# Considering opening a cigar lounge - secondary revenue ideas?



## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

Greetings fellow cigar lovers! New member here (though I've lurked for some time), looking for some input from other passionate cigar smokers.

(TL;DR - skip the next two paragraphs to get directly to my question!).

I'm considering opening a cigar lounge. Now before the onslaught of "that's a terrible idea" and "you have no idea what you're getting into" and "you better have a bunch of money to waste" replies hits, know that I'm just _considering_ it at this point, working on a business plan and relevant due diligence. I have ample prior business experience, including on the executive level in the hospitality industry (and including both retail and food service experience). I've analyzed more P&L than you could imagine, and I've written a handful of business plans. I'm fully aware of the riskiness and uncertainty of a venture like this, and should I choose to proceed with it, I do so with full knowledge that it is a capital-intensive startup with a less-than-ideal guarantee of return. I'll consider it a calculated risk in pursuing a passion.

Some details on the operation as envisioned: it would be a cozy lounge, at about 1,800 sq. ft. total, in a quaint and relatively affluent town, with a regional population of about 158k, and an additional transient university student population in excess of 30,000. It would be located on one of the highest-trafficked intersections in the area, with off-street parking, easy walking access from residential and commercial areas, and near restaurants and bars. Selling alcohol at this point is, unfortunately, not an option due to state/municipality regulation. Tobacco-related profit centers would include cigars, pipes, pipe tobacco, smoking accessories, and humidor locker rental. Decor would be high-class: studded-leather chairs, mahogany furniture, built-ins with a variety of literature and reading material, wood flooring, ambient mood lighting, fine art, etc. There is one other cigar retailer with a basic lounge about 15 miles away, and anecdotally it does very, very well.

So here is the question that I would pose to you: what are some secondary revenue generators that YOU would find appealing in a cigar lounge, if alcohol is not an option? Anything classy is fair game. Food ideas, events, retail ideas, outside-the-box ideas... anything. While I'm willing to go out on a limb and take some risk, I'd like to have more revenue streams than just cigars and accessories to boost viability and sustainability as a business model. But not at the expense of the atmosphere (i.e. I'm not doing cigarettes and lottery tickets, even if that's where the "real" money is!).

I've considered the possibility of some sort of private club membership component, which would supply some guaranteed annual revenue. I've considered weekly live music (with cover charge) as an option. Jazz, probably. I wonder if high-quality coffee could be a good component? Not like a full coffee shop, but maybe like a fresh-ground French-press option? I don't know... just throwing a few thoughts out there, and hopeful that you'll have more, since I suspect this forum represents a good cross-section of my potential customer, and I trust your tastes!

:cb


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## JtAv8tor (Apr 12, 2017)

I am going to ask an obvious question at least for me, are you a cigar smoker? And reason I ask is if you are going to be the one primarily working the establishment and I were to walk in and ask this same question and the answer is "no" I would ask if anyone working there is. If not I would probably walk back out. 

I would assume you are as you stated "other passionate cigar smokers" but momma taught me assumptions are bad a that's why I ask.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## bpegler (Mar 30, 2006)

A dedicated poker room. That would bring me in...


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

JtAv8tor said:


> I am going to ask an obvious question at least for me, are you a cigar smoker? And reason I ask is if you are going to be the one primarily working the establishment and I were to walk in and ask this same question and the answer is "no" I would ask if anyone working there is. If not I would probably walk back out.
> 
> I would assume you are as you stated "other passionate cigar smokers" but momma taught me assumptions are bad a that's why I ask.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


It's a fair question. And yes, I'm absolutely a cigar smoker, and while I'm no master tobacconist, I have a reasonable knowledge of the "art" of cigars and smoking.



bpegler said:


> A dedicated poker room. That would bring me in...


A good thought, and very viable option.


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## Fusion (Apr 5, 2017)

Online sales, yes lots of competition but it could be done.


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## Alrightdriver (May 2, 2017)

To go with the poker room, perhaps billiards as well. And hosting sporting events with a buy in for prizes. I'm a noob so i may be way off the mark. I know is enjoy shooting a rack of pool with a nice cigar. Especially on a full sized nice table in a non bar environment. Could be done classy.

Sent from my LGL82VL using Tapatalk


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

It's typical it seems that this thread comes up and what happens is that it's mostly always a new member that comes in.....asks the question and then doesn't return. Could it be to get publicity or an area that one wishes to start up? Some questions could be innocent enough but as one reads the threads below there seems to be this pattern of give me all the info and then I'll see ya later......goodbye. So, you could be one of those people who really do want to get answers so here ya go......read all of these threads and maybe you can glean information you're looking for.....your welcome.

