# Requested "Cuban" Cigars Analysis



## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

I was recently contact by a new member who asked for assistance authenticating some cigars. Soon after we exchanged a few PMs, I received a package of eight cigars for analysis. These were:
_
Upmann Monarch tubos
Partagas Serie P No. 2
Partagas Shorts from cab
Romeo y Julieta Belicosos
Bolivar Belicosos Finos
Cohiba Siglo VI (x2)
Cohiba Siglo VI tubos_

*Here are my observations in numbered list format.*
*1.* The cigars were nicely constructed. Most were on the firm side but otherwise, the wrappers were clean, of good quality and applied with expertise. _Looking good._

*2.* All dimensions measured out within acceptable tolerance ranges. The Siglo VI were 2mm long but that is not terribly bad. _Still looking good._

*3.* All the bands were essentially indistinguishable from bands on authentic specimens. Good quality printing, excellent registration of colors and emboss. Die cut properly and centered. _Rock on._

*4.* Smelled strange. There was an unusual and unpleasant bitter, leathery funk to all the cigars. I have never smelled a Havana that did not make me positively drool from the tobacco aroma but these did not smell right. The only cigars that smelled worse to me was a box of fake Bolivar Coronas. I still have this box and I still check in on it occasionally as a reference. _Hmm..._

*5.* Curiously uniform wrapper. Here is a photograph of six of these cigars. These sticks span 2004 and 2005 production, *5* different marcas, *4* different factories, *5* different vitolas with ring gauge from _42 to 52_ and length from _4-3/8" to 7"_. But look at how similar these wrappers appear. In my experience, this is a level of uniformity that is _at least as good as_ that often encountered _within a single box_ of Havanas. _Something's fishy._

*6.* The serial number two-letter prefixes on the warranty seals for these boxes are beyond the range which I have personally recorded. His 04 boxes have prefixes of BM, DB, and ES (all produced in NOV!) For my eight 2004 boxes, the span is FD-HD. His 05 box is DB and fourteen of my 2005 boxes span GI-HS.

I would feel a lot more comfortable if I had around 50 boxes from each year so I could draw a more complete picture of the distribution of prefix codes for those two years. As it stands, this observation merely _suggests_ a potential mismatch. _It's got me wondering._

*7.* The use of the discontinued *EAR* factory code on recent production is a *big* red flag. As far as I can figure, this code signifying the La Corona factory was last seen on legitimate Habanos around the middle of 2002. It has been seen commonly seen on counterfeit goods starting 2003. I only have one EAR code box and it is a box of SCdLH La Fuerza from NOV01. Both of this guy's EAR boxes are from 2004. Additionally, La Corona did not make either of the two marcas represented by the boxes he has. Finally, it is somewhat unlikely that two boxes from the same factory, produced the same month would have prefixes as far apart as BM and DB. _This is not a good sign._

*8.* Multiple structural and printing differences between the his Siglo VI tube and authentic specimens. I have had Sig VI tubes from three different vendors acquired over about a year and the construction of the tube cap and tube body are unlike the one provided by him. Here are some photos. In the first photo, the legitimate cap uses 16-panel closure at the top while his specimen uses 8-panel. In the second photo, the authentic specimen uses 8-panel at the base of the tube while his specimen uses a cap-piece.

In the absence of definitive information from the manufacturer of the legitimate Cohiba tubes, I can't say for sure that this observation means anything in particular about the legitimacy of his specimens. I can only say that that tube is constructed differently from several others I know to be authentic.

Here are two photos of his tube on the left and one of my tubes on the right. Note the minute but discernible differences in the text/type, indian head, dot pattern, length of the cedar insert, black band below "Cohiba" and gold-tone joint piece. _Curiouser and curiouser._

*Overall*, the the picture painted by these observations leads me to strongly suspect all the cigars to be counterfeit. I did not lay out every step of the analysis of every bit of data that this fellow provided but that more detailed examination suggests that these are _almost certainly_ all fakes. And, when coupled with this quote on the method of procurement, my certainty level approaches 100%


> As far as my source goes everything has been good just hard to verify, I do know that he goes to cuba himself and some how gets them back to the US.


Wilkey


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

I had the opportunity to smoke the Partagas Shorts from cab that this fellow sent me. Here is my account of that experience.

This cigar is well made with an expertly applied, silky colorado wrapper. Length and ring gauge are right on target. Sniffing the cigar prior to lighting reconfirmed an unusual leathery funk. There was a sweetness that just did not seem characteristic. I cut the cap and checked the draw which turned out to be slightly firm but reasonable. Light up was uneventful.

