# B&M Etiquette



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

My intent here is start a "living thread", so feel free to offer your own 'do's-and-don'ts', or ask any question you might have as how to navigate the world of ye olde brick and mortar cigar shoppe.

Here goes...

1) Never touch, pick up, fondle, squeeze, sniff, or otherwise manhandle any cigar in a shop you do not intend to buy. Even if you did wash your hands, you're the only one who knows you washed your hands and even if you did wash your hands, your hands are still covered in staff and oils. Don't do it!

2) Never smoke in a shop's walk in humidor. If the whole shop is a walk in humidor, chances are it's fine. However, if no one else is smoking, ASK.

3) Never assume it's okay to 'smoke what ya brung'. If you're going to smoke a cigar you brought with you (many reasons for this including preferred rh), always buy something and again, ASK.

4) If your shop has a band jar (many shops collect bands) and what you brung happens to be Cuban, NEVER toss a Cuban band in their jar. In fact, if you've asked and received the thumbs up to smoke what ya brung and what ya brung is Cuban, remove the band before you fire up and put it in your pocket. If what ya brung is Cuban, you're the only one who should know it's Cuban. If asked by someone you don't know well, lie. If you live outside the US, ignore this completely.

5) Never try to 'educate' the errant owner, or register jockey. While they're often wrong about many things, don't think you're doing them a favor by setting them straight. All you're doing is identifying yourself as a pompous know-it-all and creating resentment.

6) Never discuss another source for purchasing cigars. I can't tell you how many times I've heard someone in a B&M talk about how they bought a box of this and that from an online source and saved a bucket of dough doing it. Bad form. ALL B&M owners HATE the internet. It's a massive boil on their bottoms. They are offering a service the internet cannot possibly replace. Respect it and be grateful.

That's about it for my initial front of brain thoughts. Very interested to see what y'all come up with.


----------



## Tobias Lutz (Feb 18, 2013)

7) Don't haggle. I might be alone in thinking this, but a B&M is not a used car lot or a roadside swapmeet. Many shop owners/employees will be glad to slip you some swag if you make a nice purchase. In my limited experience with B&Ms I have been gifted pipe baccy samples, cigars, ashtrays, whiskey stones, etc. I've also been given a percentage off the total. While the "perk" has varied, what has been consistent is that I don't ask for freebies or discounts. I try to be friendly and show appreciation for their inventory and sometimes I'm pleasantly suprised. If you don't want to pay the price on the stick/box, you should consider purchasing it elsewhere.


----------



## dj1340 (Mar 30, 2009)

One thing I do when I travel is visit local B&M's. Check out their inventory and talk to the owner/staff.
If I have some cigars with me they don't have or haven't tried, I gift one to them. Many times they will
pick one of their favorites(sometimes just made for their shop) and give it to me to try. I have always
had a great time talking with them and sharing smokes. I've had some great conversations and learned
a lot from these guys. Listen more than you talk and you'd be surprised what you can learn.

I have picked up some great finds during my travels.


----------



## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

If you or anyone you may be with is a cigarette smoker don't assume or try to smoke a cigarette in a B&M. Its disgusting and smells terrible. Take that nastiness outside. I personally can't stand when people do that as it totally ruins the lovely smell in the shop.


----------



## meatcake (Mar 3, 2012)

1) Never touch, pick up, fondle, squeeze, sniff, or otherwise manhandle any cigar in a shop you do not intend to buy. Even if you did wash your hands, you're the only one who knows you washed your hands and even if you did wash your hands, your hands are still covered in staff and oils. Don't do it!

2) Never smoke in a shop's walk in humidor. If the whole shop is a walk in humidor, chances are it's fine. However, if no one else is smoking, ASK.

3) Never assume it's okay to 'smoke what ya brung'. If you're going to smoke a cigar you brought with you (many reasons for this including preferred rh), always buy something and again, ASK.

4) If your shop has a band jar (many shops collect bands) and what you brung happens to be Cuban, NEVER toss a Cuban band in their jar. In fact, if you've asked and received the thumbs up to smoke what ya brung and what ya brung is Cuban, remove the band before you fire up and put it in your pocket. If what ya brung is Cuban, you're the only one who should know it's Cuban. If asked by someone you don't know well, lie. If you live outside the US, ignore this completely.

5) Never try to 'educate' the errant owner, or register jockey. While they're often wrong about many things, don't think you're doing them a favor by setting them straight. All you're doing is identifying yourself as a pompous know-it-all and creating resentment.

6) Never discuss another source for purchasing cigars. I can't tell you how many times I've heard someone in a B&M talk about how they bought a box of this and that from an online source and saved a bucket of dough doing it. Bad form. ALL B&M owners HATE the internet. It's a massive boil on their bottoms. They are offering a service the internet cannot possibly replace. Respect it and be grateful.

7) Don't haggle. I might be alone in thinking this, but a B&M is not a used car lot or a roadside swapmeet. Many shop owners/employees will be glad to slip you some swag if you make a nice purchase. In my limited experience with B&Ms I have been gifted pipe baccy samples, cigars, ashtrays, whiskey stones, etc. I've also been given a percentage off the total. While the "perk" has varied, what has been consistent is that I don't ask for freebies or discounts. I try to be friendly and show appreciation for their inventory and sometimes I'm pleasantly sup

8) Don't just grab a random lighter and/or cutter and use them on your cigar. It might be another patrons. If you forgot yours, ask the shop owner if they have cutters and lighters to use, they typically keep them in a specific area. Use those instead of accidentally using someone else's and making a potential enemy. 

9) if you use the shop cutter, don't mouth your cigar first. You spread germs this way. Cut the cigar, then put it in your mouth. If you are using your own cutter do what you want, but for the "community cutters" please, don't leave your germs and spit behind.

10) Don't just light up a cigarette after a cigar and sit and chain smoke. Typically B&M's don't like or allow cigarette smokers (this might be a regional thing). Ask before you light up a cigarette. 

