# I think I got duped!!!



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Tell me what this list is worth at retail price please....and then Ill elaborate. Theres a scam going around!!

Partagas 4.5x48?
Romeo Y Julietta Maduro 5x52
Onyx Torbusto
Montecristo Platinum Tubo 6x52
2) Olgr Fuerte 5x50
Padron 1964 Natural 5.5 x?? box press
Padron 1964 natural 4.5x?? box press
Hoyo De Monterey 6x50 Maybe a CT Shade?
Immenso 6.75x70?
Diablo Picantes 4.75x50
Ashton Puro Sol 5.5x44
AVO 5x52
Baccarat 8.5x54
Indian Tabac Limited reserve Cedar Wrap with gold band on bottom 6.5x50

These are all singles and the padron have some small cracks in the wrapper and caps. 

So lets hear it put a real number on these, not an exaggerated price but a real honest number as to what they are worth.

Thanks Guys.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

Well the Padrons are by far the most expensive, and if they have cracks in the heads, they may be worthless.

I would venture a guess around $80-90 for retail, off the top of my head with no research. That is my "high" end opinion.


----------



## muziq (Mar 14, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> Well the Padrons are by far the most expensive, and if they have cracks in the heads, they may be worthless.
> 
> I would venture a guess around $80-90 for retail, off the top of my head with no research. That is my "high" end opinion.


That figures right by me. Tops would be $100 w/tax.

So, what's the deal?


----------



## Bobb (Jun 26, 2006)

muziq said:


> That figures right by me. Tops would be $100 w/tax.
> 
> So, what's the deal?


:tpd:

$80-$100 sounds about right


----------



## floydpink (Feb 15, 2007)

Not jumping to conclusions, but I would hope that if you were in fact duped, you would post the duper's name. Reason being, the $100 retail seems to ring a bell and there was a similar offer not long ago offering singles and boxes to be around the c-note range.

I haven't heard good or bad about the previous offer nor seen the poster lately until i got a message yesterday asking if I was still interested.

This could get interesting, as I trusted my gut and pulled away from my offer.


----------



## trogdor | the burninator (Jan 4, 2007)

floydpink said:


> Not jumping to conclusions, but I would hope that if you were in fact duped, you would post the duper's name. Reason being, the $100 retail seems to ring a bell and there was a similar offer not long ago offering singles and boxes to be around the c-note range.
> 
> I haven't heard good or bad about the previous offer nor seen the poster lately until i got a message yesterday asking if I was still interested.
> 
> This could get interesting, as I trusted my gut and pulled away from my offer.


yeah, i'd be curious, as well. i know bluehavanaII had a $100 deal goin on, but i jumped on that and received my cigars within two days (top notch service)...so do tell~


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Has nothing to do with he $100 deals from BlueHavana.

Remember this thread I started a while back about a good deal I got? http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73841

Well I spoke, at length, to this guy and determined he had a LOT of smokes. I told him I was low on cash but would like a box of Onyx, and to round off the remainder with some high end stuff and stuff I hadn't tried yet but he determined I liked i.e. Ashton VSG, Aged Maduro, Heritage etc Padron 1926, and 1964, and other Maduros and SG's I hadn't tried. the deal just like last time was half of retail. I paid 250 Shipped for the last big order you see there and the book was a gift.

Well this time I had no communication for a week! NOTHING. When he finally gets back with me he says he was practicing ALL day for a church event. I said no problem hes a religious guy and that will keep him honest. Then NO communication for a few days, and then excuses why this small order hadn't gotten out. Last e-mail i got said that it was shipped, he threw in some extras because of the delay, and that there were roughly 30 smokes in the box. I thought great! And that is what I got....

This guy is a scammer, and I am FAR from the only one. I know of one other guy he took for $5,000!!!!!!!

Beware! regardless if he makes my situation right or not I am still pissed. There are others besides us two also. Some people here have met him in person.

I expect $50 back or more cigars. I didn't want nor will I probably even smoke 3/4 of these sticks he sent.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

The deal I made was for $100 shipped! All cigars at 1/2 or MORE off of RETAIL!!!!

I got smoke up my ass with no lube on this deal! Lucky it wasnt a big order like I wanted it to be.


----------



## [OT] Loki (May 24, 2006)

BostonBull said:


> I said no problem hes a religious guy and that will keep him honest..


this was your first mistake


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

[OT] Loki said:


> this was your first mistake


CULT!!!! :hn


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

The mebers name for those who dont follow the link is BIGBEEFY79


----------



## burninator (Jul 11, 2006)

You sure this is best handled publicly?


----------



## Kayak_Rat (Nov 28, 2005)

Isn't he the guy that you told the whole board was upstanding and a great BOTL to trade with?


----------



## stormin (Feb 11, 2005)

What exactly was the deal? Did you specifically agree to certain types and quantities of cigars? And he sent less then agreed? Or did you agree to send him $100 and he would send you an unspecified number of unnamed smokes?

If the latter is true, then although you didn't get a great deal, you didn't get totally ripped off either. The closest B&M to me is in Buffalo. The cigars you listed would cost me $100 there.

If you agreed to specific numbers, brands and sizes and he didn't send them, then you were definitely ripped off.

:2


----------



## stormin (Feb 11, 2005)

[OT] Loki said:


> this was your first mistake


What do you mean? Some of here go to church and would be considered "religious" by some folks standards.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

The thread you linked has you gushing over what an awesome deal you got and what a great guy he was. I am not sure I understand what has changed, can you explain what has changed?


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

burninator said:


> You sure this is best handled publicly?


Personally, not sure.
However, one thing I know, I would never buy cigars from someone whose only posts and contributions to CS are on three threads talking about selling his collection.
That was mistake numero uno.
Perhaps taking it openly as this helps others realize that you should never enter into mail monetary agreements with someone you know nothing of.


----------



## burninator (Jul 11, 2006)

stormin said:


> What do you mean? Some of here go to church and would be considered "religious" by some folks standards.


I think he just means that it was a mistake to figure the guy was trustworthy based on the fact that he goes to church.


----------



## stormin (Feb 11, 2005)

burninator said:


> I think he just means that it was a mistake to figure the guy was trustworthy based on the fact that he goes to church.


Sorry. Easy miscommunicate/misinterpret when reading forums. If I misunderstood, I apologize.


----------



## Kayak_Rat (Nov 28, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> The thread you linked has you gushing over what an awesome deal you got and what a great guy he was. I am not sure I understand what has changed, can you explain what has changed?


http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showpost.php?p=835901&postcount=19


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

I know that BB is not the only member who is unhappy with his transactions with BigBeefy79. Mr Beef has not logged on since 3/28/07, and I am guessing we have seen the last of him. Knowing of at least one other situation was my determining factor on not making an issue of BostonBull going public with this.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

Kayak_Rat said:


> http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showpost.php?p=835901&postcount=19


http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73841


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

burninator said:


> You sure this is best handled publicly?


Yes


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Kayak_Rat said:


> Isn't he the guy that you told the whole board was upstanding and a great BOTL to trade with?


yes I did......I was suckered into dealing with him and I feel he used me as publicity with that great deal.



stormin said:


> What exactly was the deal? Did you specifically agree to certain types and quantities of cigars? And he sent less then agreed? Or did you agree to send him $100 and he would send you an unspecified number of unnamed smokes?
> 
> If the latter is true, then although you didn't get a great deal, you didn't get totally ripped off either. The closest B&M to me is in Buffalo. The cigars you listed would cost me $100 there.
> 
> ...


