# A Terrible Experience with Altinok Pipes



## Emerson Biggins (Sep 27, 2011)

After deciding to get a meerschaum pipe I was pointed (by a co-worker) into the direction of three highly regarded carvers/sellers. IMP, Baki and Altinok. I decided on because his prices and shapes were more to my liking. I am aware that he carved the Puff pipe for 2010 and likely has some supporters here but I wanted put my experience on the forum because it was so horrendous, that I wanted to give people an idea of what can go wrong.

I ordered a simple pipe from Sinan, just a large brandy lattice (Product #IK108 ), and was quoted a two month delivery. Well, after a three month wait, I finally received the package and opened it up to find the worst looking meerschaum I have ever seen. The pipe was considerably smaller than ordered, at least half an inch in length and also in bowl height. Instead of carving any lattice work, the person just took a sharp tool and scratched little non-symetrical half-moon shapes and circles around the pipe. There were other things that showed poor quality of work but those were the main problems.

I contacted Sinan and told him about the pipe and he instructed me to return the pipe at my expense, as he did not have a shipping account. I told him I didn't think shipping the wrong pipe back should cost me anything and let him know that I would want to be credited the shipping cost or be upgraded to the extra-large sized Brandy Lattice pipe. He said that he would credit me the shipping cost once he received the pipe and informed me that he could not give me an ETA for the correct pipe because he didn't have any meerschaum to carve, or know when he would be getting any. I was done at this point&#8230; there was no way I was going to wait another 4-5 months in hopes of receiving what I ordered three months previously, so I told him to cancel my order and to credit all of the costs back to my credit card, and we would call it even.

On December 27[SUP]th[/SUP], I received this E-mail from him:*Hi Mike,*

*I received the pipe today. You were right. The carving was totally different than that of the displayed one. I will talk to my carver and if you like, I would like to make the same pipe you originally ordered. Sure, I will refund the $29.95 return shipping with pleasure. What do you think? I don't want any customers left behind with unpleasant feelings about my business.*

*Happy New Year!*
*Sinan*​
To date, and despite my attempts to contact him, I have never received another E-mail after December 27th . Toward the end of January, I called my credit card company and filed a claims dispute. The credit card company was able to credit me for the initial cost of the pipe and the shipping; however, they would not compensate me for the return shipping, even though their policy is that I have to return the item to the merchant, before filing a dispute claim.

I have nothing good to say about , his pipes or his service. I'm sure he has done right for others; however, I will not be recommending him to anyone and I feel strongly enough about my negative experience that I wanted to let everyone know what happened to me, so you would think twice about placing any more orders with him.

Mike Foster


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## Sinan Altinok (Jun 21, 2007)

I think you are a little greedy kid to play in a big garden where the kids not allowed to enter. I hope you are older than 18. Because you are smoking.

In fact, it was only a small difference in details. The pictures were showing an eye-drops lattice but we instead had made another kind of lattice. Anyway, you were right if you didn't like it. I offered you that I could make a new pipe with the same lattice you want otherwise you could return the pipe to claim a refund. You didn't accept to get a replacement and returned the pipe which is fair enough. As soon as I have received the returning pipe, I refunded in full as promised (pipe price and shipping cost). Right here, I have to stress that I made the refund process, NOT your card company. Also, I never intended and promised to anyone to refund any returning shipping cost if the customer likes to return the pipe. Everything has been done correctly and ethically according to my business rules.

Case closed.

Sinan Altinok


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## Emerson Biggins (Sep 27, 2011)

Sinan,
Your insults do not hide the fact that you sent me the wrong pipe, and you did not reimbures me for the return shipping cost of the poorly carved pipe. If what I had received was even close to what was ordered and was of decent craftsmanship, I would have accepted the pipe and not cared. My complaint is valid.


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## IrishCamel81 (Jan 26, 2009)

Greedy for not wanting to pay to return something you didn't order? Eeesh.
Should have gone with a Baki.


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## bpegler (Mar 30, 2006)

Sinan Altinok said:


> I think you are a little greedy kid to play in a big garden where the kids not allowed to enter. I hope you are older than 18. Because you are smoking.
> 
> Case closed.
> 
> Sinan Altinok


There is absolutely no reason to have made this into a personal attack. If you cannot conduct yourself in a professional manner, you will loose the privilege of posting on this forum.

As to the OP, I believe your point about customer service has been made. Personally, I would never do business with someone who demonstrated such an attitude. I'm sure this will be noticed by the other BOTLs who read this.


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## Stonedog (Mar 9, 2011)

I hate to see the general pipe forum marred by topics like this.

Does Puff have a Cheers'n'Jeers (or similar) sub forum?


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## ChronoB (Nov 4, 2007)

When it comes to ebay, online shopping from small vendors, etc., I have a very simple rule: if the person selling the item is out of the reach of a car trip, I don't buy it. If someone screws me over and I can't get in the car, however far away it may be, and drive up to his place of business to personally complain and make my demands then I simply pass on the purchase. As a consumer you have no protection or recourse with a retailer that is an ocean away. Live and learn.


