# The Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act



## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

Well worth reading and rereading ........

*Full Broadside From Congress*

Some key extracts .....

_Tobacco as it is produced today is going to be forever changed with the passage of this law. If not, the industry can rest assured that some change is coming. Regardless if the full measure of this bill gets past the Senate and then comes out intact through the House-Senate conferee hearings

Essentially, the bill gives the FDA sweeping powers, to regulate the tobacco industry.

.............

Here is the wording: "In applying manufacturing restrictions to tobacco, the Secretary shall . . . . prescribe regulations (which may differ based on the type of tobacco product involved) requiring that the methods used in, and the facilities and controls used for the manufacture, preproduction design validation (including a process to assess the performance of a tobacco product), packing, and storage of a tobacco product conform to current good manufacturing practice, or hazard analysis and critical control point methodology, as prescribed in such regulations to assure that the public health is protected and that the tobacco product is in compliance with this chapter. Such regulations may provide for the testing of raw tobacco for pesticide chemical residues regardless of whether a tolerance for such chemical residues has been established."_​See how Sen. Scary Reid plans to move it in June: ARTICLE II

_The bill is also an attempt to circumvent a March 2000 Supreme Court ruling that struck down a Clinton administration attempt to regulate tobacco. On a 5-4 vote, justices at the time said the FDA was "overreaching" in attempting to regulate tobacco without congressional approval.

"It is plain that Congress has not given the FDA the authority that it seeks to exercise here," wrote Justice Sandra Day O'Connor in the majority opinion joined by Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist and Justices Antonin Scalia, Anthony M. Kennedy and Clarence Thomas.

But the bill won't go down without a fight. Democrats say they have the necessary 60 votes to pass the bill, but Burr said he will lead opposition.

"FDA's core mission is to prove the safety of every product that they regulate -- except for tobacco, which we know is dangerous and kills people," said Burr. "So what do you do, ask FDA to ignore their core mission when it comes to tobacco but apply it on everything else?"_​
Thank you Nanny-Leaders, thanks so very much.


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## doublebassmusician (Jul 15, 2008)

Let's see. I'm 22, and If I plan on living to 70 I'll need at least 50 pounds to continue smoking my evening pipe everyday.
So far I have 7 1/2 pounds and about 10 various tins.
Can everyone here hold off on buying for a while? I'd really like to get my orders as soon as possible.


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

doublebassmusician said:


> Let's see. I'm 22, and If I plan on living to 70 I'll need at least 50 pounds to continue smoking my evening pipe everyday.
> So far I have 7 1/2 pounds and about 10 various tins.
> Can everyone here hold off on buying for a while? I'd really like to get my orders as soon as possible.


I'll hold off for ya. I just got about 9 pounds last month and I'm good for a while


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

I wonder if Teddy Binion's old silver and gold vault in the Pahrump desert is for sale or lease .......


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

I don't get up in arms about this stuff because it's done with cigarettes as the sole concern, and cigarette smoking is clearly very bad for people. What happens is that we 2% that smoke cigars and pipes get lumped in because there's too few of us to make a nuanced distinction / exception. Clouding the issue, many cigar smokers and pipers also smoke cigarettes currently, in their past, or may well in the future.

So, I'd love if non-inhaled, non-ammonia/ chemically treated/ mother liquor tobacco products were given a pass, but it ain't gonna happen. If every person who has smoked a pipe in the last decade got on board, it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans compared to the cigarette smokers.


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## SmokinJohnny (Jan 21, 2009)

Amazing our tax dollars are used to support those who are taking our freedom away. We need to figure out how to get a tin of Penzance and a sanblast Petersen in the hands and mouth of Obama so he vetos this line of BS.


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## IrishCamel81 (Jan 26, 2009)

SmokinJohnny said:


> Amazing our tax dollars are used to support those who are taking our freedom away. We need to figure out how to get a tin of Penzance and a sanblast Petersen in the hands and mouth of Obama so he vetos this line of BS.


I think he has smoked out of a pipe before, but it will be a few more years before crack is legalized...:tape2:

banned in 3,2,1...


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## strider72 (Jan 25, 2009)

Dang liberal varmints.... too bad they put Yosemite Sam in the ******... he would fill them dang varmint's butts full o'lead...


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## brianwalden (Mar 18, 2009)

plexiprs said:


> Thank you Nanny-Leaders, thanks so very much.


Don't thank the Nanny-Leaders, they're just delivering on what they promised. Thank all the people who voted them into office. The sad fact is the majority of Americans vote for politicians who promise to deliver a big powerful government who gets up in everyone's business - we get exactly what we deserve.


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## phatmax (Mar 18, 2009)

brianwalden said:


> Don't thank the Nanny-Leaders, they're just delivering on what they promised. Thank all the people who voted them into office. The sad fact is the majority of Americans vote for politicians who promise to deliver a big powerful government who gets up in everyone's business - we get exactly what we deserve.


Actually, barring statisical issues with felons, if you take the voting age population, then the total number of votes and then votes broken down party lines.....

Only something like 32% of voting age Americans got the Nanny Staters Elected.


