# Hoppy Challenge



## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

I have a college buddy that comes down to join me for Jazz Fest every year. He is a home brewer and an EXTREME Hop Head. He claims they don't make one too hoppy for him.

This year will mark the 20th straight of our annual pilgrimage. In honor of the occasion, I would like to have something on hand to "wreck his palate" or make a very impressive attempt.

Your suggestions would be greatly appreciated as I am not of his world.


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## TreySC (May 30, 2014)

Sounds like @HIM specialty here. Not sure what you can get in MS, but a couple off the top of the head that I've had fairly recently Thomas Creek's Up the Creek was pretty hoppy. Evil Twin's Molotov Cocktail is strong but it's nicely balanced at the same time so that may not do it.


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## Nature (Jul 30, 2012)

Not sure if you can get this in MS, but it purportedly has an IBU (International Bittering Units) of 100+.
Boulevard Brewing Tasting Room Series, Mid-Coast IPA.







Despite being extremely hoppy, it is very balanced. Tastes like hops smell.


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## chadderkdawg (Dec 17, 2014)

The Lagunitas Sucks is slap you in the face hoppy, probably the hoppiest I've had.


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## NorCalJaybird (Sep 2, 2014)

Palate Wrecker from Green Flash
Hopsickle from Moylan's
Hop Stoopid from Lagunitas

Are 3 that you should be able to get where ever you are. All 3 are well over 100 on the IBU scale 

Cheers
Jay


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## chadderkdawg (Dec 17, 2014)

NorCalJaybird said:


> Palate Wrecker from Green Flash
> Hopsickle from Moylan's
> Hop Stoopid from Lagunitas
> 
> ...


Hop stupid is really really good, I still thought Sucks was hoppyer though.


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

Lagunitas Hop Stoopid or Green Flash Palate Wrecker are both good ones and top rated West Coast IPAs. Looking at your distribution Mississippi gets both Lagunitas and Green Flash so you may be able to find them. As with any IPA though it can be a let down if the bottle isn't fresh.
A problem you may actually have is the freshness of the beer. As a homebrewer he's going to be used to a fresh hop character you won't experience unless you live near the brewery or brew your own beer. FWIW as a fellow hop head and homebrewer too hoppy doesn't exist, only too bitter and a good IPA shouldn't be overly bitter it should have huge hop flavor with a smooth bitterness.


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

and looks like Jay beat me to it with my slow typing.


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## NorCalJaybird (Sep 2, 2014)

chadderkdawg said:


> Hop stupid is really really good, I still thought Sucks was hoppyer though.


It must just be perception on the palate from 1 to the next. Stoopid it over 100 IBU and 8%. Sucks I think (going off memory here) about 60ish IBU and 7 maybe 8%

Its funny how malt can hide the presents of hops. Its the balance of the beer universe. I am right there with ya though.. I LIKE EM!

Cheers
Jay


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

The dumb thing about it is the limit of alpha acid isomerization in wort is about 100 IBU and our taste threshold is also about the same. Going over that is basically all for show, sort of a gimmick in a way. You can't tell the difference in bitterness between Pliny at ~200 IBU(supposedly) and any other beer close to 100 IBU. All you notice is the strength in hop flavor vs bitterness depending on how long the hops are boiled.


So a 100 IBU beer that has all its IBU from the bittering hop addition will just seem really bitter but nearly flavorless but a 100 IBU beer that was hop bursted and had no bittering addition will have a huge flavor and less noticeable bitterness even though the IBU are the same. Essentially the IBUs the way they try to market the beer means nothing its all about the technique the brewer uses.


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## NorCalJaybird (Sep 2, 2014)

HIM said:


> Lagunitas Hop Stoopid or Green Flash Palate Wrecker are both good ones and top rated West Coast IPAs. Looking at your distribution Mississippi gets both Lagunitas and Green Flash so you may be able to find them. As with any IPA though it can be a let down if the bottle isn't fresh.
> A problem you may actually have is the freshness of the beer. As a homebrewer he's going to be used to a fresh hop character you won't experience unless you live near the brewery or brew your own beer. FWIW as a fellow hop head and homebrewer too hoppy doesn't exist, only too bitter and a good IPA shouldn't be overly bitter it should have huge hop flavor with a smooth bitterness.


Its almost like you know a thing or 2 about hops, freshness AND brewing..... 

I am spoiled though...I live less than 4 hours from both of these breweries..AND the local distributor makes a HUGE representation of both locally. So FRESH IIPA's are really easy to come by here.... Lucky me huh 

Cheers
Jay


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

NorCalJaybird said:


> Its almost like you know a thing or 2 about hops, freshness AND brewing.....
> 
> I am spoiled though...I live less than 4 hours from both of these breweries..AND the local distributor makes a HUGE representation of both locally. So FRESH IIPA's are really easy to come by here.... Lucky me huh
> 
> ...