I told him I had $100 to spend. I wanted a full box or thereabouts of ONYX Mini Belicoso, And to make up the remainder of $60-$70 with Some High end stuff I wanted, and named. i got 2 of those and 14 others of stuff I never dicussed or wanted.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> Yes


OK...then please explain what changed from the time you posted that this guy was the new Messiah. I am not taking you to task at this point for publically posting, but we do have some procedures at CS. Please explain or I will close this thread.


----------



## mdtaggart (Sep 22, 2006)

icehog3 said:


> The thread you linked has you gushing over what an awesome deal you got and what a great guy he was. I am not sure I understand what has changed, can you explain what has changed?


Inquiring minds want to know.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

icehog3 said:


> The thread you linked has you gushing over what an awesome deal you got and what a great guy he was. I am not sure I understand what has changed, can you explain what has changed?


I spoke to him on the phone and through e-mail. It is understood that ALL cigars sold are at Half or MORE off of reatail prices.

I told him what I wanted, NEVR got it.
There was no communication for one solid week AFTER I PAYPAL the money to him! And then for one more week communication is scarce at best.

I recieve my package, LATE, and it is Not even close to wht he told me I was getting. I got an e-mail from him a few days ago saying he sent some nice stuff that I will be impressed with and there was "around" 30 sticks in the box. there were 16, with one so damagd I couldnt even think of smoking it, and two more with cracks in them.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> yes I did......I was suckered into dealing with him and I feel he used me as publicity with that great deal.
> 
> I told him I had $100 to spend. I wanted a full box or thereabouts of ONYX Mini Belicoso, And to make up the remainder of $60-$70 with Some High end stuff I wanted, and named. i got 2 of those and 14 others of stuff I never dicussed or wanted.


How were you used? They were your words. :2

You got $80-$100 of stuff for $60-$70. Did you make suggestions, or did you specifically agree on what cigars he was sending?

Again, not trying to rail you, just trying to bring out the truth.


----------



## Kayak_Rat (Nov 28, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> yes I did......I was suckered into dealing with him and I feel he used me as publicity with that great deal.


I would say that it is of your own doing. The MODS and FOG's warn repeatedly about this exact thing. It is of your own ignorance that this happened. Even Pnoon pointed out this was fishy. This happens over and over and some people never learn.


----------



## Puffin Fresh (Nov 1, 2006)

BostonBull said:


> yes I did......I was suckered into dealing with him and I feel he used me as publicity with that great deal.
> 
> I told him I had $100 to spend. I wanted a full box or thereabouts of ONYX Mini Belicoso, And to make up the remainder of $60-$70 with Some High end stuff I wanted, and named. i got 2 of those and 14 others of stuff I never dicussed or wanted.


Hey man, I think people are confused as to why you posted that you got such a great deal and now you are complaining about the same deal. I think you are just having a hard to explaining the situation, as I am sure there is more than people are getting here.

From what I heard from you, it sounds like you got this great deal, and in turn it suckered you into buying more. Then on that second transaction you got ripped off. Is that correct?


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

AND the fact that there are other people involved in dealing with this guy who are out THOUSANDS of dollars!!!! I think people should be aware that he is a scammer and doesnt follow through on what he says. Up until I got this package today he still promised there would be lots of smokes worth at least double what I sent him. 

So I sent 100 expecting 200 worth of smokes. I barely got 100 worth. And shit communication and stories of being robbed, strep throat and church projects....all in ONE week.


----------



## [OT] Loki (May 24, 2006)

stormin said:


> What do you mean? Some of here go to church and would be considered "religious" by some folks standards.


assuming that someone is a good person simply because they go to church or a horrible person because they don't is flawed logic


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Greerzilla said:


> Hey man, I think people are confused as to why you posted that you got such a great deal and now you are complaining about the same deal. I think you are just having a hard to explaining the situation, as I am sure there is more than people are getting here.
> 
> From what I heard from you, it sounds like you got this great deal, and in turn it suckered you into buying more. Then on that second transaction you got ripped off. Is that correct?


I am not complaining about the original deal.....I am complaining about the first post in this thread.

This should be used as a informational post. I know XXXXXX is out $5k!!!!! He just callede and said hes on the raod but will tell his tale tonight when he gets home. And I am out around a $50.

JUst Beware.

*EDIT: I removed the other member's name, it is up to him whether he wants his name and story public, please leave that to him...icehog3.*


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

So you were owed $120-140 in smokes (considering the 1/2 MSRP) deal, and you did get less than that. You also got less smokes than you were promised, and a couple damaged smokes too. Yes, I would say you got stiffed.

Unfortunately, I think we have seen the last of BigBeefy79 here. I know at least one member is taking legal action against this guy. I guess that isn't feasible for you since the fees would outweigh what you would recover.

I think it sucks that this happened to you, but I think some people made a big mistake spending money with a guy who joined a couple days earlier and only posted to make money. This is part of the reason we have a waiting period for members before they can use the WTS Forums, because chit like this happens. This guy circumvented the rules, used the retailers Forum and ripped some of our people off. I am sorry some of our guys had to take it in the behind, I hope this might be a lesson to some of our newer members in the long run.:2


----------



## burninator (Jul 11, 2006)

Greerzilla said:


> Hey man, I think people are confused as to why you posted that you got such a great deal and now you are complaining about the same deal. I think you are just having a hard to explaining the situation, as I am sure there is more than people are getting here.
> 
> From what I heard from you, it sounds like you got this great deal, and in turn it suckered you into buying more. Then on that second transaction you got ripped off. Is that correct?


This is what he seems to be alluding to, but I'm really having a hard time piecing it together.


----------



## stormin (Feb 11, 2005)

[OT] Loki said:


> assuming that someone is a good person simply because they go to church or a horrible person because they don't is flawed logic


Not if you go to my church. :ss

Actually, my church maintains a homeless shelter which is attached to the church. Many of the residents attend church on Sunday. Some are trustworthy, some are not (much like the general population before you jump on me for stereotyping). The cook at the shelter, a 30 something SF, fell for one of the residents and was taken for $5,000. Now she has to work 2 jobs.

Sorry to thread jack...back to the debate at hand.


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> So you were owed $120-140 in smokes (considering the 1/2 MSRP) deal, and you did get less than that. You also got less smokes than you were promised, and a couple damaged smokes too. Yes, I would say you got stiffed.
> 
> Unfortunately, I think we have seen the last of BigBeefy79 here. I know at least one member is taking legal action against this guy. I guess that isn't feasible for you since the fees would outweigh what you would recover.
> 
> I think it sucks that this happened to you, but I think some people made a big mistake spending money with a guy who joined a couple days earlier and only posted to make money. This is part of the reason we have a waiting period for members before they can use the WTS Forums, because chit like this happens. This guy circumvented the rules, used the retailers Forum and ripped some of our people off. I am sorry some of our guys had to take it in the behind, I hope this might be a lesson to some of our newer members in the long run.:2


:tpd: 
Unreal!!!
This is as nuts as the emails from Africa to offer up your bank accounts or pay money to get money.
How can one possibly be so blinded to "good" deals?
How can you offer (in the case of one member $5,000) large amounts of money to someone you know nothing of? Whose limited posts are visible to all on CS by viewing their profile? Who you can obviously see came here to take money from you?
People, wake up and stop volunteering to be victims.
Holy crap!!!


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Greerzilla said:


> From what I heard from you, it sounds like you got this great deal, and in turn it suckered you into buying more. Then on that second transaction you got ripped off. Is that correct?


This is absolutely correct, and simple.....I should have said that!


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

Caveat Emptor at its most obvious.


