# More Government Propaganda



## MDSPHOTO (Sep 10, 2013)

I'm sure many of you have seen this by now, yet another piece of propaganda put out by "Our" government to support their own pre-drawn conclusion that cigars should be regulated.

When FDA stated they wanted to extend the comment period regarding the proposed legislation they should have made it clear to the American public that it was to do hatchet job on the industry to support their own agenda. The only additional comments I have seen are three poorly designed "studies" fabricated by the same agency that would have control over the industry. Can you say conflict of interest!

Having worked with the FDA I can tell you that if I submitted this data to FDA to support the approval of a drug, medical device or any other product overseen by them, they would laugh me right out of their office. First of all this not a prospective, well-controlled clinical trial whose primary endpoint was to determine that cigar smoking is as bad as cigarette smoking. This was an ad hoc analysis of data that was collected for a totally separate purpose. Were the FDA to conduct a study the only way that they would approve the data to support this point would be to conduct two multi-center head to head studies comparing normal healthy volunteers in two arms, ones who smoked cigarettes and ones who smoked cigars and compare designated metrics and outcomes over a defined period of time, most likely years. Only the results of those two studies could be used to support the conclusion that cigar smoking is as bad as cigarette smoking. This analysis done by the FDA puppet Dr. Jiping Chen simply looked at biomarkers from a cross section of the population and determined that cigar smokers had similar biomarkers in their blood as cigarette smokers. The source of the biomarkers comes from blood samples taken up to 15-years ago.

The conclusion of study could be deemed valid, that cigar smokers do have a higher concentration of substances in their blood versus non-cigar smokers. However, the abstract heading titled "Impact" is not only NOT supported by this data, but reckless. To my knowledge FDA has never granted a product approval based on epidemiologic evidence or an ad hoc analysis and there is no significant body of evidence showing cigar smokers have the same health outcomes as cigarette smokers.

The media takes Dr. Cheng's statement in the Impact Section of the abstract and pushes it one step further by creating headlines that _Cigars Are No Safer Than Cigarettes_ to sell papers, magazines and drive web traffic to their sites. Which further builds a ground swell for the FDA's original point that cigar's should be regulated. Do you see what is happening here? FDA is using the media to prove their points for them and then the misinformed fall in line with FDA.

Smoking Cigars Or Cigarettes Is Equally Harmful, Study Says

This crap should make you angry for right now it is cigars that they want to regulate, but once they have this issue handled they will find something else they want to control to keep the big machine in DC rolling and using our tax dollars to support it.

SOAP BOX
----------------
ME

Biomarkers of Exposure among U.S. Cigar Smokers: An Analysis of 1999-2012 National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES) Data


[*=left]Jiping Chen,
[*=left]Anna Kettermann,
[*=left]Brian L. Rostron, and
[*=left]Hannah R. Day
+Author Affiliations

Office of Science, Center for Tobacco Products, U.S. Food and Drug Administration, Silver Spring, Maryland.


*Corresponding Author:*
Jiping Chen, Office of Science, Center for Tobacco Products, U.S. Food and Drug Administration, Document Control Center, Building 71, Room G335, 10903 New Hampshire Avenue, Silver Spring, MD 20993-0002. Phone: 301-796-6058; Fax: 240-276-3655; E-mail: [email protected]
​Abstract*Background:* Cigar consumption is increasing in the United States, but little information is available about exposure to toxic constituents from cigar smoking.*Methods:* We conducted a cross-sectional analysis of biomarkers of tobacco exposure among 25,522 participants from the National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES, 1999-2012). The biomarkers analyzed were serum cotinine, urinary 4-(methylnitrosamino)-1-(3-pyridyl)-1-butanol (NNAL), blood lead, blood cadmium, and urinary arsenic. We calculated geometric mean concentrations for each biomarker by tobacco use category and geometric mean ratios controlling for demographic factors.*Results:* Cigar smokers had higher cotinine, NNAL, and lead concentrations than nontobacco users. The geometric mean concentration [95% confidence interval (CI)] of cotinine for primary cigar smokers (i.e., current cigar/never cigarette smokers) was 6.2 (4.2-9.2) ng/mL versus 0.045 (0.043-0.048) ng/mL for nontobacco users, and the NNAL concentration was 19.1 (10.6-34.3) pg/mg creatinine for primary cigar smokers versus 1.01 (0.95-1.07) pg/mg creatinine for nontobacco users. Secondary cigar smokers (i.e., current cigar/former cigarette smokers) and dual cigar/cigarette smokers had higher cadmium concentrations than nontobacco users. Cigar smoking was associated with significantly higher concentrations of cotinine, NNAL, cadmium, and lead, after adjusting for demographic factors. Secondary cigar smokers had significantly higher cotinine and NNAL concentrations than primary cigar smokers. The NNAL concentrations in daily cigar smokers were comparable with those in daily cigarette smokers.*Conclusions:* Cigar smokers have higher concentrations of several toxic and carcinogenic substances than nontobacco users.*Impact:* Our results are consistent with epidemiologic evidence demonstrating cigar smoking as a cause of disease and premature death. _Cancer Epidemiol Biomarkers Prev; 1-10. ©2014 AACR_.


