# Ammonia Attack! Over-humidification: a cautionary tale!



## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

I was gone for several months and asked the wife to refill the water in my heartfelt beads in the coolerdor before she took off as well. I should have specified how much...

Got back and checked the cooler and I could tell the beads were almost wet even months later! Bad smell emanating from the cooler...this is not good news.

Sticks are very humidified...almost flexible when you squeeze them. The ammonia smell is pungent. Sticking my nose in the worst cabs is like smelling a bottle of ammonia. I can't tell if it's certain boxes or all of them...with that much time in the cooler and without breathing I assume it wafted around to all of them. Luckily no mold on anything.

Biggest panic was looking at my old PLPC and SLR DCs and seeing many of the bands tarnished/green...although the gold lettering on the SLR doesn't really tarnish so much as get black and gummy and almost "bleed." I've had some light tarnish happen to gold bands before so am not too worried about it.

After going through everything, all the boxes that were just fine cosmetically I stacked and set aside...they might have residual ammonia smell or have absorbed it from the other sticks, but no band bleeding or other "obviously wrong" issues. The worst hit were SLB cabs at the bottom of the cooler where the dampness settled. Dress boxes must breathe better and were unaffected, as were varnished dress boxes/BNs. You can't tell anything is amiss with these other than touching the cigars. 

So here's my solution...do you gents agree? 

Cleaned out the coolerdor, scrubbed it down to air dry. Boxes will sit in the cooler with no humidification and with the lid cracked. Given how humidified they are and in the environment they were in I'm not surprised we triggered some kind of fermentation and ammonia release. All of the sticks are in good condition (but for the aforementioned bands), so as long as I can gradually lower the RH gradually I'm not really concerned. I've had light ammonia before and just "burped" the coolerdor more and adjusted the RH. The ammonia smell should go away with proper aeration and getting them back to rest at a normal RH. Just will have to wait a while before smoking them.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

Here's a link that addresses your issue and sounds like great advice....I have not had this issue so I can't say with certainty if this is the definitive way to get humidity down in your situation.

How to Fix Overhumidified Cigars


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## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

Cigary said:


> Here's a link that addresses your issue and sounds like great advice....I have not had this issue so I can't say with certainty if this is the definitive way to get humidity down in your situation.
> 
> How to Fix Overhumidified Cigars


Good advice...I have a bunch of uncorrupted cedar strips and lining from old boxes I will throw in as well to try and suck up some of the excess humidity.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

Good luck....those look to be some very good cigars and hope they come back to your satisfaction.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

I'd think the SLB's got it worse because the raw cedar is more absorbent than slick-label covered dress boxes or varnished wood. One assumes they'll keep giving off excess moisture along with the cigars if you lower the ambient RH in the cooler. So, I'd go with a closed cooler and dry HF beads (or KL) to bring its RH down at a metered rate. I don't think you will risk hurting anything for the first good while to completely air the cooler out for a bit daily to help dissipate the ammonia, while keeping it closed otherwise. But, it sounds like it's going to be a long haul to get back on track.


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## Grey Goose (May 24, 2016)

Dry out the beads with a blow dryer set to cool air, and place the dry beads back into the cooler.

IME one should always leave the drain plug open on coolidors as SOP.

If you have a small battery operated fan, place that in it as well.

Best regards!


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## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

curmudgeonista said:


> I'd think the SLB's got it worse because the raw cedar is more absorbent than slick label cover dress boxes or varnished wood. One assumes they'll keep giving off excess moisture along with the cigars if you lower the ambient RH in the cooler. So, I'd go with a closed cooler and dry HF beads (or KL) to bring its RH down at a metered rate. I don't think you will risk hurting anything for the first good while to completely air the cooler out for a bit daily to help dissipate the ammonia, while keeping it closed otherwise. But, it sounds like it's going to be a long haul to get back on track.


Beads seem to have absorbed the ammonia smell themselves...toss them or try to rehab?


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## Hudabear (Feb 1, 2016)

I'm no professional but wouldn't it be better and safer in the long run to take out the sticks until the ammonia aroma disperses? This would make sure there's no long term affects from the aroma being around the sticks. Once the ammonia is gone then put the sticks back in with your RH media. 
Just my 2 ¢ from the way I read the issue.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

Frinkiac7 said:


> Beads seem to have absorbed the ammonia smell themselves...toss them or try to rehab?


Your guess is as good as mine. I'd go with @Grey Goose's suggestion and dry them out. Then see if the odor persists.


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## Regiampiero (Jan 18, 2013)

Grey Goose said:


> Dry out the beads with a blow dryer set to cool air, and place the dry beads back into the cooler.
> 
> IME one should always leave the drain plug open on coolidors as SOP.
> 
> ...


Yea but if you leave the plug open, you would be losing humidity fairly quickly.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## Grey Goose (May 24, 2016)

Regiampiero said:


> Yea but if you leave the plug open, you would be losing humidity fairly quickly.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


Not so.

I know its counter-intuitive, but the truth is it doesn't noticeably affect humidity at all.

The coolidors run beautifully that way.

Try it.


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## Hudabear (Feb 1, 2016)

Grey Goose said:


> Not so.
> 
> I know its counter-intuitive, but the truth is it doesn't noticeably affect humidity at all.
> 
> ...


I think I've read a few times that humidity rises. If so, the drain at the bottom should be negligible.


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## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

Cooler doesn't have a plug so it's a moot point for me. 
It's a matter of seeing how I can ease down the humidity to a lower, stable level without upsetting the cigars.
Ammonia happens, from time to time. I'm not so much worried about that as getting them back to a stable, lower RH. The ammonia will go away in time once the cigars are taken out of what was a sealed, humid environment that caused them to start fermenting and passing gas.


