# Great cognac



## DonCarlos (Jul 22, 2008)

Hi 

I have a question for the cognac expert. 

I want to buy a really good cognac, but cant decide wich. The thing I like about good cognac is the creamy smoothness. I hate most vs and vsop. Im considdering Curvoisieur XO or Hennessy XO..

Any good advice?


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

How much are you looking to spend? I my opinion, Martell Cordon Bleu is the best but you will be very lucky if you can find it under $100.


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## DonCarlos (Jul 22, 2008)

my max is about 150usd. Wouldnt Martell XO be better?


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

I haven't had the XO yet but I must say the Cordon Bleu was wonderful.


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## piperman (Sep 8, 2005)

I drink Hennessy


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

IMHO he's right, the Cordon B is consistently a better buy. 

I hope this won't come off as rolling one down my nose. If you are learning about Cognacs (particularly), I would caution you to resist the temptation to systematically fall prey to terminology such as X.O. etc. 

Quite simplified but think of it this way, a poor blend (no matter the age & prestige of what brandies are in the blend) - is still a poor blend. 

No. I'm not suggesting Martell's X.O. consists of a sub-standard blend but I am basically trying to emphasize the point that X.O. (as well as other terms of endearment) do not automatically translate to better, even factoring out the the "taste is subjective" notion. 

Again - JMHO


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## Neuromancer (Sep 7, 2005)

Remy XO...:tu


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## robofan (Jun 7, 2008)




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## Neuromancer (Sep 7, 2005)

robofan said:


>


Heyyyy...if you wanna get fancy and start posting pics...


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## DonCarlos (Jul 22, 2008)

I think ill try the cordon bleu first, then buy a xo to see if its better, and later a hennessy xo. Its all about budget.


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

You will enjoy the Cordon Bleu. Keep us posted.


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## Blueface (May 28, 2005)

Neuromancer said:


> Heyyyy...if you wanna get fancy and start posting pics...


Remy XO.
My favorite.
Love going on cruises.
You get them for $75 a bottle v. $150 in the states.


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

DonCarlos said:


> I think ill try the cordon bleu first, then buy a xo to see if its better, and later a hennessy xo. *Its all about budget.*


Then, I'd also recommend looking at Cognac's older, often overlooked, relative - *Armagnac*. Your money could go a lot further.
:tu


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

Cognac Pierre Ferrand, they have been making this since 1702 and is made in France where all good wines and cognacs are made. Not saying that the above are not good cognacs, but this one blows my dress up! Way Up!


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## EastBay (Jun 2, 2008)

Avoid all the big houses, they are industrial producers.

Pierre Ferrand is a good start, as already pointed out. For the price you mentioned ($150 per) you can have pretty much any small house cognac made, and I can assure you that a "low end" small house bottle will easily beat any and all of the best big houses bottles (Martell, Remy, Hennesy, etc.).

Do a search for Leopold Gourmel cognacs, they are simply stupendous, even on the low end. Deret, another small house, is on par as well. If you spend $80-90 per bottle for a bottle of Gourmel or Deret I can assure you that no big house bottle will even come close at whatever price. Another old, small house producer is Delamaine, although pricier than these two based on the name recognition, but incredible as well. 

The common theme in all the small houses is that they do not use the "dumbed down" marketing scheme of VS/VSOP/XO desigantions, ALL of their bottles easily bypass the XO designation (6 years of aging) and usually start at 10 years of aging to begin with and rapidly escalate to 30 years of AVERAGE blend components. Thus, they use their own desigantions to mark the blends. Also, pay close attention to the color of what's in the bottle, any red color hint indicates artificial coloring added (all the big houses do that) while a true barrel aged cognac shows a light brown tint and usually the pale light brown, which is the true color as it should be (slow oxidation does that).

I stopped drinking industrial cognacs long time ago, I am sure that once you taste one of the labels I listed you will not look back, either.

Let me know your impressions if you decide to follow my advise.

Happy New Year!


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## DonCarlos (Jul 22, 2008)

Many good advices here! Thank you for all the feedback:tu


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## llatsni (Jan 3, 2009)

Cigary said:


> Cognac Pierre Ferrand, they have been making this since 1702 and is made in France where all good wines and cognacs are made. Not saying that the above are not good cognacs, but this one blows my dress up! Way Up!


Agreed!

