# Why don't the top pipe companies make the best tobacco?



## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

You would think that the pipe companies that dominate the marketplace from entry-level briars to expensive ones would also make the best tobacco. So, with some exceptions, why do these companies either not put out any tobacco, or provide only lackluster offerings - like Stanwell and Savinelli? I mean, why shouldn't Stanwell make one of the world's best Virginia blends? wouldn't it only strengthen their overall reputation in the pipe world?

Dunhill would be another, though different, example. Even before their scarcity, the blends where highly touted as some of the best. So why in the world was that tobacco line ever sold out to another company by Dunhill? The flow of Dunhills briars never stopped. Can you imagine if they still made their blends in house?


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

Someone may have an answer for you that is based on facts and history. I don't. Since they would primarily be dealing with the exact same customer it should be a natural fit. However, companies close or sell off natural fit divisions and of the ones I have seen personally it was most often due to poor management.


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

I wouldn't think that would be the case at all. Even though both are parts of the hobby they're two totally different things IMO.


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## dmkerr (Oct 27, 2008)

First of all, I think it makes sense for a Danish company (Stanwell) to make Danish-style tobaccos, which they do.

I have no clue about Savinelli! :mrgreen:

But as Hatter said, they're two very different things, pipes and tobaccos. Same with cars and tires.


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

Mad Hatter said:


> I wouldn't think that would be the case at all. Even though both are parts of the hobby they're two totally different things IMO.


They are two different things but selling additional products and services to a pre-existing customer base should cost less than someone who specializes so it would mean more profit. The question is whether or not they can get all the necessary talent to pull it off.


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## ChronoB (Nov 4, 2007)

drastic_quench said:


> You would think that the pipe companies that dominate the marketplace from entry-level briars to expensive ones would also make the best tobacco. So, with some exceptions, why do these companies either not put out any tobacco, or provide only lackluster offerings - like Stanwell and Savinelli? I mean, why shouldn't Stanwell make one of the world's best Virginia blends? wouldn't it only strengthen their overall reputation in the pipe world?
> 
> Dunhill would be another, though different, example. Even before their scarcity, the blends where highly touted as some of the best. So why in the world was that tobacco line ever sold out to another company by Dunhill? The flow of Dunhills briars never stopped. Can you imagine if they still made their blends in house?


The simple answer is that I'm sure they would if it made financial sense. I suspect the level of profitability is different between pipes and tobacco. In Dunhill's case, they haven't made their own tobacco for a long time. Murray's made it for decades and now Orlilk does. I suspect if it was more profitable to run your own blending business Dunhill would not have contracted it out all those years ago. Don't forget that the big pipe producers like Stanwell and Savinelli make their bacon off of the lower end pipe market, even if they have some high end lines. If you're Dunhill or Castello it makes more sense to offer a premium pipe tobacco product. If you're Savinelli you just need to get your name on some tins because some people will naturally buy it along with one of your pipes.

One other thing is that pipe making can very mechanized to a far greater degree than tobacco blending. There are only so many skilled tobacco blenders in the world, and they already have jobs. So, if you want something really good you'll have to contract it from a premier blender, and they don't want to help Savinelli or Stanwell draw away their business. Like I said, I'm sure if it was financially prudent to offer really good tobaccos those companies would already do it.

I guess Peterson makes money offering well-liked tobaccos. Folks around here seem to really like some of their stuff. Does anyone know if it is actually blended and packaged by Peterson, or does some other company do it for them? I haven't had any tobacco from Peterson, Stanwell, or Savinelli.

Now that Greg Pease has joined the forum perhaps he'll see this and offer some info on how the business works.


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## Jack Straw (Nov 20, 2008)

Peterson tobacco manages to do a good job of it, and they are wildly popular as well - they seem to sell out at online retailers faster than anything but stonehaven. They are the second most common tinned tobacco that I have seen in B&Ms, after MacBaren, in places that don't stock a lot of brands. And I bet at least part of this is because they have the name recognition. Their tobacco is also just great, they are one of my personal favorite blenders. Of course that aspect is a matter of taste.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

The companies that make the best televisions and DVD players don't make the best shows or movies. Why don't Toyota, Dodge, etc., make gasoline or tires?? Kitchen appliance makers don't make foods ...... Seems to be a recurring theme .....

