# IYO: What is the Holy Grail of Habano Cigars



## No1der (Apr 2, 2007)

So many folks in the NC lounge talk of the Opus X as a sort of Holy Grail and I'm interested in seeing if there is such a thing in the world of Cuban Cigars...

I realize that cigars are very subjective but that asside, what is the Holy Grail of Cuban's???

Now, the criteria is that it must be a cigar that is "purchasable" in the open market and I guess price is not of issue here.

They can be "aged reserve stock" but like I said, it must be available from a vendor...

So, anyone know of an equivalent of the Opus X (which I still haven't tried) of Habano's???


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## LasciviousXXX (Oct 12, 2004)

IMO the only "holy grail" type cigars in the Cuban Market are Rare/vintage ones that are NOT available in the open market.

And I would contend that most would not even consider the Opus X's the holy grail of NC's.

:2


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## LasciviousXXX (Oct 12, 2004)

PS - Many of our CS brethren have been fortunate enough to try some of the more Holy Grail-esque Cuban Cigars like the 1492 and the Punch Nectare etc etc. All you need to do is check out the Habanos review forum.

Also, when I first started out, Davidoffs and Dunhills were my Grails. Then as I was able to sample those, smokes like the RyJ Clem, Original BGM's, Hoyo's from the 70's were my goals then came the limited editions and one-offs etc. Having tried so much you realize that all cigars are Holy Grail's to someone at some point in their cigar Journey so there's really no end to it.


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## zemekone (Aug 1, 2004)

LasciviousXXX said:


> IMO the only "holy grail" type cigars in the Cuban Market are Rare/vintage ones that are NOT available in the open market.


:tpd: NOT AVAILABLE ON THE OPEN MARKET... sad but true


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## Sandman (Mar 26, 2006)

Any cigar that rocks my world. I don't care if it's 100 years old or 1 month old!:ss


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## designwise1 (Aug 17, 2006)

Amen to that.
My first Cuban was my holy grail. Then my second...
Now I know that I'll never really find my holy grail but that doesn't stop me from trying.
It's a fun trip, anyway.

Enjoy!


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## No1der (Apr 2, 2007)

Thanks for the posts guys. I kinda figured that there wasn't "One" Holly Grail.

Let me rephrase the question,

Based on concensus of the Gorillas here what is the "Gotta Try It At Least Once" Habano on the market?


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## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

No1der said:


> Thanks for the posts guys. I kinda figured that there wasn't "One" Holly Grail.
> 
> Let me rephrase the question,
> 
> Based on concensus of the Gorillas here what is the "Gotta Try It At Least Once" Habano on the market?


By "on the market" do you mean a currently produced, "regular production" Cuban cigar? As posted, the question still leaves room for interpretation. :2


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## drevim (Dec 21, 2005)

LasciviousXXX said:


> PS - Many of our CS brethren have been fortunate enough to try some of the more Holy Grail-esque Cuban Cigars like the 1492 and the Punch Nectare etc etc. All you need to do is check out the Habanos review forum.
> 
> Also, when I first started out, Davidoffs and Dunhills were my Grails. Then as I was able to sample those, smokes like the RyJ Clem, Original BGM's, Hoyo's from the 70's were my goals then came the limited editions and one-offs etc. Having tried so much you realize that all cigars are Holy Grail's to someone at some point in their cigar Journey so there's really no end to it.


We were talking about this at the Shack. The holy grail is an elusive animal. Always changing. I'd guess there may be 3 or 4 guys on this board who can say they have their holy grail...but I don't know how many have smoked one. Just from cigars I've got to sample, my true holy grail is the RyJ Clem (or at least one I get to smoke all the way through). The taste is one of the single most unique cigars I've tasted, along with RG Vit. C. As far as unique taste, I'd put them against the 1492, and the 1994.

But taste is a VERY subjective matter....Of course all of the above is negated by your desire to have a "vendor available" cigar.