11) Don't just go from Cigar to Pipe. Ask the B&M owner if smoking a pipe is fine. Some B&Ms allow it, others have pipe days. Same goes with infused cigars. A lot of b&ms don't allow them to be smoked on premises.


----------



## TKE174 (Nov 19, 2011)

8) Introduce yourself if you're new in the shop and there are an established group of regulars wait for their invite to join the group. Sit back relax enjoy it won't be long till they are asking you for your likes and dislikes.


----------



## GrouchyDog (Mar 12, 2013)

This is a great thread - thanks all!


----------



## wittywon (Sep 10, 2013)

If there is a community pop/water/drink fridge, don't take what isn't yours and if they cost a buck, pay a buck.

If you are allowed to bring in booze, don't get so drunk you're falling over.


----------



## piperdown (Jul 19, 2009)

Never go against a Sicilian when death is on the line....wait wrong topic...lol

Be polite, even if there is a cigar know it all annoying you. Smile, nod your head and just walk away.


----------



## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

Just like to amend the haggling rule.
Im always out to save a buck and if they start it then its fine to continue.
Example, shopping then say Well Im not really interested in that stick that they offered then they start offering discounts based on quantity and throwing different numbers than whats posted. If you are prepared to drop some dough and allow them to turn a per customer profit from you most will be happy to fill their register and let you leave extremely pleased as well and know they will have a repeat customer and made more from you than the guy that just walked in and bought 1 $3 stick.

The US is one of the few countries where haggling isnt expected in the market place. Most others its very much a part of doing business and if you don't haggle you get taken to the cleaners.


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

piperdown said:


> Never go against a Sicilian when death is on the line....wait wrong topic...lol
> 
> Be polite, even if there is a cigar know it all annoying you. Smile, nod your head and just walk away.


Oh yeah, I forgot, never get into a ground war in Indo China.


----------



## Under A Mountain (May 24, 2007)

Disagree with #1 .


----------



## edwardsdigital (Mar 18, 2013)

Under A Mountain said:


> Disagree with #1 [/URL] .


Care to elaborate? While I totally agree with Rule #1 , you may have other thoughts and are welcome to share them with us. Personally, I dont want to put YOUR finger in MY mouth so please dont put your fingers all over the cigar I am looking to buy.


----------



## _LURK_ (Aug 26, 2013)

#1 is one of the newbie mistakes I've seen first hand. Went to a b&m and was browsing the humidor when this group of 2-3 people walk in, with the b&m employee right behind them. They were asking questions and such and one of them was touching and squeezing the cigars, trying to smell through the cellophane. The employee asked him not to do it particularly for the same reasons posted.

I agree with #1 though, especially with naked cigars.

I dunno if this would be etiquette, but if I'm visiting a new b&m I've never been to, I always tell the employee, or even ask, that I'm heading into the humidor. I dunno why, but I just feel like it's a polite thing to do even though a humidor in a shop is there to shop around in, especially if the employees don't know you. I guess it kind of gets you away from the awkward staring the employees give you.


----------



## Michael77 (Aug 9, 2013)

They are hand rolled cigars, people do have their hands on them, im just messing around lol you should ask first.


----------



## Under A Mountain (May 24, 2007)

I just think it's a bit extreme. I'll pick up a cigar, test it's firmness and decide not to buy it. I might pick up a cigar and then see something else and decide not to purchase. Ever been to a tobacco farm/cigar factory? They are not wearing rubber gloves. I understand why people might not like it, I just don't think it's that big a deal. If I owned a store and stood in the humidor pestering people for touching, I might not have too many customers.


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

I think the key phrase Don used was...



Herf N Turf said:


> 1) Never touch, pick up, fondle, squeeze, sniff, or otherwise manhandle any cigar in a shop *you do not intend to buy*.


----------



## Bivens (Aug 29, 2013)

Great rules!!! Thanks.


----------



## slimjim32 (Sep 16, 2010)

I disagree with number one as well. Cigars are worked on by people that don't wear gloves while they work. From picking the leaf, to bunching them together to ferment, to moving them around the farm, to bunching the filler, to wrapping the binder and wrapper. To packaging (whether putting in cellophane or not) and boxed.

Consider me OCD, but I like to pick up cigars and feel if there are any soft spots throughout the cigar. Or if they have any firm spots that might ruin my smoking experience. As long as it is a soft squeeze, I don't see the problem with it.


----------



## AndyRN (Oct 24, 2012)

I tend to agree with rule #1 . There is a difference between someone hand rolling a cigar and 15 idiots coming off the street and handling cigars. I especially don't think you should smell a cigar. Now if you pick it up and notice a problem that's another story. Personally I think squeezing a cigar is very subjective. I have squeezed my cigars and they were hard as a rock and the smoke fine and same with softer cigars. As far as finding knots by squeezing, I don't think the presence of a firmer section of the cigar necessarily indicates a potential problem. If you want to try it, and the general construction is good, then buy it. If it is plugged, then take it back, any B&M worth anything will take it back. They would rather do that then have you squeeze everything in the shop.


----------



## boro62 (Jan 21, 2013)

dj1340 said:


> One thing I do when I travel is visit local B&M's. Check out their inventory and talk to the owner/staff.
> If I have some cigars with me they don't have or haven't tried, I gift one to them. Many times they will
> pick one of their favorites(sometimes just made for their shop) and give it to me to try. I have always
> had a great time talking with them and sharing smokes. I've had some great conversations and learned
> ...


I've done this also. My local B&M that I frequent quite a bit, if they don't have something I like, I will gift them one to try and let them know that I really enjoy that particular smoke and would purchase from them if they carried it.

I have also found some fantastic finds while visiting B&M's while traveling. Sometimes you find some great gems that have just been sitting on the shelf for years that are still in great shape that you can't find anywhere else.