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> This is absolutely correct, and simple.....I should have said that!


Classic bait and switch.
Hell if I ever buy anything from anyone I don't know extremely well, or an established vendor.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Blueface said:


> :tpd:
> Unreal!!!
> This is as nuts as the emails from Africa to offer up your bank accounts or pay money to get money.
> How can one possibly be so blinded to "good" deals?
> ...


I know for a FACT we both spoke to BigBeefy on the phone for well over 6 hours total each!!

DaKlug and XXXXX have been talking about this Via PM, for a week or so, XXXXXX wanted me to add that.

EDIT: PLEASE allow the other member to post this when he wants! icehog3


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

I was owed $100 in smokes. That one hundered SHOULD have bought $200 worth of smokes with his "half off sale"


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> I know for a FACT we both spoke to BigBeefy on the phone for well over 6 hours total each!!
> 
> DaKlug and PathMan have been talking about this Via PM, for a week or so, XXXXXX wanted me to add that.


And now you are a mouthpiece for XXXXX?
You should speak for yourself and no one else.


----------



## [OT] Loki (May 24, 2006)

stormin said:


> Not if you go to my church. :ss
> 
> Actually, my church maintains a homeless shelter which is attached to the church. Many of the residents attend church on Sunday. Some are trustworthy, some are not (much like the general population before you jump on me for stereotyping). The cook at the shelter, a 30 something SF, fell for one of the residents and was taken for $5,000. Now she has to work 2 jobs.
> 
> Sorry to thread jack...back to the debate at hand.


all i'm saying is church going people can be just as big as scum as the rest of the world.

sorry to get the thread offtopic but i'm in an even bigger anti-religion mode than normal


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

pnoon said:


> And now you are a mouthpiece for XXXXXX?
> You should speak for yourself and no one else.


I am on the phone with him, as he is in his car driving as I type this.

I am a mouthpiece for NOONE! I am noones punk!


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> I am on the phone with him, as he is in his car driving as I type this.
> 
> I am a mouthpiece for NOONE! I am noones punk!


Pathman is logged on now, he can do this in his car??


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> I am on the phone with him, as he is in his car driving as I type this.
> 
> I am a mouthpiece for NOONE! I am noones punk!


:r :r :r


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Look guys I started this thread to see where I stood. I found out I got taken, and proceeded with my story.

I am not looking to start a witch trial. I am just looking to make people aware that this guy took som people here for a LOT of money. I luckily went with my gut and only sent a small amount of $$$. I am glad it happened like this and not a $1,000 order.

Again not trying to start trouble/flame wars.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

icehog3 said:


> Pathman is logged on now, he can do this in his car??


wife?..I am unsure who?


----------



## Kayak_Rat (Nov 28, 2005)

My god, here we go again. Who's on first?

(that was pure sarcasm)


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> Pathman is logged on now, he can do this in his car??


Oooops!


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> Look guys I started this thread to see where I stood. I found out I got taken, and proceeded with my story.
> 
> I am not looking to start a witch trial. I am just looking to make people aware that this guy took som people here for a LOT of money. I luckily went with my gut and only sent a small amount of $$$. I am glad it happened like this and not a $1,000 order.
> 
> Again not trying to start trouble/flame wars.


Then stick to your own issue and don't speak for anyone else.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> Look guys I started this thread to see where I stood. I found out I got taken, and proceeded with my story.
> 
> I am not looking to start a witch trial. I am just looking to make people aware that this guy took som people here for a LOT of money. I luckily went with my gut and only sent a small amount of $$$. I am glad it happened like this and not a $1,000 order.
> 
> Again not trying to start trouble/flame wars.


Understood, you have some legitimate beefs.

My beef is that I asked you not to mention pathman by name and let him decide if he wanted to go public. He was logged on the first time you did it, right up until 4:30PM CST, so the "he is driving" seems a little strange.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

icehog3 said:


> Understood, you have some legitimate beefs.
> 
> My beef is that I asked you not to mention pathman by name and let him decide if he wanted to go public. He was logged on the first time you did it, right up until 4:30PM CST, so the "he is driving" seems a little strange.


Understood!

lesson learned.


----------



## SDmate (Apr 24, 2005)

all I can say is you were warned by more than a few elders & you didn't listen
so you get what ya get...
one of lifes lessons I guess


----------



## montecristo#2 (May 29, 2006)

Wow, this has gone from bad to worse.

Lets face it, this guy has taken at least two CS members for a ride. One of them is taking legal action the other is out about $50 dollars. 

BostonBull, considering you got a pretty decent deal the first time around, I think in the end you are doing alright. Obviously, it didn't turn out the way you wanted and it is now clear this guy is not legit. Considering he has not logged in to CS in over two weeks, most likely he is gone. He took the money and ran.

It probably would have been better to state the problem in the original post instead of trying to make this a guessing game. Your complaint would have been much clearer and everyone would have understood your problem. 

This guy definitely seemed fishy from the beginning and this is a sad episode to say the least.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

I will leave this open so pathman can decide what he wants to say, as long as the thread doesn't get more out of hand. I think pathman has a right to say what he will here, as I am personally aware of his dealings with bigbeefy79.

As I said, I think unfortunately bb79 has taken his money and run, so mod actions against him would be rather pointless at this juncture.


----------



## pathman (Oct 15, 2006)

pathman is in the car driving as we speak. he is/was on the phone with "boston bull". pathman will tell his story when he gets home if he wants. Hope this helps the people that were confused.

-wife


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

pathman said:


> pathman is in the car driving as we speak. he is/was on the phone with "boston bull". pathman will tell his story when he gets home if he wants. Hope this helps the people that were confused.
> 
> -wife


Thanks, I will leave this open for him as I think he has the right to speak here, based on what happened to him. :2


----------



## pistol (Mar 23, 2006)

So this guy turned out to be a scumbag huh? Shocking... Isn't this why the rules are in place for the WTB/WTS forum? This is a classic example of getting burned because someone circumvented the rules (that are there for a reason). Sorry to BB and Pathman for getting hosed, but maybe now people will quit bitching about the requirements to access the WTB/WTS area.:2


----------



## RGD (May 10, 2006)

Just to recap for some of you newer guys looking for a short way - read and learn!



Kayak_Rat said:


> I would say that it is of your own doing. *The MODS and FOG's warn repeatedly about this exact thing.* It is of your own ignorance that this happened. Even Pnoon pointed out this was fishy. *This happens over and over and some people never learn.*





pistol said:


> So this guy turned out to be a scumbag huh? Shocking... *Isn't this why the rules are in place for the WTB/WTS forum? This is a classic example of getting burned because someone circumvented the rules (that are there for a reason).* Sorry to BB and Pathman for getting hosed, but maybe now people will quit bitching about the requirements to access the WTB/WTS area.:2





icehog3 said:


> So you were owed $120-140 in smokes (considering the 1/2 MSRP) deal, and you did get less than that. You also got less smokes than you were promised, and a couple damaged smokes too. Yes, I would say you got stiffed.
> 
> *Unfortunately, I think we have seen the last of BigBeefy79 here*. I know at least one member is taking legal action against this guy. I guess that isn't feasible for you since the fees would outweigh what you would recover.
> 
> I think it sucks that this happened to you, but I think *some people made a big mistake spending money with a guy who joined a couple days earlier and only posted to make money. This is part of the reason we have a waiting period for members before they can use the WTS Forums, because chit like this happens. This guy circumvented the rules, used the retailers Forum and ripped some of our people off. I am sorry some of our guys had to take it in the behind, I hope this might be a lesson to some of our newer members in the long run*.:2


Ron


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

pistol said:


> So this guy turned out to be a scumbag huh? Shocking... Isn't this why the rules are in place for the WTB/WTS forum? This is a classic example of getting burned because someone circumvented the rules (that are there for a reason). Sorry to BB and Pathman for getting hosed, but maybe now people will quit bitching about the requirements to access the WTB/WTS area.:2


Good post! I cant wait until i gain access to that part, I am only dealing with people with trader feedback, or that come HIGHLY recommended from established memebers.