I've smoked a few Party Shorts in my time and right away, I noticed that this cigar lacked the signature spicy punch. Also lacking was the pronounced peppery character that asserts itself early on and then settles down into a rich background of medium heavy tobacco. In its place was a mellow, sweet earthiness. This was a mild cigar, mild-medium bodied with a subdued aroma and quite out of character with my experience of the real thing. As the cigar progressed, I made another important observation. The ash was bright white and tight. As some of you may already be aware, tight, bright white ashes are quite uncommon in Cuban cigars. Much more characteristic is a fluffy medium-dark gray, dappled ash. Here is a photograph of the cigar and the first 1.25" of ash.

At this point, I have a strong suspicion that this cigar might not be what it was represented to be. But this remained a suspicion for only a little while longer. Thus far, it wasn't a terrible cigar, just rather nondescript and somewhat bland. At about the 1.5" mark, the cigar had still not developed in any meaningful way and so I decided to stop smoking, let it cool off, and dissect the stub. And that is when all doubt fled from my mind.

As you can see from the following photograph, the filler contains low quality, fragmentary tobacco. Basically, what we have here is a mixed-filler, "sandwich" style cigar. In an authentic _totalmente a mano_ Havana cigar, every leaf is intact and either full, or half leaf. There is *never* chopped leaf in premium, totally hand made long-filler Cuban cigars. This clinched the diagnosis. *Fugazi*.

BTW, here is a shot of the foot of the cigar prior to lighting. You can see that the pattern of the bunching is suggestive of the type of construction found in some counterfeits. Moki illustrates this schematically on his Vitolas website, here. Genuine, high quality handmades will show a much less structured pattern that I call "Habana Chaos." The leaves are bunched to provide proper structure between ligero and seco/viso tobaccos and this means you won't see a heavy ring of concentrically laid leaves near the outer surface. Keep in mind that this is an observation that is only useful when the concentric-over-core structure is severe.

Wilkey


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## ToddziLLa (Oct 17, 2005)

Great work as always Wilkey! 

What camera and resolution are you using btw? The pictures you take are great.


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## 68TriShield (May 15, 2006)

I feel bad for the guy...


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## Guitarman-S.T- (Jun 14, 2006)

Damn.... theres SOO much that i got to learn if i ever wanna get soem legit isom's lol
S.T-


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

ToddziLLa said:


> Great work as always Wilkey!
> 
> What camera and resolution are you using btw? The pictures you take are great.


Hi Todd,

Thanks for the kind words.

For general shotmaking, I use a Casio EX-Z600 at 6MP. For macro work, I use a Canon A430 at 4MP. Pictures for posting are typically scaled to 720 pixels wide at 72 pixels per inch.

I don't massage the photos normally except for level adjustment to correct contrast and perhaps a bit of luminance channel sharpening. I like to keep the pictures as close to as-captured as possible.

Wilkey


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## montecristo#2 (May 29, 2006)

This is one awesome post, very very informative. I vote for a sticky.

I assume from the last line, these did not come from a vendor, but from someone who supposedly got them directly from cuba? If they came from cuba, shouldn't they have a hologram on the box?

thanks again for posting this - mc#2


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## noprob1017 (Jul 29, 2006)

Excellent work. I have learned the hard way about fakes. Bought way too many when I first started smoking. These show all the signs of some of my mistakes. Just goes to show that if you're not buying from legitimate overseas vendors, you're most likely getting fakes. Just my :2 

Guy


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

montecristo#2 said:


> This is one awesome post, very very informative. I vote for a sticky.
> 
> I assume from the last line, these did not come from a vendor, but from someone who supposedly got them directly from cuba? If they came from cuba, shouldn't they have a hologram on the box?
> 
> thanks again for posting this - mc#2


Their true origin is unknown. The _"I know a guy who brings these back from Cuba"_ source is never a good sign and the merchandise can range from authentic cigars to utter garbage made in the Dominican Republic or Little Havana.

Wilkey


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## ca21455 (Jul 23, 2006)

Thanks for the post, I learned a lot. I am definitely deficient when it comes to Cuban cigars.


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## Sandman (Mar 26, 2006)

Very interesting post. A great resourse for someone that is unsure of their vendor and trying to verify their cigars.


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## BeagleOne (Dec 23, 2005)

Very interesting. Thanks for the info and the photos.


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## j6ppc (Jun 5, 2006)

Great post.
Sticky worthy as well IMHO.

Funny really - I'd moments before received a couple of boxes of ISOMS and my wife was watching me do the ritual verification of umm... *everything*.

She asked me numerous quesions - appearance, smell, construction, box codes, warranty seals etc. ( she's a scientist and loves data of all kinds).

Anyway mine checked out OK and had just lit one up (a partagas short) for final QA when I saw your post.

We both enjoyed the use of the party short as an an example as I was smoking one at the time so we could compare to the pics & comments.

My wife finished reading your post, had another puff of my cigar and noted "that needs to be a sticky".

Great info thanks again.

Bests

Jon


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## wij (May 25, 2006)

Great sleuthing. Thanks for the lesson professor!