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...5045-thinking-about-opening-cigar-lounge.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...3456-questions-about-opening-cigar-store.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...92067-need-help-cigar-shop-business-plan.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...hinking-opening-up-cigar-shop-some-ideas.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-cigar-discussion/60642-opening-lounge.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-cigar-discussion/155569-looking-open-cigar-shop.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-cigar-discussion/141118-opening-b-m-tobacco-shop.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/general-cigar-discussion/117552-starting-cigar-shop.html


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

Cigary said:


> It's typical it seems that this thread comes up and what happens is that it's mostly always a new member that comes in.....asks the question and then doesn't return. Could it be to get publicity or an area that one wishes to start up? Some questions could be innocent enough but as one reads the threads below there seems to be this pattern of give me all the info and then I'll see ya later......goodbye. So, you could be one of those people who really do want to get answers so here ya go......read all of these threads and maybe you can glean information you're looking for.....your welcome.
> 
> New Cigar/Scotch lounge in an old jailhouse
> 
> ...


Thanks for the links. I believe I've read most of those threads. But I'll review again.

I'm sorry if you find the question overasked and disingenuous. For me, it's just smart market research. I'd do the same for any kind of startup. I'm just here acknowledging that I don't have all the answers, and I want to make sure if I were to take on a project like this, I'd actually be providing what the larger cigar community wants. Each startup is unique, and I've tried to provide enough particulars to get specific input on this opportunity. And if you actually read my post, I'm not asking for "all the info". I asked one specific question to help give a little direction to the secondary aspects of this opportunity.

Cheers. I'm heading back to my Oliva Melanio now.


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## csk415 (Sep 6, 2016)

BYOB if allowed, Movie night, Ps4/Xbox 1 (for the mid 20 folks), poker night, have non alcohol drinks on hand, sports on tv, stay open until midnight. My B&M closes at 6 and it turns me off from it.


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## WABOOM (Oct 15, 2015)

the internet is getting weird. Now entrepreneurs are asking prospective clientele how to generate more revenue for themselves.


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## JtAv8tor (Apr 12, 2017)

@59smokes I think if what cigary is getting at here is that we are a community that would welcome you into the group but hope that it is just not to do market research but also become a long term member of the community.

If you get a chance put up an introduction on the new members area and tel is a bit about yourself.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

JtAv8tor said:


> @59smokes I think if what cigary is getting at here is that we are a community that would welcome you into the group but hope that it is just not to do market research but also become a long term member of the community.
> 
> If you get a chance put up an introduction on the new members area and tel is a bit about yourself.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Oh, I have every intention of being an active member. This question was just what prompted me to join this evening. As I mentioned, I've lurked for some time, and enjoy the content and community. I'll work up an intro for the new member sub forum.


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## FTPuff (Sep 14, 2016)

A couple things I've seen in my travels...

Humidity controlled locker rental. 

Video projection golf.


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## Rondo (Sep 9, 2015)

Bikini babes with cutters and lighters.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

59smokes said:


> Oh, I have every intention of being an active member. This question was just what prompted me to join this evening. As I mentioned, I've lurked for some time, and enjoy the content and community. I'll work up an intro for the new member sub forum.


As others have said as well we believe in community...our community and those who register as new members we are a very welcoming Forum. We have 4 Moderators who are tasked with the responsibility of watching over Puff.com to ensure continuity and keeping it moving in a forward direction and that means we look for things that raise red flags....our experience is not to be demigods but rather protectors. We hope that new members become long term members but we do see some who come here to take advantage of this platform and if you are here to contribute then it's a win-win.

Looking forward to your introduction post.


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

Cigary said:


> As others have said as well we believe in community...our community and those who register as new members we are a very welcoming Forum. We have 4 Moderators who are tasked with the responsibility of watching over Puff.com to ensure continuity and keeping it moving in a forward direction and that means we look for things that raise red flags....our experience is not to be demigods but rather protectors. We hope that new members become long term members but we do see some who come here to take advantage of this platform and if you are here to contribute then it's a win-win.
> 
> Looking forward to your introduction post.


Thanks. I get it - I started and administrated two active forums. I just wanted to be clear that I'm not just here to troll or to steal info and run, despite what came across as that very accusation. But no harm done.

Intro at http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...tion-forum/247897-new-forum-not-new-post.html


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

59smokes said:


> Thanks. I get it - I started and administrated two active forums. I just wanted to be clear that I'm not just here to troll or to steal info and run, despite what came across as that very accusation. But no harm done.
> 
> Intro at http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/v...tion-forum/247897-new-forum-not-new-post.html


I'm not here to split hairs sir...I was speaking generically and if I make a direct accusation it won't be clouded in smoke....it would come in like a fastball....high and inside.&#129300;


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## BaconandEggs (Jun 4, 2016)

Annual - (Your lounge name here) Golf Tournament! Day full of golf/ smoking. With @Rondo idea of bikini babes going around serving you cigars/ alcohol/ food. DAM sounds good.

Serve non-alcoholic drinks that pair well with cigars (Root Beer, DIET COKE, Etc...)
Annual membership dues or small fee to smoke in the lounge.

I need to go golfing.


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

Cigary said:


> I'm not here to split hairs sir...I was speaking generically and if I make a direct accusation it won't be clouded in smoke....it would come in like a fastball....high and inside.&#129300;


As it should be! :beerchug:

And if I ever see that high & inside fastball coming my way, I'll be swinging for the fences. :wink2:


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## Del Fuego (Mar 29, 2017)

From my understanding, cigar shops aren't all that lucrative. I may be wrong, but I think most of em are just squeekin by. You will need a strong, dedicated clientele.