----------



## Tabarquino (Sep 7, 2013)

As a newbie to the Puff forum I am really enjoying this thread. I completely agree on every rule, which basically they all can be reduced to three:

- Always be polite. ALWAYS
- Don't touch anything, unless they give you permission to do so
- Don't be a smart-ass

Support your local B&M shop! :nod:


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

There are several shop owners here, one of whom has already weighed in against fondling cigars. Trust me, it's really poor form and every experienced smoker in the humidor will meet it with disdain. Just how many times do people think a cigar can be squeezed before you damage it? Does your local have a ticker to indicate how many people have spindled the cigar you have in your hand?

The only thing squeezing a cigar can reliably tell you is the thing's too damn wet to smoke.

Just don't do it.


----------



## Ianoue (Jun 24, 2013)

Meat,

Thanks! I am new to cigars and cigar shopping.


----------



## Damselnotindistress (Aug 7, 2011)

That just happens to be a personal rule of thumb for me...to be sure my hands are washed/clean before going into the humidor to touch all over the non-cello'd smokes in there. Plus, I'm a little picky. I carefully lift up the cigar ontop by the foot to get one lower down...precisely BECAUSE I'm not sure if some-BODY might have fingered the ones ontop with sneezed on hands, etc. And yes, usually the proprietor will be happy to include a few freebies or knock the price down some - at least with me because I'm one of their best customers! These are all common sense good rules of thumb mentioned on this thread...and one would be surprised about how many people do need it!


----------



## njsket (Sep 11, 2013)

The B&M in my area comes off as very corporate, I don't see any free swag coming out of that place, they don't even offer up the matches either (the one time I got matches there they were the cardboard type) I haven't had that experience at any other B&M I've gone to in other towns. Unless the giving of the matches are not the norm....


----------



## FireRunner (Jul 19, 2012)

#1 will always be debated until the end of time. My brother and I have been smoking for almost 20 years and we roll cigars between our fingers. Normally we grab the band. To me and many of my friends who have been smoking longer than I have this is a very acceptable practice. It's also a great (and only) way to tell if the cigar is packed too tight, too light or is at the wrong RH (high or low). Also, if you don't pick up a cigar how can you tell it's not damaged? How do you know the other side of the cigar isn't torn? Eventually you'll have to touch the cigar. I'm not agreeing people "fondle" the cigar, but rolling it gently is fine in my book (especially if you know what you're doing).

With most cigars having cello this isn't really an issue, but shop owners/workers touch the cigars anyway. It's not a big deal unless a smoker makes it a big deal. If you buy at a local cigar stop you can automatically assume the cigar you're looking at has been handled already (unless it's a new box and you're taking from the bottom row).

I'll also add to never try and "educate" anyone on cigars, how to light them, how to maintain them, etc. Everyone is different with different methods that *all* work. No one likes a smart ass. :wacko:


----------



## A.McSmoke (Jan 9, 2013)

#1 makes total since, but inexperienced & occasional smokers make this rule necessary. However, there are some Catch 22's. I'm with FireRunner, in that with non-cello cigars, at one time you were taught to check the wrapper to make sure it was not damaged and in good shape. Impossible without handling the cigar to some degree. Always try to grab/hold it at the band. I don't think you should squeeze it & put your sweaty palms all over it, but you can usually see dents/knots from poorly rolled cigars...but then again, most cigars without cello are usually the higher end sticks that rarely have this problem. Sticking a cigar up your nostrils is always a NO GO.

I'll add this to the B&M Etiquette list:

While hanging out in a lounge, don't try to sell your products, goods & services to patrons who are relaxing and enjoying a good cigar. I've seen many times where folks have come in, got into the conversation which is perfectly fine, but soon start talking about their occupation/business, and telling you how you could benefit from them.

I'm all for networking, but in the cigar lounge setting, I thing you'll be more respected and your intentions better received by just handing everyone a business card. If they need you, they'll contact you.


----------



## Chrishorsley13 (Jun 15, 2013)

njsket said:


> The B&M in my area comes off as very corporate, I don't see any free swag coming out of that place, they don't even offer up the matches either (the one time I got matches there they were the cardboard type) I haven't had that experience at any other B&M I've gone to in other towns. Unless the giving of the matches are not the norm....


Find a new B&M, the one I frequent not only would give me matches if needed but would pull their own lighter out of there pocket for me if needed. Your local shop should be a friendly place to hang out and enjoy a stick or three. If I was to go and didn't feel good about the staff or the fact that they value my business and I'm spending my money with them I wouldn't return. As a matter of fact my local store manager just gifted me a flying pig for my birthday! Love that shop! He's on here but I won't call him out but he knows who he is. Thanks again, I owe you one. Oh and it was awesome!


----------



## Hoosier Daddy (May 15, 2012)

I am definitely guilty of violating rule #1 , but I will think twice from now on. More than once here in Denver, I have received a 10% discount for mentioning Puff.com as well. I'd also like to add that when in shops that operate off of the honor system, don't lie about the price of the cigars that you are purchasing. These folks are really good people for the most part, and they are trying to scrape together a living just like the rest of us.


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

Chrishorsley13 said:


> Find a new B&M, the one I frequent not only would give me matches if needed but would pull their own lighter out of there pocket for me if needed. Your local shop should be a friendly place to hang out and enjoy a stick or three. If I was to go and didn't feel good about the staff or the fact that they value my business and I'm spending my money with them I wouldn't return. As a matter of fact my local store manager just gifted me a flying pig for my birthday! Love that shop! He's on here but I won't call him out but he knows who he is. Thanks again, I owe you one. Oh and it was awesome!


