# Bolivar Gold Medal oddity?



## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

I have a box of 07 BGM's sitting in the humidor. My friend calls me and asks me if I want to smoke a cigar, I said sure and he came over and showed me a few sticks he brought back from Canada. I checked out the store and it sems legit.
A BGM as well as a few other cubans. I smoked a Bolivar Simones Edicion Regional Exclusiveo Canada and it was great. He smoked a HDM Robusto and said it was eh.
The he gifted me the BGM and another stick. I went to put the BGM in my BGM box and noticed a huge difference in size. The cigar, band and the gold wrapper's were all different sizes. I pulled out the CS ring guage tool and realized that it's mine that are the wrong size. It should be 42 and mine is 46~. Also mine is a touch too long. 
Has anyone seen differences like this in BGM's?


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## hk3 (Jan 29, 2008)

That's odd. Post some side by side photos if you will.


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## DonnieW (Jul 2, 2008)

I've only seen the ring at 42. I have seen two different lengths - 6 1/2 and also 6 3/8. The length measured with gold condom on.

I'll gladly take photos of the stick I have.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

I'll post pictures of them once I get home tonight. I'm wondering if one could be for the Canadian market and mine, the European.


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## poker (Dec 11, 1997)

Both the original release & current release should measure out to be 165mm x 42 (classic Lonsdale size).


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## SeanGAR (Jul 9, 2004)

One large, otherwise well respected, Vancouver cigar store was found recently to be selling fake Cohiba sublimes. 

It is clear they were fake based on construction, taste and bands. A number of different people looked at these cigars and came to the same conclusions.

The cigars in question were reportedly received from Havana House by the retailer in question. However, they were supposedly validated as authentic by Havana House, so it is not out of the realm of possibility that a cigar is fake from a store that normally sells legit cigars if the Canadian distributor, HH, is this deeply involved in fakes. This is obviously not a widespread problem in legit stores up there, but caution is, obviously, wise.

I would recommend only buying "to cheap to bother faking" cigars up there.

Google 'Got Duped by authorized Habanos dealer' for more information.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

His were purchased in the Niagara Falls area.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

Here are some images...


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## Fistville (Mar 26, 2007)

That seems pretty suspect.


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## DonnieW (Jul 2, 2008)

WOW!! What a big difference. Starting to smell funny... Like I said, I noticed a very small length difference and actually just now noticed it was due to the way they folded the end. We're talking 1/8" difference. In your case... yikes, it's off by a mile.


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## SmokinApe (Jun 20, 2007)

Are you saying that you think your box of cigars are fake? If the ring gauge is wrong, it is probably a good chance...


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

SmokinApe said:


> Are you saying that you think your box of cigars are fake? If the ring gauge is wrong, it is probably a good chance...


I hope not, but I'm becoming suspect. Either way, I may try and contact a few of the people I traded with to see if they have any to compare. Or at least to let them know.


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## Da Klugs (Jan 8, 2005)

It's just one cigar. Smoke it when you are in a good mood ... it might be real good.

Authenticating singles is like trying to analyze drunk women. It can take a bunch of time and provide some amusement but ... it aint the road most frequently traveled.


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

I have 4 boxes at home I am going to have a look at them tonight and will let you know what I find. I don't even think I have opened 3 of them as yet.


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## DonnieW (Jul 2, 2008)

FWIW...


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

Da Klugs said:


> It's just one cigar. Smoke it when you are in a good mood ... it might be real good.
> 
> Authenticating singles is like trying to analyze drunk women. It can take a bunch of time and provide some amusement but ... it aint the road most frequently traveled.



As usual perfectly said, I am still going to have a look at mine for shits and giggles, plus it will give me an opportunity to try my new fancy shmancy CS RG tool thingy

:ss


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

He also got me an RASS which I compared to my box of RASS's. I'm embarrassed to say that my cigar is on the right.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)




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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

Footbag said:


>


RA bands have varied a bit in the past few years. The recent RE's (Eminencias, Estupendos) have had the new style band w/ more prominent embossing. I wouldn't be surprised to see 07 and/or 08 boxes of RASS with the newer bands.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

I know the bands vary a bit, these RASS are from July 07 factory code:TEB. The BGM's are from Sept 07 PBS. 

Trying to figure out how to get some sort of confirmation one way or another.


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## NCRadioMan (Feb 28, 2005)

Footbag said:


> Trying to figure out how to get some sort of confirmation one way or another.


Exacto knife. Take a look inside. That _could_ tell you alot.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

Now that I think of it, I was given an RASS from a BOTL on the board, and it was much more similar to the ones I had in the box. They have a kind of box-press making them more square. 

The one my friend got me is more round. Are there Cabs of RASS's?


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## NCRadioMan (Feb 28, 2005)

Footbag said:


> The one my friend got me is more round. Are there Cabs of RASS's?


Yep.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

I may consider opening one up, but first, I'd like to see if someone with a BGM and a ring gauge tool could help me out.

If you could also measure the Gold I'd appreciate it.


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## yayson (Aug 21, 2006)

Footbag said:


> I may consider opening one up, but first, I'd like to see if someone with a BGM and a ring gauge tool could help me out.
> 
> If you could also measure the Gold I'd appreciate it.


Hmm, at your request I'm measuring my GMs with the CS measuring tool and it fits easily through the 46 hole with air to spare, looks spot on with the 44 and near 42.

Source is good here (Spanish LCdH) and I've smoked a few, Boli profile tho needing some rest I think

interesting


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## jkorp (Sep 27, 2007)

Footbag said:


> I may consider opening one up, but first, I'd like to see if someone with a BGM and a ring gauge tool could help me out.
> 
> If you could also measure the Gold I'd appreciate it.