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## Ams417 (May 13, 2016)

Tough break man. Hope it works out for you. Hate to see you lose any inventory. Take it slow.


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## Grey Goose (May 24, 2016)

Frinkiac7 said:


> Beads seem to have absorbed the ammonia smell themselves...toss them or try to rehab?


Cycle them dry, wet, dry, wet a couple times, the odor should dissipate and they should be GTG.

Don't know that for certain, but thats my understanding.


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## Hudabear (Feb 1, 2016)

I know I'm asking a lot but this is a learning experience for me as well. My apologies to the op for hijacking. In a case like this where the ammonia builds up does it revert to its "sick period"? Or do cigars have muscle memory so to speak so all those years they could have been aging are still valid and you don't need to start the process again?


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## Grey Goose (May 24, 2016)

Hudabear said:


> I think I've read a few times that humidity rises. If so, the drain at the bottom should be negligible.


That is correct, the drain plug just adds to, and the box benefits from, a little passive air exchange.

RH remains stable and consistent.

I have 6 54qt boxes going, equivalent to a little more than two of the extra large coolers, I'm using beads exclusively, and it sure has worked well for me over the last 7 or so years.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

Hudabear said:


> I know I'm asking a lot but this is a learning experience for me as well. My apologies to the op for hijacking. In a case like this where the ammonia builds up does it revert to its "sick period"? Or do cigars have muscle memory so to speak so all those years they could have been aging are still valid and you don't need to start the process again?


Seems like you're asking the old _"Have you stopped beating your wife_? _Answer Yes or No!" _question. It need not be either.

The sick period includes off-gassing ammonia in a second round of fermentation and aging is presumed to include slow micro-fermentation. @Frinkiac7's cigars may well have accelerated those processes, neither of which necessarily imply being a bad thing in the long run. Now the real question is how to bring their RH back down to Earth without shocking them.


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## Hudabear (Feb 1, 2016)

Ok thanks.


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## MaxG (Jan 2, 2016)

Hate to be a dark cloud here, but if the beads are stinky, I think you have to toss them. If you rescue your cigars from being basically underwater, count your blessings. But the beads; can't see it happening.


- MG


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## Regiampiero (Jan 18, 2013)

Grey Goose said:


> Not so.
> 
> I know its counter-intuitive, but the truth is it doesn't noticeably affect humidity at all.
> 
> ...


Ingesting. Although I glued mine shut, so I can't try it. Instead I have a dry bag of beads at the bottom to catch the condesantion.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Frinkiac7 said:


> I was gone for several months and asked the wife to refill the water in my heartfelt beads in the coolerdor before she took off as well. I should have specified how much...
> 
> Got back and checked the cooler and I could tell the beads were almost wet even months later! Bad smell emanating from the cooler...this is not good news.
> 
> ...


Sorry for your troubles.:frown2: Best of luck.


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## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

We'll hold off on the condolences for now! I am not worried about their long term smokability, more peeved that this will take time and delicate adjustments to undo. 

As others above mentioned, ammonia release can happen during a sick period. I think the months at high RH and no air flow accelerated this and trapped the gases...that being said, it's to some degree just fermenting tobacco and will presumably "blow off" given resumed air flow and stable RH. I have had lesser ammonia attacks in the past during the winter months for instance when I didn't have the chance to smoke and would neglect the coolerdor for long periods. If you are parking cabs for years and not circulating the air or getting dangerous RH levels you will get ammonia. 

In the past I have aerated and when the odor goes away I smoke and they are as good as ever. After years in there the whole cooler has a bit of a must/barnyard smell...no longer crisp tobacco or cedar. At first I was worried about it but the sticks always smoked as good as always and no mold issues. 

The PLPCs are 08 and the SLRs are 09. Those were inordinately affected, although a HDM cab from 08 also at the bottom of the cooler seems to be doing just fine and doesnt smell like it's throwing gas. Not a scientist by any means but I probably just accelerated their sick periods or booted them back into a sick phase/fermentation...like being in a pressure cooker. 

As always, proof is in the pudding. A cigar each from each is currently being dry boxed and once they seem okay will be smoked. After 24 hours the PLPCs are still tossing ammonia...the SLRs look worse because of the bands, but they smell like tobacco with only a minor hint of ammonia.


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## avitti (Jun 4, 2011)

I would have put a hygrometer in the dry box just to see what i'm dealing with in terms of raised humidity levels.A smaller box with maybe a dozen or so cigars.

If you want to bring these cigars back to original rh levels you'll need to know where they stand right now.

After you know the current rh level you will know what levels to saturate your beads to.I would use KL.There cheap and easy to get to desired levels.More than likely at first the beads will need no water -in the summer time they sometimes come out of the bag around 67 more or less. 

You will only want to come down in rh levels around 2 degrees at a time.Its a long an arduous process. 

Good luck


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## Frinkiac7 (Dec 12, 2008)

Taste test update: I have been smoking the PLPCs as they seemed like the most ammonia-soaked box. They have been hit or miss. Usually you can tell or find hints of the original flavor which tells me it's still in there, but the smoke can be very acrid and tart. They need to even out and toss the ammonia

I had a Partagas PCE that did not smell bad but was over-humidified. Tasted fine but flavors were muted like you would expect from a moist cigar.

Overall the collection seems like it wil persevere but had a bad humidity shock that triggered the ammonia release. As was mentioned above the trickiest part will be bringing them down without shocking them. I'm not worried about their long-term flavor or stability once they return to normal (thank goodness).


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## avitti (Jun 4, 2011)

The more air that passes through and over these cigars the quicker they will re acclimate. A wood humidor which neither neeeds to be opened or burped,but through natural osmosis would be the best way 
to get those cigars back to their intended rh levels and rid them of the ammonia like smell


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