Sounds like a great guy :thumb:


----------



## knilas (Sep 15, 2013)

Rule #1 , while understandable, has me puzzled a lil bit considering one of the biggest things that cigar shops have going for them over the online retailers (along with atmosphere, camaraderie, try it there...like it there...buy several there, etc..) is that you can actually inspect what you buy, BEFORE you buy it. Heck, it's the reason why I tell every cigar smoker I know to frequent their local B&M as opposed to purchasing online. Not to mention, the dollars spent locally, stay in the local economy. So...to tell me that I should no longer do something that I felt (and verbalized) was one of the perks of patronizing a B&M....? Honestly, I'm sllightly taken aback. :dunno:


----------



## Tabarquino (Sep 7, 2013)

I think there may be away around rule #1 without being tarred and feathered, which is what I do.

Now that I have become a more familiar face around my B&M tobacco shop I chat to the owner and ask him about any new stuff coming in or any recommendations. Because I know he's a real pro, once I know which brands I'll purchase, I ask him to pick the cigars for me. I just ask him to pick "a good one". When he's chosen it, then I ask, very politely, if I could have a closer look, but to be honest, I trust the guy and I know he won't sell me a bad cigar. If, and only if, it turns out there's something wrong with the cigar (which it's never happened), I would bring it back and talk to him.

Politeness goes a long way!


----------



## Old Stogies Cigars (Mar 4, 2012)

_LURK_ said:


> #1 is one of the newbie mistakes I've seen first hand. Went to a b&m and was browsing the humidor when this group of 2-3 people walk in, with the b&m employee right behind them. They were asking questions and such and one of them was touching and squeezing the cigars, trying to smell through the cellophane. The employee asked him not to do it particularly for the same reasons posted.
> 
> I agree with #1 though, especially with naked cigars.
> 
> I dunno if this would be etiquette, but if I'm visiting a new b&m I've never been to, *I always tell the employee, or even ask, that I'm heading into the humidor.* I dunno why, but I just feel like it's a polite thing to do even though a humidor in a shop is there to shop around in, especially if the employees don't know you. I guess it kind of *gets you away from the awkward staring the employees give you*.


GOOD POINTS!!!

As a small shop owner I have learned that I now have to lock the humidor and unlock it when a customer wants to go in. I will not always follow in with them if they are by themselves, or if they have been in my shop before and I am familiar with how they act inside.

The lesson I learned was that as an older guy I may not be able to see some shoplifting happen...a few times while I was inside too. Caught it happening afterwards while reviewing security cameras. Almost all of my customers are trustworthy and don't handle the sticks except the ones they want to buy, or to inspect them closer. But some, well they have ruined it for me to just let people have free roaming of the humidor.

I have had guys open and remove stogies from glass tubo's :crazy:, take them out of cello, or toss them back in a box like it was a baseball.

It's not that I have all high priced cigars, but after the purchase price I pay, plus state tobacco tax, my profit is pretty slim to keep my prices competitive with online shops. This is also getting worse with more talk of tax increases on tobacco.

This is a good thread, and is helpful to me as an owner, and as a buyer at other B&M's.


----------



## Ianoue (Jun 24, 2013)

Nice to hear from shop owners!


----------



## Jordan23 (May 25, 2012)

FireRunner said:


> #1 will always be debated until the end of time. My brother and I have been smoking for almost 20 years and we roll cigars between our fingers. Normally we grab the band. To me and many of my friends who have been smoking longer than I have this is a very acceptable practice. It's also a great (and only) way to tell if the cigar is packed too tight, too light or is at the wrong RH (high or low). Also, if you don't pick up a cigar how can you tell it's not damaged? How do you know the other side of the cigar isn't torn? Eventually you'll have to touch the cigar. I'm not agreeing people "fondle" the cigar, but rolling it gently is fine in my book (especially if you know what you're doing).
> 
> With most cigars having cello this isn't really an issue, but shop owners/workers touch the cigars anyway. It's not a big deal unless a smoker makes it a big deal. If you buy at a local cigar stop you can automatically assume the cigar you're looking at has been handled already (unless it's a new box and you're taking from the bottom row).
> 
> I'll also add to never try and "educate" anyone on cigars, how to light them, how to maintain them, etc. Everyone is different with different methods that *all* work. No one likes a smart ass. :wacko:


Well said.

I agree with basically everything else though. Be polite and use common sense. Also, a relationship (doesnt take much effort-just talk to the guy or the gal, about more than cigars) helps a lot too. I'm fortune enough to have a staff at my B&M more knowledgeable than I. They're great with all types of questions. They keep a look out for certain boxes, etc.


----------



## Bruck (Jan 8, 2013)

#6 - I've been guilty of this, but not anymore! Question though - don't B&M proprietors use online sources for their ordering?

#1 - I generally avoid smelling as (1) it's bad hygiene all around, and (2) the smell of an unlit cigar, in my experience, doesn't have a strong relationship to its flavor.

There's a lot of "don'ts" in this list, but let me suggest some "dos":
Be friendly/cordial as appropriate
Encourage good service with repeat business
Buy something before using the lounge even if it's not explicitly required
Clean up after yourself
Put something in the tip jar if they have one


----------



## Livin' Legend (Sep 23, 2012)

dj1340 said:


> One thing I do when I travel is visit local B&M's. Check out their inventory and talk to the owner/staff.
> If I have some cigars with me they don't have or haven't tried, I gift one to them. Many times they will
> pick one of their favorites(sometimes just made for their shop) and give it to me to try. I have always
> had a great time talking with them and sharing smokes. I've had some great conversations and learned
> ...


This is a personal favorite travel activity. I love to travel, and I've found that even the most backwater areas have at least one decent humidor in the local area. I've found some truly interesting smokes in these places, and part of the greatness of doing that is speaking with the owners. And no, it never ever hurts to have a small gift.


----------



## Old Stogies Cigars (Mar 4, 2012)

I buy my products from wholesalers or brokers so that I have invoices for paying state taxes. (OTP) I would risk getting closed down if a state regulator would come to my shop and I couldn't prove products had state tax paid on them. 
This is just me maybe, but I have too much invested to get shut down trying to sell products not legally purchased/taxed for my state.


