# Coveting Cubans



## zackly (Jun 27, 2008)

I've been smoking cigars since the mid eighties. Tried many, enjoyed most but I'm a total newbie when it comes to Cuban cigars. The 50 or so that I've smoked (either gifted or on vacation outside the US) were for the most part spectacular, except for the obviously counterfeit Cohibas prevalent during the cigar boom years. The Cuban Hoyo I smoked in Bermuda & the Cuban Montecristo # 2's my ex brother in law used to score for me in NY were delicious, different, multi-dimensional affairs. Why are they so good? Is it just the soil in the Vuelta Abajo? Or is partly how they process them? Maybe is like the soil in Burgundy or Bordeaux, unique? 
I feel like I'm a minor league ballplayer hoping for a trip to THE SHOW. I have a whole new world to experience & I'm anxious to begin the journey. I feel like a second class cigar aficionado smoking non-Cubans.
Has Obama commented on normalizing relationships with Cuba if he gets elected? That would be great as long as he leaves us with some cash to buy the stogies.


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## md4958 (Aug 15, 2008)

zackly said:


> That would be great as long as he leaves us with some cash to buy the stogies.


I wouldnt count on it Zack... where in CT are you?


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## zackly (Jun 27, 2008)

Stamford native now living in Norwalk


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## clampdown (Feb 7, 2006)

For selfish reason, I dont want to have normal trade relations with Cuba. The market place would get flooded with CCs and they would be crap (similar to the boom years). Everyone and their mother would want to try a cc and therefore the demand will grow and their by diminishing the quality of the product. 

Some ncs are just as good as cc but in my 7 years of smoking I have only found a handful that can make that claim. I hear the reason being is that they roll wacky tabacky with each stick.:chk


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## zackly (Jun 27, 2008)

*which nc's compare?*



clampdown said:


> For selfish reason, I dont want to have normal trade relations with Cuba. The market place would get flooded with CCs and they would be crap (similar to the boom years). Everyone and their mother would want to try a cc and therefore the demand will grow and their by diminishing the quality of the product.
> 
> Some ncs are just as good as cc but in my 7 years of smoking I have only found a handful that can make that claim. I hear the reason being is that they roll wacky tabacky with each stick.:chk


 Which NC's do you think compare favorably to CC's?


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## Bax (Sep 12, 2007)

*Re: which nc's compare?*



zackly said:


> Which NC's do you think compare favorably to CC's?


 Try an Ashton VSG. See what you think of that one. :tu


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## clampdown (Feb 7, 2006)

*Re: which nc's compare?*



zackly said:


> Which NC's do you think compare favorably to CC's?


For me PAMS and the Anejo 50, probably the only Anejo I enjoy. I do like the Tat J21 and the Cabiguan is alright. But for the price I would rather take the chance and buy cc. I found I was throwing money away on the packaging of the ncs and not the actual cigar (ie DCM, Opus)


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## boonedoggle (Jun 23, 2006)

Padron Anniversary and La Riqueza smoke are some you should try, if you haven't already. These are in a class all their own, which shouldn't be compared to CCs for fairness of the particular tobacco used and blending techniques.


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## CigarDoc (Oct 13, 2007)

I've heard good things about Kristoffs, but being from the good ol' US of A, I've only had 1 CC in my life, which was a PSD4. I'm still scheeming ways to get my hands on some, but we won't talk about that here. Other than that, if I was to name some smokes that were like the PSD4, I would say anything DPG or Tat's. They seemed to have the same flavor profile. But, being I know crap about CC's, don't take my word for it.


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## TankerT (Apr 8, 2008)

I'd agree on the Aston VSG, and the Kristoff.


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## donp (Mar 5, 2006)

>>Has Obama commented on normalizing relationships with Cuba if he gets elected? That would be great as long as he leaves us with some cash to buy the stogies.<<

If you've smoked 50 CC's over the years, I wouldn't categorize you as second class or a minor leaguer to cuban cigars. It sounds as if you have developed an appreciation for them, and it seems to me, that is good enough :ss
Oh and btw, it aint Obama you need to worry about "leaving you with some cash" to buy some; he isn't the one stealing your cash  I haven't heasrd him make any mention of relations with Cuba, nor am I interested in hearing about that right now. I figure he and McCain have more important things to talk with us about.


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

clampdown said:


> For selfish reason, I dont want to have normal trade relations with Cuba. The market place would get flooded with CCs and they would be crap (similar to the boom years).


I want to have normal relations with Cuba. I could care less about the cigars; peoples lives and livelyhood are at stake and that way more important than any cigar.

I do not think the US will be flooded with Cuban cigars either. Habanos sells all it makes, so whether the US is an "official" market won't change their distribution channels that much; at least in the short run.

One benefit will be that NC cigars may have to raise their bar or may get more recognition as they will truly get to compete side-by-side Habanos in USA.