I am glad I kept e-mails from this clown!


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> Good post! I cant wait until i gain access to that part, I am only dealing with people with trader feedback, or that come HIGHLY recommended from established memebers.
> 
> I am glad I kept e-mails from this clown!


Just because you or anyone else has access to the WTB/WTS forum does not guarantee anything. Don't think you are immune from scams just because you have access.


----------



## mr.c (Apr 8, 2004)

Damn, Now I am thinking that I didnt actually win the Nigerian Lottery. This thread is just ...wow.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

mr.c said:


> Damn, Now I am thinking that I didnt actually win the Nigerian Lottery. This is just ...wow.


You didn't Joe......I just got an e-mail....I won it.


----------



## trogdor | the burninator (Jan 4, 2007)

BostonBull said:


> Good post! I cant wait until i gain access to that part, I am only dealing with people with trader feedback, or that come HIGHLY recommended from established memebers.
> 
> I am glad I kept e-mails from this clown!


BB, i think you're doing handling this thread pretty well and i'm glad you can see that the BOTLs here are just trying to help and get clarification at the same time, it's not necessarily a flame war. i've seen other guys post their initial issues and then got what they felt were flames...and then they would explode into supernova's of ridiculousness. i just wanted to acknowledge that.

the other thing i wanted to note is that it might not be a bad idea to collect a few of these threads where people get burned by "seemingly trustworthy new posters with stupendous unbelievable deals" and make a sticky referencing them. a "Why you should listen to the FOGs and MODs when making Trades/Purchases and Life Altering Decisions". i think real life examples we can point to would help in discouraging tasting the forbidden fruit...
:2


----------



## jesto68 (Dec 7, 2006)

trogdor | the burninator said:


> the other thing i wanted to note is that it might not be a bad idea to collect a few of these threads where people get burned by "seemingly trustworthy new posters with stupendous unbelievable deals" and make a sticky referencing them. a "Why you should listen to the FOGs and MODs when making Trades/Purchases and Life Altering Decisions". i think real life examples we can point to would help in discouraging tasting the forbidden fruit...
> :2


:tpd:


----------



## Mr. White (Dec 4, 2004)

This was a rather classic scam. As someone else mentioned, you got the Bait and Switch version of it. I'm guessing Pathman didn't even get that lucky. This guy sounds like a rather stupid con-man (or is he?) A good con-man would have left no way for you to contact him afterwards. So I would have to wonder if he used his real address and other info or if he offered up fake emails and information specifically for this purpose. Big Beefy is probably still around using another user-name to see where this goes. 

If I had to guess, I would say this isn't the first time this guy has done something like this, and won't be the last. The whole "church" thing smacks of something that a con-man would use to get old ladies to give up their life savings. heh. If you've ever spent any time at all dealing with people on the seedier side of things then you'd know that the "church" issue is the first thing a person mentions (and then is oft-repeated after that) when you are about to be taken for a ride.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

I know of one other man on this baord....who will remain nameless!!....tha went to his house and bought a bunch of stuff. he had nothing but :r :c to say!


----------



## ResIpsa (Mar 8, 2006)

bigbeefy79 said:


> All Prices Are Not Set In Stone Any Resonable Offer Accepted
> Thank You Matt





pnoon said:


> As long as it is done via PM.
> This is NOT an auction.





bigbeefy79 said:


> Ok thank you for letting me know still working on learning your by-laws. Thank You Matt


This series of exchanges were BigBeefys last posts here. Once Peter let BigBeefy know this was not an auction house, POOF, like the wind he was gone and stopped posting. I don't know what was going on behind the scenes, but anyone tracking the situation should have smelled the stink from that moment on, at the very latest. There's only so much the mods can do to protect the members here, at some point we have to look out for ourselves and listen to those little warning bells going off in our heads.

I'm sorry members got taken. Guess we're never too old to learn that if something seems too good to be true, it probably is.


----------



## theycallmedan'lboone (Feb 22, 2007)

Not that I would suggest violence against someone, but if you know where he lives.... walmart sells shotguns.... you could always insist on getting your money back... 
Sarcasm...


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

theycallmedan'lboone said:


> Not that I would suggest violence against someone, but if you know where he lives.... walmart sells shotguns.... you could always insist on getting your money back...
> Sarcasm...


Yup....$50 in cigars is worth life in prison......Sarcasm....


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

theycallmedan'lboone said:


> Not that I would suggest violence against someone, but if you know where he lives.... walmart sells shotguns.... you could always insist on getting your money back...
> Sarcasm...


:bn . . . . sarcasm (maybe not)


----------



## justinphilly-cl (Sep 7, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> Yup....$50 in cigars is worth life in prison......Sarcasm....


it just all depends on who you are sharing your cell with.... (sarcasm)


----------



## Da Klugs (Jan 8, 2005)

Tried to warn you guys in the first thread he posted. He should send first as he was an "unkown quantity". Peter said not to do business via PM but out in the open in a thread.

You did neither. The list of cigars seems OK for $ 100. Take it as a learning experience, at least you got some cigars.

Got burned for $ 2500 on a box of Dunhill Mohitos once. Never even got a callback much less any cigars to smoke.

A relatively inexpensive lesson far more valuable than the small amount of $$ you feel you were cheated out of.

I'm guessing you wont be seeing BB again here.


----------



## floydpink (Feb 15, 2007)

I vote we rename this whole thread, "Where's the Beef?"

I didn't like that guy from his first post.


----------



## justinphilly-cl (Sep 7, 2005)

Da Klugs said:


> The list of cigars seems OK for $ 100. Take it as a learning experience, at least you got some cigars.
> 
> I'm guessing you wont be seeing BB again here.


just like in the Bronx Tale... For $100, he's out of your life forever, you got off easy.. (well, i think in the movie it was like 20 bucks, but you get the idea)

people should lheed klugs' and peter's warnings.. they have been here awhile, and i am sure they have seen some pretty shady characters offering some pretty shady deals over the past few years.


----------



## No1der (Apr 2, 2007)

Wow, I feel bad for anyone who got taken cause that has to suck. I've never been taken for more than $10 but that's only because I tend not to trust the man in the street.

Unless the guy has something equivalent to an eBay rating or a CS rating I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot stogie.

But that's just me and obviously I'm a newbie around these parts.


----------



## larryinlc (Oct 22, 2005)

I really hadn't been paying attention to Mr Beefy, but looking at one of his first posts, well, things could have been much worse.....

*"Actually I call it inventory but that isn't what I was refering to I was refering to my personal collection if somebody wants all my inventory they can have it for $220,000 and will call it good it would be a great start for someone wanting to open a buisness if there a serious buyer and not just pulling my chain."*

Larry


----------



## Kiss079 (Mar 25, 2007)

WOW, this whole thing sucks. At least you got the word out, I know I learned a little something today.


