# Do you "long time" CC smokers freeze your purchases?



## Trackmyer (Jun 6, 2014)

Yes, Im new to the world of CC's. Been smoking NC's for nearly two decades, but only recently been enjoying some of the forbidden fruit.

I have never froze cigars, never had an issue or reason to.
I know that most NC companies do a flash freeze before shipping to distribution. But after reading a member here mentioning "when his come out of the freezer", I was left wondering if CC companies do not follow this practice.

I would have thought that Habanos S.A. would do it, based on their size and market.

Any insight or tips is greatly appreciated in regards to this.


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## GoJohnnyGo (Nov 19, 2011)

Yes. I freeze everything. H.S.A. claims to freeze all the cigars before they are exported but I still freeze anyway. Freezing is easy and cigars are expensive. I don't smoke anything until it has rested for a few months so a couple extra days in the freezer to minimize beetle risk is a no-brainer.


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## Cigar-Enthusiast (Feb 2, 2014)

After much research I would recommend either freezing them or placing them in a temperature controlled environment such as a wineador, if your current storage exceeds 70 degrees F by a significant amount, because Cuban enterprise doesn't tend to adhere strictly to their business model and polices. A common example to support this is the delay of new cigars band due to remaining stocks of old bands. Thus if their freezers do breakdown I doubt they will halt the shipment of cigars to fix the freezers. The process will simply go on. Furthermore there is also the possibility that they become contaminated with eggs after being put in the freezer as well through many means, such as shipment, improper storage, et cetera. 
As you can see my philosophy is that the more variables you account for, the greater chance of success you will have.

The answer to your question is below and I posted this before at this thread here. 
http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/habanos-discussion/336269-coolidor-vs-wineador.html#post4045442



> Cuban-cigar merchants are declaring death of the tobacco weevil following a visit to a new, massive storage and quality control center in Guanabacoa, a suburb of Havana.
> 
> I visited the complex last week with English cigar merchants Jemma Freeman, head of Cuban cigar importers Hunters & Frankau, and Edward Sahakian, owner of London's Davidoff shop. The 90,000-square-foot building is a temperature- and humidity-controlled building for holding all cigar stocks for export. It has a capacity of about 70 million to 80 million cigars. Habanos S.A., the global distribution and marketing company for Cuban cigars, runs the facility.
> 
> ...


Havana Corner: Freezing in Havana | Cuba | Cigar Aficionado


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Trackmyer said:


> Yes, Im new to the world of CC's. Been smoking NC's for nearly two decades, but only recently been enjoying some of the forbidden fruit.
> 
> I have never froze cigars, never had an issue or reason to.
> I know that most NC companies do a flash freeze before shipping to distribution. But after reading a member here mentioning "when his come out of the freezer", I was left wondering if CC companies do not follow this practice.
> ...


They do freeze i never understood what that had to do with anything.
Cigars can become contaminated after the freezing process.
In warehouses during shipping etc.
Sure i freeze everything has no impact what so ever on taste etc.
Your just lucky as i was got away without freezing for many years.
Let me tell you that one time you get nailed by those buggers.
More than makes up for thinking you got away.


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## Trackmyer (Jun 6, 2014)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> They do freeze i never understood what that had to do with anything.
> Cigars can become contaminated after the freezing process.
> In warehouses during shipping etc.
> Sure i freeze everything has no impact what so ever on taste etc.
> ...


Your right, Just because I havent had any issues doesn't mean that one day....

I was never worried of freezing effecting flavor as much as my worry that I'd bone it up and ruin some good cigars in the process.


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## asmartbull (Aug 16, 2009)

Yes


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

No, I can taste the difference so I don't. All mine are kept below 70, usually around 65-66 and under 65% RH.


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Yes. No active temp control in my Aristocrat and temps can get up to 75-80* in there in the summer.


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## CeeGar (Feb 19, 2007)

I stopped freezing a while back. Mine stay in a constant 68 degree/ 60%RH environment. Also...I have never tasted anything in my life that was the same after being frozen.

I also know my grandfather and great grandfather were not concerned with freezing their cigars. I may pay a price for this line of thinking, but it's a risk I'm willing to accept.


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## Hubby (May 28, 2013)

Yup... I freeze mine to.. I would rather not risk it even thought my temps never get above 70.... Rather safe than sorry as they say...


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## dvickery (Jan 1, 2000)

in '01 or '02 i got to see the little horrors live ... yes i freeze everything .

to those who swear they can taste a difference before and after they freeze ... chances are habanos froze them and your vendor froze em also .
but that doesnt stop them from picking up hitchhikers from a shop in switzerland somewhere .

derrek


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

dvickery said:


> .
> 
> to those who swear they can taste a difference before and after they freeze ... chances are habanos froze them and your vendor froze em also .
> but that doesnt stop them from picking up hitchhikers from a shop in switzerland somewhere .
> ...