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

Before we go thanking anyone prematurely I think we have three questions to answer here. 1) What did the "nanny-staters" do to win votes? 2) what did the "non-nanny-staters" do to lose votes? 3)How and to what extent did 1 & 2 affect the outcome of the election?


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## phatmax (Mar 18, 2009)

Mad Hatter said:


> Before we go thanking anyone prematurely I think we have three questions to answer here. 1) What did the "nanny-staters" do to win votes? 2) what did the "non-nanny-staters" do to lose votes? 3)How and to what extent did 1 & 2 affect the outcome of the election?


Answer to 1: Promised voters the moon. Free stuff and .gov protection from any possible bad time, from poverty, housing, jobs, healthcare to bad dreams and ingrown toenails.

Answer to 2: Did not quite manage to promise as much free stuff as the winners.

Answer to 3: Either way the taxpayers got the shaft and eventually the piper will have to be paid. The outcome of this election will hopefully be an awakening and return to people who promise to cut SPENDING versus those that promise to "use taxpayer money more effectively" and get their noses out of every aspect of our lives.


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## Arizona (Jul 19, 2007)

I've been stockpiling and will continue to do so. These rabid communists WILL NOT STOP - whether it's through outrageous taxation or outrite banning of tobacco. 

I say screw them, the winds of change are very obvious, so I'm preparing before the storm hits and essentially I'll have myself set for a lifetime of smoking pleasure. 

Soon people will be growing their own tobacco when things really get bad. Then watch for growing tobacco to be illegal just like marijuana - with the Feds knocking down your door if you've got tobacco plants...


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

phatmax said:


> Answer to 1: Promised voters the moon. Free stuff and .gov protection from any possible bad time, from poverty, housing, jobs, healthcare to bad dreams and ingrown toenails.
> 
> Answer to 2: Did not quite manage to promise as much free stuff as the winners.
> 
> Answer to 3: Either way the taxpayers got the shaft and eventually the piper will have to be paid. The outcome of this election will hopefully be an awakening and return to people who promise to cut SPENDING versus those that promise to "use taxpayer money more effectively" and get their noses out of every aspect of our lives.


I guess that's a good answer from your perspective but people sharing your perspective were definitely outnumbered at election time and currently still are.


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## phatmax (Mar 18, 2009)

Mad Hatter said:


> I guess that's a good answer from your perspective but people sharing your perspective were definitely outnumbered at election time and currently still are.


I think once the .gov figures it is time to start getting Americans to pay for all these goodies and starts putting ever increasing taxes on things Americans buy everyday... more moderate people who voted one way, will look at their wallet and want someone who will trim fat, not add to it.

My personal view is that most, not all, but most politicos try their best to get re-elected by promising every increasing goodies and ever increasing "oversight" which just means more taxpayer money going to government.

Looking at the raw numbers, every taxpaying household now owns over $500K in government debt. This is without the trillions needed for National healthcare. So, right now, if the .gov budget was cut to equal the annual tax revenue, (balanced budget).... each taxpaying household would have to pony up and ADDITIONAL $50,000 for the next 10-12 years, every year...to pay off the debt.

It is a house of cards that just keeps getting bigger, because every knucklehead that promises his or her constituents .gov projects, money, assistance, etc... is just taking from their pockets, running the money through the beauracracy and sending it back is smaller amounts.

Eventually, people will have to RElearn that the government has NO money. They just get money from people and when they spend more, they must take more.

And to take more, they need to tax more...hence the situation we are in right here with tobacco and coming soon, soda and alcohol, and I believe things such as red meat, dessert products and fast food...


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## Arizona (Jul 19, 2007)

phatmax said:


> I think once the .gov figures it is time to start getting Americans to pay for all these goodies and starts putting ever increasing taxes on things Americans buy everyday... more moderate people who voted one way, will look at their wallet and want someone who will trim fat, not add to it.
> 
> My personal view is that most, not all, but most politicos try their best to get re-elected by promising every increasing goodies and ever increasing "oversight" which just means more taxpayer money going to government.
> 
> ...


We're currently under occupation by a enemy - yes Communists are an outright enemy to any free nation - that few comprehend how extreme the damage they cause will be. They're going to COLLAPSE the US economy in the next year or two, or maybe three, but it's going to collapse. The level of both personal and government debt is so extreme there's no way to avoid this. The fools are printing billions of worthless paper dollars and this will be a bullet in the head to the already faltering and extremely precarious situation we are in. The depression in the 1930's did not involve half of the problems we now face with credit card debt, screwy mortgages people have on their home, etc. Soon to come will be outrageous inflation not seen since the Weimar republic when a wheelbarrow full of cash would get you a loaf of bread, etc. To try and counter this they'll jack up interest rates into credit-card levels and this will finish off any who thought they could hold on and survive.

Hold onto your butt cuz it's going to be a worldwide catastrophe. Stock up on your tobacco and prepare yourself in other ways the best you can beforehand...