----------



## floydpink (Feb 15, 2007)

larryinlc said:


> I really hadn't been paying attention to Mr Beefy, but looking at one of his first posts, well, things could have been much worse.....
> 
> *"Actually I call it inventory but that isn't what I was refering to I was refering to my personal collection if somebody wants all my inventory they can have it for $220,000 and will call it good it would be a great start for someone wanting to open a buisness if there a serious buyer and not just pulling my chain."*
> 
> Larry


Yes, things definitely could have been worse if there were potential buyers on the fence that read Boston's praise of Big Beefy and went ahead with writing a check. Sad that it happened, but perhaps there is more than one lesson learned here.


----------



## dawgs47 (Mar 15, 2007)

justinphilly said:


> just like in the Bronx Tale... For $100, he's out of your life forever, you got off easy.. (well, i think in the movie it was like 20 bucks, but you get the idea)
> 
> people should lheed klugs' and peter's warnings.. they have been here awhile, and i am sure they have seen some pretty shady characters offering some pretty shady deals over the past few years.


with inflation from the 1950's setting of that movie, 100 dollars is a good comparison!


----------



## Pablo (Oct 13, 1997)

I must be naive, or jaded, or both. I would never agree to a $5000 or even $100 deal with anyone if I didn't know them, or at least had the ability to check their track record.

Even if I had a brief lobotomy and did the deal, I still would not send the money first. Buyer beware, and don't be surprised if you take a risk and lose.


----------



## stevieray (Sep 28, 2006)

pds said:


> I must be naive, or jaded, or both. I would never agree to a $5000 or even $100 deal with anyone if I didn't know them, or at least had the ability to check their track record.
> 
> Even if I had a brief lobotomy and did the deal, I still would not send the money first. Buyer beware, and don't be surprised if you take a risk and lose.


When things seem too good to be true they usually are......


----------



## Da Klugs (Jan 8, 2005)

pathman said:


> pathman is in the car driving as we speak. he is/was on the phone with "boston bull". pathman will tell his story when he gets home if he wants. Hope this helps the people that were confused.
> 
> *-wife*


And we thought we had troubles. :hn


----------



## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

Da Klugs said:


> And we thought we had troubles. :hn


:r :r *BUSTED!*


----------



## mr.c (Apr 8, 2004)

Da Klugs said:


> .
> 
> *Got burned for $ 25 *on a box of Dunhill Mohitos once. Never even got a callback much less any cigars to smoke.





Da Klugs said:


> And we thought we had troubles. :hn


Well Dave, how much ya gonna pay me not to NOT show this to your wife ?

:r :r


----------



## Da Klugs (Jan 8, 2005)

Turn me in for what?


----------



## Bigwaved (May 20, 2006)

Da Klugs said:


> Turn me in for what?


_
I was sitting in the coffee shop
Just minding my own affair
When all of a sudden, this
Policeman caught me unaware

Said, is your name Pedro
I says, yeah, I guess so
Said, then come with me cause
You're the man we been looking for

I said, hey, man
I been framed
Hey, no, really, man
I was framed

Aw, I never do nothing wrong, man
But every time I get the blame
I been framed

They put me in the lineup
And let the bright lights shine
There was ten poor dudes like me
Standing in that line

I knew I was the victim
Of somebody's evil plan
When this scroungy looking dude
Came up and said, yeah
That's him, man

Hey, wait a minute, man
I been framed, man
Aw, listen to me, judge
I was framed

I never do nothing wrong
But every time I get the blame
Hey, I been framed

Then the prosecuting attorney
Started prosecuting on me

Log on to Top40db.

That dude gave me the first
Second, and third degree

He said where were you
On the night of July 29
I said, man, I was home in bed
He said, judge, that man's lying

I said wait a minute, man
I was framed, man
Hey, judge, listen to me, man
Really, you gotta believe me
I been framed, man

I never do nothing wrong
But every time I get the blame
Oh, I was framed

Now look, I deny the charges
Of having any weed
And I also deny the charges
Of taking any speed

I deny the charges
Of selling any grass
But when the judge
Looked down and said guilty
I said, judge, you can kiss my

Framed
Judge, I'm telling you the truth
I was framed, man

I never do nothing wrong
But every time I get the blame
Hey, I was framed

Oh, framed
You gotta believe me, judge
That wasn't even my stuff
I was holding it for a friend, man

Could this face life, man
Oh, come on, judge
Don't send me to camp, man
I just got my car fixed, man

Look, I just got a new
Tattoo and everything, man
Oh, man, what a bummer, man

Oh, come on, judge
Gimme a break, please
Aw, judge, come on, man
Don't take me away, I was framed
Man, really I been framed_


----------



## snkbyt (Jun 22, 2006)

icehog3 said:


> Yup....$50 in cigars is worth life in prison......Sarcasm....


Q) so what are you in for?......A) killing a guy w/a blue light special shotgun for a stogie deal gone bad...:r we have guys in prison now for just this thing...sarcasm...Lord I apologize


----------



## Puffin Fresh (Nov 1, 2006)

I agree pathman should be the one to bring his side of his dealings with this guy to light... but it really wasn't an underground CS secret that pathman had trouble with a guy (not specifically this guy) in a purchase...

http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73198&page=2

Starts on post 17. Pathman has been a top notch gorilla for the short time he's been here, so I hope all works out for both of you. I agree with Klugs though, take it as a learning experience and be glad you didn't lose more.


----------



## hornitosmonster (Sep 5, 2006)

Ouch. That suck that you got burned. You gotta investigate before you trade on the internet. 

This guy had his "store" posted on Craigslist. One guy was going to buy a large Humi full of cigars at a crazy low price...but it never went through. And I think he never appeared again on these boards(?). Then we get another guy claiming to be the one selling the collection...Hmm...

I wonder if they were working together? Or maybe it is the same person? It is worth checking out.


----------



## Mr. White (Dec 4, 2004)

hornitosmonster said:


> Ouch. That suck that you got burned. You gotta investigate before you trade on the internet.
> 
> This guy had his "store" posted on Craigslist. One guy was going to buy a large Humi full of cigars at a crazy low price...but it never went through. And I think he never appeared again on these boards(?). Then we get another guy claiming to be the one selling the collection...Hmm...
> 
> I wonder if they were working together? Or maybe it is the same person? It is worth checking out.


Probably the same person, from what little I know this guy doesn't sound like he was very smart about this. The truth of the matter is that if he was smart, nobody would have any recourse at all, and it sounds like he's left himself open to criminal charges. Credit Cards, paypal, and basically anything but cash is traceable. And to top it off it sounds like the guy gave out a real address as well.


----------



## pathman (Oct 15, 2006)

Hi gang, Pathman here, I'm putting up a quick post from my buddies computer in a hotel room in New Orleans. I will be posting the chronicles of my unfortunate transaction in the morning, I'm off to play some hold-em. On thing real quick to all the "we warned you guys" I spent an extensive amount of time with this guy on the phone and he billed himself as a tobacconist who was out of business and was liquidating his stock, which I believe to be the truth. I didn't just call him and say here's 5 grand, send me some cut rate boxes. I buy thousands of dollars of cigars online and over the phone with people I've never met, so I don't view this as risky business. It's a really long story that I will be more than happy to post in the morning. I do not want to attack BB personally, I do not want sympathy or I told you so, I simply want to warn this fine community as to the difficulty in dealing with this guy. More to follow, I promise, but for now I'm off to win some hands.


----------



## Boston_Dude05 (Oct 10, 2006)

Do keep us posted.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

I should have done this earlier.....this is why I am also angry. I feel these were sitting in one of the bottom of his humidors, and he just sent them.....What am I going to do with those Anni? And what that stain on the Indian Tabac?

http://imageshack.us


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

Wheres the cap? Just had this laying around did ya?