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## ResIpsa (Mar 8, 2006)

icehog3 said:


> By "on the market" do you mean a currently produced, "regular production" Cuban cigar? As posted, the question still leaves room for interpretation. :2


:tpd:This is no different from asking, "What is the best cuban cigar", or any other cigar related question dependant on personal tastes.

PS: Tossing in the "which I still haven't tried" in regards to the Opus X smacks a little too closely to a mooch attempt....IMO.


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## DriftyGypsy (May 24, 2006)

First you are asking for opinions... and well you can and will get a lot of different ones, then you are putting down rules by which people can voice their opinion, by putting down rules you are asking them to change their opinion. What some would consider the Holy grail others may poo-poo.


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## hova45 (Jun 17, 2007)

To me it is the davidoff cc anniversary or the Dom P


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## opus (Jun 21, 2005)

To me, the Holy Grail is a one-of-a-kind artifact that is not readily available. Something many have been seeking for a long time with historical signifigance to many. Something that is almost mythical and which not everyone agrees as to what it actually is. I think in the cigar world this would have to be a specific cigar or box of cigars with great historical signifigance, perhaps a box specifically made for someone.

I think what you are looking for is a current or recent production cigar with a limited release. I think one of the "books" might fit this idea in my mind, or a special release humidor. Everyone has their own Holy Grail and it changes, as others have stated. Right now my "Holy Grail" is a 510th Anniversary humidor. These were made for release in 2002 and are still out there somewhere. I have sampled a few singles from this humi and love them. Actually hope I don't find one as I cannot afford it right now anyway. 

510 numbered humidors were handcrafted to celebrate the 510th anniversary of the arrival of tobacco to the Old World, when Christopher Columbus took with him to Europe the first tobacco plants he had seen after landing on the island of Cuba. 

Each one of these humidors contains 100 cigars in the following five vitolas: 

20 Espléndidos de Cohiba
20 Montecristo No. 2
20 Epicure No. 1 of Hoyo de Monterrey
20 Royales de Partagás
20 Hermosos No. 3 of Romeo y Julieta (new)


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

Out of regular current production cigars:

Montecristo A
Cohiba Lanceros & Esplendidos
Upmann Sir Winston
Cuaba Diademas & Solomones
Trinidad Fundadores

Hard to single it out to one cigar and I tried to exclude EL's, regionals, or LCDH cigars. Just your basic production Habanos.


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## replicant_argent (May 13, 2006)

right now? 

Phenomenal.


Cheap.



Flavor bomb.




Oh yeah, that is in stock.





and is legal.



and one I can purchase while driving around my neighborhood.


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## Sisyphus (Oct 9, 2005)

ResIpsa said:


> PS: Tossing in the "which I still haven't tried" in regards to the Opus X smacks a little too closely to a mooch attempt....IMO.


I don't see a mooch attempt here -- I've never seen Rob act like anything but a gentleman in these forums. :2

-Ken


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## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

party shorts or boli pc's. :tu

and opusX... uh.... only the holy grail to those who haven't tried one. if i had any, and lacked taste buds to know not to buy any, i'd send you a handful to put your mind at ease, and that's not a "cuban vs non-cuban" thing, that's a non-cuban vs OpusX thing - i just think they're not very good, then factor in the price, and they're major let-downs. i'd take a SeriesX or "famous brands Nic 3000" or whatever they're called now because Fuente owns the rights to the letter "X".... (that's just my opinion though - i like my taste buds)

now i'm off to my Chiropractor to get an "X-ray" before Fuente takes everyone in the medical field to court and we have to call them something else. "Famous Brands Nicaraguan Bone Finder 2000".


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## Corona Gigante-cl (Sep 8, 2005)

At the risk of stretching the analogy, remember that of all the knights of King Arthur's court, only Sir Percival was pure enough of heart to find the grail.

I guess I used to have a "holy grail" cigar--an aged Cohiba--possible if not necessarily easy to find on the open market. Not long ago, I picked up a fiver of ten year old Esplendidos. I tried one and I was a bit disappointed. It was nice and smooth but the flavor was a lot more subtle than I was used to and I ended up fairly unimpressed. That's just not where my palate is at.