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## Nick S. (Jul 10, 2011)

Stonedog said:


> I hate to see the general pipe forum marred by topics like this.


+1 on this.... this thread could go bad fast...


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## TommyTree (Jan 7, 2012)

Both parties concerned have given their side. I don't know how much more needs to be said on the subject. It's unfortunate that this disagreement, for whatever reason, had to go public.


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## bazookajoe (Nov 2, 2006)

Stonedog said:


> I hate to see the general pipe forum marred by topics like this.
> 
> Does Puff have a Cheers'n'Jeers (or similar) sub forum?


There is no separate forum for complaints or accolades-those type of areas usually become unmanageable. While threads like this can be unpleasant they do provide some insight into the behavior, attitudes etc. of members and vendors. It's an unfortunate aspect of the anonymity internet forums provide.


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## Troutman22 (Feb 2, 2011)

I applaud the original poster and appreciate the heads up. After the comment:



> I think you are a little greedy kid to play in a big garden where the kids not allowed to enter. I hope you are older than 18. Because you are smoking.


I believe the complaint to be legit.


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## ChronoB (Nov 4, 2007)

bazookajoe said:


> There is no separate forum for complaints or accolades-those type of areas usually become unmanageable. While threads like this can be unpleasant they do provide some insight into the behavior, attitudes etc. of members and vendors. It's an unfortunate aspect of the anonymity internet forums provide.


We (pipe smokers) are a small community. I honestly think we need threads like this. Consumer and retailer can make their case to the community and we can draw our own conclusions. Should they want to make it personal there are private means of doing that. The internet can be a great equalizer. Treat your customers poorly, and others will hear. Be an unreasonable consumer, and your forum mates will hear.


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## IrishCamel81 (Jan 26, 2009)

I think if this was only regarding the quality/performance of a pipe it should go in the PIPE RELATED REVIEWS. I prefer complaints or compliments like this in the general forum. My opinion.

Regards,


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## Firedawg (Nov 8, 2010)

You could tell this wasnt gonna end well..

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-pipe-forum/300384-long-alti.html#post3416624


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## Nick S. (Jul 10, 2011)

Firedawg said:


> You could tell this wasnt gonna end well..
> 
> http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-pipe-forum/300384-long-alti.html#post3416624


Yeah, I thought I had seen this somewhere before... I'm not really sure what to make of the whole thing...


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

Firedawg said:


> You could tell this wasnt gonna end well..
> 
> http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-pipe-forum/300384-long-alti.html#post3416624


Ah. Okay; moving on now...


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## Irfan (Dec 18, 2011)

I can't help thinking that Sinan spoils his response by being rude. It comes with being a retailer: no matter who's right or wrong, you have to hide your annoyance with your customer and answer their queries without ego. Without knowing anything more about the case, I think Sinan's response gave me more of a negative feeling than the original post. I know a hotel GM, he says whenever a customer complains, he sends him a free bottle of wine, regardless of whether he thinks they are right or wrong -- just because it's worth it to maintain goodwill and not have people complaining about service to other potential customers. I had a minor misunderstanding with a vendor the other week, instead of arguing he refunded my money _and_ gave me the product I wanted free of charge: I've praised him heavily in another post without discussing the issue, just because I thought his response won my loyalty -- I'll keep on ordering cobs from him, even if they cost a dollar or two more than other vendors.


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## InsidiousTact (Dec 3, 2010)

I have to say, my meer is great, I love it. But, Sinan does tend to act almost like a child sometimes.

In my case, there was an error on my end, and my last payment of my three part payment didn't go through iirc. I was in constant contact, did my best to fix the situation, and got him his money promptly. In my, admittedly weak, defense it was not my fault, there was a problem with my bank. I felt bad, I was apologetic, but what surprised me was his response... He put my full contact information on my public profile, and said some bad things about me to boot. He called me a thief, didn't give the full story, etc, and encouraged others to harass me. He refused to edit out my contact info or take this down, even after I'd fixed things. 

I know I deserved the negative rating, my end wasn't held up on time, but I think he went a little too far, especially since I was being very proactive in my communication.


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## Nick S. (Jul 10, 2011)

Irfan said:


> I can't help thinking that Sinan spoils his response by being rude. It comes with being a retailer: no matter who's right or wrong, you have to hide your annoyance with your customer and answer their queries without ego. Without knowing anything more about the case, I think Sinan's response gave me more of a negative feeling than the original post. I know a hotel GM, he says whenever a customer complains, he sends him a free bottle of wine, regardless of whether he thinks they are right or wrong -- just because it's worth it to maintain goodwill and not have people complaining about service to other potential customers. I had a minor misunderstanding with a vendor the other week, instead of arguing he refunded my money _and_ gave me the product I wanted free of charge: I've praised him heavily in another post without discussing the issue, just because I thought his response won my loyalty -- I'll keep on ordering cobs from him, even if they cost a dollar or two more than other vendors.


well said.


