization is great, but I just don't understand the numbering. Enlighten me!


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## David M (Mar 11, 2009)

MarkC said:


> Marking it with the year and organization is great, but I just don't understand the numbering. Enlighten me!


Thats a good point.
If it costs extra maybe we should reconsider and focus the NRG on the "Group Branding"


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## michwen (Oct 9, 2008)

Darn, i red the question wrong, i voted yes when i mean NO, i´m not in with* this* pipe!!!:banghead:
That is because i really, really dont like this shape.


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

I honestly don't know if I'd be in on any pipe but this shape definitely doesn't do it for me, especially if its in a smooth finish. But don't lose any sleep over my opinion. I voted no but that doesn't necessarily mean I think we should go back to the ol' drawing board. Like I said, I'm probably not going to be in on this anyway.


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## Habanolover (Feb 22, 2006)

David M said:


> Wow. This happened kind of quick no?
> 
> How much time was spent discussing the shape? 1-2 days?
> 
> ...


I agree. I would rather it take a little longer and we get something that all the participants agree on. While I happen to think the shape is very nice I had to vote no because of the above reason.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

madurolover said:


> I agree. I would rather it take a little longer and we get something that all the participants agree on. While I happen to think the shape is very nice I had to vote no because of the above reason.


That's a nice idea, but total agreement just isn't going to happen. Even if we went with the obvious pipe-designed-by-committee, a straight brown-stained billiard, there'd be "no" votes and detractors. Like me, for one. It's impossible to find something we'd all agree on. I bet a good number of people will bow out because Boswell or Wiley didn't win.

I think this poll provides total involvement. Voting "no" is just the same as voting for a different shape -- in fact it's a much more powerful vote because it pools everyone who wants something else into one voice - not dividing them into three additional camps. This way there's a chance we might actually get this thing moving. This project is dragging ass, so I thought it clearly needed at _an opportunity_ to cut to the chase. At every turn people have had the opportunity to express themselves and sway others. How much more "feeling out" does this process need? We'll have to stamp the pipes 2011.:rotfl:

If this shape doesn't fly, we should do the same thing again with another shape, I think.


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

I did vote yes on this shape but perhaps we are moving a bit too fast. While I love this shape and it will get my vote regardless, narrowing it down to 3 or 4 possibilities would be best and then holding a poll for those.


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## dj1340 (Mar 30, 2009)

I have no problem with any of the shapes discussed. So that makes it easy for me, stems are no problem either. I do have some favorites but enjoy most any style.


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## Blaylock-cl (Apr 28, 2006)

33 members said that they would purchase a POY at $125 and under.

Johs seems to be the artist of choice.

Members can post their favorite style(s) within a period of time. Narrow it down to 3 and take a vote. This assumes that these can be made by the artist in this price range.

Once a style is chosen, select a finish or offer choices...rusticated, sandblasted, smooth (prices may vary a bit). 
Pick a stem and see a prototype of the pipe along with a stamp.

I've seen other forum POYs with the Forum name (Puff), Year (2010) and the Artist. That's it. No number or Made in _______ .

You really need to limit the choices within a period of time, find out what the artist can do at the price point, see a prototype w/ stamp and go with it.

There are many example of the artist's pipes at these two sites:
Johs Pipes
Johs Pipes at Smoking Pipes .com

Just my opinion.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

HAND MADE IN DENMARK is part of Johs standard stamp.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

I would think that instead of asking for members to post their favorite styles, which could be dozens of choices, follow the logic that naturally presents. A price point of $125 was positively received; Johs has a seeming consensus as the maker of this pipe. Now get that maker to tell us what styles can be had for that price point and then start the eliminating.

The problem I see right now is that a NO vote in this poll versus a yes vote means what? "If we get enough YES votes" does that mean the total of NO votes is irrelevant? 

How many is enough? If only 33 said they would purchase at $125 or under, do we need 33 YES, or just 17, or is it 22, YES votes?

Could a completed POY design be presented and asked for votes with a sufficiency reestablished?

IMHO, as always and YMMV!!!


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

Beats me. The 33 from the interest poll was well before the maker was even decided. Naturally some are not going to want in now, and yet others who didn't vote may now want in.

I'm not big on the idea of the maker choosing the shapes for us. That's like blindly writing a check to a car dealership and letting them choose the model and color for us. If you browse through Johs' pipes on smokingpipes or at iwan reis you can get an idea of shape and dollar. That said, from my extensive browsing and using google to search for past pipes at smokingpipes that are no longer posted, anything that is not a Johs Giant is very likely in our price range. His smooth billiards are very approximately priced with his outstanding freehands.


