# UPDATE on Cigar Tax...Per Rocky



## mrgatorman (Mar 23, 2007)

Spoke extensively with Rocky and him enterage. Rocky first said that he finished a meeting with the House Ways and Means Committee and they have officially capped the tax to $1 from $10. One dollar from Ten dollars per stick. He and his group are proposing a 10 cent tax to give them something. He has been working like I cant even explain. They have dedicated all their focus on campaigning, calling every manufacturer, retailer, and rep/senator. To the point that Senator Bill Nelson D-FLA has turned off his fax and refuses to answer his phone. However the wharehouse guy knows Nelson and he was sent to his house to talk to him. They have converted a couple of senators but need three more to officially kill this before it gets to the president.

Rocky is worried that bush will allow this to go through as part of a deal to get something else from the Dems. Although Bush has vowed to Veto this. 

being an ex lawyer, Rocky has found a possibility that has not been thought of much yet. The Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA) basically that tax is disallowed on products imported from certain companies including Nic, Hon and others...They may be able to use this agreement to kill the tax all together. Officials from other S american countries are fighting this with the agreement. 

Rocky has been successful coordinating efforts with other manufacturers and meeting at his place in naples. They had a meeting recently and brought together lots of ideas and coordinated efforts to really kill this. 

I have to say that I feel pretty confident that this will be reduced considerably or killed all together. That man and his company is rally one of the hardest working group i have ever met.

He had faxes incomming and outgoing, emails, phone calls and he was so generous to let me see some of the faxes. Letters from other countries (in english) referring to CAFTA and a list of the House Ways and means committee. 

If I can get more info Ill let you guys know


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## mrgatorman (Mar 23, 2007)

please do not let your guard down. CALL YOUR SENATORS AND REPS!!!


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## g8trbone (Apr 26, 2007)

Bill... thanks for that update. You know... of the local B&M's that I have visited lately, only one has had anything posted about the potential tax. That is one of the most disheartening things.


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## kass (May 16, 2007)

It's great to see ppl in the industry making such an effort!
I'm gonna spark up an OWR now for rocky!


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## ER Doc (Feb 8, 2007)

Thanks for the update, Bill.


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## Labman (May 27, 2007)

> Rocky has been successful coordinating efforts with other manufacturers and meeting at his place in naples. They had a meeting recently and brought together lots of ideas and coordinated efforts to really kill this.


This is excellent news Bill. It's hard work and teamwork like this that will help kill this insane cigar tax. Thank you for your hard work Mr. Patel!!


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## CHRIS7891011 (Apr 1, 2007)

That's great news. We still need to fight though!


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## terrasco-cl (Mar 4, 2007)

Thanks for the update. This is still a significant issue. We have to fight this as hard as we can. Let's face it, cigars are a luxury item. We will only smoke them as long as we can afford them.

This is also a kiss of death for our beloved retailers. As I said, cigars are a luxury item. If the price goes up, people quit buying and people are out of work.


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## tobacmon (May 17, 2007)

Great News Bill-thanks For Passing It On.


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## Lefty-cl (Jun 15, 2007)

And remember, buy more RP cigars.:biggrin: :teacher:


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## havanitascigars-cl (Apr 29, 2007)

Word from Washington is Bush is now condemning not only the tax, but the changes to the SCHIP bill as a whole! Even with the proposed tobacco tax, the program would not be funded beyond a couple of years. As such, he is saying he will veto the entire bill if it is not rewritten.


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## Ceedee (Jun 2, 2006)

Great stuff Bill, can't believe I missed this... I've been working away and pestering my NC senators with email and phone calls. No real info to report other than we all NEED to keep on our State congresspeople to kill this stupid thing dead!! Thanks D also for your latest report!

CD


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## sonick-cl (Jun 5, 2007)

Wow, good on Rocky for spearheading this effort.... an industry-internal leader was needed to head the opposition; now we have one. 

I can tell you this much, in addition to the usual weekly activity of calling my state legislators, I am going to be buying more Rocky Patel cigars! In fact, I'm low on Edge Corojo Missiles; time to order a new box....


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

Guys, don't forget you can send in your letters against this through the RTDA website. They're now sending emails and faxes both on your behalf! All you gotta do is modify (or not) their boilerplate text and click a button.


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## Marlboro Cigars-cl (Feb 19, 2007)

Thanks for the update.
Always nice to hear good news.


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## Tha Criddler (Jul 26, 2007)

Yeah thanks.
This is the scariest thing I've ever seen in the cigar world.