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## IrishCamel81 (Jan 26, 2009)

I am admittedly biased here, as I brought the OP into piping and the forum. I don't see any indication of him being unreasonable in his previous thread by venting a little frustration with the late delivery of a very anticipated first pipe. I can't imagine any BOTL here would be fine with waiting three months for the wrong pipe, going out of pocket to return it, with no ETA of when the pipe you ordered could be sent. The response from Altinok was surprising in that non of the corresepondence between them has ever been even slightly rude. If Sinan thinks the credit was sent, great, it seems something went wrong and it was never received. It should be easy to provide the date when the credit was sent, that would be the place to start.
Happy piping,


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## Guest (Feb 11, 2012)

Are there any photos of the pipe in question?


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## rogypipe (May 29, 2012)

I got very angry reading about this event !! :frusty: 
Money is not earned that easy ... 
Isn't there a website or online monitoring system where customers can apply when they are ripped off !!!!!!!!!! ????????????


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## Dr. Plume (Sep 24, 2012)

Sounds like what you need is a Missouri meerschaum!


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## Emerson Biggins (Sep 27, 2011)

Dr. Plume said:


> Sounds like what you need is a Missouri meerschaum!


LOL, I ended up buying an extra-large IMP, with a silver band from smokingpipes, for less money, and couldn't be happier... it's coloring nicely. :biggrin1:

Emerson


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## Dr. Plume (Sep 24, 2012)

And that is what counts.


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## Kevin Keith (Jan 24, 2010)

Dr. Plume said:


> And that is what counts.


Thus endeth the lesson.


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## rogypipe (May 29, 2012)

Dr. Plume said:


> Sounds like what you need is a Missouri meerschaum!


Hey Plume

You cant be serious.There are awesome "ready" meerschaum pipes at smokingpipes.com with guarantee of smokingpipes.com ..Imp and also Storient..
You dont wait for 3 months ( or even more) !!!! You dont buy something that is not even ready ;that is to say, you don't buy a photo !!!
Instead of buying from unreputable / unprofessional wanna be sellers who are selling from their homes , I would always prefer reputable brands from serious e-commerce websites.

When it comes to great quality meerschaum I am quite experienced as I own many,I am a meerschaum smoker of years and I have worked in my company's construction project in Adana Turkey.
I have visited eskisehir many times where I talked to carvers and watched them carving pipes nearby me.
You only think that the meerschaum business is consisted of what you see online ?

For instance there is a company named "altinay " www.altinaypipe.com check it online...those guys are exporting 10.000 pipes to europe each year.

Deal with serious "companies" not with online home sellers who are seeking for some extra money...
There are many more brands and providers of greatest quality meerschaum pipes.Much more higher quality than those claimed to be excellent grade at some so called online meerschaum seller web sites ( As you are already experience...)

E-business is a serious thing..Dealing with the right web site is even more serious..If you don't pay attention you ll pay the price..


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## rogypipe (May 29, 2012)

Dont forget Baki from deniz ural meerschaums (not that large brand currently but selling quality pipes)


And sms !! Sms is a big company founded by a turk located in Usa.


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## WyoBob (Mar 6, 2007)

"Originally Posted by *Dr. Plume*  Sounds like what you need is a Missouri meerschaum!:smile:"



rogypipe said:


> Hey Plume
> 
> You cant be serious.


I don't know if he's serious or not but MM cobs offer a great pipe smoking experience. I have 15 cobs in my rotation and one meer and one briar. My natural finished cobs (no plaster) smoke as well if not better than the few meerschaums I've owed. Open draw, no gurgle or wet dottle and, if I destroy or lose a cob, it's not a traumatic event. For the price of one meer, I have a lifetime's worth of good smoking pipes and can spend the savings on tobacco. I think I have enough tobacco to last me until I'm in my late 90's. Yes, cobs are a bit "rustic" but, then, so am I.

I had good luck dealing with Altinok and enjoy my 103. I do worry about dropping it. It fails the "bang for the buck" test but I thought everyone should probably own a nice meer. If I had to choose one pipe, though, it would be the MM natural Diplomat I'm smoking now, even if they cost the same.


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## Dr. Plume (Sep 24, 2012)

No not that serious mostly joking just changing the tone of the thread to something a little more light hearted.... Down boy down . 
Ps. You should read how mm supposedly got their name.


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## rogypipe (May 29, 2012)

Dr. Plume said:


> No not that serious mostly joking just changing the tone of the thread to something a little more light hearted.... Down boy down .
> Ps. You should read how mm supposedly got their name.


Hi brother I know you were trying to chnge the tone to something more light hearted.. 
No worries we are all brothers and sisters here.. We share the same hobby.. 
I never take the word of a brother wrong..

I am smoking a full bowl of penzance in my sms meer in your honor..

Cheers..


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## rogypipe (May 29, 2012)

I am also a great fan of MM.
I have purchased 19 corncobs up to now 2 of which I am smoking regularly.


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