The more I smoke cigars, the more I realize that what makes a great cigar experience has at least as much to do with the circumstances and the company than with the particular cigar. I enjoy an '06 RASS in good company far more than some other, supposedly more prestigious cigar smoked by myself.


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

Sir Winston
Lancero


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## opus (Jun 21, 2005)

IHT said:


> party shorts or boli pc's. :tu
> 
> and opusX... uh.... only the holy grail to those who haven't tried one. if i had any, and lacked taste buds to know not to buy any, i'd send you a handful to put your mind at ease, and that's not a "cuban vs non-cuban" thing, that's a non-cuban vs OpusX thing - i just think they're not very good, then factor in the price, and they're major let-downs. i'd take a SeriesX or "famous brands Nic 3000" or whatever they're called now because Fuente owns the rights to the letter "X".... (that's just my opinion though - i like my taste buds)
> 
> now i'm off to my Chiropractor to get an "X-ray" before Fuente takes everyone in the medical field to court and we have to call them something else. "Famous Brands Nicaraguan Bone Finder 2000".


 Gol darn pipe smokin, thread jackin Fuente basher! Opus X is a love em or hate em kinda cigar. You don't find too many that are on the fence about them. That* is *what makes America great though, we can like or dislike whatever we wish, and openly. I don't approve of Fuente's marketing, or 800 lb gorilla demeanor either. They are certainly quite full of themselves. I do however enjoy the occasional Opus X.


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## Sean9689 (Nov 9, 2005)

At the moment, my "Holy Grail" would be the Cubatobacco 25th Anniversario cigars from the limited edition humidor. Never had one. Through great friends and good times, I'm very happy to say that I have/had most of the cigars I'd consider my to be on my "Holy Grail" list.


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## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

opusxox said:


> Gol darn pipe smokin, thread jackin Fuente basher! Opus X is a love em or hate em kinda cigar. You don't find too many that are on the fence about them. That* is *what makes America great though, we can like or dislike whatever we wish, and openly. I don't approve of Fuente's marketing, or 800 lb gorilla demeanor either. They are certainly quite full of themselves. I do however enjoy the occasional Opus X.


true, true. i can't hide what side of the fence i am on concerning the OpusX though.


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## RedBaron (Nov 25, 2005)

Just to maybe get the thread back on track. My holy grail of cigars was the 1492. I met a White Whale Slayer @ SHIII by the name of AllanB who helped me attain my holy grail. (Thanks again Allan!!)

Right now I would have to say Cubatobacco 25th is my holy grail. :chk


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

Why doesn't anyone talk about the A's? Opening a cabinet is enough to bow down to, and smoking one is a right of passage... In the early 90's, everyone was talking about them, but they seem to be under the radar now...


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## Sisyphus (Oct 9, 2005)

The "holy grail" is an interesting metaphor because for me, attainment is no more satisfying than the quest itself.

-Ken


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## jinny (Sep 30, 2006)

I'm gonna go with the MC#2. (I am a bit biased... see avatar)

I've had plenty that I've enjoyed as much or even better, but the MC#2 feels, to me, to be the iconic cigar...
even with its known variation, it seems like the benchmark.

although, if you want to include all the hype that surrounds Opus...
I think the Havana brand most similar, is Cohiba...
except I've liked the few Cohibas I've had... can't say the same for every Opus.


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## Funnymantrip (Oct 28, 2004)

Monte #2
Sir Winston
Boli PC
Punch-Punch
PSD4
not a fauxhiba Siglo

Others that would look like a grail shaped Beacon. 
Boli BF
RyJ Churchill 
Rass
PLPC


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## Ivory Tower (Nov 18, 2005)

opusxox said:


> Right now my "Holy Grail" is a 510th Anniversary humidor. These were made for release in 2002 and are still out there somewhere. 510 numbered humidors were handcrafted to celebrate the 510th anniversary of the arrival of tobacco to the Old World, when Christopher Columbus took with him to Europe the first tobacco plants he had seen after landing on the island of Cuba.