I would smoke the cigar and then cut the nub open, short or mixed filler will be present all the way through if it's a dud. If you at least smoke it you won't have wasted a potentially good cigar and if it's a dub you'll know once you spark it, imo .


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

yayson said:


> Hmm, at your request I'm measuring my GMs with the CS measuring tool and it fits easily through the 46 hole with air to spare, looks spot on with the 44 and near 42.
> 
> Source is good here (Spanish LCdH) and I've smoked a few, Boli profile tho needing some rest I think
> 
> interesting


Hmmm. My friends fit through the 42 hole. Mine fit's through the 46 hole, but is closer to the 44. Once again, the box has pressed these to be a bit square. All of my BGM's as well as my friends weigh between 12.0 and 12.6g with the gold wrap.

Sorry, mind measuring the gold.


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## yayson (Aug 21, 2006)

Footbag said:


> Hmmm. My friends fit through the 42 hole. Mine fit's through the 46 hole, but is closer to the 44. Once again, the box has pressed these to be a bit square. All of my BGM's as well as my friends weigh between 12.0 and 12.6g with the gold wrap.
> 
> Sorry, mind measuring the gold.


I have them at the office and left for the day, if I remember tomorrow, sure. If I don't and you need it, feel free to give me a kick up the butt


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

yayson said:


> I have them at the office and left for the day, if I remember tomorrow, sure. If I don't and you need it, feel free to give me a kick up the butt


Thanks! If anyone has the chance in the meantime I'd appreciate it, too.

Yes. Box codes checked out. Maybe I'm making something out of nothing. The variation seems huge though.


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## Bear (Sep 22, 2007)

I suppose it would be easy to say "that's Cuban hand made products for ya", but I don't think that this settles anything.
I'll be watching this to see what the outcome is.


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## yayson (Aug 21, 2006)

no worries, I'm pretty sure the CS RG tools are fakes :tu


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

Ok so I took my handy dandy fancy shmancy CS RG tool to 2 boxes of BGM's and based on that they are all 44RG by measurement and all within a hair of 6 and 3/8ths some slight variances but nothing that you could really discern without the ruler and some close inspection.

The length on the band/gold was pretty much right on 4 inches on all of them.

I trust the source that these came from and both were sept 07 box codes.


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## jdbwolverines (Mar 2, 2007)

SilverFox said:


> Ok so I took my handy dandy fancy shmancy CS RG tool to 2 boxes of BGM's and based on that they are all 44RG by measurement and all within a hair of 6 and 3/8ths some slight variances but nothing that you could really discern without the ruler and some close inspection.
> 
> The length on the band/gold was pretty much right on 4 inches on all of them.
> 
> I trust the source that these came from and both were sept 07 box codes.


:tpd:Mine were pretty much dead on at 44rg and 6-3/8" length with the gold wrapper measuring in at 4".


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

My gold wrapper/ ban was 4". My friends was off. I may be making something of nothing, but it is a bit odd.


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## JCK (Nov 9, 2006)

Where is Cuba getting it's rulers from?


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## newcigarz (Feb 11, 2007)

khubli said:


> Where is Cuba getting it's *rulers* from?


They are all related :r:r:r


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

Maybe we should have extended the CS RG Tool GB to Cuba??


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## freakygar (Dec 13, 2007)

SilverFox said:


> Ok so I took my handy dandy fancy shmancy CS RG tool to 2 boxes of BGM's and based on that they are all 44RG by measurement and all within a hair of 6 and 3/8ths some slight variances but nothing that you could really discern without the ruler and some close inspection.
> 
> The length on the band/gold was pretty much right on 4 inches on all of them.
> 
> I trust the source that these came from and both were sept 07 box codes.


You my friend have waaaaaaaaaay to much free time.


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

ahc4353 said:


> You my friend have waaaaaaaaaay to much free time.


I had lots of time as with this bronchial infection I can't lie down for more than an hour or so at a time so might as well keep myself entertained.


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## Footbag (May 14, 2008)

SilverFox said:


> I had lots of time as with this bronchial infection I can't lie down for more than an hour or so at a time so might as well keep myself entertained.


Ouch... And I'm sure that playing with your cigars is fun when you cannot smoke them. Your not smoking them right?

Either way, thanks for the measurements. It appears now that my friends is the anomaly. Wonder what the deal with that is? Supposed to be a respected B&M in Canada.


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## SilverFox (Feb 19, 2008)

Footbag said:


> Ouch... And I'm sure that playing with your cigars is fun when you cannot smoke them. Your not smoking them right?
> 
> Either way, thanks for the measurements. It appears now that my friends is the anomaly. Wonder what the deal with that is? Supposed to be a respected B&M in Canada.



Nope no smoking for me, which makes for a cranky fox.

Remember that Quality Control in Cuba is not exactly the benchmark of the cigar industry.

Also things like changes in humidity will change the cigar and it may not fully come back after they settle out. No explanation for the labeling issue.

In the end smoke it see what you think.


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## SeanGAR (Jul 9, 2004)

Footbag said:


> Supposed to be a respected B&M in Canada.


As noted above, fake LEs have been reported from a _Vancouver cigar_ company. I also know from personal experience that another retailer up there has sold fake LEs /// this particular business is not "as straight as an _arrow _":tu.

The additional problems of Havana House pretending fakes are real and fake LEs appearing at a respected retailer in Switzerland raise serious questions.


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