# Questions you think are to stupid to ask



## asmartbull

Ray is right !

With the on-slot of new contributers,
it is time that one thread is dedicated to such questions.
I am sure our senior members will do their best
to check-in when they log on.......


----------



## asmartbull

I got one....
I have read that Cuba has been "freezing", for a couple yrs.
Has anyone actually seen where they do this?
Is there one in every farm ?

OK thats 2 questions

Thanks, Al


----------



## Rock31

Thanks for the thread once again Al


----------



## asmartbull

Hey Jason

s0 3l1t3....

I give up


----------



## Rock31

What is the whole thing with EMS...are they truly better cigars? Do they go through a second QA process? or is it just out there to jack prices up?


----------



## asmartbull

Rock31 said:


> What is the whole thing with EMS...are they truly better cigars? Do they go through a second QA process? or is it just out there to jack prices up?


Ray, I am sure some of the elders will chime in soon, but can tell you that last summer
I had two party 898's , same month/yr. Not same factory code. 1 EMS, 1
not EMS.........My goat-like taste buds could not tell the difference.
Perhaps, Don, Bob, Steve or Jeff will see this and respond.


----------



## HydroRaven

asmartbull said:


> I got one....
> I have read that Cuba has been "freezing", for a couple yrs.
> Has anyone actually seen where they do this?
> Is there one in every farm ?
> 
> OK thats 2 questions
> 
> Thanks, Al


Might not be much, but I found this:

Havana Corner: Freezing in Havana | Cuba | Cigar Aficionado


----------



## asmartbull

Dave, I too saw that when it can out...I just thought that since many members have been to Cuba, that someone might have seen it.....


----------



## bpegler

Rock31 said:


> What is the whole thing with EMS...are they truly better cigars? Do they go through a second QA process? or is it just out there to jack prices up?


As Al mentioned, a box of Cuban cigars with the same box code and date doesn't improve because it has been imported to England by H&F. The cigars will be the same.

However,

A lot of cigars are grey market, especially those sold at discount on unnamed sites. It is not unusual to see mold or other problems on these sticks. EMS cigars are double checked by H&F for quality. I can't recall ever seeing a EMS box with mold. Also, with all the concerns about fakes, that sticker is one more sign of authenticity.

Finally, H&F has been aging cigars for longer than anyone else. Their conditions are perfect. I know that when purchasing aged cigars, a lot of credit is given to that little sticker.


----------



## HydroRaven

I think this has the information you want Al, but you might have to translate it from German to English:

http://www.flyingcigar.de/travel_cigars/2008_03_kuba_ein_reisebericht_2008.php

Look under 29.02.2008

Nino says they freeze all exports in facilities in Guanabacoa, everything from the 51 different factories. Unfortunately no pictures...


----------



## Pipedreamz

Here's one. I was td that if there is a hurricane or drought or something that causes a poor crop yield for the Cubans tobacco, they will buy tobacco from Honduras or DR to make up for it and you will not be getting all Cuban tobacco in cigars. Makes since to me. Cuba is small.... They don't have a lot of "stock" put away. The world is large and consumes all the tobacco Cuba has to offer.... Anyone know what happens when Cuba has a poor crop yield?


----------



## JGD

Pipedreamz said:


> Here's one. I was td that if there is a hurricane or drought or something that causes a poor crop yield for the Cubans tobacco, they will buy tobacco from Honduras or DR to make up for it and you will not be getting all Cuban tobacco in cigars. Makes since to me. Cuba is small.... They don't have a lot of "stock" put away. The world is large and consumes all the tobacco Cuba has to offer.... Anyone know what happens when Cuba has a poor crop yield?


The statement that Cuba will buy tobacco from other countries during bad years is false. I have heard this said by people in the cigar business, always as a way to rationalize why their cigars are equal or better to Cuba's.

When the crop suffers in Cuba there will be less cigars available or the cigars will be made, but will have noticeable different characteristics. Some of the older guys should be able to chime in, but I'm pretty sure that some years/ factories are known to be duds - thus why people pay close attention to factory codes from certain years.


----------



## Rock31

bpegler said:


> As Al mentioned, a box of Cuban cigars with the same box code and date doesn't improve because it has been imported to England by H&F. The cigars will be the same.
> 
> However,
> 
> A lot of cigars are grey market, especially those sold at discount on unnamed sites. It is not unusual to see mold or other problems on these sticks. EMS cigars are double checked by H&F for quality. I can't recall ever seeing a EMS box with mold. Also, with all the concerns about fakes, that sticker is one more sign of authenticity.
> 
> Finally, H&F has been aging cigars for longer than anyone else. Their conditions are perfect. I know that when purchasing aged cigars, a lot of credit is given to that little sticker.


Thanks Bob, appreciate that!


----------



## Rodeo

Good thread Bull ...

On the freezing, I was (and remain to some extent) very skeptical that Cuba would be able to pull off that kind of energy and infrastructure intensive operation on tens of millions of cigars a year. It just seems like a massive operation involving a huge amount of money and effort.

I do recall Suckling reporting in an older issue of CA about a trip to a freezing facility. No reason for him or CA to lie about it, but it was a pretty short blurb without any real detail if I recall correctly

But I've never seen a picture of a facility and never heard anyone discuss an actual visit to a freezing facility. You'd think there'd be more out there if it actually existed ....


----------



## ouirknotamuzd

okay..I know this isn't a stupid question, but it is a concern so I'm gonna throw it out there.

recently, I received 2 5x3's of Monte 4's. Upon inspection, I discovered that one pack had claro wrappers and the other pack had a much darker wrapper, probably colorado maduro.

my question is: do Habano makers use different wrapper shades for the same line i.e. the Monte 4's?

both packs were stamped with the same 09 code if that makes a difference.


----------



## bpegler

ouirknotamuzd said:


> okay..I know this isn't a stupid question, but it is a concern so I'm gonna throw it out there.
> 
> recently, I received 2 5x3's of Monte 4's. Upon inspection, I discovered that one pack had claro wrappers and the other pack had a much darker wrapper, probably colorado maduro.
> 
> my question is: do Habano makers use different wrapper shades for the same line i.e. the Monte 4's?
> 
> both packs were stamped with the same 09 code if that makes a difference.


You are correct . Habanos SA uses dozens of different shades of wrappers for the same cigar. Within a box, the wrappers should match. If you have a favorite shade, and know your vendor very well you could even ask for it, like you might a box code.


----------



## Pipedreamz

I didn't think anything had dates except boxes.... Probably talking out my a$$ though


----------



## ouirknotamuzd

bpegler said:


> You are correct . Habanos SA uses dozens of different shades of wrappers for the same cigar. Within a box, the wrappers should match. If you have a favorite shade, and know your vendor very well you could even ask for it, like you might a box code.


thanks,Bob. As you said, the wrappers in each pack were identical.I haven't sampled enough different wrapper shades to find my favorite yet, but I'm sure that problem will be resolved in no time.


----------



## bpegler

Pipedreamz said:


> I didn't think anything had dates except boxes.... Probably talking out my a$$ though


If you open the cardboard top of a 15er, the box code is listed underneath.


----------



## Herf N Turf

asmartbull said:


> I got one....
> I have read that Cuba has been "freezing", for a couple yrs.
> Has anyone actually seen where they do this?
> Is there one in every farm ?
> 
> OK thats 2 questions
> 
> Thanks, Al


state of the art freezing facility at the Habanos s.a warehouse
my understanding is the facility was completed late '04 and the practice was in full swing early '05.


----------



## Pipedreamz

Ok with the exodus of the legendary rollers, has the passion also left the Cuban factories? Oh and how the crap are all you people traveling to Cuba? I thought it was off limits to the everyday Joe.


----------



## JGD

Pipedreamz said:


> Ok with the exodus of the legendary rollers, has the passion also left the Cuban factories? Oh and how the crap are all you people traveling to Cuba? I thought it was off limits to the everyday Joe.


Do you mean the exodus that occurred decades ago? If so, that really has no bearing on what is currently going on in the Cuban factories.

Also, I do not think it's a good idea to discuss how Americans are getting into Cuba on an open forum. Just my opinion.


----------



## Herf N Turf

Pipedreamz said:


> Ok with the exodus of the legendary rollers, has the passion also left the Cuban factories? Oh and how the crap are all you people traveling to Cuba? I thought it was off limits to the everyday Joe.





JGD said:


> Do you mean the exodus that occurred decades ago? If so, that really has no bearing on what is currently going on in the Cuban factories.
> 
> Also, I do not think it's a good idea to discuss how Americans are getting into Cuba on an open forum. Just my opinion.