Is that a picture of a ship on the band?


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## Sandman (Mar 26, 2006)

Corona Gigante said:


> At the risk of stretching the analogy, remember that of all the knights of King Arthur's court, only Sir Percival was pure enough of heart to find the grail.
> 
> I guess I used to have a "holy grail" cigar--an aged Cohiba--possible if not necessarily easy to find on the open market. Not long ago, I picked up a fiver of ten year old Esplendidos. I tried one and I was a bit disappointed. It was nice and smooth but the flavor was a lot more subtle than I was used to and I ended up fairly unimpressed. That's just not where my palate is at.
> 
> The more I smoke cigars, the more I realize that what makes a great cigar experience has at least as much to do with the circumstances and the company than with the particular cigar. I enjoy an '06 RASS in good company far more than some other, supposedly more prestigious cigar smoked by myself.


Great post Nicholas!


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## onlyonerm (Mar 18, 2006)

Sisyphus said:


> I don't see a mooch attempt here -- I've never seen Rob act like anything but a gentleman in these forums. :2
> 
> -Ken


:tpd:Agree I didn't get the mooch comment myself.


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## Bruce (Dec 31, 1999)

To be honest with you, I really don't have a Holy Grail cigar anymore.


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## No1der (Apr 2, 2007)

ResIpsa said:


> :tpd:This is no different from asking, "What is the best cuban cigar", or any other cigar related question dependant on personal tastes.
> 
> PS: Tossing in the "which I still haven't tried" in regards to the Opus X smacks a little too closely to a mooch attempt....IMO.


Oh by no means was I suggesting I want anyone to send me anything. I have an Opus sitting in my cooler from April 06 but I haven't smoked it because I only have one and it's been built up so much that I sometimes don't know whether to smoke it or frame it.

I'm not in the least trying to mooch anything nor do I desire anyone to send me anything. If I want an Opus bad enough I'll go and buy one.



Sisyphus said:


> I don't see a mooch attempt here -- I've never seen Rob act like anything but a gentleman in these forums. :2
> 
> -Ken


Ken, thank you for your kind words... I'm glad I've built up enough of a reputation to validate your kind words.

Now, as for the original question and for further clarification; When I said it should be a "cigar that is available on the market" I mean that it should be possible to find said cigar available for sale from some regulare retailer somewhere.

The reason I asked this question is because I have tried quite a variety of excellent Habano's and I know how subjective "taste" is...

Just about all the ones I've tried are great in their own way. Never had a bad one, unless bad draw, quallifies as a "bad one"...

I guess what I'm asking is, which stogie will just have this almost mythical "Wow Factor" that would just send one into Habano Nervana.

I know, this is a really subjective question... So I'm just curious to see what most of the BOTL's here agree upon as far as a "Must Try" type of cigar with cost not being an issue.

I really hope I made this a little clearer than mud but somehow I think I probably didn't. :hn



onlyonerm said:


> :tpd:Agree I didn't get the mooch comment myself.


Thank you onlyonerm...

I wanted to edit this post because I guess what I'm really saying is, "If there was one Habano to smoke befor you die it should be the _____________"


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## Bigwaved (May 20, 2006)

Is it just me or is the tenor of this thread a bit tightly wound?


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## opus (Jun 21, 2005)

Ivory Tower said:


> Is that a picture of a ship on the band?


yeppers.


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## JPH (Jun 30, 2006)

I'm just going to say that I love the cohiba Lancero...and its a must try...especially with some years on it....


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## burninator (Jul 11, 2006)

Bigwaved said:


> Is it just me or is the tenor of this thread a bit tightly wound?


How would I know? I'm an alto. :sl


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## lenguamor (Nov 23, 2006)

Bigwaved said:


> Is it just me or is the tenor of this thread a bit tightly wound?


It does seem to be, doesn't it?

For such an innocuous subject, it is generating some simmering tension.

For me, as others have said, the "Holy Grail" changes according to what I have been fortunate enough to try, and what I desire to try.