----------



## Gordo1473 (Dec 1, 2012)

The some of the best hidden hems have been recommended by shop owners. And the b&m I frequent a lot they ask me what I like and don't like and why. I don't bash a brand ever just tell them I don't care for a certain stick and why. Someone right behind you may love that one just for the same reasons you don't. 

They also have asked me about other shops and I do go to others. Certain shops in town carry different brands. But I buy 85-90 percent from one shop in town( or their stores they have 3) but I have gotten to know the owners and all the guys that work in each one. This also helps when they keep certain htf behind lock and key for their loyal customers


----------



## egoo33 (Jul 21, 2013)

Don't just walk right into a humidor without asking with the exception of being a regular. I have seen first hand a few people who just stormed into the walk in without the employees being all that happy. The way I look at it it's easier to ask if you can go in and that way you can avoid any potential headaches


----------



## SpartanFan (Sep 7, 2013)

No swag at the ones I've gone to. Limited selection it seems. Can't find the Liga to try again either. Seems more partyish lounges.


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

All you guys talking about being polite, communicating with the employees and building a relationship are dead on the money. THAT, in my opinion, is the real advantage of the B&M.

For every rule, or recommended manners, there are a thousand excuses for breaking it, or considering oneself the singular exception to whom it doesn't apply. For those so passionate about fondling a cigar, or who still believe that doing so provides some magical indication of how it's going to draw, etc, I've got something for you to try, communication.

It's indeed rare when a shop owner will slap someone up-side the head for groping his 'gars, or otherwise discourage them. Shop owners are in the business of selling cigars to put gas in their cars. Openly calling someone a dull-witted Philistine is hardly conducive to getting their money. However, next time you're in your B&M, in as easy going a manner possible, just ask the owner, "doesn't it bother you when people pick up and fondle your cigars, but don't buy them?" I'd bet you nine of ten will say it does. Then, as long as you're on the plot, ask them why.

I didn't create the etiquette, but I sure as hell abide by it and I am indeed annoyed when I'm in my local's humidor and someone's in there doing all kinds of unthinkable crimes to someone else's product. I am in my B&M quite often, referred to by name and am quite friendly and familiar with most members of staff. I feel a sense of personal investment in my shop. I feel completely comfortable interacting with other customers and recommending cigars, pipes, humidors, etc. I feel a sense of pride when I can create a sale for them. I must admit, I've gone so far as to discourage people from displaying a lack of etiquette in the shop. In 99% of cases, it's simply a matter of ignorance. They simply didn't know, hadn't been told, or lacked the common sense. Can't fault them for the first 2.

Before anyone jumps to the wrong conclusion, I'm not a jerkish jackass, control issue having buttinski. I'm very polite and approachable about and it generally turns into very enjoyable conversation. That, or I get my ass kicked 

As a matter of casual conversation about touching cigars, I once asked a guy, "Would you go into a stranger's home and start picking up things off the mantle and rolling them around in your fingers?" I wasn't confrontational and he wasn't offended, but rather said, "wow, never thought of it like that, but of course not." Thing is, some people would :ask:

For me, I was fortunate enough to be befriended by 3 guys, much older than I, one 3x my age, who took me under their wings and taught me the ropes. Everything from storage, toasting, cutting, drawing, to how to act and particularly how not to act in a shop. Over the years, I've asked a lot of shop owners their opinions on the do's and don'ts of B&M culture and it's been from that, that I compiled the list above.

You don't have to agree with it. You don't have to abide by it. As with most things, the choice is entirely up to you... as long as I'm not standing next to you in the humidor ound:


----------



## Ianoue (Jun 24, 2013)

Thanks for the info. I'll follow your advice.


----------



## ATLDave (May 15, 2013)

Well said Herf n Turf


----------



## jcullen24 (Sep 7, 2013)

Don't touch the cigars? 

That's what differentiates the B&M from online retailers. 
They know that, or they should. I go in looking for a brand I've just read about in Cigar Afficianado, or I'll see an interesting Brand, Like the Warlock. 'm tactile in my sensory. I want to know how the cigar is wrapped, I want to know how dense the tobacco is rolled in this gar. 

Like I said, what keeps a B&M in business? The tactile, and personal response that an online retail can't provide.
I also squeeze fruit and vegetables in the grocery store!


----------



## Emperor Zurg (May 6, 2013)

I just figured I'd drop in and post a comment about rule #1 because everyone else has and I want to be part of the crowd.
This ought to be called the 'Argue About Rule #1 Thread' or 'To Grope Or Not To Grope' LOL!

As far as rule #1 goes, I... er... I think... well, I um... just don't know. But I'm sure of that!

Seriously though, people are gross. (And you gross people know who you are.) Some don't even wash their mitts after taking a dump.
Would you want something in your mouth that was manhandled just like money is? Yuck!
I won't even buy a cigar unless it's still in the cello. For that matter, I never eat unwrapped candy out of a dish.
E-Coli! It's everywhere!!!!



jcullen24 said:


> Don't touch the cigars? -snip- I also squeeze fruit and vegetables in the grocery store!


Yes, but I'd go straight home and wash that apple I bought with soap and water. Last time I tried that with a Fuente it didn't go so well.


----------



## Under A Mountain (May 24, 2007)

If they have one of those leave a penny/take a penny containers by the register, don't ash in it. It really cheeses them off.


----------



## Under A Mountain (May 24, 2007)

Emperor Zurg said:


> I just figured I'd drop in and post a comment about rule #1 because everyone else has and I want to be part of the crowd.
> This ought to be called the 'Argue About Rule #1 Thread' or 'To Grope Or Not To Grope' LOL!
> 
> As far as rule #1 goes, I... er... I think... well, I um... just don't know. But I'm sure of that!
> ...