Excellent point but there is a huge difference between a sub zero flash freezer and residential freezers. One freezes them in a matter of seconds and the other takes hours if not days and few residential get sub zero. Flash freezing is done commercially for food purely because it doesn't have the same freshness degradation effects as slow freezing does. Hell they probably tried liquid nitrogen to freeze sticks but my guess is they became so brittle they began to crumble as quick as they came out of the bath. If you ever see something that is labeled IQF or individually quick frozen it went for a nitrogen bath. I'm sure the temp used is as low as they can go without compromising the sticks.

Hell I wish I couldn't tell the difference at times.


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## maverickmage (Feb 10, 2008)

The thing is that industrial freezing drops the temps a lot more quickly and far lower than what the home freezer can manage. In terms of food science, the faster it freezes the smaller the ice crystal formation which results in less cell damage.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

I think its time for a little challenge.
Like David Habano did a while back.
Cuban cigars and non cubans remember.
Only this time it will be frozen vs unfrozen sticks.
Lets see who steps up and guess right.
I am willing to bet no one can tell.
Next order i get i think i will not freeze a box thoughts.


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## Merovius (Sep 11, 2013)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> I think its time for a little challenge.
> Like David Habano did a while back.
> Cuban cigars and non cubans remember.
> Only this time it will be frozen vs unfrozen sticks.
> ...


Ill take the Pepsi challenge. I can totally tell the difference, yup...mmmhmmm thats the ticket. 

Id love to see @JustinThyme and @CeeGar take a crack at it but looks are a dead giveaway imo, especially on oily sticks that have been frozen. Not sure how you get past that.


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## FireRunner (Jul 19, 2012)

No. Been smoking since early 90s. None of my cigars have seen the inside of a freezer. I just keep them around 66-68 RH and under 70 degrees. Never a problem. 66-68 RH being key. In my region that's possible with air conditioning, etc. For some it's not possible (closer to equator). Everyone's situation is different.


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## CeeGar (Feb 19, 2007)

Merovius said:


> Ill take the Pepsi challenge. I can totally tell the difference, yup...mmmhmmm thats the ticket.
> 
> Id love to see @JustinThyme and @CeeGar take a crack at it but looks are a dead giveaway imo, especially on oily sticks that have been frozen. Not sure how you get past that.


I have demonstrated previously that I don't do so well under such pressure. :laugh:

I would never try to sway anyone to my way of thinking. If freezing your cigars lets you sleep at night, go for it. I'll just lay awake and listen to the tobacco beetles scurry about.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Merovius said:


> Ill take the Pepsi challenge. I can totally tell the difference, yup...mmmhmmm thats the ticket.
> 
> Id love to see @JustinThyme and @CeeGar take a crack at it but looks are a dead giveaway imo, especially on oily sticks that have been frozen. Not sure how you get past that.


I have plenty of oily sticks that look just fine after freezing. I mean you don't really think i of all people would do anything to hurt a Cuban Cigar.
Hey do as you like like Colin says.
In the end your the one that has to live with you decision.


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## bpegler (Mar 30, 2006)

I received a box of Montecristo #3s several years ago from a well know and respected vendor.

The entire lower level of the box, beneath the cedar partition was completely infested.

Crawling.

Needless to say, I freeze.

Let me add, if you ever get hold of some custom rolls, or farmies, and don't freeze them you are really playing with fire.


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

Me on both counts. 
I can smell the difference between coke and pespi as soon as you pop the top on a can or twist off a bottle cap, no need to taste it. Cocaholic 110%. Whats funny is whatever your preference may be the competition is too sweet. Thats my number 1 complaint about pepsi is it taste too sweet and seems less carbonated than coke.

On the sticks, I'm an engineer by trade, its my job to be an over analytical prick LOL. You can set me down with two sticks that are identical in every way, went down the same path from birth to meeting the torch and Ill point out at least a dozen differences just on casual observation alone and show you just how unique each really is.


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## Merovius (Sep 11, 2013)

CeeGar said:


> I have demonstrated previously that I don't do so well under such pressure. :laugh:
> 
> I would never try to sway anyone to my way of thinking. If freezing your cigars lets you sleep at night, go for it. I'll just lay awake and listen to the tobacco beetles scurry about.





TonyBrooklyn said:


> I have plenty of oily sticks that look just fine after freezing. I mean you don't really think i of all people would do anything to hurt a Cuban Cigar.
> Hey do as you like like Colin says.
> In the end your the one that has to live with you decision.


I think you guys misunderstood my comment which was stated tongue-in-cheek; a simple ploy to procure some of Tony's fine Habanos. 