Plus, I haven't tried a lot of the very rare cigars such as the Cuban Davodoffs and Dunhills...I've tried one, but the others remain a sort of holy grail. As with the nectare, original BGM's that I never got to sample, etc. So those are kind of a grail...but once I've had them, then something else becomes the object of the quest.

There is one cigar which was rated a 100 by CA, I can't remember which one and I'm too lazy to look it up right now. That could be a holy grail; or maybe Suckling is even more of a jerk than he comes off and he got it totally wrong. I'll probably never get to try it.

But I'll enjoy the hell out of the ones I do!:ss


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## Twill413 (Jul 19, 2006)

Bigwaved said:


> Is it just me or is the tenor of this thread a bit tightly wound?


I'll wind your tenor 

I will agree with FunnyManTrip, I think PLPC falls into this category. It is not rare or anything, but sometimes difficult to track down. Maybe cause they are so good? (will find out for myself on the 21st).

I think this question just like palate questions, is subjective and constantly evolving depending on your rate and depth of slide down this particular slope coupled with what you consider a reasonable price to pay for a cigar. For some it is any Cuban cigar as they have never had one, others it is a true "White Whale" that we have only seen pictures of in MRN.


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## lenguamor (Nov 23, 2006)

onlyonerm said:


> :tpd:Agree I didn't get the mooch comment myself.


Ditto.

Can't someone mention what they haven't tried yet without being a mooch?


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## Sandman (Mar 26, 2006)

No1der said:


> I guess what I'm asking is, which stogie will just have this almost mythical "Wow Factor" that would just send one into Habano Nervana.
> 
> "


Ah yes, for recent production, then my answer would be the new Bolivar Gold Medals or the Cohiba Maduro 5's. They are very tasty cigars right now.


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## Bob (Jun 29, 2006)

I know I am outta my league here...but what happened to those $10,000 and $20,000 dollar boxes of Cuban Davidoffs that sold when Davidoff left Cuba? Would those be classified as a "holy grail"? If so why did they fetch the prices they did? Are any of those left? I realize what I am asking is not really pertinent to the question of something in circulation. But, I have always been interested in why those went for those prices? Not meaning to hijack the thread!!:ss


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## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

it's all relative, bob.
some ppl on here own many of those boxes, so it's not as "unobtainable" to some as one might think.
while, to others, a Trinidad Robusto Extra would be the "holy grail".


----
edit: i didn't notice anyone being wound up tight in this topic??


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## newcigarz (Feb 11, 2007)

No1der said:


> I have an Opus sitting in my cooler from April 06 but I haven't smoked it because I only have one and it's been built up so much that I sometimes don't know whether to smoke it or frame it.


Ok so What is the point of your question? Are you looking for a cigar to keep your Opus company? Sorry If I sound flip, but cigars are for smoking right? 
If you found your Cuban Holy Grail, Then what? How would you ever know?

IMHO, Smoke the Opus and Find a Cuban Cigar that you enjoy smoking as well. 
:ss


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## hova45 (Jun 17, 2007)

Bob said:


> I know I am outta my league here...but what happened to those $10,000 and $20,000 dollar boxes of Cuban Davidoffs that sold when Davidoff left Cuba? Would those be classified as a "holy grail"? If so why did they fetch the prices they did? Are any of those left? I realize what I am asking is not really pertinent to the question of something in circulation. But, I have always been interested in why those went for those prices? Not meaning to hijack the thread!!:ss


the ones that fetched those prices were the dom P and the anniversary one for the old man. dom p can be had for 100-300 dollars and the anniversary goes for 800-1000 dollars. They are avidly collected and can be found in abundance in Hong kong and a few other places. The Blend is unique is something that cannot be recreated since the tobacco grown now is different from what they grew back then. Also they are one of the best cigars in my opinion and I have been blessed to have been able to try a few and etc..