Jimmy, I think he means the cigar boom exodus that occurred when several companies recruited most of the master rollers from Cuba to their central American operations.

From my purely subjective observations, it's quite the opposite. Many lower and mid-level rollers saw fast and substantial promotions and are driven to make good on that opportunity. Quality has slowly increased over the past decade and the product is as good as ever and getting better. For the first time, Habanos is using aged tobaccos, employing three year old ligero, two year old seco and year old wrapper leaves. The Cohiba maduros released in 2007-current use a 5yrs aged naturally fermented wrapper. They mechanically draw test cigars now to ensure a proper delivery of smoke. They also use a mechanized system for moistening wrapper leaves, to ensure consistency and reduce the chances of over-wetting.

No one with a US passport, unless they have diplomatic credentials or a press visa are spending a lot of time in Cuba. For our Canadian brethren, it's a different, jealousy inspiring story.


----------



## asmartbull

Pipedreamz said:


> Ok with the exodus of the legendary rollers, has the passion also left the Cuban factories? Oh and how the crap are all you people traveling to Cuba? I thought it was off limits to the everyday Joe.


 There are also "Educational" exemptions for small groups.
I will look for the press release


----------



## Pipedreamz

JGD said:


> Also, I do not think it's a good idea to discuss how Americans are getting into Cuba on an open forum. Just my opinion.


I meant the "cigar boom exodus" 
But I guess my thinking that the average Joe American still can not visit Cuban. I always seen to forget about our lucky northerly neighbors.


----------



## JGD

Pipedreamz said:


> I meant the "cigar boom exodus"
> But I guess my thinking that the average Joe American still can not visit Cuban. I always seen to forget about our lucky northerly neighbors.


Gotcha. In that case, there was a definite impact. There have been lost of construction issues with cigars that were released from 2000-2002. Some of these issues were likely caused by promotions from within the factory that occurred a bit too early. However, it has been my experience at least, that some of the recent smokes have had very few issues construction wise. So, it seems as if any problems caused by the cigar boom exodus are nonexistent today.


----------



## Pipedreamz

This is a good thread


----------



## bpegler

JGD said:


> Gotcha. In that case, there was a definite impact. There have been lost of construction issues with cigars that were released from 2000-2002. Some of these issues were likely caused by promotions from within the factory that occurred a bit too early. However, it has been my experience at least, that some of the recent smokes have had very few issues construction wise. So, it seems as if any problems caused by the cigar boom exodus are nonexistent today.


As Jim said, there were some problematic years for Cuban cigars. Truth is that during the cigar boom all cigars suffered from overproduction and overpricing, not just Cubans.

Many of the current great rollers still live in Cuba and work in the factories, plus they do some fabulous custom rolling. Hamlet, La China, Reynaldo, Handsome Jimmy, Carlos Fernandez to name a few.

The passion lives on...


----------



## Captnstabn

Here's one. What is the difference between dress and cabinet boxes? And why do they offer both?


----------



## asmartbull

Captnstabn said:


> Here's one. What is the difference between dress and cabinet boxes? And why do they offer both?


Dress box, usually cardboard, 2 rows of cigars
Cab, Wooden , 50 cigars

I will find you a great link...but in the mean time

Check this link out...Awesome info on boxes
Cuban_boxes


----------



## Captnstabn

Thanks for the link. There's a lot of other cool cigar history stuff on that website too.


----------



## asmartbull

Use this site...Awesome

http://www.cubancigarwebsite.com/info-packaging.htm

Dress Box

This is the standard cigar box. Also referred to as a current box, labelled box or semi-plain box (semi-plain more correctly applies to boxes pre-WW2, where the dressings did not cover the whole box).

The standard dress box contains 25 banded cigars. The cigars are normally box pressed (the cigars are slightly flat on four sides) except for cedar-wrapped or tubed cigars. The box is "dressed" with specific paper labels and trimmings. Until the mid 1970's, the box is constructed from solid cedar, after which time it changed to cedar veneered plywood. The box is sealed using a pin / nail.

Small Dress Box

This is a smaller version of the dress box, usually containing 10 cigars.

Slide Lid Box (SLB)

Also referred to as a Cabinet. This is a varnished or unvarnished timber box containing 25 or 50 round cigars; packed in a bundle and tied with a silk ribbon, with cigars-bands since mid 2006. Around 1997, the timber changed from solid cedar to cedar veneered plywood.


----------



## Pipedreamz

You would think a dress box would be.. oh I don't know, dressier.


----------



## bdw1984

Pipedreamz said:


> You would think a dress box would be.. oh I don't know, dressier.


Compared to cabinets, they are.


----------



## Pipedreamz

Here is one I know is too stupid to ask because I have looked at all the box info links and I'm still clueless.... So here is Lees stupid question (surprise surprise)
My box of San Cristobal has two seals, the top one has the hologram ripped off, because of the vendor region or something like that. So I wasn't worried when I saw that even though the bottom is wider than the top. The bottom of the box is stamped URG May 10... So they were boxed in May 2010. I can't find URG anything. Monte 4's the same thing... ALE and Sep 10. What is ALE? I thought these would be factory codes but I don't see them listed. Am I just retarded?


----------



## Perfecto Dave

*Can cigars be frozen too long or too many times?

ie.........A person get their stash in and freezes....does a trade with B person and B person freezes the same cigars........B person decides he wants to do a trade with C person and C person wants to hold a length of time in their humi for a special occasion so C person freezes.....**:noidea:*


----------



## HydroRaven

Pipedreamz said:


> Here is one I know is too stupid to ask because I have looked at all the box info links and I'm still clueless.... So here is Lees stupid question (surprise surprise)
> My box of San Cristobal has two seals, the top one has the hologram ripped off, because of the vendor region or something like that. So I wasn't worried when I saw that even though the bottom is wider than the top. The bottom of the box is stamped URG May 10... So they were boxed in May 2010. I can't find URG anything. Monte 4's the same thing... ALE and Sep 10. What is ALE? I thought these would be factory codes but I don't see them listed. Am I just retarded?


You won't be finding factory codes anymore. They get changed every so often and randomly assigned, so it's very difficult / pointless to figure out which codes belong to which factories.


----------



## Pipedreamz

So basically all we worry about now is the date stamp then and the other is just gibberish to all?


----------



## JGD

Pipedreamz said:


> So basically all we worry about now is the date stamp then and the other is just gibberish to all?


More or less. However, the factory code is something to keep in mind. If you get a box with a certain code and you love the smokes, you may want to seek out more with the same code. On the flip side, if hated the cigars you will want to ensure that you don;t buy cigars from the same code again.


----------



## asmartbull

JGD said:


> More or less. However, the factory code is something to keep in mind. If you get a box with a certain code and you love the smokes, you may want to seek out more with the same code. On the flip side, if hated the cigars you will want to ensure that you don;t buy cigars from the same code again.


to give you an example
Most agree that the TEB 06 was outstanding.
Some will buy almost anything with that code
I will


----------



## harley33

This is a great thread. A good refresher course as well as enlightening! :smoke2:


----------



## HydroRaven

asmartbull said:


> to give you an example
> Most agree that the TEB 06 was outstanding.
> Some will buy almost anything with that code
> I will


Thanks Bull!


----------



## asmartbull

Here is one that is not so stupid....

Why do boxes with less air flow age slower than ones
with more air flow ????


----------



## JGD

asmartbull said:


> Here is one that is not so stupid....
> 
> Why do boxes with less air flow age slower than ones
> with more air flow ????


According to a hypothesis presented by MRN, when there is more air flow the chemical reactions in the tobacco that take place when the cigar ages (goes through the three stages) will occur at a faster pace. On the other hand, when there is a lack of airflow, those reactions will take longer to to occur, thus slowing down the aging process.


----------



## asmartbull

Jim
I understand what he wrote, but aren't we really talking about fermentation?
Are there 3 fermentation's ?


----------



## JGD

asmartbull said:


> Jim
> I understand what he wrote, but aren't we really talking about fermentation?
> Are there 3 fermentation's ?


According to his book, there are 4 stages of aging (I misspoke when I said three earlier), which seems to be a result of a continuous fermentation.

The first is the Sick Period, which is then followed by the First Maturation. The First Maturation is "the result of of the ongoing fermentation after the cigar has been made." Then the cigar goes through the Second Maturation, which "is the result of degradation of tannin and the interaction of its end products with the flavors generated by fermentation." After that, the cigar goes through the final stage, which is the Third Maturation, which "is the result of accumulation of a finesse generated by the mysterious chemical reaction between congeners, and everything else in the cigar."