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

Did Johs say what can be had for under $125? Why not outright ask about shape, ferrule, stain, rustication, markings? While I agree with Drastic that not all will come to agreement no matter the shape, some sort of a consensus would be nice. I just think catalog shapes are a bit boring but I would really smoke anything. We could get custom cobs with Puff 2010 carved on the side with a butcher knife and I would cradle it like a baby.


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## David M (Mar 11, 2009)

Fellow puffers,

Let's all agree on a few basics that come with the territory of this great idea.

We will not be able to make everyone happy. Thats a fact.
Pugsley said it best earlier...

Pugsley Said:
"This, after all, is going to be a limited edition pipe and I would prefer that it not look like 5 other pipes in my rack. This is the time for something a little more bold, something that will truly stand apart from the others."

That comment, I fully agree with and it makes it easier for me to even consider this venture because the pipe will be "special" with these special characteristics. This pipe goes beyond "ME" and enters the land of My Group Pipe With Fellow Pipers. Whenever I reach for it, it will have "PUFF.com" and everything it means to me, associated with it. I can live with that and accept that this pipe is going to be different.

So hopefully we can agree that we wont be able to make everyone happy and we should lower our high standards and personal demands for finding the perfect shape. It may be the bent apple, it may be something else. Let's just have a few more voices heard.

So far we have had the following shapes have received 2 or more mentions.

Bent Dublin


Bent Bulldog


Bent Apple


Lets give a week or so for all of the ideas that people have to come out. Lets try and track which shapes get the most positive responses and then after our time is over, let's list all those shapes and take a vote on the shape.

Whatever shape gets the most votes, just like we did to decide which carver gets our vote, thats what we will pick.

I am throwing another vote in for the Bent Dublin, even though I could live with any of these shapes.

Then we move to Finish Voting.
Then we move to Branding Voting.
Then we place the order.


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## David M (Mar 11, 2009)

rlaliberty said:


> We could get custom cobs with Puff 2010 carved on the side with a butcher knife and I would cradle it like a baby.


I get an image of a teddybear like pipe that we go to sleep with when you say that.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

rlaliberty said:


> Did Johs say what can be had for under $125? Why not outright ask about shape, ferrule, stain, rustication, markings? While I agree with Drastic that not all will come to agreement no matter the shape, some sort of a consensus would be nice. I just think catalog shapes are a bit boring but I would really smoke anything. We could get custom cobs with Puff 2010 carved on the side with a butcher knife and I would cradle it like a baby.


rlaliberty, Bear wrote:


> I talked to Mogens *[Johs]* and he feels like it shouldn't be an issue to bring in the pipes at (or under) the $100 price point. He asked if anyone had sketched out what the club would desires, as far as shape, what size (rendered in mm). Johs said he can do the pipe for about $100, either working with our drawings, or just using his interpretation of a desired shape.


For everyone else questioning numbering and finishes, this too has been covered:


> On the matter of finish, I told him that we may ask for smooth, sandblasted or, if the pipe's aesthetic would naturally lend itself to the process, a partial blast (think a quarter bent rhodesian with blast below the bead and smooth above). For the sake of uniformity, spot rustication was unacceptable. I also told him, if he were awarded the commission, that we would like the pipes individually numbered.


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

drastic_quench said:


> For everyone else questioning numbering and finishes, this too has been covered:


Covered? The pipes will be numbered because you wanted it that way isn't really much of an explanation. I'm not trying to stir up an argument here, I would just prefer a better explanation of the point of numbering. I mean, it gives some lucky guy the bragging rights of having pipe #1, but I don't see what else it accomplishes.


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## Stench (Aug 17, 2009)

I like this pipe, but can we do a poll with all the shapes mentioned in the other thread to better see the desires of the majority?


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

Did no one mention any straight pipes? I feel like there should at least be a polling option of something straight just to be fair. As for the numbering issue, I am indifferent. if Johs wants to number them, that is fine with me. If we ask him not to and he is content with it, then I am fine with it. i don't really see the point but again, I don't need to.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

drastic_quench said:


> Beats me.


 Really. then why post the poll if you yourself have no clue what the required numbers are to make the decision?? This poll was posted with the following conditional statement,



drastic_quench said:


> If we get enough YES votes, lets send the details off to Johs and get cooking on this baby.


Now, you don't know what constitutes "enough"? But, you are ready to "get cooking" with no established criteria.



drastic_quench said:


> I'm not big on the idea of the maker choosing the shapes for us. That's like blindly writing a check to a car dealership and letting them choose the model and color for us.


Didn't say, hint, or suggest that. I said



> Now get that maker to tell us what styles can be had for that price point and then start the eliminating.


Not the same as you say, no blank check at all. Merely a wise shopper asking what can be had for this price point.


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

Plexiprs, I am not sure he was referring to you with that 2nd statement from the bottom. Someone else did state that as an option. 

Just trying to keep the peace....