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

This one has a huge crack in it....not sure if you can see it but these two pictures are of that.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

[No message]


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

I dont feel these are worth 100 with shipping....no matter how you look at it. Whether he sold them at 1/2 off, or full retail I was taken!

Again not looking for a witch trial or pity, I am part defending myself and more than anything letting everyone know to stay away!


----------



## fireman43 (Oct 15, 2006)

I missed all this, but do remember the incident in question. My only comment on the subject other than to say I am sorry you were taken advantage of is this.

Caveat Emptor. Most of us know what it means, and usually if it sounds to good to be true, it probably is. I myself recently almost got taken for a ride, but thanks to a Gorilla and my own gut feeling I avoided it. It was not with the seller in question, and I'll leave it at that. We all see a good deal, and I know myself want to jump all over it, but sometimes it's better to let it go if we're not sure who we're dealing with. The majority of folks here would give you the shirt of their backs if you needed it, but there all also the very few lurking among us who will take you for what they can if you give em half a chance.


----------



## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

the indian tabac doesnt look like a stain it looks like a knot in the wood i wouldnt get to nervous about that and the pics of the ani's its hard to see the crack try to get a batter pic.


----------



## SDmate (Apr 24, 2005)

where's the crack 
all I see is a leaf vein


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> Again not looking for a witch trial or pity, I am part defending myself and more than anything letting everyone know to stay away!


Then let it go. You've made your point.


----------



## Marlboro Cigars-cl (Feb 19, 2007)

BostonBull said:


> I dont feel these are worth 100 with shipping....no matter how you look at it. Whether he sold them at 1/2 off, or full retail I was taken!


I wouldn't feel too bad.
He conned a whopping $2-13 out of you.

Partagas 4.5x48 $6
Romeo Y Julietta Maduro 5x52 $6
Onyx Torbusto $8
Montecristo Platinum Tubo 6x52 $8
2) Olgr Fuerte 5x50 $6 x 2 = $12
Padron 1964 Natural 5.5 x?? box press $10
Padron 1964 natural 4.5x?? box press $7
Hoyo De Monterey 6x50 Maybe a CT Shade? $5
Immenso 6.75x70? $6
Diablo Picantes 4.75x50 $4
Ashton Puro Sol 5.5x44 $9
AVO 5x52 $7
Baccarat 8.5x54 $6?
Indian Tabac Limited reserve Cedar Wrap with gold band on bottom 6.5x50 $3

Subtotal: $98

**Prices taken from top25Cigar.com
I rounded up on most cigars since there are no taxes charged,
and the Padrons would probably go for more nowadays.
(if they weren't cracked)

With shipping,
You actually got a $5 discount.

I know it's not that much
Nor am I trying to defend the guy,
but it's not THAT bad really.
:2

Let's say the Padron's AND Indian Tabac are worthless.
(Even though they look somewhat smokeable to me)
You're out about $13 max.

Hope this puts things in better perspective for you.
Smoke a cigar and feel better.


----------



## Blaylock-cl (Apr 28, 2006)

This guy had 38 posts with all but two related to his three threads. 
3/22 Massive Cigar Collection
3/22 some cigar collection pictures
3/23 Partial price list…
His last post was on 3/24.

He never officially introduced himself or got involved in any other way with this forum. In hindsight, it’s clear his only intention was to unload a bunch of cigars. I read his first posts the day he came here and remember thinking that someone may get hurt. The “caution flags” pop up more often as you get older, I guess. 

Sorry to here that some of you got “burnt” with this guy.
It’s sometime easy to get caught up in the “to good to be true” frenzy, before you know exactly what you did.


----------



## The Mum (Mar 28, 2007)

Good point. Follow the old saying: If it's too good to be true then don't buy it.


----------



## pnoon (Jun 8, 2005)

Marlboro Cigars said:


> I wouldn't feel too bad.
> He conned a whopping $2-13 out of you.
> 
> Partagas 4.5x48 $6
> ...


This analysis, coupled with your HUGE score here: http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73841
makes it look like less of an issue. Would you consider sending something back because you paid too little?

Yes, the Anni is damaged. A missing tubo cap? Many store tubos with the caps off.

BigBeefy is a scam artist. Plain and simple. No one disputes that. But you are blowing your situation way out of proportion. You have made your point (and hopefully learned something). Time to let it go.


----------



## winnie (Feb 27, 2007)

To put it into perspective for you, you could have gone to the Dominican with about zero knowledge about cigars, bought 4 boxes of smokes for $200 U.S., come home, post the pics proudly on this forum as a newbie, and promptly find out they are all fakes.

http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=68354&highlight=fakes

Live and learn, let it go, life is too short.

I appreciate you letting people know about this guy, though. Just don't dwell on it too much.


----------



## Puro_Angler (Mar 23, 2006)

I've smoked cigars in worse conditions; those sticks are way smokable. However, when you purchase/trade cigars from *anyone*, they should be in pristine conditon unless otherwise notified. Its also possible that the cracks happened during the shipping process. I'm not trying to choose sides here, I just had this on mind while following this thread since yesterday and needed to let it out.


----------



## stormin (Feb 11, 2005)

pnoon said:


> This analysis, coupled with your HUGE score here: http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=73841
> makes it look like less of an issue. Would you consider sending something back because you paid too little?
> 
> Yes, the Anni is damaged. A missing tubo cap? Many store tubos with the caps off.
> ...


:tpd:

I'm with Peter. If there was a bait and switch, then the original deal with you was the bait and the switch was pulled on someone else. When you take both deals into account, you still came out pretty good.


----------



## SteveDMatt (Feb 23, 2007)

Moral of the story...

Don't trust people who go to church. They believe God will forgive them of their sins.


----------



## OB1 Stogie (Sep 29, 2006)

Wow..remind me not to post any of my bad business decisions. I cant believe the way some of you are treating BostonBull...he is the victim here. I dont care if it was a sketchy deal or not....the fact of the matter is a fellow BOTL got the shaft from someone who has done it before. Where's the outrage???? Let's try not to place so much blame on the victim and try to find this a-hole and recoup some losses. :sb



> I wouldn't feel too bad.
> He conned a whopping $2-13 out of you.
> 
> Partagas 4.5x48 $6
> ...


This isn't the point, whether the smokes are worth $100 bucks or not, he was promised $200 worth, or he wouldn't have made the deal.


----------



## NHsmoker (Feb 18, 2007)

OB1 Stogie said:


> Wow..remind me not to post any of my bad business decisions. I cant believe the way some of you are treating BostonBull...he is the victim here. I dont care if it was a sketchy deal or not....the fact of the matter is a fellow BOTL got the shaft from someone who has done it before. Where's the outrage???? Let's try not to place so much blame on the victim and try to find this a-hole and recoup some losses. :sb
> 
> This isn't the point, whether the smokes are worth $100 bucks or not, he was promised $200 worth, or he wouldn't have made the deal.


I totally agree he was promised $200 worth of smokes and got maybe $100 that he didn't get to pick and may not like. All I can say is all of you that thought it was a scam from the beginning great gut but BostonBull didn't and he got burned let's all have a little sympathy.


----------



## jbock (Feb 22, 2007)

OB1 Stogie said:


> Wow..remind me not to post any of my bad business decisions. I cant believe the way some of you are treating BostonBull...he is the victim here. I dont care if it was a sketchy deal or not....the fact of the matter is a fellow BOTL got the shaft from someone who has done it before. Where's the outrage???? Let's try not to place so much blame on the victim and try to find this a-hole and recoup some losses. :sb
> 
> This isn't the point, whether the smokes are worth $100 bucks or not, he was promised $200 worth, or he wouldn't have made the deal.