Regarding freezing, Ive done it and the cigars were great. As far as a side-by-side experiment, I cant comment with experience.

I run a wineador so I dont have to freeze, for whatever that's worth.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Merovius said:


> I think you guys misunderstood my comment which was stated tongue-in-cheek; a simple ploy to procure some of Tony's fine Habanos.
> 
> Regarding freezing, Ive done it and the cigars were great. As far as a side-by-side experiment, I cant comment with experience.
> 
> I run a wineador so I dont have to freeze, for whatever that's worth.


Well now that you mention it i have had several cigars out of wineador's. IMHO they have a funky kinda musty smell and taste to them. Reminds me of the house i sold 6 months back. I have also noticed the wrappers on some to appear wrinkled sorta like an old persons skin YMMV.
But that's another topic i apologise for the thread jack carry on gents!


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## piperdown (Jul 19, 2009)

I freeze everything coming from cuba.

Had a few cigars come in with nice little round holes a few years back.

Being that my pallet is probably on par with a mountain goat, I don't taste a difference.


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## SeanTheEvans (Dec 13, 2013)

JustinThyme said:


> Thats my number 1 complaint about pepsi is it taste too sweet and seems less carbonated than coke.


I'd totally agree. That's why I only prefer Coke at restaurants, as a fountain drink. Too much bubbly for me when coming out of a can. It tickles my nose too much and I can't enjoy my beverage.

I'll certainly attempt to discern any differences between any of Tony's cigars. I have yet to taste a "frozen" cigar, as far as I know, although I've smoked some gifts from members here, so perhaps I have...

That being said, I don't freeze. Trying to get a wineador set up, but have my cigars all temp controlled <70F in the meantime. I've gone above a degree or two for a couple hours perhaps, but never any longer durations. Never any problems, but that's just me, and if anyone has seen the pictures they know that I love playing with fire[works].

@TonyBrooklyn, are you saying cigars from a wineador were all musty smelling and shriveled? I think this is the first I've heard of this, but would be interested to know if this is a common experience. It may second-guess my switch to a wineador...


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## LGHT (Oct 12, 2009)

I guess i'm lucky because I have never frozen a single box in almost 15 years. I do inspect each box upon arrival.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

SeanTheEvans said:


> I'd totally agree. That's why I only prefer Coke at restaurants, as a fountain drink. Too much bubbly for me when coming out of a can. It tickles my nose too much and I can't enjoy my beverage.
> 
> I'll certainly attempt to discern any differences between any of Tony's cigars. I have yet to taste a "frozen" cigar, as far as I know, although I've smoked some gifts from members here, so perhaps I have...
> 
> ...


What i am saying is i have had cigars gifted to me from winedors that was my personal experience with them. Could have been error on the part of those that stored them maybe i guess i dunno. All i know is when i pull a bottle of wine out of a wineador. The bottle is moist to the touch Hmmmmmmmmmmm!When i was trying to make up my mind on whether to freeze or not go the wineador route kitty litter beads etc etc etc. The list is endless on all the things i have tried in nearly 35 years of cigar smoking. What i taste or don't taste should really have no impact on your decision. Its a long journey with many roads to travel like life. Don't ever let anyone hand cuff you or put you in a box. Because you are to afraid to try or think for yourself. That being said i got away without freezing for about 20 years. But boy when i got hit it was a doozy! At this stage of the game i don't choose to do something or not because it is fashionable to do so. I do it because it works. That took a long time to achieve. A couple of old timers taught me most of what i know. They said and i quote "Son take the cotton out of your ears and stick it in your mouth" All they asked was that i pay it forward. That's all i do whenever i post on here. As far as freezing`like Kitty Litter it works for me!


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Frozen v. Unfrozen would be an interesting random blind taste test.


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## Jordan23 (May 25, 2012)

Yep....I freeze EVERYTHING and do random inspections of my boxes/sticks.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Just lit an RYJ 2004 Hermosos #2 EL. My last one in fact. This fine Seegar has been frozen and stored at low R/H in the 50's. And is smoking fantastic. Wish i had more to freeze.


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## SmokinSpider (May 12, 2010)

Well as a never had a CC smoker I must admit that this is a very interesting read. I never would have guessed people were so "for" or "against" freezing. 

Now I am off to find a Coke, I'm very thirsty all of a sudden.


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## havanajohn (Apr 4, 2009)

I am with the non freeze crowd.


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## MDSPHOTO (Sep 10, 2013)

I'm a new CC guy, but based on the fog's recommendations i froze my first batch.


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## Jordan23 (May 25, 2012)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> Just lit an RYJ 2004 Hermosos #2 EL. My last one in fact. This fine Seegar has been frozen and stored at low R/H in the 50's. And is smoking fantastic. Wish i had more to freeze.