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## skibumdc (Jun 27, 2007)

mosesbotbol said:


> I want to have normal relations with Cuba. I could care less about the cigars; peoples lives and livelyhood are at stake and that way more important than any cigar.


While I'm sure having relations with Cuba would certainly help them financially, let's not forget there are PLENTY of other nations that deal with Cuba all the time and give them aid. Our embargo really doesn't affect them as much as people perceive it to. We are but ONE country.



mosesbotbol said:


> I do not think the US will be flooded with Cuban cigars either. Habanos sells all it makes, so whether the US is an "official" market won't change their distribution channels that much; at least in the short run.


It's wishful thinking that the market would NOT be flooded with CC's. Ever been to a bachelor party or wedding and someone breaks out cigars. Most people will try one. Now imagine what has been taboo for decades is now legal. 80% of people that had wondered what a cuban cigar is all about would run out and pay a premium to try it. Prices would go up and quality down UNLESS the Cuban gov't put STRICT guidelines on production and FORCED quality control. It takes serious effort to maintain quality when demand is so high.
Just like the cigar boom of the 90's. It would take a decade to get back to quality exports from the island.

I agree with Clampdown. For the sake of quality cigars from the ISOM, make them hard to get.


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

skibumdc said:


> While I'm sure having relations with Cuba would certainly help them financially, let's not forget there are PLENTY of other nations that deal with Cuba all the time and give them aid. *Our embargo really doesn't affect them as much as people perceive it to.* We are but ONE country.


Well the UN thinks different, as does many world organizations. I think most will argue that our embargo has had a significant effect on Cuba.



skibumdc said:


> It's wishful thinking that the market would NOT be flooded with CC's. Ever been to a bachelor party or wedding and someone breaks out cigars. Most people will try one. Now imagine what has been taboo for decades is now legal. 80% of people that had wondered what a cuban cigar is all about would run out and pay a premium to try it. Prices would go up and quality down UNLESS the Cuban gov't put STRICT guidelines on production and FORCED quality control. It takes serious effort to maintain quality when demand is so high.


The demand worldwide is already huge and growing for Habanos. There's already virtually untapped markets in SE Asia, Russia, Middle East, and Eastern Europe that haven't been developed fully yet. All of their current distribution channels will take all they can make. The legal battles over trademarks are going to be battle in USA just to start. We'll see some select dealer in the USA, but most will be from parallel markets coming to USA.

I think Habanos learned its lesson on diluting the brand, and from what I read, they have a road map set for the next 10 years on increasing production. Regardless if USA opens up or not, they'll have to stick to their road map.

I see high prices in the USA for Habanos, and slightly increased pricing world wide. The deathblow for Habanos may be the global efforts to eradicate smoking. At some point, Cuba will have to be smoke-free in public places. How ironic...


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## fsjonsey (May 23, 2008)

I'd gladly smoke Habanos if the people who made them actually got fair compensation for their labor.

Hopefully this will become a reality in my lifetime.



mosesbotbol said:


> Well the UN thinks different, as does many world organizations. I think most will argue that our embargo has had a significant effect on Cuba.


Yeah, even though we still provide Cuba most of it's food and medical supplies.


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## duhman (Dec 3, 2007)

There will be a very hard time normalizing relations with Cuba since there is the issue of the billions of dollars they stole from US and their expatriots, even if it was more than 40 years ago.
Cuba is still defiant and won't take one step in our direction.

There are many different types of CCs and even more different types of NCs. Try them all, smoke what you like, like what you smoke.
My top favorites are mostly NCs.


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

fsjonsey said:


> I'd gladly smoke Habanos if the people who made them actually got fair compensation for their labor.
> 
> Hopefully this will become a reality in my lifetime.


:tpd:


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## Lanthor (Jun 16, 2007)

To the OP, not an expert but to relay what I have read and what some people who I consider experts have indicated; the difference in Habanos is a combination of soil, atmosphere, temperature, (overall environment) and experience in blending and production.

Like many I view it like wine, some grapes just grow better in certain places, and some people just have a skill for turning them into good wine.

Habanos has a game plan for US distribution, they are not stupid. Biggest threat there -in my mind- would be the simultanious influx of fakes.


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## Bax (Sep 12, 2007)

Lanthor said:


> Habanos has a game plan for US distribution, they are not stupid. Biggest threat there -in my mind- would be the simultanious influx of fakes.


DING DING DING!!! We have a winner!


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## bolio (Sep 19, 2007)

workers on nicaragua, dom. rep and honduras recieve an average daily 
payment of about 3 dollars, i think this is much lower on cuba. 

also, opening up trading doors with cuba would end up badly for us cigar smokers and the workers residing there. it would only result on more profit for habanos and the gov't officials but not for the workers. 

if i may say this, cuban cigars is one of the best life experience we can have, the people of cuba are the warmest people i have ever encountered, however, the cuban gov't and habanos s.a. should burn in hell for what they are doing.

just my :2.

PS

sorry for discussing politics, but i just thought everyones eyes must open up with regards to the real cuba.


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