Manufacturing is a specialized field and such specialization is expensive. Once the pipe makers has the craftsmen and tools to find, cure, carve and finish fine briars, absolutely none of that translates to growing, drying, curing, aging, blending, packaging and marketing the tobacco. Pipe tobacco like cigars is much more labor intensive than cigarettes so it has less profit margin, regardless that neither is as widely used.


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## Brinson (Oct 28, 2007)

I imagine the profit margins for running a pipe company are alot better than running a tobacco company.

Edit: Didn't read the thread before posting, looks like ChronoB said this and more. My theory is that while you can sell a pipe at MANY imes the cost of the physical material because of skilled labor and reputation, you won't often be able to do that with tobacco. I mean, you have $20 and $600 briar pipes, which is 30 times the cost of the low end. A pound of the cheapest bulk toboaccos is like $30, but you won't see any selling at 30 times that.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

All sensible reasons, really. 

But man, you would think that if you made two products, one which people cared for and tried to keep for a lifetime of service, and the other product THEY BURNED, wouldn't the one they burn up make you more money. Again, for the difference in labor costs, perhaps not. But you'd think so. At least I did.

Peterson, was my one big exception here. Though my Peterson tins do say something like "made for Peterson's of Dublin" just not my who.


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

plexiprs said:


> The companies that make the best televisions and DVD players don't make the best shows or movies. Why don't Toyota, Dodge, etc., make gasoline or tires?? Kitchen appliance makers don't make foods ...... Seems to be a recurring theme .....
> 
> Manufacturing is a specialized field and such specialization is expensive. Once the pipe makers has the craftsmen and tools to find, cure, carve and finish fine briars, absolutely none of that translates to growing, drying, curing, aging, blending, packaging and marketing the tobacco. Pipe tobacco like cigars is much more labor intensive than cigarettes so it has less profit margin, regardless that neither is as widely used.


HP sells printers and toner and paper
Duracell sells flashlights and batteries
Kodak sells cameras and film
Uhaul will rent you a truck and sell you uhaul boxes to pack your stuff
Zippo sells lighters and lighter fluid
Disney sells vacations and makes movies among gazillion other things

It is not uncommon for a single entity to have multiple very diverse offerings if the customer base is the same. HP wants Staples to have as many of their products as possible because it makes distribution cheaper. Since tobacco and pipes are very often both sold by the same outlets it is a fair question.

If pipe tobacco didn't turn a decent profit everyone would stop selling it.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

Rascal said:


> HP *sells*
> Duracell *sells*
> Kodak *sells*
> Uhaul will rent you a truck and sell you uhaul boxes to pack your stuff
> ...


Too bad that selling does not equal manufacture or make as the thread's OP actually asked.

HP's name is on the ink cartridges but they are made for them. Kodak sells mainly digital cameras and when film was king, made no professional cameras just throw away junk. U-haul doesn't make those trucks or the boxes, just ask them. They buy them and rebrand them. Find me the Uhaul box and truck factory, you'll fail.

Disney ??? Great example of a manufacturer ..... You forgot Sony who has their name on all sorts of things, but what of theirs do they actually make?? You forgot Wal-Mart as well, another recognized seller, with their name on lots of stuff, but do they actually *MAKE* anything??

Doesn't provide any rationale to answer the question at hand. Your first answer was your best and we'll just stick with that as your expertise, ok?



Rascal said:


> Someone may have an answer for you that is based on facts and history. I don't.


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

plexiprs said:


> Too bad that selling does not equal manufacture or make as the thread's OP actually asked.
> 
> HP's name is on the ink cartridges but they are made for them. Kodak sells mainly digital cameras and when film was king, made no professional cameras just throw away junk. U-haul doesn't make those trucks or the boxes, just ask them. They buy them and rebrand them. Find me the Uhaul box and truck factory, you'll fail.
> 
> ...


Have I done something to you to make you especially nasty towards me?