Again have you seen pics of a cigar factory lately? Not a glove in sight, and also not the best bathroom facilities.


----------



## Michael77 (Aug 9, 2013)

the clerk i bought from today touched money then picked up my cigars, i couldn't care less lol


----------



## knilas (Sep 15, 2013)

A very polarizing subject indeed! I can certainly see both sides of the argument here. Essentially we are strictly talking about the naked (un-celloed) sticks, correct? Or does the "no touch" policy apply to all cigars in a B&M? If it's strictly the naked ones, and considering noone knows who may have touched or fondled them w/ their yucky hands before you got there, would it be safe to assume we should no longer buy unwrapped cigars? And if only the shop owner/employees can handle the merchandise, how do we know where their hands and fingers have been?

Color me still puzzled.....


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

Under A Mountain said:


> If they have one of those leave a penny/take a penny containers by the register, don't ash in it. It really cheeses them off.


Bravo, sir :lol:


----------



## boro62 (Jan 21, 2013)

just another thought on the whole no touchy thing....but I always thought that B&M owners worried less about the germs and such but more about people manhandling them, giving them a too hard of a squeeze and breaking the wrapper or some other way of accidentally damaging the cigar.


----------



## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

I think people arent understanding the *"unless you intend to buy"* part of rule #1 . If your interested in buying the cigar its one thing. If your browsing around picking up random cigars just to do so thats not cool.


----------



## Tobias Lutz (Feb 18, 2013)

Herf N Turf said:


> Before anyone jumps to the wrong conclusion, I'm not a jerkish jackass, control issue having buttinski. I'm very polite and approachable about and it generally turns into very enjoyable conversation.


When you took me to your B&M you specifically said: "Tobias, if you don't behave yourself I swear upon all that is holy, no one will find your body!"

But granted, you did it in a very polite manner :biggrin:


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

Okay... I do have a couple of pet peeves. I see them A LOT...

Please do not cut your cigar *on* the front counter. There are usually ashtrays very close by.

Please do not use the brand new lighters being sold at the front counter. Granted, they are the cheap $10 torches, but still... Ask the guy at the counter for a lighter, matches, whatever. I see this almost at least once a day.


----------



## ColdSmoker (Jan 22, 2013)

A lot of times you have to touch the cigar to see the price at my b&m. I want to see the price first because they have a way of overpricing certain sticks and not others.


----------



## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Don't wet the head of the cigar before using the house cutters and then put them back for someone else to use.


----------



## Commander Quan (May 6, 2003)

When you accidentally drop ash on the floor, chair, your shirt, clean it up, or at least offer to, and not by grinding it into the carpet either.


----------



## edwardsdigital (Mar 18, 2013)

I agree with Cole, I think the major part of rule #1 is the manhandling aspect of it. It was stated earlier that a b&m priced the individual stick and had it sitting so it could not be read. In a case like that I can see picking it up to read the price, but if you are looking at the price you are also probably interested in buying it. At my b&m Seth has all the shelves nicely marked with a card that has the box & stick prices along with color coded dots relating to the strength of the cigar. You really don't need to touch the cigars for anything other than your final inspection before going to the counter to buy.

I don't think anyone here is going to a shop just to poke around in the humidor and not pick something up to smoke. I can think of much better ways to kill time, including just dropping buy to chit chat with the brothers and sisters sitting in the lounge.


----------



## Heath (Aug 16, 2013)

Ok so here is my 2 cents I would agree in genral however I dont mind if some one carefully picks up a cigar by the band and inspects it no big deal but for me its when they press it all up in thier nose and snufle it yeah just what wanted notes of leather, wood and dirty burnt bugger. I think b&ms could be a little more proactive with some friendly/funny signs most new cigar smokers dont even realize what they're doing


----------



## nikesupremedunk (Jun 29, 2012)

I was just at the b&m today and I took my time looking over several sticks before choosing the one that felt and looked right. I didn't squeeze the crap out of them, just a gentle push to feel how the stick was rolled. I also inspect the foot to make sure it looks nicely packed. If I'm paying the premium at a b&m, I'm going to make sure I get the one I want but of course without ruining it for the next buyer.


----------



## Tombstone (Aug 22, 2013)

Very good info to think about. I like seeing both sides to certain rules.


----------



## El wedo del milagro (Jul 3, 2012)

It sounds like most of yall have nice places to go to, and all of yall have somewhere at least decent. Count yer blessings.

I've only once been to a B&M. It was a three hour drive south to Albuquerque. My wife had hours of shopping she wanted to do, so I visited a B&M.

The owner was working the counter, and I was told anything I bought could be taken into the lounge and be smoked free (no membership required). I bought a tin of Dunhill Flake, and headed back to the lounge, sat near an AC vent, and got ready to pack a bowl. Folks started to yell at me before I even cracked the tin. They didn't want me smoking a pipe around them (even though several of them reeked of cigarettes). They told me I had to go into the back room. No AC in the back room, no radio or TV either. Nothing but three drunks (it was 10:30 am) giving me nasty looks. One of the drunks kept gesticulating wildly with his lit cigar, and twice almost got me in the face with it. I asked him calmly and politely to be careful with his cigar. He just cussed me out and started waving his stick around again. Before long he ended up burning my forearm. I told him to watch himself! He cussed me and reached over and knocked over my icedtea intentionally. Then left the room and came back with an employee who told me very rudely that I'm not allowed to smoke pipe tobacco here. I told him the owner told me anything I bought here, I could smoke here. He told me they didn't sell Dunhill here, and I needed to leave. I said I just bought it here moments ago, and if I have to leave after he burnt me and dumped my drink, then I want a full refund. I was told "no".

About this time the owner came back inside. I told my story, and was told that if "the guys" didn't want a stranger smoking a pipe, there was nothing to be done. I said one of "the guys" burnt me with a cigar on my arm, then instead of apologizing, he dumped my tea on the floor. I was told, "I don't believe that".