So, by allowing more air, the chemical reaction will allow the cigars to go through these stages quicker. As you know, MRN has advocated storage that cuts down the air flow, in order to slow down this process. However, in his book, he informs his readers to give ample air flow during the sick period in order to make the cigars smokable if they are unable to wait the necessary length of time for them to go to the First Maturation stage (where he notes that the cigars are often at their most flavorful) at optimal storage conditions.


----------



## piperdown

asmartbull said:


> Jim
> I understand what he wrote, but aren't we really talking about fermentation?
> Are there 3 fermentation's ?


Most fermentation is driven by oxidation (i.e., needs some form of O2). Less airflow, less oxygen to drive fermentation.


----------



## Perfecto Dave

Perfecto Dave said:


> *Can cigars be frozen too long or too many times?
> 
> *


*I guess this was a really stupid question.*


----------



## JGD

Perfecto Dave said:


> *I guess this was a really stupid question.*


I don't think so. I'm also very curious about this.


----------



## asmartbull

If we believe the the cigars are frozen before they leave the island.
Then we freeze when we get them at our homes.
I know we can safely do it twice.

Ya know, that will be a good experiment.


----------



## Perfecto Dave

*I try to read about everything I have seen about freezing and the techniques used. I guess I'm assuming that it wouldn't have any ill effects except for maybe the too long part. But I'd figure I'd throw it out there and see what the consensus is.

You know what is said about the assuming part........... *:smow:


----------



## bpegler

Perfecto Dave said:


> *I guess this was a really stupid question.*


Not a stupid question, but I'm not sure any of us know the answer.


----------



## SmoknTaz

Perfecto Dave said:


> *Can cigars be frozen too long or too many times?*
> 
> *ie.........A person get their stash in and freezes....does a trade with B person and B person freezes the same cigars........B person decides he wants to do a trade with C person and C person wants to hold a length of time in their humi for a special occasion so C person freezes.....**:noidea:*


 If you leave cigars in the freezer for let say a couple of months then I would say YES. Eventually they will become freezer burned. I have a hard time picking out the subtle flavors so for me a couple of treatments in the freezer won't make a difference. Does that make sense?


----------



## Perfecto Dave

SmoknTaz said:


> If you leave cigars in the freezer for let say a couple of months then I would say YES. Eventually they will become freezer burned. I have a hard time picking out the subtle flavors so for me a couple of treatments in the freezer won't make a difference. Does that make sense?


*Thanks for the replies...yes it does make sense. I was kind of thinking along those same lines just wanted to get some others opinions.*


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

asmartbull said:


> I got one....
> I have read that Cuba has been "freezing", for a couple yrs.
> Has anyone actually seen where they do this?
> Is there one in every farm ?
> 
> OK thats 2 questions
> 
> Thanks, Al


I don't know if they are even really frozen ,as i have heard of beetles after the supposed start of freezing!


----------



## Barefoot

I suppose if the cigars are damp enough and being frozen multiple times it could cause problems; at 65% I don't see any probs but I am definately no expert. 
I am just thinking of the freezer burn in meats and what not that are very moist vs drier commodities.
I suppose it would be a good idea to inform any recipients about the freeze status of the goods. If not notified I would surely freeze again and why do it if you trust the word of the source?


----------



## JGD

TonyBrooklyn said:


> I don't know if they are even really frozen ,as i have heard of beetles after the supposed start of freezing!


I agree. As much as I hear that I still have doubts.


----------



## Herf N Turf

First of all, there's a significant difference between flash freezing and slow freezing, like we do at home. It's not about what happens to the water in the cigar, but what happens to the oils. Think fish. There is a distinct difference in the taste of fish that's been completely frozen and fish that's only been laid in ice. All agree unfrozen fish tastes better.

When oils are frozen, they lose hydrocarbons and other molecular elements, which alter taste. It's the oils in tobacco, which give it its characteristic flavors and complexity. There's been much complaining of late, over the "muted" flavors of Cuban cigars, since the practice of flash freezing was made universal. To my way of thinking, freezing them again is only increasing the compromising of flavors and especially, complexity. Slow freezing will produce a far more dramatic change. Whether or not this is noticeable, or negatively impacts the experience of the individual smoker is, well, up to that individual smoker to determine. To each his own.


----------



## bpegler

Herf N Turf said:


> First of all, there's a significant difference between flash freezing and slow freezing, like we do at home. It's not about what happens to the water in the cigar, but what happens to the oils. Think fish. There is a distinct difference in the taste of fish that's been completely frozen and fish that's only been laid in ice. All agree unfrozen fish tastes better.
> 
> When oils are frozen, they lose hydrocarbons and other molecular elements, which alter taste. It's the oils in tobacco, which give it its characteristic flavors and complexity. There's been much complaining of late, over the "muted" flavors of Cuban cigars, since the practice of flash freezing was made universal. To my way of thinking, freezing them again is only increasing the compromising of flavors and especially, complexity. Slow freezing will produce a far more dramatic change. Whether or not this is noticeable, or negatively impacts the experience of the individual smoker is, well, up to that individual smoker to determine. To each his own.


Very interesting post. I wonder if that would explain why freshly rolled custom Cubans that haven't been frozen have such intensity of flavor.

Something to ponder.


----------



## Herf N Turf

bpegler said:


> Very interesting post. I wonder if that would explain why freshly rolled custom Cubans that haven't been frozen have such intensity of flavor.
> 
> Something to ponder.


Partially, but not majoritatively. It's more the fact that everything's "fresh" and hasn't had time for the final fermentation to take hold. I know we all love to talk about aging this and that, but there's nothing that comes close to a cigar ROTT (Right Off The Table). That's the way Cubans prefer them, too.


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

Herf N Turf said:


> Partially, but not majoritatively. It's more the fact that everything's "fresh" and hasn't had time for the final fermentation to take hold. I know we all love to talk about aging this and that, but there's nothing that comes close to a cigar ROTT (Right Off The Table). That's the way Cubans prefer them, too.


I gotta agree i love a cigar ROTT!


----------



## Barefoot

I dig em that way to!
I just think that if you gift or bomb someone, it would be a courtesy to disclose the cigars history of being frozen previous or not. It might save someone from compromising the health of a cigar or their whole stash. 
I hate it when a box turns for the worst.......


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

Well i will say this i personally have taken cigars. The ones that where not frozen from the late 90's. I have smoked an un frozen one. And a frozen one side by side. You see i was very resistant to the thought of freezing cigars for loss of flavor. Just as i was very resistant to Kitty Litter instead of beads. But when i got hit by beetles i had no choice. So i smoked them side by side. I could not taste any difference between the two. Just as i have found no difference between beads and Kitty Litter. But what the hell do i know anyways. I have only been smoking cigars. Longer than some of you have been alive.:fencing::lever::grouphug:


----------



## JGD

TonyBrooklyn said:


> Well i will say this i personally have taken cigars. The ones that where not frozen from the late 90's. I have smoked an un frozen one. And a frozen one side by side. You see i was very resistant to the thought of freezing cigars for loss of flavor. Just as i was very resistant to Kitty Litter instead of beads. But when i got hit by beetles i had no choice. So i smoked them side by side. I could not taste any difference between the two. Just as i have found no difference between beads and Kitty Litter. But what the hell do i know anyways. I have only been smoking cigars. Longer than some of you have been alive.:fencing::lever::grouphug:


LOL. :smoke:


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

JGD said:


> LOL. :smoke:


I knew you would get a kick out of that!:drinking:


----------



## Perfecto Dave

*And now for my next stupid question...............:help:

"Sublime" What exactly does that mean in terms of a CC? 
How do these differ from say.... EL's or RE's?

*


----------



## bpegler

Perfecto Dave said:


> *And now for my next stupid question...............:help:
> 
> "Sublime" What exactly does that mean in terms of a CC?
> How do these differ from say.... EL's or RE's?
> 
> *


Sublime is a size of cigar. Specifically 6.5 inches by 54 RG.


----------



## asmartbull

Gents
Over the last few yrs, I see Cuba going to larger RG cigars.
I see them getting away from what I thought they did the best.
Other than speculating that it is for foreign markets, does
anyone know for sure ???


----------



## asmartbull

Here is another one....
Why is do cigars of the same age, stored in the same environment taste better when coming from a cab vs. a dress box ?.....