Leasing a retail space in an affluent neighborhood will be high. Add in the costs to build the store and then think about how many sticks + accessories you will need to sell per day just to break even in a years time. You would probably need to ring $800 a day on the register to have a shot.

You're much better off opening a small sports bar that specializes in micro brews and whiskey. Hire a couple sexy bartenders and make sure the place is catered to attract women clientele. If you can bring in the women, them men will come. If you slap some big TV's on the wall you'll draw in a good sports crowd to watch the game. Keep a smoke lounge in the back with a walk-in humidor stuffed full of cigars.

I would also be a lot more fun than a cigar store.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

59smokes said:


> Oh, I have every intention of being an active member. This question was just what prompted me to join this evening. As I mentioned, I've lurked for some time, and enjoy the content and community. I'll work up an intro for the new member sub forum.


First impressions matter. Saying you were only prompted to actually join when there was something you wanted, to serve your own ends I might add, from the Puff community really only confirms that @*Cigary* potentially has a valid concerns. You're going to need to figure out how to climb out of the hole you've dug for yourself on your own. But, it's your own actions going forward that will prove or disprove your sincerity.


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

@curmudgeonista, please see my PM.

Back on-track, I appreciate all the thoughts thus far. Some good ideas, and some worthwhile food for thought. And @Del Fuego - you're probably right from a practical standpoint, but I'm not really into the sports bar thing.

Here's a thought that's been rolling around in my head, which does combine a lot of the ideas mentioned here. I would be curious to know what you think about it -

>I'm thinking of a kind of hybrid model between a private club and a public-access lounge
>Lounge would include plush leather furniture, a big-screen or two, a pool table, a poker table, and a small bar (no alcohol sold or served, by BYO ok)
>The lounge would be open to public, let's just say hypothetically, Wednesday-Sunday, 1pm-9pm; purchase required, or nominal "cutting fee" will apply
>A weekly public event might be hosted, whether it's live music, or a movie, or sports-related, or cigar-specific
>All other times, 24/7, the lounge would be accessible only to paid members, by way of biometric or key-card access
>Member benefits would include the 24/7 access, humidor locker, discounts on cigars and merchandise, and member-only events

Crazy, or viable? What other benefits would you look for in a semi-private cigar club?

I'm not entirely sure what kind of membership fee would be appropriate for that. I've seen some fully exclusive cigar clubs with annual fees around $1000, but there's no public access at all. More to think about, I suppose.


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## Randy956 (Dec 16, 2013)

You'd need a lot of money to do it right.

My guess is you will have to have a bar to generate additional income. I can't imagine you being able to pay tax, rent, overhead, and money in your pocket with cigar sales only.

To make enough money I think you'll have to go big or go home, otherwise it's loosing proposition, or one in which you bought yourself a low paying job.

How much will inventory cost? Inventory tax?
Overhead? (rent, utilities, TAX, advertising...)
How much cigar income?
Bar income?
Any other sales like vape, pipes? (think inventory cost)

Honestly, I think you'd make better income working part time at Home Depot or Lowe's with less risk, than to open a cigar shop.


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## 59smokes (May 10, 2017)

Randy956 said:


> You'd need a lot of money to do it right.
> 
> My guess is you will have to have a bar to generate additional income. I can't imagine you being able to pay tax, rent, overhead, and money in your pocket with cigar sales only.
> 
> ...


I appreciate the sentiment. That's where all of the "cigar lounge idea" threads seem to go. But let's assume, for the moment, that the idea isn't to make a big primary income. The idea, rather, is to break even or a little better in the pursuit of a passion. That's why I was very quick to admit in original question that it's a risky venture with low chance of solid return. I'm just trying to determine if there's a good chance of break-even, and part of that equation is outside-the-box ideas beyond just selling cigars.


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## Randy956 (Dec 16, 2013)

59smokes said:


> I appreciate the sentiment. That's where all of the "cigar lounge idea" threads seem to go. But let's assume, for the moment, that the idea isn't to make a big primary income. The idea, rather, is to break even or a little better in the pursuit of a passion. That's why I was very quick to admit in original question that it's a risky venture with low chance of solid return. I'm just trying to determine if there's a good chance of break-even, and part of that equation is outside-the-box ideas beyond just selling cigars.


*RISK*.... are you willing to risk your home or retirement income on this venture?

If it's your passion, then perhaps you could work part time at the local JR or other larger shop.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

curmudgeonista said:


> First impressions matter. Saying you were only prompted to actually join when there was something you wanted, to serve your own ends I might add, from the Puff community really only confirms that @*Cigary* potentially has a valid concerns. You're going to need to figure out how to climb out of the hole you've dug for yourself on your own. But, it's your own actions going forward that will prove or disprove your sincerity.


Let's see now...his last post was 5/12 when he was all gung-ho about getting advice and now it appears he got what he came for and wasn't here just to get info and split....what do I know?&#128527;


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