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## phatmax (Mar 18, 2009)

Arizona said:


> We're currently under occupation by a enemy - yes Communists are an outright enemy to any free nation - that few comprehend how extreme the damage they cause will be. They're going to COLLAPSE the US economy in the next year or two, or maybe three, but it's going to collapse. The level of both personal and government debt is so extreme there's no way to avoid this. The fools are printing billions of worthless paper dollars and this will be a bullet in the head to the already faltering and extremely precarious situation we are in. The depression in the 1930's did not involve half of the problems we now face with credit card debt, screwy mortgages people have on their home, etc. Soon to come will be outrageous inflation not seen since the Weimar republic when a wheelbarrow full of cash would get you a loaf of bread, etc. To try and counter this they'll jack up interest rates into credit-card levels and this will finish off any who thought they could hold on and survive.
> 
> Hold onto your butt cuz it's going to be a worldwide catastrophe. Stock up on your tobacco and prepare yourself in other ways the best you can beforehand...


Vladimir *Lenin* "The way to *crush *the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation."

Keep buying supplies.


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## Arizona (Jul 19, 2007)

Great quote Phatmax! Wow how true, but still more amazing is how people NEVER seem to learn the lessons of history despite the tactics of tyrants almost never changing - always the same old thing and people are so clueless they keep falling for it over and over and over again. 

Tyrants need to be hung - they're easy to recognize if you only know your history!


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## N7COF (Dec 29, 2008)

I'm stocking my cellar up but I also keep in mind "All Politics is Theater" to bad they are playing with our liberties & wallets


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## RJpuffs (Jan 27, 2008)

I only had 29 lbs cellared, and all this talk made me go and buy more. I needed pipe cleaners (heavens, will they ban those too?) - so picked up 5xFVF and 4xSt.JamesFlake to get free shipping :whoo:

Now up to 30 lbs, by the cellar-place's calculations enough for 8 years. Hmmm ... two elections ... :hmm:


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

Arizona said:


> Great quote Phatmax! Wow how true, but still *more amazing is how people NEVER seem to learn the lessons of history despite the tactics of tyrants almost never changing* - always the same old thing and people are so clueless they keep falling for it over and over and over again.
> 
> Tyrants need to be hung - they're easy to recognize if you only know your history!


Like the use of fear and the continual repetition of a message as a means of affecting public opinion?


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## Plazma (Mar 11, 2009)

Wow, I guess as a non-conservative anti-capitalist I'll stay out of this thread.

Just a reminder, you may have enough for yourself, remember that when there's a collapse money will likely be useless so you should also store some extra tobacco for bartering purposes after the death of the capitalist system and the rebirth of bartering.


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## Zeabed (Apr 23, 2009)

The progressive, Pavlovian recipe for a Totalitarian State: A dog had his chain reduced one link at a time, every few days, until his chain was so short he could barely move. He never resisted because he had been conditioned to the loss of his freedom slowly, over time. 

This is nothing new. Socialist Party leader Norman Thomas described the blueprint a long time ago. He vowed that they would work from within to destroy the economy, until "you fall into our hands like overripe fruit." That quotation is not a paraphrase: I heard a tape of that speech, and anyway I remember the well-known tactics of Fabianism, and I remember Norman Thomas, who died all of 40 years ago. The only difference now is that they're cutting off longer segments from the dog chain, and they're doing it with increasing momentum. They must be getting impatient; either that or they're really hopeful of nearing their goal.


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## strider72 (Jan 25, 2009)

Maybe the dog will turn around and bite them the hext time they put their hand on the chain. On the average, amerikans are ignorant to politics, tactics, reality it seems, etc.


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## garydh2000 (Dec 22, 2008)

In addition to the already posted brilliant comments:

They went after the children in our land through "government-run schools" and of course, "higher education". Parents seemed to have just let it happen, as ignorance is bliss, I guess? So now in addition to government run schools we have govt. run banks and auto manufacturers with perhaps more on da way, I say.

And how about taxation without "intelligent-moral-ethical" representation! Here here I say...

Can anyone show me where socialism has actually worked? Oh I am sorry to have said the "S" word.

Gary


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## Zeabed (Apr 23, 2009)

strider72 said:


> Maybe the dog will turn around and bite them the hext time they put their hand on the chain. [...]


Well, that's always a possibility as they have to get closer and closer to the dog to shorten its chain. But who knows? If the dog by now is probably their bitch already....


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## x6ftundx (Jul 31, 2008)

I guess I am confused about this... do you think brands will go out instead of just charging more? I don't mind paying a buck or two more for my favorite brands, I just don't want them to go like my Mixture 965


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

Plazma said:


> Wow, I guess as a non-conservative anti-capitalist I'll stay out of this thread.
> 
> Just a reminder, you may have enough for yourself, remember that when there's a collapse money will likely be useless so you should also store some extra tobacco for bartering purposes after the death of the capitalist system and the rebirth of bartering.


Yep, I'm figuring the 64 pounds should be augmented by about 20%-30%. That way you nicotine freaks can be bartering for a smoke and giving up your bullets, gold, women, etc. ... Gotta love that C A P I T A L I S M !!


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