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

No nastiness, just a message and example. You seem to like to give people crap for their posts. We've watched you do it and then dodge when they ask why you took offense. Hmmm ...... Perhaps getting the same back can provide some perspective. Maybe .... ? Your _expertise_ is a self-annointed delusion, unacknowledged here and as demonstrated so far; totally unearned. You do seem to totally enjoy "hearing" your own voice; but your are a minority of one in that respect.

Being a member for barely a month means you _might_ try too hard. Don't fall into that trap. Be yourself. Even if your are a prick, eventually everyone will come to understand what you really are. If it bothers you that much take action, make adjustments; adapt. If you are too full of yourself to see the image that others are seeing, well, new members come and new members go. All things are impermanent, all things change, all things die and decay.

If that offends or upsets you then get over it. No one cares, its just an other Internet forum, you are just another newbie; so far.


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## presidentbryce (Oct 9, 2008)

Why don't Ford and Chevy get into the gasoline business? Even though it seems related, the production of a product and the consumable it uses can be a totally different industry. Often the company just gives their name to a subcontractor who may or may not make a good product. You can buy HP paper, but they are know for their computers and printers.


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## Requiem (Dec 6, 2008)

At least in Europe, tobacco brands are almost all being produced by Orlik and Kolhause & Kopp, using several brand names and recipies.
I believe it's about the pre-blended tobaccos price (and even availabilty). As said, the profit margin for blending companies is probably not very high, and buying larger quantities should make a good difference.

Take a look at this interview with Russ Ouellette (blender from pipesandcigars) and notice on how hard it is to get some tobaccos.
Russ Ouellette Tobacco Blender Interview | With Pipe and Pen


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## Diodon nepheligina (Nov 5, 2009)

drastic_quench said:


> You would think that the pipe companies that dominate the marketplace from entry-level briars to expensive ones would also make the best tobacco. So, with some exceptions, why do these companies either not put out any tobacco, or provide only lackluster offerings - like Stanwell and Savinelli? I mean, why shouldn't Stanwell make one of the world's best Virginia blends? wouldn't it only strengthen their overall reputation in the pipe world?
> 
> Dunhill would be another, though different, example. Even before their scarcity, the blends where highly touted as some of the best. So why in the world was that tobacco line ever sold out to another company by Dunhill? The flow of Dunhills briars never stopped. Can you imagine if they still made their blends in house?


I have often wondered about those tobaccos with the pipe makers names on them. Every time I get on the tinned tobacco page at pipesandcigars, I see 'em and wonder if they are any good. Peterson and Dunhill seem to have established solid reputations and have lots of fans. The ones I wonder about are the likes of Bjarne, Comoy, Chonowitch, Savinelli, and Stanwell...:noidea:


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

plexiprs said:


> No nastiness, just a message and example. You seem to like to give people crap for their posts. We've watched you do it and then dodge when they ask why you took offense. Hmmm ...... Perhaps getting the same back can provide some perspective. Maybe .... ? Your _expertise_ is a self-annointed delusion, unacknowledged here and as demonstrated so far; totally unearned. You do seem to totally enjoy "hearing" your own voice; but your are a minority of one in that respect.
> 
> Being a member for barely a month means you _might_ try too hard. Don't fall into that trap. Be yourself. Even if your are a prick, eventually everyone will come to understand what you really are. If it bothers you that much take action, make adjustments; adapt. If you are too full of yourself to see the image that others are seeing, well, new members come and new members go. All things are impermanent, all things change, all things die and decay.
> 
> If that offends or upsets you then get over it. No one cares, its just an other Internet forum, you are just another newbie; so far.


So the answer is I haven't done anything to you. I will take all of your notes into consideration and perhaps you might consider being a little less abrasive when you feel the need to correct new people. I get the newbies can be annoying but the junkyard dog approach might run someone off that could have later been a good contributor to various discussions. It'd never work on me though.

I would not have even registered here had it not been for that blasted video that annoyed the crap out of me when I was trying to look up something on this board. After I did, I figured I would jump in. Not every newbie is going to be meek and nervous to post. If that upsets or offends you... :wink:

I think it takes time for everyone to figure everyone out. I fully understand and expect a few bumps in the road along the way... assuming I stay.