----------



## Perfecto Dave

bpegler said:


> Sublime is a size of cigar. Specifically 6.5 inches by 54 RG.


*Thanks Bob....according to wiki it is something totally different....Glad I asked now.*


----------



## Perfecto Dave

asmartbull said:


> Here is another one....
> Why is do cigars of the same age, stored in the same environment taste better when coming from a cab vs. a dress box ?.....


*I heard this but don't have the experience to know. It is a quandary though.....and thinking just a little bit of paper with ink on it would make a diff?*


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

_This is a great thread BullMan!
As my father used to say!
"There are no stupid questions only stupid answers"!_
:rockon::rockon::rockon::rockon::rockon:


----------



## bdw1984

asmartbull said:


> Here is another one....
> Why is do cigars of the same age, stored in the same environment taste better when coming from a cab vs. a dress box ?.....


The only logical argument that I have ever heard regarding this is that cabs get better airflow due to being made out of wood and the placement of the cigars in the cab format is more is more conducive to that airflow. I don't know if this is true but I can attest to the fact that cigars from cabs generally smoke better. If available, I always buy a cab


----------



## bdw1984

Ok here is one... say you buy some aged CC's from someone on a board. The cigars arrive un-banded and it was not disclosed in the thread that they would be band-less. How would you proceed?


----------



## JGD

bdw1984 said:


> Ok here is one... say you buy some aged CC's from someone on a board. The cigars arrive un-banded and it was not disclosed in the thread that they would be band-less. How would you proceed?


It would depend entirely on who they are.


----------



## asmartbull

bdw1984 said:


> Ok here is one... say you buy some aged CC's from someone on a board. The cigars arrive un-banded and it was not disclosed in the thread that they would be band-less. How would you proceed?


 Depends on the yr, as many in cabs of 50 were not banded until the late
05 or 06 ??...So I would ask if they were from such a cab.
The next question would be the vendor,,,,this speaks for it self.
Frankly, I see many buying from questionable sourses and I know they are in circulation so I would be suspect......Ben, it scares me when these questions get asked....


----------



## bdw1984

JGD said:


> It would depend entirely on who they are.


Total newb... never any transactions on the board and agreed to send first

Edit: I have smoked over 200 of this exact cigar so it would not be difficult for me to discern whether or not they are real, band or no band


----------



## bdw1984

asmartbull said:


> Depends on the yr, as many in cabs of 50 were not banded until the late
> 05 or 06 ??...So I would ask if they were from such a cab.
> The next question would be the vendor,,,,this speaks for it self.
> Frankly, I see many buying from questionable sourses and I know they are in circulation so I would be suspect......Ben, it scares me when these questions get asked....


they should have a band... I don't want to take away from the spirit of this thread so if you guys think we should move this to pm, it's your call. If not, I'm fine talking about this here, it may be a good lesson/convo starter.


----------



## JGD

asmartbull said:


> Depends on the yr, as many in cabs of 50 were not banded until the late
> 05 or 06 ??...So I would ask if they were from such a cab.
> The next question would be the vendor,,,,this speaks for it self.
> Frankly, I see many buying from questionable sourses and I know they are in circulation so I would be suspect......Ben, it scares me when these questions get asked....


I agree with Bull, if the cigars fit certain criteria then it would be ok. However, if they are cigars that _should_ have bands then I would be suspect.


----------



## bdw1984

I'll put it out there... 03 BBF


----------



## asmartbull

bdw1984 said:


> Total newb... never any transactions on the board and agreed to send first


Frankly, I see many NEWB's buying from questionable sourses and I know they are in circulation so I would be suspect....Ben< I am sure your palate will tell the truth....but I stand by my first comment


----------



## bpegler

asmartbull said:


> Gents
> Over the last few yrs, I see Cuba going to larger RG cigars.
> I see them getting away from what I thought they did the best.
> Other than speculating that it is for foreign markets, does
> anyone know for sure ???


I believe the answer is simple economics. In Cuba, both the commodity (tobacco) and labor (the rollers) are cheap. The cost to the manufacturer is minimal regardless of the size of the cigar. Therefore, the additional price of a larger cigar is pure profit.

REs, LEs, Jars, Books, really don't cost much more to manufacture.

If I was Habanos SA I would make 60 RG monsters, put them in cool jars I bought from China, and whistle all the way to the bank.


----------



## asmartbull

bdw1984 said:


> I'll put it out there... 03 BBF


 Without looking, was it from a Cab (50)


----------



## bdw1984

asmartbull said:


> Without looking, was it from a Cab (50)


To the best of my knowledge these have only come in 25's, cab and box


----------



## asmartbull

That is supposed to be a great cigar.....
If the NOOB is a seasoned guy who is new to 
the board, that is one thing. If he only has 1 yr under his belt, that is quite another


----------



## fiatster

Ok I'm going to embarrass myself and ask a really noob dumb question. Is the tiingling (for lack of a better word) feeling in the nose on retrohale what people refer to as pepper?


----------



## Tritones

Maybe for some, but not for me. I explain pepper as a distinct tingle in my mouth - the same sort of feeling (not necessarily the taste, though) that black pepper or chili peppers produce. And there is a distinction in the black pepper feel and the chili pepper feel of cigars, as there is of the real spices.


----------



## tpharkman

asmartbull said:


> Here is another one....
> Why is do cigars of the same age, stored in the same environment taste better when coming from a cab vs. a dress box ?.....


What about havanas stored in the all cedar 10 ct boxes...will they smoke as well as those in a cab or the same as those in a dress box? or somewhere in between?

I take cedar pieces from old boxes and line the bottom of dress boxes with them in order to keep the cigars from touching the paper. I will also remove havanas from the dress boxes and actually put them in nc boxes that were made from all cedar or at least cedar lined.

What are your thoughts on the 10 cts?


----------



## D307P

Sorry, did a search for the NC thread and got this one by mistake.


----------



## fuente~fuente

D307P said:


> Sorry, did a search for the NC thread and got this one by mistake.


Ugghh... I got it 

I'm tired of cleaning up your messes Dave


----------



## D307P

Thank you


----------



## jabuan

aloha, the magic revelation of these threads just happened to me and to be honest never even considered CCs mostly because they seem so unattainable (kinda like my bachelor's when i was in undergrad. hahahah) this thread and section has gotten me crazy interested in this aspect of the hobby. 

anyway, my question refers to the term "cuban seed." if brands talk about how their tobacco is made from "cuban seed" wouldn't i be experiencing the same thing if i smoke those? 

again...mega noob to cigars and the forum so i apologize for the question if it has been asked repeatedly. i just could't find anything with search.


----------



## Tritones

The environment in which it is grown has a lot to do with the taste of tobacco. Probably at least as much as the origin of the seed. Also bear in mind that "Cuban seed" usually means seeds produced by the descendants of the plants grown from seeds exported (or smuggled) from Cuba before the embargo. Tobacco is a very malleable plant, genetically speaking - it adapts to new environments rapidly. So, there are probably genetic differences between Cuban seed descendants and Cuban tobacco grown in Cuba. all of which adds up to wide taste distinctions.

Too bad, too. I've heard Cuban cigars are pretty tasty. My Australian friends swear by them. :biggrin:


----------



## Mante

Tritones said:


> Too bad, too. I've heard Cuban cigars are pretty tasty. My Australian friends swear by them. :biggrin:


Hahahaaaaaahaaaaaaa........ :spy:


----------



## tpharkman

It is very similar to planting a california grape in Iowa and expecting it to produce an incredible cabernet or vice versa, planting Iowa corn in the california wine region and expecting it to become world famous corn on the cob. It isn't the seed it's the soil.


----------



## jabuan

Right on guys thanks. And so the hunt begins. Hahahah. I was having fun tracking LP unicos and rare Tatuajes down and now this forum has just opened a whole new game. Hahaha


----------



## z0diac

fiatster said:


> Ok I'm going to embarrass myself and ask a really noob dumb question. Is the tiingling (for lack of a better word) feeling in the nose on retrohale what people refer to as pepper?


I refer to a 'peppery' cigar as any cigar that burns my nose when exhaling through it, or spicy/hot taste on my tongue (the two always seem to go hand in hand).


----------



## fiatster

That's exactly what I was talking about. Thanks for the answer Jake BTW... Great avatar.


z0diac said:


> I refer to a 'peppery' cigar as any cigar that burns my nose when exhaling through it, or spicy/hot taste on my tongue (the two always seem to go hand in hand).