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## hova45 (Jun 17, 2007)

newcigarz said:


> Ok so What is the point of your question? Are you looking for a cigar to keep your Opus company? Sorry If I sound flip, but cigars are for smoking right?
> If you found your Cuban Holy Grail, Then what? How would you ever know?
> 
> IMHO, Smoke the Opus and Find a Cuban Cigar that you enjoy smoking as well.
> :ss


no1der just smoke it, thats what it is for and those you can always come across.


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## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

Bruce said:


> To be honest with you, I really don't have a Holy Grail cigar anymore.


And thanks to Bruce, I smoked a couple of mine this weekend.


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## Da Klugs (Jan 8, 2005)

Interpreting the question... not holy grail but the flagship of current production that stands out as "top tier".

To me top tier smokes.....

Many of the regional releases. They seem to try harder on these.
HU Sir Winstons
Monte # 2"s
Partagas Psp2's
and strangely Partagas Shorts.

Yup Partagas shorts. If you are buying cigars to smoke these are a great choice for a short smoke and an incredible value. You can say I like the RASCC better, or the SCdlh El Principe etc, but these have stood the test of time. There are few cigars that you find that have such a small percentage of smokers that say "they don't like them".

Personal Holy Grails are just that.... the next thing you really want to try. They are different for each smoker.


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## bonggoy (Mar 9, 2006)

Favorite amongst the current production:

- Monte Especiales (with a little age)
- RASS
- ERDM Tainos, Gran Corona, Lonsdale
- Monte #2
- Party 898V (with a little age).

Holy Grail

- La Flor de Cano Short Churchill
- RA Corona
- Original BGM's


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## No1der (Apr 2, 2007)

Gents, not to worry I will eventually smoke it. I made that quote about "framing it" to ease the ever growing tension that this thread is creating for some unknown (to me) reason.

I just need to sit down with a good drink when I have some time and enjoy it or maybe not. I don't know if I'll like it so I can't promise to enjoy it. But it certainly has some age on it now. :tu



newcigarz said:


> Ok so What is the point of your question? Are you looking for a cigar to keep your Opus company? Sorry If I sound flip, but cigars are for smoking right?
> If you found your Cuban Holy Grail, Then what? How would you ever know?
> 
> IMHO, Smoke the Opus and Find a Cuban Cigar that you enjoy smoking as well.
> :ss


newcigarz, I'm just trying to figure out what is that one "super cigar" that everyone :dr over so that I can buy 5 or 10 and try the subjective "Best" and see what I think. I'm pretty new to this side of the slope so I like to get an idea of what to really look for. That's all.



hova45 said:


> no1der just smoke it, thats what it is for and those you can always come across.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I really don't understand why this thread is causing so much tension? Seems like the long holliday weekend left some with a touch of a hangover maybe? I dunno.

In any case, I'm getting a bit uncomfortable in the thread I started.

So, gentlemen, I thank you for your input, I will look through all the suggestions and let you know what I think at a future date. :tu

I think I'm going to ask to have this thread locked. There's no need for so many BOTL's to be upset by a non issue.


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## Sisyphus (Oct 9, 2005)

No1der said:


> I really don't understand why this thread is causing so much tension?


Tense? Who's tense? I'm not tense, goddammit.... :cb

-Ken


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## newcigarz (Feb 11, 2007)

No1der said:


> newcigarz, I'm just trying to figure out what is that one "super cigar" that everyone :dr over so that I can buy 5 or 10 and try the subjective "Best" and see what I think. I'm pretty new to this side of the slope so I like to get an idea of what to really look for. That's all.


IMHO the Question is way to subjective. The cigar that floats the boat of someone else may not do it for you.
You can look at http://www.cigars-review.org/ or 
http://www.top25cigar.com/ until your head spins. Take it all with a grain of salt. Trial and error is the best method. It may cost you more in the long run, but think how much fun it will be when you find the "it" cigar. 
Personally I love to read the reviews of chibnkr and others who have what I consider to be "ultimate" collections. But my reality is that my collection is what I get to smoke every day, and that's what I have to be happy with.

Just my :2


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## icehog3 (Feb 20, 2005)

No1der said:


> I think I'm going to ask to have this thread locked.


Done.


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