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

MarkC said:


> Covered? The pipes will be numbered because you wanted it that way isn't really much of an explanation. I'm not trying to stir up an argument here, I would just prefer a better explanation of the point of numbering. I mean, it gives some lucky guy the bragging rights of having pipe #1, but I don't see what else it accomplishes.


That's what Bear Graves wrote on this forum. He asked Johs about it; that's what Johs responded with. It is a very nice idea. This is a limited series -- just like if you've ever bought a limited print from an artist; they're numbered. It doesn't matter what number you get. The point is that it is one of, say, 25.

And, plexiprs you can try to make me out as the big mean ole boss of this thing - the guy who's throwing his weight around, but here's the straight dope:

I'm just the guy who volunteered to start a few threads, get some polls going, and try to organize an idea into a reality in short order. I'm not here to step on toes. This is a cool idea, but without a decent pace and direction, you know what this is - and this is really funny - A PIPE DREAM.

I offered to bow out of this role before:
http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...-pipe-nominate-pipe-makers-2.html#post2742593
But nobody stepped in to pick up the slack, and predictably the project stalled. But it's still not my show; I just volunteered. And now I've got an inbox filling up with kind messages from members thanking me for taking the initiative to with this project.

Smart shopping is key. So, just like I wrote before, browsing Johs' page on smokingpipes gives us a clear understanding of what can be hand for what price, and that's before you factor in a group discount. Then, there's Bear's conversation with Mogens, where he clearly states that he can hit our price point. The MOST expensive Johs pipes there are all Giants, and they're only $128. We're not even asking for a Giant. I know, because this particular pipe was sold at smokingpipes and not listed as a Giant, plus, looking at the specs for size and stamping, it's not a giant. So why would we ask questions we already have the answers to with the absolute minimum amount of detective work. Johs makes fantastic pipes with superb styling in all finishes - including smooth - routinely for under a $100. What more do we need to know from him?

If we get "enough" YES votes - and you want an exact number, so right out of my ass... 25! What's the worst that could happen if we send this off to Mogens? There's no reason to believe that any shape in any discussion couldn't meet our price point given ALL the evidence. But for some bizarrely unpredictable reason, if it doesn't, BIG DEAL! We re-group and revise.

I should have been a dentist, with all this teeth pulling...


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## Habanolover (Feb 22, 2006)

Let's all settle down guys. 

I am sure that we can come up with something that we can all be pleased with. As far as the numbering goes, I don't see how it matters one way or the other unless it is going to put us over our price point. Hell, if they are numbered i will take the one with the highest number.


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## David M (Mar 11, 2009)

Were getting a bit off topic.

Back to basics. Pipe Shapes and selecting which one we like.

People should continue to chime in with whatever they would like our group to consider for "Our Pipe".

Toss in not just a name please, but a pictures as well. A picture is as always, 1000 words.

This is very easy and we will get to the simple place where we will have several shapes to choose from and we will then select one. Very very easy. Lets not make it out to be more difficult than it is.

There are a bunch of websites out there fellas with Johs pipes. Whatever you are looking and like, please make sure its under $100. Then post the picture of the shape you would like us all to consider.

Results for PIPES!!:JOHS PIPES

Johs Pipes at Smoking Pipes .com

JOHS Pipes

Johs Pipes - Iwan Ries & Co. Chicago's Pipe and Tobacco Store

JOHS PIPES

Now let's put a timeline on this Shape Evaluation process.
The more time means the more people get to see this and the more people can then hopefully participate.

At the same time we cant do this forever so how about 10 days then huh?
On December 16th, we tally up all the pipe shapes that were mentioned and we will focus on having at least 5 shapes to choose from. The 5 shapes that get the most votes in this thread, in the pick a shape thread, those 5 shapes will go to the Voting Polls.

Simple enough?

Drastic has been doing a great job of taking the bull by the horns and I nominate that we keep him in charge and doing his thing with these guidelines for all of us being able to participate.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

I was creating the next poll while you were posting that. Hopefully it's inclusive enough -- if not, there's an option for that too. I included just about everything he does that I found - including style variations, like the thick, masculine dublin and acorn vs the more slender and elegant takes he also does.

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...s-pipe-throwdown-choose-multiple-options.html


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

drastic_quench said:


> And, plexiprs you can try to make me out as the big mean ole boss of this thing - the guy who's throwing his weight around, but here's the straight dope:


I am not trying to make you into anything, you do that without my external assistance. I am holding you, and others, to being accurate and correct. Funny, how the actual facts seem to eventually, always,slip away.

Yes, you volunteered. So shut-up and do the best possible job that you can and satisfy as many people as you possibly can. :wink: If you didn't realize that was a difficult task before you accepted it, well, then shame on you. Yes, it is a uncomfortable and unforgiving job trying to satisfy an entire forum. But, it was not required of you; the forum was doing just fine without a Pipe of The Year.