I agree. Thank you BostonBull for bringing this to light. To those of us who have very limited funds, this is a devastating loss. I echo everything OB1 said.

Jim


----------



## RJT (Feb 12, 2005)

OB1 Stogie said:


> Wow..remind me not to post any of my bad business decisions. I cant believe the way some of you are treating BostonBull...he is the victim here. I dont care if it was a sketchy deal or not....the fact of the matter is a fellow BOTL got the shaft from someone who has done it before. Where's the outrage???? Let's try not to place so much blame on the victim and try to find this a-hole and recoup some losses. :sb
> 
> This isn't the point, whether the smokes are worth $100 bucks or not, he was promised $200 worth, or he wouldn't have made the deal.


:tpd:


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

Wow!
Now has turned into a sympathy post thread?
My condolences.

How far do we go with this?
Who hasn't made a bad deal at one time or another?
We all have. Some better. Some worse.
How many members on this board?
How many were taken by this con-artist?
Why only two?
Because the rest saw a duck, with feathers, with webbed feet, with a beak, that quacked and we didn't need to stick our finger up his butt to confirm it.

I feel bad for anyone taken advantage of and certainly feel bad for BB.
No doubt about it that it totally sucks.
However, take ownership for falling victim and move on.
I feel a whole lot worse for so many that lose their retirment funds to a..holes in Africa with those scam emails. However, a new victim wakes up each and every day.
At what point does one stop being a victim? When you open your eyes to the obvious.
Frankly? I would be more embarrassed than upset if taken by what was so blatantly saying "fraud".


----------



## K Baz (Mar 2, 2007)

I feel for you - I know the anger (please refer to my $ 200 eBay buy) you feel and the sense of injustice.

However on the bright side although you were to get $ 200 worth of stuff for $ 100 you still got $100 worth of stuff. In reality you got your moneys worth. Sadily not the deal you agreed to but atleast you came out even. 

I do feel for you but I am gald you atleast got a $ 100 dollar value for your $ 100. I would write it off to a very cheap lesson.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> I have dealt with Matt. I have spoken with him EXTENSIVELY over the phone and have been e-mailing for over a week. I know I am a Newbie too, but for what its worth he seems like a stand up guy who LOVES this industry.
> 
> I have a small (compared to his collection) sample coming at me as we speak. When it gets here I will post pics of it all.


After this was posted in one of BigBeefy79's threads, there was a rush to buy some premium smokes by some Gorillas. Looks like a lot of Gorillas may have made purchases or attempts to purchase based on BostonBull's high recommendation of him.

Numerous Gorillas tried to voice there thoughts that something seemed fishy here, and some other Gorillas chose to ignore their advice in search of the "deal".

While I am sad that any CS members got shafted here, I have little "outrage" because I saw it coming. And to the suggestion of finding the guy and getting back BostonBull's money, are you serious? I have a job and family, I really don't have the resources to do this....do you? If so, have at it. I think saying "we should" really means "someone should", but if you have the time, money and resources to help someone get $100 back, you have more free time and cash than I do.

I understand BostonBull spent $100 with the notion of getting $200 worth of smokes (any red flags there??). He got $100 worth, and some of the smokes are damaged. That sucks, but again, a lot of us saw this coming, but all we could do was offer advice. Caveat Emptor, and P.T. Barnum rules.


----------



## RJT (Feb 12, 2005)

icehog3 said:


> After this was posted in one of BigBeefy79's threads, there was a rush to buy some premium smokes by some Gorillas. Looks like a lot of Gorillas may have made purchases or attempts to purchase based on BostonBull's high recommendation of him.
> 
> Numerous Gorillas tried to voice there thoughts that something seemed fishy here, and some other Gorillas chose to ignore their advice in search of the "deal".
> 
> ...


:tpd:

I agree with both sides...Actually I just wanted to get involved with this thread since everyone else has. I felt left out. I guess in short lesson learned by a lot of folks on this situation.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

This is getting too deep.....

Thanks for the support, I don't want anyone going looking for my money or cigars, as Ice hog said Too Bad!

I have learned from this experience, I guess I was lucky that I got my first order as we agreed upon.

I would have never dealt with this joke, had he not promised DOUBLE the dollar value! I did it the right way. PAYPAL, ALL e-mails saved, and photographs.

Oh well live and learn. Pay the price and get good stuff is what I have taken from this. 

If anything happens on my end where he tries to make this right, and ACTUALLY follows through with the promise I will let everyone know.


----------



## Blaylock-cl (Apr 28, 2006)

:tpd: Well said! :tu


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

BostonBull said:


> This is getting too deep.....
> 
> Thanks for the support, I don't want anyone going looking for my money or cigars, as Ice hog said Too Bad!
> 
> ...


Well said.
Would only add the part in bold.


----------



## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

i do agree you were definately taken by this guy and hes a piece of garbage if i was told i was getting $200 worth of cigars for $100 and didnt id be pissed too i do agree when you look at everything together from both deals he made out ok but its not the deal he was promissed. i do think however its time for this end of the thread to die before guys start fighting with each over some jacka$$ that dosent even belong in this brotherhood.


----------



## pathman (Oct 15, 2006)

Blueface said:


> Well said.
> Would only add the part in bold.


A trusted source was an unkown quantity at some point. I don't get why you guys are all trumpeting "Caveat Emptor" You do your research, you ask lots of questions, and in my case I researched public records on this guy to find out he did actually have a store that went tits up. Like most of us here, BostonBull was going forward with good faith and felt like he had done all the research he could. The fact that he got poor treatment and the run-around from this guy was no fault of his own, just one of those things that happens. I don't think anybody is asking for sympathy here. And for all the guys who could see this coming, good for you, but you could have been wrong just easily as you think you were right. The guy, by an eyewitness account, does actually have the remains of closed cigar store, he might be too flakey to actually deliver on his promises, but this is not just a scam. I don't know what it is yet, but before you sprain you're shoulders patting yourselves on the back, do some investigation. Now, I've vented, we can all be friends again, light one up and enjoy your Sunday.


----------



## Marlboro Cigars-cl (Feb 19, 2007)

OB1 Stogie said:


> Wow..remind me not to post any of my bad business decisions. I cant believe the way some of you are treating BostonBull...he is the victim here. I dont care if it was a sketchy deal or not....the fact of the matter is a fellow BOTL got the shaft from someone who has done it before. Where's the outrage???? Let's try not to place so much blame on the victim and try to find this a-hole and recoup some losses.
> :sb
> 
> This isn't the point, whether the smokes are worth $100 bucks or not, he was promised $200 worth, or he wouldn't have made the deal.


Please take note that my post was in response to the following quote.



BostonBull said:


> I dont feel these are worth 100 with shipping....no matter how you look at it. Whether he sold them at 1/2 off, or full retail I was taken!


I was trying to make Bostonbull feel better and settle this once and for all - not dismiss his concerns as illegitimate.
No one is trying to blame the victim, but I don't think any additional outrage would accomplish much as BigBeefy has apparantly left the building.

Besides, how much outrage does $13 deserve?


I said it before but I'm not trying to take sides.
Just trying put the the situation into the proper perspective.
:tu


----------



## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

pathman said:


> And for all the guys who could see this coming, good for you, but you could have been wrong just easily as you think you were right.