----------



## Mac05

I have a pretty newb question, or it will probably turn into questions. I have tried a good amount of CC's (being stationed in Germany for now has helped) I really liked the Cohiba Mad 5. With NC's I also tend to prefer the more medium to full flavored sticks. I'm looking for some recommendations on some CC's that are more medium to full flavored. Not looking to go too expensive, though I know that it's not always a possibility. Maybe someone could point me in a direction of a decent sampler or two to order. I also have not quite narrowed down where to order from. Any advice that you could give is very welcomed and PMs are VERY welcome. Thanks guys!


----------



## asmartbull

Mac05 said:


> I have a pretty newb question, or it will probably turn into questions. I have tried a good amount of CC's (being stationed in Germany for now has helped) I really liked the Cohiba Mad 5. With NC's I also tend to prefer the more medium to full flavored sticks. I'm looking for some recommendations on some CC's that are more medium to full flavored. Not looking to go too expensive, though I know that it's not always a possibility. Maybe someone could point me in a direction of a decent sampler or two to order. I also have not quite narrowed down where to order from. Any advice that you could give is very welcomed and PMs are VERY welcome. Thanks guys!


Start with Boli and Party......You will run out of $$$$ before you run out of "full Flavor" options


----------



## Mac05

asmartbull said:


> Start with Boli and Party......You will run out of $$$$ before you run out of "full Flavor" options


Thanks for the advice, and I'm assuming Party is Partagas?


----------



## bpegler

Mac05 said:


> Thanks for the advice, and I'm assuming Party is Partagas?


That is correct.


----------



## fuente~fuente

If you listen to those two guys Mac05, you're going to be a poor SOB real quick! :lol:


----------



## Tritones

fuente~fuente said:


> If you listen to those two guys Mac05, you're going to be a poor SOB real quick! :lol:


But you'll smoke a lot of great cigars along the way!


----------



## fuente~fuente

Tritones said:


> But you'll smoke a lot of great cigars along the way!


TRUTH :banana:


----------



## Mac05

fuente~fuente said:


> If you listen to those two guys Mac05, you're going to be a poor SOB real quick! :lol:


It's ok it's all about the journey. I'm all about sliding into home plate when this is all over with nothing but memories and great life experiences. A chance to smoke a good cigar is always a luxury.


----------



## Mac05

Still curious on places to order. Wondering if any of you could PM me with places they use.


----------



## z0diac

Mac05 said:


> Still curious on places to order. Wondering if any of you could PM me with places they use.


atlanticcigar.com
pipesandcigars.com
cigarplace.biz
..


----------



## teedles915

Gentlemen, please keep in mind that we do not allow the posting of Cuban Cigar Vendors in the forum. I have edited the offending post(s), please refrain from any further infractions.


----------



## Mante

Mac05 said:


> Still curious on places to order. Wondering if any of you could PM me with places they use.


You may want to have a read here.....http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/habanos-discussion/322735-habanos-forum-rules-important.html



z0diac said:


> atlanticcigar.com
> pipesandcigars.com
> cigarplace.biz
> ..


 ound:


----------



## Mac05

teedles915 said:


> Gentlemen, please keep in mind that we do not allow the posting of Cuban Cigar Vendors in the forum. I have edited the offending post(s), please refrain from any further infractions.


Apologies for the oversight. It will not happen again.


----------



## HIM

Heres a question I think is stupid to ask, not because I think its a dumb question, more because its toes the line of a touchy subject. If its better left alone I understand. I just figure were all adults here and its something that Ive yet to decide my own feelings on.

How does everyone feel about knowing your CC purchases support the Cuban government and how that government treats their people?


----------



## CeeGar

Cole, while I appreciate your effort to stimulate conversation, this is probably one of those topics best left for face to face interaction. Borderline political subjects rarely turn out well in an online forum atmosphere. Just my thoughts. Proceed at your own risk


----------



## huskers

CeeGar said:


> Cole, while I appreciate your effort to stimulate conversation, this is probably one of those topics best left for face to face interaction. Borderline political subjects rarely turn out well in an online forum atmosphere. Just my thoughts. Proceed at your own risk


might be alright in its own thread over in the proper section of this forum..............

I bet it would get closed up pretty quickly due to political reasons though.


----------



## huskers

I do have a question though. 

How long do you think it should take for a new box of cigars to get acclimated to a wineadors RH?

I've had a box of Obsidian Coronas in there for about 2 weeks I think and they still seem really wet.


----------



## HIM

CeeGar said:


> Cole, while I appreciate your effort to stimulate conversation, this is probably one of those topics best left for face to face interaction. Borderline political subjects rarely turn out well in an online forum atmosphere. Just my thoughts. Proceed at your own risk


I agree and understand. It is a very touchy subject and Im definitely not looking to start an argument. I guess for me its just something I debate within myself about because Im very close to many Cuban people. Not surprising seeing as Im closer to Cuba than I am the mainland of Florida. Both my daughters grandparents on her mothers side were born and raised in Cuba. Same with many of my friends parents. They all have very immense pride for their cigars but simultaneously deeply hurt inside. Seeing them torn between how to feel only makes it harder for me to decide where I stand. Guess this is probably best left unanswered.


----------



## asmartbull

huskers said:


> I do have a question though.
> 
> How long do you think it should take for a new box of cigars to get acclimated to a wineadors RH?
> 
> I've had a box of Obsidian Coronas in there for about 2 weeks I think and they still seem really wet.


It depends on the size and what RH they are starting out at.
along with the type of box holding the cigars.
I have seen 4 weeks to 6 months


----------



## piperdown

huskers said:


> I do have a question though.
> 
> How long do you think it should take for a new box of cigars to get acclimated to a wineadors RH?
> 
> I've had a box of Obsidian Coronas in there for about 2 weeks I think and they still seem really wet.


Josh, at that size and knowing how wet some of the online places ship you're probably going to need them to rest another 2-3 weeks.
If it was me I'd try one after another 2weeks and see how they smoke.


----------



## huskers

They are coronas........I think I may leave the box open in my humi a bit longer.

thanks Eric


----------



## asmartbull

huskers said:


> I do have a question though.
> 
> How long do you think it should take for a new box of cigars to get acclimated to a wineadors RH?
> 
> I've had a box of Obsidian Coronas in there for about 2 weeks I think and they still seem really wet.


A good rule of thumb is 1 week for everyday of transit


----------



## HIM

Are all Cuban cigars rolled only with Cuban grown tobacco? If so, do you think they would ever use tobacco from other countries in the future? If they did how would you feel about it?


----------



## avitti

HIM said:


> Are all Cuban cigars rolled only with Cuban grown tobacco? If so, do you think they would ever use tobacco from other countries in the future? If they did how would you feel about it?


Filler.binder and wrapper leaves all grown in Cuba..Cuban people and the country on the whole are very proud of their cigars-i doubt highly they would ever consider anything but puros cuban cigars


----------



## jabuan

i've read somewhere that the filler tobacco in bolivar tubos is inferior to that of everything else they produce. is this true? i see that tubo no. 2 is pretty much the same size as the pc. 

thoughts?


----------



## Mante

jabuan said:


> i've read somewhere that the filler tobacco in bolivar tubos is inferior to that of everything else they produce. is this true? i see that tubo no. 2 is pretty much the same size as the pc.
> 
> thoughts?


My thoughts are that would be incorrect but I would enjoy being proven wrong. Where was your information sourced other than an off the cuff statement made by a vendor that is oft repeated verbatim elsewhere?


----------



## jabuan

cigars-review. oh arr gee

i think they were speakign about the no 2 and pc specifically


----------



## Mante

jabuan said:


> cigars-review. oh arr gee
> 
> i think they were speakign about the no 2 and pc specifically


And they have posted exactly the descriptor that is written on a vendors website. Said vendor has a vested interest to sell certain products so I highly doubt that information is correct & I have not heard of such musings from others that have smoked both (as have I). Would it not make sense that if the Tubos #2 used inferior filler then they would be cheaper than the PC (which is not the case)?


----------



## jabuan

good point.


----------



## Mante

jabuan said:


> good point.


I'm glad you see it that way. I am all for good information being disseminated but there is always the old internet chestnut that crops up where one bad "theory" becomes wrote because enough people repeat it. :thumb:


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

jabuan said:


> i've read somewhere that the filler tobacco in bolivar tubos is inferior to that of everything else they produce. is this true? i see that tubo no. 2 is pretty much the same size as the pc.
> 
> thoughts?