Other forums have done it. They stand as testament that it isn't easy, isn't popular, until it is over and done, only then does everyone thank whomever organized and pulled all the required teeth to get it done. By then, that poor soul is drooling and babbling and swearing to never utter a word again ... :wink:

It is after all, only an internet forum. Keep thy panties unwadded, your sense of perspective in place, and realize that no one can please everyone. I know this effort you undertook sucks, as I was involved in a similar forum-related project that finally imploded because everyone demanded satisfaction. Hell, I'd probably buy one of whatever was offered even if not one poll was posted or thread developed over a POTY. You'd be surprised how many other would as well. You are doing a good job. But, a good job isn't immune to external criticism .... Now, get on with it!!! :wink:

DQ, your effort is appreciated. Just realize that every single move, step, choice, selection will be scrutinized, debated and bitched about. But I at least recognize the effort and appreciate what you are doing and have done. That don't mean I'm cutting any slack, though!!


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

Most people that wink at me that much buy me a drink first.


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

rlaliberty said:


> Plexiprs, I am not sure he was referring to you with that 2nd statement from the bottom. Someone else did state that as an option.
> 
> Just trying to keep the peace....


Yeah, that was me, on a different thread. I didn't expect it to fly, just thought I'd throw it out there. After all, the man's an artist, and I like the idea of an artist creating what he's inspired to create rather than what his patron insists he create. But I fully understand the opposite viewpoint, and would imagine that the vast majority agree with it.


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

drastic_quench said:


> That's what Bear Graves wrote on this forum. He asked Johs about it; that's what Johs responded with. It is a very nice idea. This is a limited series -- just like if you've ever bought a limited print from an artist; they're numbered. It doesn't matter what number you get. The point is that it is one of, say, 25.


Well, obviously it's a limited edition since there aren't that many of us. I don't see why a number is needed to explain that. I understand you like the idea, I just don't see the point. And a commissioned pipe is not "just like" a limited edition print. But this is a silly side issue; obviously we disagree on this, and just as obviously, it doesn't really matter for the discussion at hand.


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

drastic_quench said:


> But it's still not my show; I just volunteered. And now I've got an inbox filling up with kind messages from members thanking me for taking the initiative to with this project.


I appreciate what you're doing as well; I hope the act of discussing the project doesn't offend you.

As for the occasional comment about whether or not Johs can meet our price, I agree. All it takes is a little research to discover that he can meet it or beat it quite easily.

Edited to add:

If any comments I've made in this process seem to be snarking at you, PLEASE chalk this up to poor communication skills on my part; no disrespect was intended.


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## rlaliberty (Jul 6, 2008)

MarkC said:


> Yeah, that was me, on a different thread. I didn't expect it to fly, just thought I'd throw it out there. After all, the man's an artist, and I like the idea of an artist creating what he's inspired to create rather than what his patron insists he create. But I fully understand the opposite viewpoint, and would imagine that the vast majority agree with it.


I think its a really cool idea from an aesthetic standpoint as well but I am definitely not surprised at all that others don't agree with us.


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## michwen (Oct 9, 2008)

drastic_quench said:


> Most people that wink at me that much buy me a drink first.


:beerchug: Great job, DQ!


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

drastic_quench said:


> Most people that wink at me that much buy me a drink first.


Dude, you deserve far more than a single, solitary drink. When this gets over, consider your own personalized "Lost Weekend."

Carry on, you doing what needs doing. Never popular during the doing, but we do see the effort given.

:first:​


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## Davetopay (Jan 19, 2008)

I have grown tired of the back and forth of all of this.....(on edit: it is late and I am enjoying a beer.....or several beers) LOL

Right now, from what we have been given to choose from, I like the big apple shape. It would be the most unique thing in my rack to date. 

Aside from that, we need to keep in mind that if we can have a large number of people buy in on the inaugural Puff.com POY, it can help draw attention to the project in the future. This would result in more people participating, and possibly an even better deal being worked out with the maker of the second annual pipe.


Now, too make my position clear....

1. $125.00 or less

2. hopefully some stamping as a POY

3. tell me when to pay for it

As long as it isn't some horrible abortion of a pipe, proportionally speaking, I'm in.


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## ShamWow (Jan 17, 2009)

I voted no simply because the shape doesn't "grab" me. However, if this is what is finally decided on, I will still support this effort and purchase a pipe....as long as the price point is reached. Thank you to all involved for making this happen.

Ed


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

ShamWow said:


> I voted no simply because the shape doesn't "grab" me. However, if this is what is finally decided on, I will still support this effort and purchase a pipe....as long as the price point is reached. Thank you to all involved for making this happen.
> 
> Ed


This poll is dead. See the current poll where this shape is winning:
http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-pipe-forum/261577-forum-members-pipe-shape-vote.html


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