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## GuitarDan (Nov 26, 2009)

CAT FIGHT!!!! woo-woo!

(sorry couldn't resist) 

~ ~ p
*8^"`)= <-turn you head sideways; it's me smoking a nose-warmer while wearing a turtleneck sweater!

Anyway, most companies in niche markets stick with what has worked for them in the past. In uncertain times like this many businesses try to minimize personnel and other types of overhead. 

Some folks- Stanwell and Savinelli come to mind (don't flog me if I'm mistaken) market their own tobacco- blended by dedicated tobacco businesses to try and piggyback distribution and customer loyalty.

With the changing political (taxation) situation globally over the last decade, as well as the massive decline of pipesmokers over the last 70 years; I'm surprised that we're not down to 2-3 blenders like Middleton or CAO/Dan Tobacco and a Chinese outfit or two making EVERYTHING...

Hats off to those folks that give it a go!


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

Rascal said:


> They are two different things but selling additional products and services to a pre-existing customer base should cost less than someone who specializes so it would mean more profit. The question is whether or not they can get all the necessary talent to pull it off.


Well obviously there is some reason for what is the normal separation of pipe making/tobacco production. What ever it is I'm sure its not because no one ever thought of it. Matter of fact, I'd say to go a little further, most of the companies who do market a token tobacco or two have nothing to do with its production, with the exception of slapping their label on it. Also as I understand it, some pipe marketers are only partially involved in the manufacture of their own pipes.


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

Mad Hatter said:


> Well obviously there is some reason for what is the normal separation of pipe making/tobacco production. What ever it is I'm sure its not because no one ever thought of it. Matter of fact, I'd say to go a little further, most of the companies who do market a token tobacco or two have nothing to do with its production, with the exception of slapping their label on it. Also as I understand it, some pipe marketers are only partially involved in the manufacture of their own pipes.


But that label slapping is a powerful thing. The question then is why is there not more of it?

I think the answer is the market can't handle more competition. If a tobacco company agreed to produce blends for a pipe company they would have to do so at a discounted price otherwise the pipe maker couldn't sell it. Normally moving inventory and increasing your own buying power are reasons you might do this but in a dwindling market you could be putting yourself out of business.

If this is true for branding it is even a worse idea to try and do it yourself now.

Oh and there are still large corporations that have manufacturering subsidiaries that produce diverse products. I was providing examples of companies that do more than one thing that are unique. Disney running a theme park and making movies have nothing to do with each other.


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

:yo:


Rascal said:


> I think it takes time for everyone to figure everyone out. I fully understand and expect a few bumps in the road along the way... assuming I stay.


Don't hurt yourself or do anything out of your true character for me or anyone else. Abrasives are an international, multi-million dollar industry, by the way! !:hug: Seems the do work!! ray2:

Stay don't stay. _We_ were here before you arrived and _we_ will be here after XXXXX leaves ...... :smoke: Now, shut up and pass the damn tin around, again!! 

PS: I much prefer when a _pipe_ manufacturer focuses on that given gift and talent and leaves the creation of masterful tasty blends to the master tasty blenders ...... Otherwise, we should all just buy raw blending components and all make our own mixtures!!! :croc:


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## Mad Hatter (Apr 8, 2007)

Rascal said:


> But that label slapping is a powerful thing. The question then is why is there not more of it?
> 
> I think the answer is the market can't handle more competition. If a tobacco company agreed to produce blends for a pipe company they would have to do so at a discounted price otherwise the pipe maker couldn't sell it. Normally moving inventory and increasing your own buying power are reasons you might do this but in a dwindling market you could be putting yourself out of business.
> 
> ...


Pipe making and pipe tobacco are a niche market. I'm just gonna pretend I live in a nice happy world where no one in the business wants to step on anyone else's toes. Thats answer enough for me to a question I could really care less about :hug:


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

plexiprs said:


> :yo:
> 
> Don't hurt yourself or do anything out of your true character for me or anyone else. Abrasives are an international, multi-million dollar industry, by the way! !:hug: Seems the do work!! ray2:
> 
> Stay don't stay. _We_ were here before you arrived and _we_ will be here after XXXXX leaves ...... :smoke: Now, shut up and pass the damn tin around, again!!