As Warren has stated there is no truth to this. There are no 2nd's in Cuban cigars .Cigars that don't pass inspection are rejected. The only bargains are machine mades.


----------



## jabuan

got another one. with my newly found obssession with researching habanos i've noticed that cohibas are significantly more expensive than the others? why is that?


----------



## Mante

jabuan said:


> got another one. with my newly found obssession with researching habanos i've noticed that cohibas are significantly more expensive than the others? why is that?


They are marketed as the "premium" marca by Habanos S.A. As per the price differential, Trinidads are close to the same price point. I'm in no way belittling Cohibas value as there are some very worthy cigars in that line & to my thinking you will find the greatest value in the general releases from them like the Robusto & a few of the Siglos. Every market needs it's leader for one reason or another & Cohiba are that leader for Habanos.

Here is a real life test. Mention Bolivar to a non cigar smoker & watch their reaction. Now say Cohiba & watch the reply. 

Enjoy your journey mate.


----------



## jabuan

Appreciated, warren.


----------



## jabuan

Has a "cc noobie sampler trade" ever been done or considered? Biggest problem I have is provenance, so that prevents me from participating in the cc/nc MAW. I've been buying singles and mostly are 2010 and younger. 

Just a thought.


----------



## jabuan

Yet another one from Jojo. Hahaha. Sorry for being ultra noob guys. 

As some know ive recently gotten into habanos and have been acquiring singles. Now I have singles of the same Marcas and vitolas of differing ages. 

What should I smoke first? The newer ones (2013) or older ones? (10-12)

I'm thinking newer to have a baseline and then smoke the ones with a little rest after. 

Thoughts?


----------



## asmartbull

jabuan said:


> Yet another one from Jojo. Hahaha. Sorry for being ultra noob guys.
> 
> As some know ive recently gotten into habanos and have been acquiring singles. Now I have singles of the same Marcas and vitolas of differing ages.
> 
> What should I smoke first? The newer ones (2013) or older ones? (10-12)
> 
> I'm thinking newer to have a baseline and then smoke the ones with a little rest after.
> 
> Thoughts?


older first


----------



## jabuan

roger. thanks.


----------



## Miami Bad Boy BOSS

I have a few unopened and sealed boxed; by sealed, I mean the box is still wrapped in the factory cellophane. I am going into the Merchant Marines and in August I am leaving for a year to go to bootcamp. Should I store my sealed boxes in my tupperdor or will they be alright since they are wrapped up?

I guess I can generalize the question for others by just asking, do you need to place sealed and unopen boxes in humidors or are they okay, as is, till they are opened? 

Thanks guys!

MB³


----------



## asmartbull

Miami Bad Boy BOSS said:


> I have a few unopened and sealed boxed; by sealed, I mean the box is still wrapped in the factory cellophane. I am going into the Merchant Marines and in August I am leaving for a year to go to bootcamp. Should I store my sealed boxes in my tupperdor or will they be alright since they are wrapped up?
> 
> I guess I can generalize the question for others by just asking, do you need to place sealed and unopen boxes in humidors or are they okay, as is, till they are opened?
> 
> Thanks guys!
> 
> MB³


What are the box codes/Marca of the boxes in cellophane.....how long have you owned them and how are they being stored now ??


----------



## Miami Bad Boy BOSS

asmartbull said:


> What are the box codes/Marca of the boxes in cellophane.....how long have you owned them and how are they being stored now ??


Not sure of the codes, but will locate. Maybe a month or so. I had them sitting out, on the shelf. I recently read about the freezer thing so I just did that and now they are sitting in my fridge thawing.

MB³


----------



## asmartbull

Miami Bad Boy BOSS said:


> I have a few unopened and sealed boxed; by sealed, I mean the box is still wrapped in the factory cellophane. I am going into the Merchant Marines and in August I am leaving for a year to go to bootcamp. Should I store my sealed boxes in my tupperdor or will they be alright since they are wrapped up?
> 
> I guess I can generalize the question for others by just asking, do you need to place sealed and unopen boxes in humidors or are they okay, as is, till they are opened?
> 
> Thanks guys!
> 
> MB³


I have never received a box in cellophane ???


----------



## harley33

Can you show a picture of the sealed in cellophane box? I would be curious to see that. Or at least tell us the marca/vitola?


----------



## MarkC

asmartbull said:


> I have never received a box in cellophane ???


You know, now that you mention it...


----------



## Miami Bad Boy BOSS

!? Every box that I ever received in the mail came shrink wrapped, my Juicy Lucys, Viaje, ect.


MB³


----------



## MarkC

Do you realize that you're posting in the Habanos forum?


----------



## Miami Bad Boy BOSS

D'oh! lol... my bad guys! I just read the title of the thread and posted. :doh:

Questions still stand though 

MB³


----------



## djsmiles

I know this question probably won't get answered. But, how do you guys find custom rolled Cubans? Does a roller here in the states get their tobacco the same way I can get a Partagas/Cohiba/etc.?


----------



## MarkC

Miami Bad Boy BOSS said:


> D'oh! lol... my bad guys! I just read the title of the thread and posted. :doh:
> 
> Questions still stand though
> 
> MB³


If it was me, I'd put them in a cooler. I wouldn't trust that cellophane to keep the moisture in for that long.


----------



## Miami Bad Boy BOSS

MarkC said:


> If it was me, I'd put them in a cooler. I wouldn't trust that cellophane to keep the moisture in for that long.


I was thinking about wrapping them in some saran wrap, but yeah, going in the tupperware sounds better.

Thanks guys!

MB³


----------



## piperdown

Miami Bad Boy BOSS said:


> I was thinking about wrapping them in some saran wrap, but yeah, going in the tupperware sounds better.
> 
> Thanks guys!
> 
> MB³


Go get some big airtight tupperware containers. Throw a boat load of Boveda packs in there. Make sure the seal is good on the tupperwares. Place boxes in there and singles.
Being airtight they will hold rH for years.


----------



## piperdown

djsmiles said:


> I know this question probably won't get answered. But, how do you guys find custom rolled Cubans? Does a roller here in the states get their tobacco the same way I can get a Partagas/Cohiba/etc.?


Elves, delivered by unicorns. That's about all I can say about it......


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

djsmiles said:


> I know this question probably won't get answered. But, how do you guys find custom rolled Cubans? Does a roller here in the states get their tobacco the same way I can get a Partagas/Cohiba/etc.?


No Custom rolled all Cuban cigar is rolled in the states. All are rolled by the best of the best rollers Havana has to offer!
In Cuba!
That being said there are Johnny-O's that are supposedly all Cuban leaf that are rolled in Florida.


----------



## djsmiles

piperdown said:


> Elves, delivered by unicorns. That's about all I can say about it......


Ok, I laughed. :lol:


----------



## djsmiles

TonyBrooklyn said:


> No Custom rolled all Cuban cigar is rolled in the states. All are rolled by the best of the best rollers Havana has to offer!
> In Cuba!
> That being said there are Johnny-O's that are supposedly all Cuban leaf that are rolled in Florida.


Interesting. How do some of you guys come across these custom's? If you can't answer, i will understand.


----------



## dvickery

djsmiles said:


> Interesting. How do some of you guys come across these custom's? If you can't answer, i will understand.


go to Havana...stop in at the comodoro...get andreas Kathy Farrah to phone santos...hope there are some on hand(lanceros was it last week).

derrek


----------



## djsmiles

dvickery said:


> go to Havana...stop in at the comodoro...get andreas Kathy Farrah to phone santos...hope there are some on hand(lanceros was it last week).
> 
> derrek


Lol. Understood. Look for them on the second hand market.


----------



## Questionablesanity

So do you always store CCs in their box? I have read through a few posts on the forum and I have seen debates about cabinets vs dress boxes breathability and how that lends to the aging. Tanking them out of an box would solve any breathing issue right? Or am I missing something?


----------



## MarkC

I always leave mine in the box, as they don't have the cello to protect them from my digging paws...


----------



## asmartbull

Questionablesanity said:


> So do you always store CCs in their box? I have read through a few posts on the forum and I have seen debates about cabinets vs dress boxes breathability and how that lends to the aging. Tanking them out of an box would solve any breathing issue right? Or am I missing something?


Store them as they come unless you use a humidor......When purchasing, if you have the choice of a dress-box or SLB, choose the SLB


----------



## UTKhodgy

asmartbull said:


> Store them as they come unless you use a humidor......When purchasing, if you have the choice of a dress-box or SLB, choose the SLB


Why the SLB? I was going to order dress boxes (partly as a noob wanting cool looking boxes) and I am not (yet) concerned about playing tetris.