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## louistogie (Jun 21, 2007)

Go Rocky!:whoohoo:


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## DGreekStallion (May 31, 2007)

Rocky Rocky Rocky


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## shrtcrt (Jan 29, 2006)

As far as I know, the bill passed, HOWEVER the House and Senate each passed a different version. Now they have to compromise. Also the President can not veto the bill since it received enough votes so that it can not be vetoed. It looks like we will have a tax increase, now it is just a matter of how much. Either way it sucks and shows how we are losing more of our freedoms. Too many stupid laws, bills and taxes. We make laws to stop natural selection. Argh!


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

shrtcrt said:


> As far as I know, the bill passed, HOWEVER the House and Senate each passed a different version. Now they have to compromise. Also the President can not veto the bill since it received enough votes so that it can not be vetoed. It looks like we will have a tax increase, now it is just a matter of how much. Either way it sucks and shows how we are losing more of our freedoms. Too many stupid laws, bills and taxes. We make laws to stop natural selection. Argh!


Yeah, unfortunately, more taxes were almost inescapable. Those bloated windbags (politicians) are hungry, they need to be fed. The president can still veto whatever comes before him as a symbolic gesture, but it's likely that some sort of tax increase will get the 2/3's it needs to override it. :angry:

Looks like it's time to look into bootlegging. Hey, if it worked for the Kennedy family, it'll work for me! (Right?) :lol:


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## mrgatorman (Mar 23, 2007)

Keep inmind that the House passed a $1 and the Senate passed a $10. YOu need 2/3 on the final product once one is reached and vetod. So there is alot that still needs to be done... DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN. You must keep on your senators and representatives.


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## boonedoggle-cl (Jul 11, 2007)

mrgatorman said:


> please do not let your guard down. CALL YOUR SENATORS AND REPS!!!


sounds like RP is doing all the work for us! :biggrin:


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

mrgatorman said:


> Keep inmind that the House passed a $1 and the Senate passed a $10. YOu need 2/3 on the final product once one is reached and vetod. So there is alot that still needs to be done... DO NOT LET YOUR GUARD DOWN. You must keep on your senators and representatives.


Good point. If we holler loud enough and long enough a percentage of the necessary 2/3's may have a change of heart by the time it comes back to them. Keep faxing, writing and emailing!


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## BioSore (Aug 16, 2007)

Hey guys, one thing to keep in mind is that it is an up-to 10 dollar tax. I think it is highly unlikely that congress would impose such an absurd tax upon a single cigar. I don't think they are oblivious to the fact that such a tax increase would virtually kill the industry. Even if Senate's bill passed, I think they would more than likely stick to a simple $1-per-stick plan.

I'm right behind the rest of you on this part. A $10 per-stick increase sounds like a joke. I can understand a slight increase in tax, because it's very true that there are children out there that need medical help yet simply do not have the funds. But if they imposed a $10 tax, I don't think that they would get any more money because the strong majority of public would stop purchasing cigars.

Edit: I know most of you are going to disagree on this with me, but the health care is needed. Cigars are our luxury, but health is more than a luxury for the kids in need.


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## PremiumsOnly (Jul 28, 2007)

shrtcrt said:


> As far as I know, the bill passed, HOWEVER the House and Senate each passed a different version. Now they have to compromise. Also *the President can not veto the bill since it received enough votes* so that it can not be vetoed. It looks like we will have a tax increase, now it is just a matter of how much. Either way it sucks and shows how we are losing more of our freedoms. Too many stupid laws, bills and taxes. We make laws to stop natural selection. Argh!


It only received enough votes in the Senate, not the house, so it can still be vetoed. Also, since the bill needs to be reconciled, many who originally voted for it may rescind. I would still be worried about Bush signing it for some special interests nonetheless, in spite of the veto promise. The $1 tax adjustment, however, is most welcome news.

With compromise, everyone can leave the table happy!


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## United601 (Apr 13, 2007)

Everybody, please keep on sending your letters & comments to your state representitives. RTDA.org has a list of your state contacts. We still need to fight for our rights & what we love most; CIGARS! Thank you Rocky for standing up & taking the bull by the horns to minimize this monstrosity. I will continue to do my part as well. This is far from over.


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## BigBuddha76 (Mar 15, 2005)

BioSore said:


> Edit: I know most of you are going to disagree on this with me, but the health care is needed. Cigars are our luxury, but health is more than a luxury for the kids in need.