Trust me, I feel for you.
My business is dealing with fraud.
I have no tolerance for it.
However............I disagree with this statement of yours.
That sounds to me like a 50/50 chance of having fallen victim.
If accurate, that means we would have had a whole lot more folks falling victim given the membership in CS.
However, if it helps the recovery process, fine.

It is a lesson learned that perhaps by your situation, you have taught many members to not only be leary of business dealings with complete strangers, regardless of what research you have done (prime example is if I had researched and found BB's glorifying post, I might have relied on it and it was just soon to be bad information), but to also be leary of any business dealing of any kind that sounds to good to be true. It never is.


----------



## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

A problem I see still involves dealing with an unknown quantity.

I used to collect game worn NHL jerseys. Saw one for a price that was almost too good to be true, but the seller wasn't a member of the community I dealt with nor a known "retailer".

He had all the right answers, references, photos, etc, so I bit. Got a fake. He lived in California, so I ended up eating a large amount of cash for a jersey worth about 10% of what I paid.

I am not trying to pat myself on the back for seeing through this guy, I am just saying that there were people on his threads trying to give others the benefit of their experience. 

I know how I felt when I got ripped off, and I imagine I have a pretty good idea how the guys who got gypped by bb79 feel. I just hope that people reading this whole thread benefit from the bad experiences articulated here. :2


----------



## Coffee Grounds (Feb 14, 2007)

There is a sucker born every minute.

With all the legit outlets that you can buy cigars from why would bother with some "Flim Flam Man" ?

I can see doing some trades but to start to doing business with some you need to do your research.


THe Church thing is this is the first sign of a hustler.
I had a partnership with a scum bag and he used the church thing to gain quick trust. I got away from him with the quickness.


----------



## snowy (Nov 22, 2006)

pathman said:


> A trusted source was an unkown quantity at some point. I don't get why you guys are all trumpeting "Caveat Emptor" You do your research, you ask lots of questions, and in my case I researched public records on this guy to find out he did actually have a store that went tits up. Like most of us here, BostonBull was going forward with good faith and felt like he had done all the research he could. The fact that he got poor treatment and the run-around from this guy was no fault of his own, just one of those things that happens. I don't think anybody is asking for sympathy here. And for all the guys who could see this coming, good for you, but you could have been wrong just easily as you think you were right. The guy, by an eyewitness account, does actually have the remains of closed cigar store, he might be too flakey to actually deliver on his promises, but this is not just a scam. I don't know what it is yet, but before you sprain you're shoulders patting yourselves on the back, do some investigation. Now, I've vented, we can all be friends again, light one up and enjoy your Sunday.


So did you win some money playing hold'em last night ?


----------



## NCRadioMan (Feb 28, 2005)

pathman said:


> I don't think anybody is asking for sympathy here. And for all the guys who could see this coming, good for you, but you could have been wrong just easily as you think you were right.


No sympathy from me. bro. I saw it coming and no, it would not _easily _happen to me. Research isn't everything. Getting to actually know the person you are dealing with is a major key with these type transactions. A few hours on the phone is nothing. Just talk, no actions, no evidence of truth. Plus, no way in hell I would send anybody that much jack for items I have never seen from a private person I do not know from Adam. That's just common sense, imo.

BB, why would anybody expect $200 worth of merch for $100? Just because that is what somebody _you don't know _told you? That is the biggest warning sign there is! You know what they say, "if it's too good to be true......". You only get that deal when merch is stolen. :r

And as for outrage at the situation. Yep, I'm outraged. The whole situation sux! Warnings were given and evidently ignored. That embarks some responsibility to the_ buyer _that was warned.

In any case, I do hope you pursue the situation to a reasonable outcome Pathman.

I really hope alot of lessons have been learned by the many that read this. And that if people do decide to deal this way, if you are an established member, you should make sure the other party sends thier end first! If they don't want to do that, don't deal!


----------



## floydpink (Feb 15, 2007)

I was following this story from the offer and found Beefy's wording weird from such a seasoned tobbacco dealer and saw the red lights like others.

I still am confused as to how the heap of praise from Boston turned into such a bad deal over a $100 transaction? It would seem that all the greatness from the beginning would lessen the blow from this duping.

There is more to this story I think.


----------



## bkc888 (Mar 2, 2007)

Is there an executive summary to this 19283091238 post thread? 



And isn't there a way to open a dispute with paypal?


----------



## MeNimbus (Dec 18, 2006)

Thank you for the warning BostonBull. I'll be extra careful when dealing with people I don't know.


----------



## casadooley (Jul 11, 2006)

bkc888 said:


> Is there an executive summary to this 19283091238 post thread?
> 
> And isn't there a way to open a dispute with paypal?


Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but Paypal does not allow known tobacco transactions, so you would NOT have any recourse through them. just my :2


----------



## wharfrathoss (Dec 27, 2006)

there's a difference between sympathy & empathy-even if some of us don't sympathize w/BB, we should at least be able to empathize w/him-sorry you feel you were had man, thanks for the warning


----------



## pathman (Oct 15, 2006)

One last reply by me here, some of the posters to this thread really make me a little frustrated, and it is rather hard to keep composed, so I guess I now undestand why the Mods shut these downs. So for all of you guys that saw it coming and knew it was too good to be true, when a business or business owner is in a liquidation phase, unbelievable good deals are often found, at this point in a liquidation, retail has no meaning. If you've ever owned and shut down a business you understand this, if not, perhaps you are just ignorant to how it all works. I closed down a European motorcycle shop that I was the primary partner in. The bikes went back to Ducati, Triumph and Moto Guzzi, and all the helmets, Jackets accessories and parts were sold for pennies on the dollar. So for this guy to be offering prices that most of you can't grasp as retail customers, comes as no surprise to me. I don't like the implication that I or BostonBull were just blinded by the deals and did something stupid. Thats not how it was. Everyone here is entitled to their opinion, so there is mine. I think it would be good to shut this one down. I don't think anything else can be gained at this point.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

NCRadioMan said:


> BB, why would anybody expect $200 worth of merch for $100? Just because that is what somebody _you don't know _told you? That is the biggest warning sign there is! You know what they say, "if it's too good to be true......". You only get that deal when merch is stolen. :r


I am glad you find humor and pompousness in this.

I expected $200 worth because of my EXTENSIVE speaking on the phone with this man, and because of my first deal with him which was worth MORE than double what I paid.

Not every deal in life comes with a bunch of people telling you its good or bad. Sometimes you have to figure it out for yourself, which is what I did, and got burned...kind of.

Oh well...live and learn. Hoefully Pathman gets his money back he lost WAY more than me.


----------



## BostonBull (Mar 6, 2007)

floydpink said:


> I was following this story from the offer and found Beefy's wording weird from such a seasoned tobbacco dealer and saw the red lights like others.
> 
> I still am confused as to how the heap of praise from Boston turned into such a bad deal over a $100 transaction? It would seem that all the greatness from the beginning would lessen the blow from this duping.
> 
> There is more to this story I think.


The heep of praise was for a good deal that I got. He was a pain to deal with from the begining. No returned calls, and no e-mails for a few days. But the payoff was well worth it!

I do know firsthand what this guy was/is doing. He is in a tight spot, and needs money becasue he went belly-up!

Why over $100? Principle! I will bury (verbally) anyone in a minute over deal that I think I was taken advantage of and then made to look stupid.

I feel he took advantage of me, by the shit service and slow responses/excuses I got. I was made to look stupid when he tried passing off a bunch of SHIT cigars to me as a good deal for $100!!!


----------



## kansashat (Mar 13, 2004)

I don't see this one going any where positive any longer. It's time to find another can to kick around.


----------