At this point it's starting to be challenging to remain calm. I say I feel like a "bait and switch" happened to me and I feel like I was assaulted in this store, and all I want is a full refund. After about five minutes of arguing and suggesting I'm going to talk with the BBB and write a bad review at every site I can find, I'm refunded the tiny amount of the tin and the tea.

It was a horrible experience.


----------



## Hiroshiro (Sep 22, 2013)

Etiquette seems Quite Different from Japan. At Cigar Club or LCDH you normally don't touch the Cigars. What you normally do is walk into the Humidor with the Manager and He or She will check the Cigars for you. If they meet their Criteria they will allow you to smoke it. I've seen BHK thrown out like the non existent trash on the street! But yes very interesting how everyone'd take on Etiquette


----------



## CigarInspector (Aug 22, 2013)

One thing you may want to consider is if you have a B&M you really like or a particular owner or employee good etiquette can always be to bring an extra stick you may have that they might not be able to get a hold of and gift them it to enjoy. These shops are not easy to run a nice gesture can go along way to you always being welcomed back!


----------



## Gdaddy (Sep 20, 2012)

Touching and squeezing a cigar gives no indication of it's flavor or condition. Firmness/softness means nothing. Squeezing just shows ignorance. Some of you cigar squeezing molesters have dirty little fingers and urine or fecal matter does not enhance my smoking experience. Hands off!!!


----------



## Tobias Lutz (Feb 18, 2013)

Gdaddy said:


> Touching and squeezing a cigar gives no indication of it's flavor or condition. Firmness/softness means nothing. Squeezing just shows ignorance. Some of you cigar squeezing molesters have dirty little fingers and urine or fecal matter does not enhance my smoking experience. Hands off!!!


While I don't want to presuppose what anyone has lingering on their hands, I can attest to the idea that it is difficult to predict the quality of a cigar by feeling it. I always check for soft spots (when I'm about to light it, not prior to buying), but this is more to be preemptive in case the cigar start to canoes or something, then I have a factor to blame it on. In reality, I have smoked cigars that felt very flaccid, and yet burned perfectly with a decent draw, and I have had "firm" cigars that burned like crap and at various points felt like I was pulling sand through a straw.


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

jcullen24 said:


> Don't touch the cigars? You're catching on.
> 
> That's what differentiates the B&M from online retailers. No, it isn't.
> They know that, or they should. I go in looking for a brand I've just read about in Cigar Afficianado, or I'll see an interesting Brand, Like the Warlock. 'm tactile in my sensory. I want to know how the cigar is wrapped, I want to know how dense the tobacco is rolled in this gar.


None of which gives you the slightest indication of what the *smoking* experience will render.



Under A Mountain said:


> Again have you seen pics of a cigar factory lately? Not a glove in sight, and also not the best bathroom facilities.


 This is tanamount to comparing elementary school children fresh off the playground, to a surgeon, when touching an open wound. Bad analogy.



boro62 said:


> just another thought on the whole no touchy thing....but I always thought that B&M owners worried less about the germs and such but more about people manhandling them, giving them a too hard of a squeeze and breaking the wrapper or some other way of accidentally damaging the cigar.


You are correct.



edwardsdigital said:


> I agree with Cole, I think the major part of rule #1 is the manhandling aspect of it. It was stated earlier that a b&m priced the individual stick and had it sitting so it could not be read. In a case like that I can see picking it up to read the price, but if you are looking at the price you are also probably interested in buying it. At my b&m Seth has all the shelves nicely marked with a card that has the box & stick prices along with color coded dots relating to the strength of the cigar. You really don't need to touch the cigars for anything other than your final inspection before going to the counter to buy.
> 
> I don't think anyone here is going to a shop just to poke around in the humidor and not pick something up to smoke. I can think of much better ways to kill time, including just dropping buy to chit chat with the brothers and sisters sitting in the lounge.


This is the rule reinforcing exception. Many B&Ms indeed price-sticker their cigars on the back of the band. While we all (or should) understand this is a luxury hobby, price differences between shops can be dramatic. I'm reminded of something my father used to say as a Mercedes Benz dealer; "If you have to ask how much, you can't afford it." There's a middle ground there somewhere.



El wedo del milagro said:


> It sounds like most of yall have nice places to go to, and all of yall have somewhere at least decent. Count yer blessings.
> 
> I've only once been to a B&M. It was a three hour drive south to Albuquerque. My wife had hours of shopping she wanted to do, so I visited a B&M.
> 
> ...


This is just too bizarre not to be true. Shocking!



Hiroshiro said:


> Etiquette seems Quite Different from Japan. At Cigar Club or LCDH you normally don't touch the Cigars. What you normally do is walk into the Humidor with the Manager and He or She will check the Cigars for you. If they meet their Criteria they will allow you to smoke it. I've seen BHK thrown out like the non existent trash on the street! But yes very interesting how everyone'd take on Etiquette


What you describe is EXACTLY how things were until the last months of the "cigar boom". Up until the mid 1990's, cigar smoking was a very niche hobby, populated by tobacco enthusiasts who passed information down by word of mouth. There were a few, but rare cigar books and magazines and "Gentlemen's magazines" such as Playboy would feature the occasional article, but for the most part, we were on our own. Cigar Aficionado would come along in summer of '92, but really didn't catch on until much later. Granted, the industry was in a shambles, with most customers aging, or just dying off. At any rate, I can't help but think that if we could have just taken the '80's out of it, the olde guarde could have educated the "boomers" and all would be well. Instead, we have "Gen-E" (generation of entitlement) doing whatever they want, whenever they want, however they want.


Gdaddy said:


> Touching and squeezing a cigar gives no indication of it's flavor or condition. Firmness/softness means nothing. Squeezing just shows ignorance. Some of you cigar squeezing molesters have dirty little fingers and urine or fecal matter does not enhance my smoking experience. Hands off!!!