----------



## Questionablesanity

Thanks. 

From what I've read the dress boxes are cardboard and do not breath as well as wooden boxes. So cigars tend to age better in the wood boxes.


----------



## asmartbull

UTKhodgy said:


> Why the SLB? I was going to order dress boxes (partly as a noob wanting cool looking boxes) and I am not (yet) concerned about playing tetris.


SLB is better for aging ....if the 2 are availabe the SLB is better....if you are going to go through them quickly, it really doesn't matter


----------



## jabuan

Has anybody had issues with the cigars themselves on orders that took weeks / a month to get delivered? I get worried when NCs take more than 5 days to get to me.


----------



## asmartbull

jabuan said:


> Has anybody had issues with the cigars themselves on orders that took weeks / a month to get delivered? I get worried when NCs take more than 5 days to get to me.


Don't worry,,,,,,MANY times I have had cigars be 30 days in transit and been fine....In fact I have NEVER had an issue


----------



## jabuan

Roger thanks.


----------



## 54 Conqueror

Once through customs, can the Post Office also confiscate? I just moved and the PO won't deliver packages to the house. Hate to have things sit in the PO until I pick them up in person


----------



## asmartbull

54 Conqueror said:


> Once through customs, can the Post Office also confiscate?  I just moved and the PO won't deliver packages to the house. Hate to have things sit in the PO until I pick them up in person


Never heard of it happening...


----------



## shaun341

Ok since mum is the word on sources I only know of 1 legitimate source. I have started exchanging emails with another place and since this would be my first purchase I am not sure if this is how it normally is. The source tells me that they take the barcode off to protect the distributor. I have seen videos with boxes that had the barcodes and some that didn't. Is this a normal thing or a red flag?


----------



## asmartbull

shaun341 said:


> Ok since mum is the word on sources I only know of 1 legitimate source. I have started exchanging emails with another place and since this would be my first purchase I am not sure if this is how it normally is. The source tells me that they take the barcode off to protect the distributor. I have seen videos with boxes that had the barcodes and some that didn't. Is this a normal thing or a red flag?


yes....normal...


----------



## smoking ash

I just got a 10 count box of monte #2 and upon opening for inspection each cigar has very small white specs on them all above the band some all the way up to the tip. Not a huge amount of specs but some. No fuzz whatsoever. I believe this to be white mold since the box is only a little over a year old. I failed to snap a picture of them before but I wiped each stick with a dry cloth which left no evidence on the stick. Placed them back in the box and are now in a 3 day nap in the freezer. My question is should these be kept separate from the rest? I am not worried about the smoking of them just the spreading of mold spores to the rest of my cigars. My humidor is 70F and 63%. I have a couple extra desktops so quarantining them will not be a problem. Thinking about it now that's what I plan on doing. Just like to get some of the FOG's advice here. Thanks hope everyone has a great 4th! :smoke::drinking:


----------



## asmartbull

smoking ash said:


> I just got a 10 count box of monte #2 and upon opening for inspection each cigar has very small white specs on them all above the band some all the way up to the tip. Not a huge amount of specs but some. No fuzz whatsoever. I believe this to be white mold since the box is only a little over a year old. I failed to snap a picture of them before but I wiped each stick with a dry cloth which left no evidence on the stick. Placed them back in the box and are now in a 3 day nap in the freezer. My question is should these be kept separate from the rest? I am not worried about the smoking of them just the spreading of mold spores to the rest of my cigars. My humidor is 70F and 63%. I have a couple extra desktops so quarantining them will not be a problem. Thinking about it now that's what I plan on doing. Just like to get some of the FOG's advice here. Thanks hope everyone has a great 4th! :smoke::drinking:


They should be fine now.....it happens


----------



## smoking ash

asmartbull said:


> They should be fine now.....it happens


Thanks for the peace of mind


----------



## UTKhodgy

Normal experience to see the word CIGARS written directly onto the customs declaration on the front of the package?


----------



## Perfecto Dave

UTKhodgy said:


> Normal experience to see the word CIGARS written directly onto the customs declaration on the front of the package?


Standard operating procedure for the most part.


----------



## jabuan

I was reading a description for h. Upmann regalias and read " machine bunched." Is there any sacrifice to quality?


----------



## avitti

jabuan said:


> I was reading a description for h. Upmann regalias and read " machine bunched." Is there any sacrifice to quality?


Up until the early 2000's the Regalias was machine made--there also was a period when some Havanas were bunched by machine then the wrapper was put on by hand-Hand finished cigars- this was phased out in the early 2000's also--since 02 -03 all Regalias are hand made.


----------



## jabuan

Thanks tony.


----------



## Dhughes12

Question regarding storage. In my coolidor, I use cigar boxes to store my smokes. Any difference if I keep the lids closed on them or take the lids off? Seems to me ( maybe in my head) the closed boxes wouldn't stay as well humidified?


----------



## Mante

Dhughes12 said:


> Question regarding storage. In my coolidor, I use cigar boxes to store my smokes. Any difference if I keep the lids closed on them or take the lids off? Seems to me ( maybe in my head) the closed boxes wouldn't stay as well humidified?


If you are resting them with the view of smoking them in the next 12 months crack the lids. If ageing then closing em up is fine & they will age better with less air flow.


----------



## Tritones

Dhughes12 said:


> Question regarding storage. In my coolidor, I use cigar boxes to store my smokes. Any difference if I keep the lids closed on them or take the lids off? Seems to me ( maybe in my head) the closed boxes wouldn't stay as well humidified?


Once the boxes themselves (presuming they're wood boxes!) have acquired the right RH, open or closed shouldn't matter for maintaining humidification. Unless, of course, you either have too little humidification medium, or you don't monitor it often enough, or something, so that you get RH swings in your coolidor. In that case, the closed boxes would actually be an advantage for keeping your cigars safe, as the wood retains moisture (in a good way).

Otherwise, it's really a matter of air circulation, as a wise Aussie (or is that an Aussie wise guy? :biggrin: ) pointed out.


----------



## Dhughes12

Makes sense. Thanks guys. Next dumb question....

Using KL in a 48qt coolidor, I broke the lid off a VSG Box and use that for holding my KL. probably have 2-300 smokes. I know there was a chart showing how much to use but I haven't been able to find it. Any tips?


----------



## Perfecto Dave

Dhughes12 said:


> Makes sense. Thanks guys. Next dumb question....
> 
> Using KL in a 48qt coolidor, I broke the lid off a VSG Box and use that for holding my KL. probably have 2-300 smokes. I know there was a chart showing how much to use but I haven't been able to find it. Any tips?


For no reason but to better have a more even humidity source I like to cut the amount I use in half and put one half on the bottom and the other on the top.
If I'm getting a steady reading on my hygrometer that's all I care about.


----------



## avitti

Dhughes12 said:


> Makes sense. Thanks guys. Next dumb question....
> 
> Using KL in a 48qt coolidor, I broke the lid off a VSG Box and use that for holding my KL. probably have 2-300 smokes. I know there was a chart showing how much to use but I haven't been able to find it. Any tips?


Here you go 
\
http://heartfeltindustries.com/calculator.asp


----------



## Tritones

avitti said:


> Here you go
> \
> Heartfelt Industries Cigar Humidifiers and Accessories


That won't work for KL. :biggrin:


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

Mike is right double the amount.


----------



## avitti

Tritones said:


> That won't work for KL. :biggrin:


Well Mike-seems i'll have to tell that to my humidors,they didn't get the memo..Only thing is unlike it says under the calculator to double the amount of media i use 2.5X's the amount for a quicker recovery..:beerchug:


----------



## Tritones

avitti said:


> Well Mike-seems i'll have to tell that to my humidors,they didn't get the memo..Only thing is unlike it says under the calculator to double the amount of media i use 2.5X's the amount for a quicker recovery..:beerchug:


If you're using 2.5 times the amount, then you really aren't using the calculated amount. I'm not sure how Dustin would have known to double (or more) the calculated amount. The calculator page doesn't (not surprisingly) indicate a conversion for Kitty Litter. :biggrin:


----------



## avitti

Tritones said:


> If you're using 2.5 times the amount, then you really aren't using the calculated amount. I'm not sure how Dustin would have known to double (or more) the calculated amount. The calculator page doesn't (not surprisingly) indicate a conversion for Kitty Litter. :biggrin:


Rules are made to be broken---silica is silica--the page suggest you double your amount of silica - i'm just not good at math---any of the previous will suffice---:fencing:


----------



## jabuan

No real question, just a thought I guess. 