I would agree here, but I must ask myself, why cant they just cut the hundreds of useless programs that waste my tax dollars and use the saved money for the health care...

that would make too much sense


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

BioSore said:


> Edit: I know most of you are going to disagree on this with me, but the health care is needed. Cigars are our luxury, but health is more than a luxury for the kids in need.


I agree that kids need to have their health looked after, but that's the responsibility of the parents. (This is going to cover "children" up to the age of 25! And for families banking 60K a year! Sorry, NO!) The misconception here is that health insurance = health care. It doesn't. I've lived both with and without health insurance, and you know what? It's actually far cheaper without it, barring major problem. And I had to deal with a broken foot without insurance!

Besides, "the children" angle is a ruse. It always is. If you want a sure sign that you're about to be screwed as a tax payer, it's whenever a politician starts talking about "the children". Guaranteed, the funds will be reallocated withing 3 years to pet projects, and they'll be back talking about the needs of "the children". Don't fall for it.


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## shrtcrt (Jan 29, 2006)

You are right Brian. Health Care really does not exist. We are so quick to tell people to take a pill that we do not treat the issue or educate people. These programs to help people are a joke and just a way to take money from us to fund them. Lets use OUR money for something good and solve some problems. Screw taxing more. Soon we won't even get a paycheck.


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## BioSore (Aug 16, 2007)

BigBuddha76 said:


> I would agree here, but I must ask myself, why cant they just cut the hundreds of useless programs that waste my tax dollars and use the saved money for the health care...
> 
> that would make too much sense


Like what though? I agree, there are many useless programs in the federal government, but thats edging on politics. For example I think that the Iraq war is wasted tax dollars, but I know many out there disagree. You can take an angle on anything. Brian knows this...



brianhewitt said:


> I agree that kids need to have their health looked after, but that's the responsibility of the parents. (This is going to cover "children" up to the age of 25! And for families banking 60K a year! Sorry, NO!) The misconception here is that health insurance = health care. It doesn't. I've lived both with and without health insurance, and you know what? It's actually far cheaper without it, barring major problem. And I had to deal with a broken foot without insurance!
> 
> Besides, "the children" angle is a ruse. It always is. If you want a sure sign that you're about to be screwed as a tax payer, it's whenever a politician starts talking about "the children". Guaranteed, the funds will be reallocated withing 3 years to pet projects, and they'll be back talking about the needs of "the children". Don't fall for it.


I think that a large part of this is that there isn't adequate health insurance for those in need. It's true, I did throw about the wrong word in my previous post. However, there is still very inadequate funding for health insurance for the low-income residents of this nation. Whether children or not, I know this first hand.

Every week I volunteer at the medical clinic in my town and I see the people that cannot afford health insurance and are not eligible for health care/insurance from the government. It really is a problem. The families (specifically, children of) that this bill affects are in almost all cases in dire need of health insurance. They're not going to be making $60,000/yr and looking for an easy out. These are people that barely make enough to pay off child care and make it worthwhile to even hold their own jobs, let alone put money towards food and shelter.

Whether the "child" angle is a rues or not, the health insurance provided by the government is under-par, for a nation with as much respect as the US.


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## JohnR (Apr 1, 2007)

BioSore said:


> I know most of you are going to disagree on this with me, but the health care is needed. Cigars are our luxury, but health is more than a luxury for the kids in need.


You're right, I totally disagree. If it is a worthy program, it should be funded the way every other program is funded, with income tax dollars. It should not be funded on the backs of a single segment of the population. The simple truth here is that the Liberals know proposing an income tax increase to pay for another Government entitlement won't fly, but taxing those evil smokers will.


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## JohnR (Apr 1, 2007)

PremiumsOnly said:


> With compromise, everyone can leave the table happy!


Just for the record, if they raise the cap more than 100% (from a nickel to a dime) I will be torqued. I think Rocky Patel and I are in the same camp on that. It sets a really bad example for tax policy in this country. Just remember, when they suck all the taxes they can out of tobacco, they are coming after coffee, booze, and tator tots next.


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## PremiumsOnly (Jul 28, 2007)

JohnRider said:


> Just for the record, if they raise the cap more than 100% *(from a nickel to a dime) *I will be torqued. I think Rocky Patel and I are in the same camp on that. It sets a really bad example for tax policy in this country. Just remember, when they suck all the taxes they can out of tobacco, they are coming after coffee, booze, and tator tots next.


Good point - I didn't realize it was currently so low...


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## terrasco-cl (Mar 4, 2007)

The sad thing is that only about 30 cents on the dollar ever reaches the kids. Government waste and overhead gobbles up about 70%. I think there have to be better ways to help our kids than raising taxes and letting the government get involved.