 There IS a God.


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

El wedo del milagro said:


> It sounds like most of yall have nice places to go to, and all of yall have somewhere at least decent. Count yer blessings.
> 
> I've only once been to a B&M. It was a three hour drive south to Albuquerque. My wife had hours of shopping she wanted to do, so I visited a B&M.
> 
> ...


Good God... Are you sure you didn't slip into the Seventh Circle of Hell on accident??? Sounds like a bad acid trip, rather than a trip to a B&M.


----------



## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

I'm glad my local shop is both a cigar and pipe shop. They've straight up told me that I can come on in, open their bulk tobacco jars, and pack myself a sample bowl if I want to try something and light that sucker up right next to the cigar guys. As for the cigars, about half of their stock is in cabinets that you can open yourself and grab. Although, I only touch the ones I'm going to purchase. Getting all handsy with all the cigars would just be weird. They do have most of their more expensive sticks behind the counter humidor unit and they will take the whole box out and let you pick one... again, not getting all handsy with all of them.  

My etiquette involves not being an idiot, and asking before you dive into something.


----------



## Gdaddy (Sep 20, 2012)

If a B&M has a good ventilation system then there is no problem with pipe smokers and cigarette smokers living peacefully together in the same room with cigar smokers. Even though cigars do stink better than both of them!!:smoke:


----------



## edwardsdigital (Mar 18, 2013)

Herf N Turf said:


> Instead, we have "Gen-E" (generation of entitlement) doing whatever they want, whenever they want, however they want.


This may be the explanation for quite a few things that are going wrong in the world these days. I dont see any way to curb that thought process that doesn't involve a swift kick to the back of the head.


----------



## Cigars&GTRs (Jul 21, 2013)

Its funny, I was in a new B&M last week and was going to buy a cigar but it was low in the box and I was concerned about damging it with my fingers. I asked the owner to pull it out for me so that I didnt risk damaging his stock, he shook the box kind of rough to shake some out. I was horrified at how he would treat his stock but decided to go ahead with the puchase since the cigar was still fine. Unfortunately a Hemingway Short Story I purchased at the same time may have been treated the same way as it unraveled as I smoked it, it was such a shame. 

Although this may or may not have been the cause I definitely wont be going back to that shop after the experience. That being said, if I few cigars I bought had issues (regardless of what I saw) I probably wouldnt return to the shop either. As a shop owner any risk to their stock has huge implications on their business, if I were in their position I wouldnt risk having people manhandle cigars they dont intend to buy either.


----------



## Old Smokey (Sep 13, 2013)

As a new cigar smoker, this thread has been very informative. I also appreciate the style and class of the rules. I kind of like the thought of purchasing and smoking a cigar as something done with respect. Like a game of golf, certain do's and don'ts filled with respect for the rules of the game.

I seemed to have forgotten the guy chewing on a dog turd at the local salvage yard. Personally, I don't wanna be that guy.


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

One thing I've failed to mention... intended to, like four times, but haven't...

Like @HIM said, it's okay to touch and inspect a cigar you intend to buy. If, upon inspection, you find construction issues, don't put it back in the box, but rather take it to an employee. If you wouldn't buy it, I probably wouldn't either.


----------



## ColdSmoker (Jan 22, 2013)

Some of this stuff is way over the top in my opinion. You shouldn't have to feel like your walking on egg shells when you buy cigars or hang out at a lounge. Remember you are the customer, the store doesn't exist without you. Not sure why so many people basically worship the store owner and suck up to them as if they are better than you. Do you want to have a good relationship with your tobacconist? Of course! Show respect? Of course! But good god, we are not dealing with gremlins here. Broken unspoken, unknown, implied..etc type rules/etiquette are not going to result in disaster. And, if some snooty prick snaps at you because of an innocent infraction, than the store owner should stick up for you. If it's the actually store owner who does it...bye, bye. Not getting my business.

Go in there, be respectful, don't stick a cigar up your nose then not buy it. Simple.


----------



## Herf N Turf (Dec 31, 2008)

ColdSmoker said:


> Some of this stuff is way over the top in my opinion. You shouldn't have to feel like your walking on egg shells when you buy cigars or hang out at a lounge. Remember you are the customer, the store doesn't exist without you. Not sure why so many people basically worship the store owner and suck up to them as if they are better than you. Do you want to have a good relationship with your tobacconist? Of course! Show respect? Of course! But good god, we are not dealing with gremlins here. Broken unspoken, unknown, implied..etc type rules/etiquette are not going to result in disaster. And, if some snooty prick snaps at you because of an innocent infraction, than the store owner should stick up for you. If it's the actually store owner who does it...bye, bye. Not getting my business.
> 
> Go in there, be respectful, don't stick a cigar up your nose then not buy it. Simple.


Wow, dude. I think you're reading way too much into this. That's really all it is, just being respectful of the shop, the owner and the merchandise and considerate of your fellow customer. Simple.


----------



## ColdSmoker (Jan 22, 2013)

Didn't mean to come off like that, but there is pretty dang long list of behavior recommendations to come back and say just "be respectful", no? Also, what I said about people kissing ass is based a lot on what I've seen in shops around here.


----------



## Hiroshiro (Sep 22, 2013)

Bring Back "Store Owner will choose for You" maybe?


----------



## fuente~fuente (May 11, 2009)

Wish some guys would kiss mine more often! :tongue1:

What am I doing wrong! :lol:


----------



## Tobias Lutz (Feb 18, 2013)

fuente~fuente said:


> Wish some guys would kiss mine more often! :tongue1:
> 
> What am I doing wrong! :lol:


You don't have a Champagne Room :wink:


----------



## Gdaddy (Sep 20, 2012)

fuente~fuente said:


> Wish some guys would kiss mine more often! :tongue1:
> 
> What am I doing wrong! :lol:


I prefer girls to kiss mine.:hmm:


----------