I have no clue how to brew beer, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night haha


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## chadderkdawg (Dec 17, 2014)

HIM said:


> The dumb thing about it is the limit of alpha acid isomerization in wort is about 100 IBU and our taste threshold is also about the same. Going over that is basically all for show, sort of a gimmick in a way. You can't tell the difference in bitterness between Pliny at ~200 IBU(supposedly) and any other beer close to 100 IBU. All you notice is the strength in hop flavor vs bitterness depending on how long the hops are boiled.
> 
> So a 100 IBU beer that has all its IBU from the bittering hop addition will just seem really bitter but nearly flavorless but a 100 IBU beer that was hop bursted and had no bittering addition will have a huge flavor and less noticeable bitterness even though the IBU are the same. Essentially the IBUs the way they try to market the beer means nothing its all about the technique the brewer uses.


Bah humbug!


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## NorCalJaybird (Sep 2, 2014)

HIM said:


> I have no clue how to brew beer, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night haha


ha ha h ah ah ha ME TOO! LMAO!!!

Funny you mention Pliny and 200+ yes most any brewer knows anything over about 100-110 IBU is just wasting hops and like you said "for show" I am not a big Pliny fan. I personally think our house Pliny kit is better than the real thing. Maybe I am tainted from living less than 3 hours form the brewery and it not being able to get it or maybe it was the HYPE and I felt let down but either way.... I say Ahhhh I'll take a Stoopid over a Pliny any day.... 

Cheers
Jay
Cheers
Jay


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

NorCalJaybird said:


> ha ha h ah ah ha ME TOO! LMAO!!!
> 
> Funny you mention Pliny and 200+ yes most any brewer knows anything over about 100-110 IBU is just wasting hops and like you said "for show" I am not a big Pliny fan. I personally think our house Pliny kit is better than the real thing. Maybe I am tainted from living less than 3 hours form the brewery and it not being able to get it or maybe it was the HYPE and I felt let down but either way.... I say Ahhhh I'll take a Stoopid over a Pliny any day....
> 
> ...


I don't know if I'd call it wasting if they're all late kettle additions, which is probably how its brewed though Ive never seen the recipe. But from an IBU stand point yea its just a wasteful hop d*ck measuring contest. 
Ive only had Pliny once and I thought it lived up to my expectation. But in preference I still think Myrcenary might be the best IPA I've ever had.


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## dj1340 (Mar 30, 2009)

May not find it but Fat Head's Hop Stalker is really good, Stone Ruination is pretty good as well plus their enjoy by beers.
We have a local that is 120 ibu, surprised it really tasted good also if you can find Revolution's Unsessionable is damn good


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## Indy-hp (Feb 22, 2014)

Since you're going to Jazz Fest, you should rock him with a local brew: Abita Wrought Iron IPA (80 IBU).

I loves me Abita, but I'm more of an Amber or Restoration Pale Ale kinda guy myself.


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## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

NorCalJaybird said:


> Palate Wrecker from Green Flash
> Hopsickle from Moylan's
> Hop Stoopid from Lagunitas
> 
> ...


Thanks Jay, he had the Palate Wrecker last time down. Said it had its merits, but didn't sear the buds like he must be looking for. He must have a touch of masochism, because he has passed one to me before that he claimed "ain't hoppy enough" only to cause my head to snap back after one sip. I will look for the others though. I'm keeping a "most mentioned" list from here and will select 2 or 3 to find.


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## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

Indy-hp said:


> Since you're going to Jazz Fest, you should rock him with a local brew: Abita Wrought Iron IPA (80 IBU).
> 
> I loves me Abita, but I'm more of an Amber or Restoration Pale Ale kinda guy myself.


I can handle the Abita, been lovin it too for years :rofl: I have a New Orleans based groc store just a few miles away, that does a great job of stocking Abita, and a lot of other small batch, and micro brewed beer. We just had Crooked Letter open very close by...I'm GOOD, but this guy is a hop demon :evil:


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

Bowtech4ever said:


> Thanks Jay, he had the Palate Wrecker last time down. Said it had its merits, but didn't sear the buds like he must be looking for. He must have a touch of masochism, because he has passed one to me before that he claimed "ain't hoppy enough" only to cause my head to snap back after one sip. I will look for the others though. I'm keeping a "most mentioned" list from here and will select 2 or 3 to find.