BTW Cognac is a town in France (as is Armagnac) the spirit in question is called brandy if its not made in one of those towns! Both places are totally worth a visit if you happen to be wandering around the vineyards of western France! As is the wonderful town of Saint-Emilion; I got totally wasted on the wine samplers I was forced to drink there


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

llatsni said:


> Agreed!
> 
> BTW Cognac is a town in France (as is Armagnac)


This may be correct (cities), but I'm more familiar with Cognac & Armagnac referred to as "regions" or communities... or districts of France as opposed specific cities.



llatsni said:


> the spirit in question is called brandy if its not made in one of those towns!


If true, someone better notify the good folks in the Normandy production area. Seems they've been getting away with not settling for their produce being simplified in title as "_brandy_".


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## llatsni (Jan 3, 2009)

Chè said:


> This may be correct (cities), but I'm more familiar with Cognac & Armagnac referred to as "regions" or communities... or districts of France as opposed specific cities.
> 
> If true, someone better notify the good folks in the Normandy production area. Seems they've been getting away with not settling for their produce being simplified in title as "_brandy_".


I didn't intend to start an off topic debate, so, erm... apologies!
Suffice to say the region(s) are where the grapes are grown... some make it to the extended towns/cities of Cognac and Armagnac for the creation of their unique brandies; and yes, someone has notified the Normandy production - EU legislators!


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

llatsni said:


> Agreed!
> 
> BTW Cognac is a town in France (as is Armagnac) the spirit in question is called brandy *if its not made in one of those towns!*


JMHO. Sometimes a regular ole' water color brush is more practical than a paint roller. Example: Your description above leaves the regional brandy term, "Calvados" where?



llatsni said:


> and yes, someone has notified the Normandy production - EU legislators!


With respect to the mentioned regional term Calvados defying the qualifications of being either from Cognac or Armagnac (otherwise just Brandy), what exactly did the "EU legislators" rule & enforce?

Do tell.:cp


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## llatsni (Jan 3, 2009)

Ok you win.


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

I thought Calvados had to be made from apple juice exclusively?


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

mosesbotbol said:


> I thought Calvados had to be made from apple juice exclusively?


I could be wrong, but I think brandy made from pears may be categorized as "Calvados" as well, so long as produced with-in region.


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

*Calvados* Calvados is an apple brandy from the French région of Basse-Normandie or Lower Normandy.

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=gmail&q=define%3ACalvados


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

mosesbotbol = EU legislator? 

It never ceases to amaze me - the whole paint brush vs. paint roller analogy was obviously futile. I chose to ignore this before, but let's keep it accurate...


mosesbotbol said:


> I thought Calvados had to be *made from apple *juice *exclusively*?


False. "Exclusively", best describes the said thought or comment.



mosesbotbol said:


> *Calvados* Calvados is an apple brandy from the French région of Basse-Normandie or Lower Normandy.
> 
> http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=gmail&q=define%3ACalvados


Indeed it is. May I suggest using the same search engine to verify that Calvados is "exclusively" applied to apple brandy production? Surely you at least tried typing the combination of words "Calvados" & "Pear" in the search box before handing me my arse???

Doing so on google, I came across this quote with in the first page (of the first 10 shown pages filled with links):



> This means there are three types of Calvados, and the three AOC labels "describe" three distinct areas and three distinct traditions. "Calvados Pays d'Auge" originates in clayey limestone soils is the result of a double distillation. "Calvados Domfrontais" originates in granite soils that are damper and abound in pear trees. In the Domfront region these pear trees, often several centuries old, are as numerous as apple trees, which explains why brandy pears are present in larger quantities in the ciders destined for distilling - there is a minimum of 30% brandy pears in the must. "Calvados Domfrontais" is obtained by one distillation, using a patent still.


llatsni is right. We are drifting off the original course the ship was sailing. But, I wish to make clear, I'm only an outspoken passenger of the vessel. If you guys are going to educate us, please make the effort to check & present factual contents.

Beyond the obvious, the only thought that comes to mind is to inquire what type of toast one wants with that?


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## mosesbotbol (Sep 21, 2005)

Chè said:


> mosesbotbol = EU legislator?
> 
> Indeed it is. May I suggest using the same search engine to verify that Calvados is "exclusively" applied to apple brandy production? Surely you at least tried typing the combination of words "Calvados" & "Pear" in the search box before handing me my arse???


Not trying to hand you your arse or rain on your parade...

Yes, I stand corrected, and gladfully so. It is important to learn, and now we all know that Calvados can be either apple or pear.


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