When I first started smoking NCs on a regular basis in december of 12, I always read..."smoke 5-10 single sticks before committing to buy a box." 

Now that I'm slowly converting my stash to CCs, it's "buy multiple boxes and enjoy the ride!" Hahahaha

That's all.


----------



## thebigk

So this has probably been asked but what is the difference between Parti 898 varnished an unvarnished ?


----------



## KcJason1

thebigk said:


> So this has probably been asked but what is the difference between Parti 898 varnished an unvarnished ?


one comes in a varnished box the other was in a unvarnished box...

Unvarnished discontinued in 2002. 42 x 155(6.1")
Varnished still made... 43 x 170 (6.7")

Cubancigarwebsite.com is your friend!


----------



## jabuan

i recently placed an order with a "new to me" vendor that was actually willing to ship to my island.

how long do you guys normally wait to see if they've received your order and are in fact processing it?

i guess i'm just used to the instant gratification of the nc world as well as other classified sites that give you the "your order is processing and will be shipped out blah blah blah..." message.​


----------



## Breezy818

jabuan said:


> i recently placed an order with a "new to me" vendor that was actually willing to ship to my island.
> 
> how long do you guys normally wait to see if they've received your order and are in fact processing it?
> 
> i guess i'm just used to the instant gratification of the nc world as well as other classified sites that give you the "your order is processing and will be shipped out blah blah blah..." message.​


Did you check your spam folder? Email confirmation are usually instant. For my vendors at least.....


----------



## jabuan

I did. and have been. nothing. ill hit em up.


----------



## Fuzzy

avitti said:


> Here you go
> \
> Heartfelt Industries Cigar Humidifiers and Accessories


Probably should double the amount of HF beads recommended if you are using kitty litter. Works in my 120 qt. cooler.


----------



## brazil stogie

got a couple of boxes from 08, and wanted to do the authenticity test..but no numbers! Those box codes weren't available in 2008 I guess right?


----------



## protekk

brazil stogie said:


> got a couple of boxes from 08, and wanted to do the authenticity test..but no numbers! Those box codes weren't available in 2008 I guess right?


I think tHe earliest warranty seals are in 2009 Ed. You can check cubancigarwebsite dot com for more detail into packaging codes


----------



## brazil stogie

protekk said:


> I think tHe earliest warranty seals are in 2009 Ed. You can check cubancigarwebsite dot com for more detail into packaging codes


Thanks Mike!


----------



## jabuan

how old is vintage?


----------



## protekk

jabuan said:


> how old is vintage?


Hey JoJo....great question and not an easy one to answer. I believe that most have their own beliefs. Personally I would say vintage is anywhere between 10 -20 years, and does not refer to quality of smoke. Aged for me would be 5-10 years and recent would be 0-5 years.


----------



## avitti

jabuan said:


> how old is vintage?


Vintage to some means a great year for the tobacco crop in whole -example some say the 02 crop was a vintage year..


----------



## jabuan

right on guys. thanks!


----------



## jabuan

anybody keeping up with factory codes and can help me out. anybody know MSE in 2012?


----------



## SigMike

Here is my stupid question.

When storing (not aging) CC's....is 65% too high Rh? Can ROTT CC's be stored in a humi with NC's without detracting from the flavor?

Right now I have a humi set up at 65% and a couple empty tuppadors that I could rest my first order in. Eventually I am going to build a wineador (bcuz of summers in TX) and I would like to use it to age since I can control the temps better. What do you suggest as the optimal temp and Rh for the CC sticks I want to keep around longer?


----------



## IBEW

SigMike said:


> Here is my stupid question.
> 
> When storing (not aging) CC's....is 65% too high Rh? Can ROTT CC's be stored in a humi with NC's without detracting from the flavor?
> 
> Right now I have a humi set up at 65% and a couple empty tuppadors that I could rest my first order in. Eventually I am going to build a wineador (bcuz of summers in TX) and I would like to use it to age since I can control the temps better. What do you suggest as the optimal temp and Rh for the CC sticks I want to keep around longer?


*IMHO...*
60°/60Rh is how I store my CC's at, but you should be ok at 65Rh. I've found the draw to be a little tighter at higher humidities.
Yes, keeping CC's and NC's in the same humi is not a problem.

BTW, as said a million times; no question is considered stupid, it's the best way to learn. In fact, I asked the same question about CC/NC storage on here a few years ago!


----------



## SigMike

IBEW said:


> *IMHO...*
> 60°/60Rh is how I store my CC's at, but you should be ok at 65Rh. I've found the draw to be a little tighter at higher humidities.
> Yes, keeping CC's and NC's in the same humi is not a problem.
> 
> BTW, as said a million times; no question is considered stupid, it's the best way to learn. In fact, I asked the same question about CC/NC storage on here a few years ago!


Thank you for the information! I bet you have the same issues keeping things cool during the summer!


----------



## TonyBrooklyn

jabuan said:


> anybody keeping up with factory codes and can help me out. anybody know MSE in 2012?


Codes are randomly generated these days and really mean very little.


----------



## commonsenseman

I have a question related to one asked on the general forum.

Don (Herf N Turf) had said:



> Box pressing was once quite popular, but I know of no one currently doing it the traditional way.


That doesn't apply to Habanos though....right?

I mean, the dress boxes I've seen sure look like they were box-pressed the traditional way.


----------



## jabuan

TonyBrooklyn said:


> Codes are randomly generated these days and really mean very little.


roger


----------



## jabuan

partagas culebras...is the shape cooler than the flavor? considering picking some up for shits and giggles.


----------



## brimy623

I'm sorry I haven't taken the time to read the entire thread (I will at some point, I promise!:nod
Have any done a comparison of the CC vs it's NC namesake?:hmm:


----------



## thebigk

You have that wrong NC's took there name from CC and it's like comparing Apples to bowling balls there both round and that's and that's were it ends


----------



## brimy623

@thebigk
So if I understand your point, they have *NO* affiliation?


----------



## thebigk

brimy623 said:


> @thebigk
> So if I understand your point, they have *NO* affiliation?


 None or the US would not allow the import of there cigars


----------



## brimy623

thebigk said:


> None or the US would not allow the import of there cigars


Got you!
I actually thought it was their way of working around the embargo by doing the "Cuban seed" grown & harvested elsewhere thing to work around it.


----------



## brazil stogie

jabuan said:


> partagas culebras...is the shape cooler than the flavor? considering picking some up for shits and giggles.


Partagas Culebras are really tasty! I was surprised, it has a lot of TWANG! It also draws a lot of attention hahaha...


----------



## asmartbull

jabuan said:


> partagas culebras...is the shape cooler than the flavor? considering picking some up for shits and giggles.


These are my second favorite Party, just behind the 898....their creamy base reminds me on samples much older...


----------



## brazil stogie

Do you guys recommend 1) Inspect box, 2) Nitrogen packing (what is the purpose for this?), 3) Vaccum packing, 4) Humidipak 69% - keep your cigars hydrated in transit. Which of these would you go for? Please keep in mind I order and they end up waiting for me for about a month without proper humidification. Thanks in advance.


----------



## LGHT

brimy623 said:


> Got you!
> I actually thought it was their way of working around the embargo by doing the "Cuban seed" grown & harvested elsewhere thing to work around it.


There was a big law suite about these several years ago. Basically vendors just started registering well known cigar brands and selling under that brand. Since cuba is not "recognized", by the US the law suits brought by the actual owners of the legit companies got tossed out and the US basically said you and your copyrights don't exist. That opened the flood gates and now just about every CC name has a US company also and none have any affiliation lol.


----------



## brimy623

@LGHT
Thanks for the info! Interesting stuff.


----------



## bpegler

brazil stogie said:


> Do you guys recommend 1) Inspect box, 2) Nitrogen packing (what is the purpose for this?), 3) Vaccum packing, 4) Humidipak 69% - keep your cigars hydrated in transit. Which of these would you go for? Please keep in mind I order and they end up waiting for me for about a month without proper humidification. Thanks in advance.


#1 yes, everything else no. A good inspection by the vendor will save a ton of hassles down the road.

Those cigars are already Overhumidified, for questions #2-4 ...


----------



## brazil stogie

bpegler said:


> #1 yes, everything else no. A good inspection by the vendor will save a ton of hassles down the road.
> 
> Those cigars are already Overhumidified, for questions #2-4 ...


Thank you Bob, always appreciate your input.


----------