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## pinoyman (Jan 28, 2005)

*WOW! Great post Amigo.*


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## Poriggity (Dec 8, 2005)

Very informative post!!
Scott


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## HeavySmoke (Apr 9, 2006)

Thank you for the great pictures and excellent post. Glad you finally posted again. I always look forward to them.

J


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## RPB67 (Mar 26, 2005)

Very well thought out Wilkey.

Thanks for the informative and great post


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## Navydoc (Jan 26, 2005)

montecristo#2 said:


> If they came from cuba, shouldn't they have a hologram on the box?


Negative ghostrider.....of course I have only purchased a *few* boxes in my time but I have yet to see an authentic box with the hologram....maybe some others have:2


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## Danbreeze (Jun 27, 2006)

Bump!

Excellent post Wilkey. To be honest with my limited cigar knowledge, I couldnt tell a fake from the real deal. Your crystal clear pics really illustrate the the little differences to look for. Keep up the good work


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## sekoudog (Oct 20, 2005)

3x5card said:


> Hi Todd,
> 
> Thanks for the kind words.
> 
> ...


I can appreciate the knowledge you have imparted, but I gotta bail on the Perla/MRN-esque photography dialogue.

Thanks


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

sekoudog said:


> I can appreciate the knowledge you have imparted, but I gotta bail on the Perla/MRN-esque photography dialogue.
> 
> Thanks


 I think he was just answering Todd's question as precisely as possible -- in the same manner he chooses to take photographs.


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## sekoudog (Oct 20, 2005)

It's tongue and cheek. Nothing serious. However, I would like to ask the question--how does one authentic vintage, pre-embargo, or pre-castro stogies?


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## HeavySmoke (Apr 9, 2006)

whiteboard said:


> I think he was just answering Todd's question as precisely as possible -- in the same manner he chooses to take photographs.


:tpd:

Wilkey is a very analytical guy by nature. That is just who he is. I have herfed with him several times and found out quick that he has knowledge. He isn't trying to be MRN-esqu or flashy. he is just being himself.:bx


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## sekoudog (Oct 20, 2005)

Let me get out my shears and nip this in the bud lest anyone think I was slighting Wilkey. My statement was meant as a joke.


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

sekoudog said:


> Let me get out my shears and nip this in the bud lest anyone think I was slighting Wilkey. My statement was meant as a joke.


 I should have figured as much!


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

HeavySmoke said:


> :tpd:
> 
> Wilkey is a very analytical guy by nature. That is just who he is. I have herfed with him several times and found out quick that he has knowledge. He isn't trying to be MRN-esqu or flashy. he is just being himself.:bx


Hey John,
Speaking of herfing, when are we hitting Deer Park again? :al

Sekoudog,
No harm, no foul. It's exactly as Hoyohio says. My style is my own and I certainly do not claim to be or aim to be another MRN. Perhaps the only thing we share in common is a curiosity about cigars and a desire to share what we know. That's all.

Wilkey


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## MoTheMan (May 24, 2003)

3x5card said:


> Their true origin is unknown. The _"I know a guy who brings these back from Cuba"_ source is never a good sign and the merchandise can range from authentic cigars to utter garbage made in the Dominican Republic or Little Havana.


That's why a lot of the FOG's recommend to buy only from trusted sources. There'll be no question of authenticity if the source is a reliable one.


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## luckybandit (Jul 9, 2006)

This was wonderful getting my feet wet i avoided the friend who new a friend who new a friend that could get a box for me as i was warned on this forum. I ordered as recommended from an overseas vendor as posted. i waited in anticipation almost say 10 days for my first box of isom's boli pcs. well worth the wait!

thanks to you all for helping me to be patient and not getting ripped off. This forum rocks!!

luckybandit


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## Ivory Tower (Nov 18, 2005)

There's only one, single source that I know of that sells cigars that look like that on the outside and inside. Somebody gave me some "PSD4s" and "Siglo VIs" and I was very suspicious on first impression. The wrappers did not appear to be like other Cuban wrappers. They looked very similar to the pictures above. The smell was okay, but not great. I cut one open and it was filled with scraps. A very singular coincident.


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## Lopez (Mar 14, 2006)

sekoudog said:


> It's tongue and cheek. Nothing serious. However, I would like to ask the question--how does one authentic vintage, pre-embargo, or pre-castro stogies?


Prolly easiest just to send them to me and I'll check them out and get back to you.:r


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## kjd2121 (Jul 13, 2006)

luckybandit said:


> This was wonderful getting my feet wet i avoided the friend who new a friend who new a friend that could get a box for me as i was warned on this forum. I ordered as recommended from an overseas vendor as posted. i waited in anticipation almost say 10 days for my first box of isom's boli pcs. well worth the wait!
> 
> thanks to you all for helping me to be patient and not getting ripped off. This forum rocks!!
> 
> luckybandit


Wow, how did such a newbie get a recommendation???


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