Tony I rarely have draw problems with my sticks (and when I do a draw tool fixes it) but all this talk of 50 RH has me curious. I might set up a tupperware bowl with some REALLY dry KL and see if I like it.

To the OP, again I freeze everything...helps me sleep easier.


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## the nub (Mar 24, 2006)

IMHO freezing is like insurance. If you have a dozen or a couple hundred then you may not feel the need and think the risk/reward ration is not worth it. OTOH if you have a few thousand, or tens of thousands like some people I know, then freezing is a good step in reducing your chances of infestation, especially when it might be difficult to go through your entire stock to check for damage. BTW for those who think 70F is the safe zone to stop hatching, think again. I have a good friend who had an outbreak at 58F in his temp controlled freezer. That might not be common, but it can happen. 

Back in the old ASC days someone did a blind taste test with twenty tasters. Not one of them was able to tell the difference. A couple were able to guess but admitted it was a complete guess and they had no idea which was frozen and which wasn't. It might be possible that some are able to detect the difference but chances are the vast majority could not.


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## six10 (May 23, 2013)

I am in the freeze everything crowd.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

the nub said:


> IMHO freezing is like insurance. If you have a dozen or a couple hundred then you may not feel the need and think the risk/reward ration is not worth it. OTOH if you have a few thousand, or tens of thousands like some people I know, then freezing is a good step in reducing your chances of infestation, especially when it might be difficult to go through your entire stock to check for damage. BTW for those who think 70F is the safe zone to stop hatching, think again. I have a good friend who had an outbreak at 58F in his temp controlled freezer. That might not be common, but it can happen.
> 
> Back in the old ASC days someone did a blind taste test with twenty tasters. Not one of them was able to tell the difference. A couple were able to guess but admitted it was a complete guess and they had no idea which was frozen and which wasn't. It might be possible that some are able to detect the difference but chances are the vast majority could not.


Great post and so true.
Before i ventured into freezing i had tried many times to tell the difference.
I then set up a party with all my cigar smoking friends and some that did not smoke cigars ,either exclusively or occasionally.
The list was long out of nearly 30 participants only 3 got it right .
In the end the same conclusion they were just lucky guesses.
We continued to drink and eat.
Then i dropped the bomb on them. 
They could not believe the final results.


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## Trackmyer (Jun 6, 2014)

Alright it seems fairly common on both sides as to their choice. 

Next questions are for the freezer crowd.

I do have two deep freezers. One of which has a digital setting is a constant -3'f. 
Do you folks put the whole box in the freezer as it arrived? Remove cigars and triple bag? 
What is your process for boxes vs. sticks?


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## six10 (May 23, 2013)

I take them out and double freezer bag them single row then go two days in a regular freezer. Then thaw in unopened bag on kitchen table for a few hours. This process always worked for me so I stuck with it. The only thing I've ever heard going wrong was when someone mechanically sucked air out of bag with a shrink wrapper or something.


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## protekk (Oct 18, 2010)

I freeze the whole box. 3 Freezerbags with air sucked out of each and into the freezer for 5 full days then one day room temp in unopened freezer bags then to the humi. For loose sticks use same process just drop to 3 days in the freezer


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## john_007 (Nov 4, 2011)

I never freeze, I am lazy is all. I have in the past on NC stuff but just dont anymore. Not really much to add.


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## the nub (Mar 24, 2006)

six10 said:


> I take them out and double freezer bag them single row then go two days in a regular freezer. Then thaw in unopened bag on kitchen table for a few hours. This process always worked for me so I stuck with it. The only thing I've ever heard going wrong was when someone mechanically sucked air out of bag with a shrink wrapper or something.


do you freeze the box? If not, you should. It would be quite easy to miss spotting a bug or larvae in the corners and crevices of a box, especially a cab.


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## six10 (May 23, 2013)

the nub said:


> do you freeze the box? If not, you should. It would be quite easy to miss spotting a bug or larvae in the corners and crevices of a box, especially a cab.


Good point. I don't always store them in boxes or cabs at first but will do this. Thanks.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

protekk said:


> I freeze the whole box. 3 Freezerbags with air sucked out of each and into the freezer for 5 full days then one day room temp in unopened freezer bags then to the humi. For loose sticks use same process just drop to 3 days in the freezer


_THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!_


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Our dog's biscuits just had a major outbreak of pantry beetles. They were decimated like that infamous photo of the Padron Annys that is all over the internet. Nervous about my already frozen sticks. My Aristocrat has the small hole in the back for the active humidification power source connection. Will be checking them often over the next few days.


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## knilas (Sep 15, 2013)

I would have to agree with the risk/reward comment from above. Guess it depends on how many you're willing to lose. Personally, I've not frozen a single stick. But then again, I don't have as many to lose as most do.


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