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## tnlawyer (Jul 17, 2013)

The whole system sucks. It's all about control, and you're right...as soon as they get this one nailed down, they'll be on to the next thing. We're too dumb to know what's good for us, right? Light bulbs, shower heads, toilet tanks...the shit never ends.


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## Sigaar (Sep 19, 2014)

tnlawyer said:


> The whole system sucks. It's all about control, and you're right...as soon as they get this one nailed down, they'll be on to the next thing. We're too dumb to know what's good for us, right? Light bulbs, shower heads, toilet tanks...the shit never ends.


This. It's absolutely maddening. The nanny state big gov't libs will never stop trying to tell us how to live.:c


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## c.ortiz108 (Nov 16, 2013)

Sigaar said:


> This. It's absolutely maddening. The nanny state big gov't libs will never stop trying to tell us how to live.:c


Er, and the cons don't try telling us how to live? Just sayin'.... Pretty much all politicians are just a bunch of greedy self-interested sell-out control freaks, no matter what side of the fence they're on.


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## Sigaar (Sep 19, 2014)

c.ortiz108 said:


> Er, and the cons don't try telling us how to live? Just sayin'.... Pretty much all politicians are just a bunch of greedy self-interested sell-out control freaks, no matter what side of the fence they're on.


Oh, there is some of that, too...pick your poison. That said, there is much more nanny state BS from the left compared to what you see from the right. I prefer liberty/libertarian minded candidates whenever possible.


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## Wicked_Rhube (Jul 29, 2012)

God damn it, and here I was thinking I would have LESS toxic chemicals in my blood than non cigar smokers! What the hell?!?!

Next thing you know they will say this IPA is in fact not healthier than herbal tea....


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## Wicked_Rhube (Jul 29, 2012)

Eventually footwear will be required to meet FDA standards...


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## Trackmyer (Jun 6, 2014)

It is sad. We will most likely never regain our liberties lost to politicians and their ambitions. Every new year brings new madness of laws aimed at controlling some aspect of our daily living. Its getting to where the number of states you could escape to is dwindling. Shame really. To have so much love for your country and its history, and yet so much disappointment with how greedy politicians looking to make a name for themselves at the costs of others bring our great nation down.

Just yesterday I was reading the plight of a BOTL who lives in the Seattle area in an apartment. The gist I got was that he's not allowed to smoke inside his residence. Nor can he smoke a cigar outside in public. It seems the closest place legal for him and available is a 40minute drive. That's f'in nuts!! Even if some of these statements are a tad off, it still shows the craziness we have become. If this is where we are now, where are we in the next 20 years?


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## tnlawyer (Jul 17, 2013)

Trackmyer said:


> If this is where we are now, where are we in the next 20 years?


Probably in the middle of Civil War II.


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## Trackmyer (Jun 6, 2014)

tnlawyer said:


> Probably in the middle of Civil War II.


Based on our history and that of other nations, I believe a collapse is inevitable. I just hope its after I'm gone. My fighting days are behind me. I'm getting too old for chaos.


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## MadMatt (Jan 20, 2013)

But it's okay to eat ammoniated beef paste! Who knows what's next??


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