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## shrtcrt (Jan 29, 2006)

Lets educate them and the parents on what food really is. That over processed stuff is not good for you. Fresh veggies, no high fructose corn oils, or partially hydrogenated oils. Those two things are in almost everything.


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## JohnR (Apr 1, 2007)

BioSore said:


> Whether the "child" angle is a rues or not, the health insurance provided by the government is under-par, for a nation with as much respect as the US.


I will concede that SCHIP is a worthwhile venture. Where I think we would disagree is on how to fund it and how big it should be. The Repubicans (and the President) want to renew the funding for this program - even increase the federal funding by several billion dollars - but the liberals are wanting to expand it A LOT - like 30 Billion dollars. I also think that providing health insurance for illegal aliens is wrong. You should have to prove that you are a US CITIZEN to get this entitlement. There is no reason why I should be paying healthcare insurance premiums for people who broke the law and shouldn't even be here in the first place. It also seems like we need to work on an end game. This whole thing does nothing to fix the problem - it just puts a big bandaid on it. Ten years from now, we will be in the same spot we are right now. God, I hate politics. I am done here.


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## PremiumsOnly (Jul 28, 2007)

JohnRider said:


> God, I hate politics. I am done here.


Plus, let's not forget its discussion here is banned. I'm with you though John.


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

PremiumsOnly said:


> Plus, let's not forget its discussion here is banned. I'm with you though John.


Amen. Let's get back to smokin'. I've already irritated enough people today!

(I made the mistake of discussing it at the bar tonight, and I really ticked a guy off. Hey, I was tryin' to be polite, and I wasn't angry! He sure was. LOL!)


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## mrgatorman (Mar 23, 2007)

JohnRider said:


> I will concede that SCHIP is a worthwhile venture. Where I think we would disagree is on how to fund it and how big it should be. The Repubicans (and the President) want to renew the funding for this program - even increase the federal funding by several billion dollars - but the liberals are wanting to expand it A LOT - like 30 Billion dollars. I also think that providing health insurance for illegal aliens is wrong. You should have to prove that you are a US CITIZEN to get this entitlement. There is no reason why I should be paying healthcare insurance premiums for people who broke the law and shouldn't even be here in the first place. It also seems like we need to work on an end game. This whole thing does nothing to fix the problem - it just puts a big bandaid on it. Ten years from now, we will be in the same spot we are right now. God, I hate politics. I am done here.


Well I couldnt have said it better myself. Unfortunately we are incredibly hypocritical as a whole. We want government to be responsibe for certain things and complain about tax increases. Our government says it doesnt have enough money to do stuff and yet spends like drunken sailors. Rep or Dem alike...we piss money away like we have an endless supply. then when something worth while comes along (and I say that loosly)we have to aquire more money to pay for it. Sometimes I wonder how were not the butt of many jokes worldwide..


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## Pumpkinsdad (Apr 21, 2007)

shrtcrt said:


> Lets educate them and the parents on what food really is. That over processed stuff is not good for you. Fresh veggies, no high fructose corn oils, or partially hydrogenated oils. Those two things are in almost everything.


How about putting physical education back into schools?


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## United601 (Apr 13, 2007)

I received a letter back from my FL. state rep. Connie Mack stating he agrees that we should better prioritize where they send tax payer funds instead of continuously raising taxes and/or creating new one. 

It is good to know that some politicians are on our side, unfortunately cigars have been catagorized under the same catagory as cigarettes giving cigars a bad rep. I couldn't agree more that child health care is a worthy cause. Potentially putting people out business and jobs here & Internationally, that I have a problem with.

Therefore, it is urgent that we all still contact our state reps. & continue to figght legislation & not lose this battle.


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## Cigar Czar-cl (Aug 20, 2007)

Argh... The irony in taxing a product that we refuse to import from a socialist country to finance a social reform!


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## Topper (Apr 9, 2007)

I buy almost exclusively RP products ever since I went to Honduras and had the chance to see the quality put into every cigar. Don't forget he also makes Indian Tabac and other private label products. Be sure to ask your retailers for RP.


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## brianhewitt (Jul 10, 2007)

Cigar Czar said:


> Argh... The irony in taxing a product that we refuse to import from a socialist country to finance a social reform!


:lol: Exactly!



mrgatorman said:


> We want government to be responsibe for certain things and complain about tax increases. Our government says it doesnt have enough money to do stuff and yet spends like drunken sailors.


I'd be in favor of the government doing less! We all know how well they get things done with the responsibilities they already have!


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