Im sorry but if he said Palate Wrecker only "has its merits" then it sounds like the only beers he will think are up to snuff are his own(one of the perks of homebrewing). That beer is known by hop heads to be one of the most bitter beers on the market. I guess I'd try to figure out if he means bitterness or hop flavor when he says something isn't hoppy enough because they're 2 different things with very different recommendations. And in that case Palate Wrecker isn't known for having huge hop flavor.


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## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

HIM said:


> Im sorry but if he said Palate Wrecker only "has its merits" then it sounds like the only beers he will think are up to snuff are his own(one of the perks of homebrewing). That beer is known by hop heads to be one of the most bitter beers on the market. I guess I'd try to figure out if he means bitterness or hop flavor when he says something isn't hoppy enough because they're 2 different things with very different recommendations. And in that case Palate Wrecker isn't known for having huge hop flavor.


Yeah, and I don't know how to please the beast either. Thanks for that point, but it's the bitterness that he craves. I know in conversation he's has spoken as though they are one and the same....like its the hops content that provide the bitterness he strives for. Let's take it in the bittness direction then.

It could be the palate in his case too. For discussion's sake...someone who likes a full (FULL) bodied cigar may recommend a Comacho Corojo Gigantea to someone with similar likes. They may love it, like it, or hate it, or it was TOO strong...or not full enough. That could be just a matter of certain notes picked up, not picked up, or a palate issue. My friend could have a limited palate. One limited to only the most intense of flavors. "Genetics" was mentioned in another thread, which could limit ones ability to tastes all the various subtle notes in cigars, wines, foods, etc. I know early on, that my palate is not nearly as developed as a lot of you here, but detect a little more with each passing week / month. Could be his palate is already wrecked or was to start with, but short of serving him a nice cold glass of kerosene, I'm gonna chase down some of these recommendations in hopes there is "that one" out there....& Thanks!


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## NorCalJaybird (Sep 2, 2014)

Bowtech4ever said:


> Yeah, and I don't know how to please the beast either.


Easy hand him some Apollo hops and have him suck on them as he drinks his IPA. At (about) 17-19% AAU he wont taste $H!T for the rest of the night! Baaahhhaaaaa

Let me know Scott.. I'll send you some! That will teach him to Fk with a guy who knows a guy...LMAO!

Cheers
Jay


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## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

NorCalJaybird said:


> Easy hand him some Apollo hops and have him suck on them as he drinks his IPA. At (about) 17-19% AAU he wont taste $H!T for the rest of the night! Baaahhhaaaaa
> 
> Let me know Scott.. I'll send you some! That will teach him to Fk with a guy who knows a guy...LMAO!
> 
> ...


Let me back up a bit. I just busted his balls a bit & this is what he told me...."the Palate Wrecker was a damn fine brew", he is now on a quest for the Grail if there is one...that will back him down....kinda like me when it comes to coffee. Bad will always do it, but the search for the best goes on.

We met in Denver this year for the GABF & had:
The Great Divide..Hercules Double IPA 90
Strange Craft......1000 Barrel Imperial IPA 90
" " .......Dr Strangelove Barleywine 99
Wits End.............Super FL IPA ?

Jacksonville, FL last year
Intuition Ale Works....I-10 IPA 90's

Mobile, AL last year
Some Bar....Green Flash Palate Wrecker Imperial / Double IPA 100+

All great.....just lookin for one bitter :bounce::al


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

There might not be any hope for this guy lol. If he's brewing his own he's got to be used to some crazy hopped up IPAs by now. He's going to have to brew "the one" because he's kind of already seen the mountain top of hoppyness at this point. Tell him to use a 60min addition of 8oz(per 5 gal) of Apollo or Warrior and see if that doesn't quench his thirst :mrgreen:


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## Bowtech4ever (Oct 25, 2014)

HIM said:


> There might not be any hope for this guy lol. If he's brewing his own he's got to be used to some crazy hopped up IPAs by now. He's going to have to brew "the one" because he's kind of already seen the mountain top of hoppyness at this point. Granted have him chew on some Apollo like Jay mentioned and he wont be able to taste right after that. That might be your only choice if the hops are going to win this fight.


Yeah, he could be the beast that couldn't be fed, so to speak. Hops are a Northwest crop right? I'm gonna get with Jay on how to aquire. May roll a fatty out of em, and have him smoke it with another Palate Wrecker. See if that don't bring him down LMAO :biglaugh:u


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

Its a slippery slope I guess lol. Hops are typically grown in a belt around latitude 48 but Ive actually grown them myself down here successfully and many others farm them outside that zone. Heres a few of the main places people get their hops if your really interested....

Hops
Beer Hops - Shop cascade hops, citra hops, and more : Northern Brewer
Beer Brewing Ingredients & Beer Recipe Kits | Midwest Supplies


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