I don't think you get it because you are telling me not to change. That wasn't going to happen. Please read this post in a polite voice because that is how it is intended.

Just like I am new to you, you are new to me. Being a long time member with a pile of posts doesn't grant you any credentials or immediate respect. If you modified your initial approach you stand a better chance at offering an opinion that has value. You are only going to get 1 of 3 responses as it is 1) People will think this place is full of rude people and leave 2) People will ignore you or 3) People will laugh at you.

I was laughing at you. I found it deeply amusing that you were trying to school me. If I stay, I will probably like you. I just haven't decided whether or not this place is worth my time yet. I have learned some new things so that has you guys in the plus column right now. I know you are relieved to know you are passing my test so far... :wink:


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

Rascal said:


> I was laughing at you. I found it deeply amusing that you were trying to school me. If I stay, I will probably like you.


Funny, I bet many members were, and are, laughing and at you as well. Stay or go, what matters it to me; not one bit. One month a member and telling others what to do, and how inexperienced they are compared to you, and how to behave. Have another _Rookie_ ... :drinking:

Schooling wasn't the point, I don't care that much about you to waste that amount of energy. Sad, but I'm betting you don't last two more months .... Ta Ta !! Fit in or fit out, totally _*your*_ choice ...

PS: Around here, a "pile of posts" is over 5,000. But we can't expect you, as an _expert_ to be bothered with facts or simple research .... 800+ posts is a pile now!!!


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## Rascal (Jan 29, 2010)

plexiprs said:


> Funny, I bet many members were, and are, laughing and at you as well. Stay or go, what matters it to me; not one bit. One month a member and telling others what to do, and how inexperienced they are compared to you, and how to behave. Have another _Rookie_ ... :drinking:
> 
> Schooling wasn't the point, I don't care that much about you to waste that amount of energy. Sad, but I'm betting you don't last two more months .... Ta Ta !! Fit in or fit out, totally _*your*_ choice ...
> 
> PS: Around here, a "pile of posts" is over 5,000. But we can't expect you, as an _expert_ to be bothered with facts or simple research .... 800+ posts is a pile now!!!


You get away with treating newbies like dirt so I figure the bar for fitting in is set pretty low.

LOL at doing board research and knowing board facts. I am getting a definite Dwight Schrute vibe off of you. How do you feel about beets?


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## ChronoB (Nov 4, 2007)

plexiprs said:


> PS: Around here, a "pile of posts" is over 5,000. But we can't expect you, as an _expert_ to be bothered with facts or simple research .... 800+ posts is a pile now!!!


The thread is way off topic, but I have to make a comment. I take offense to the idea that until you've amassed hundreds of posts you some how are inferior to other posters. That's like assuming no one young has wisdom, and that just because someone is old they must be wise. :der:



> Stay don't stay. _We_ were here before you arrived and _we_ will be here after XXXXX leaves


Way to foster new membership in the forum and help bolster the pipe community. :tsk:


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## GuitarDan (Nov 26, 2009)

Somebody give those two some sticks with nails- this is going to be gooooood!


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## plexiprs (Nov 18, 2005)

GuitarDan said:


> Somebody give those two some sticks with nails- this is going to be gooooood!


Nope, I'm out. You can tag in for me, if you'd like


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## GuitarDan (Nov 26, 2009)

Nah... I'm still recovering from the ebay pricing carnage.


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## juni (Oct 16, 2009)

To derail back to the question: I got the impression that Peterson used to make their own tobacco but has since then delegated it somewhere else so the tins say "Made for Peterson...". I read at tobaccoreviews a review where someone said that Irish Flake used to be "better" when Peterson made it.

Edit: here is part of the review (by Captain pete): "...When Murray's in Belfast closed their doors, we all shed tears for the demise of the Irish tradition of tobacco production. The tobacco blends that were created in Belfast included Erinmore Flake, Peterson's tobacco products, and many Dunhill blends"


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## GuitarDan (Nov 26, 2009)

Sorry for the digression. 
The short answer is because the company hasn't found a way to make it a reliable source of profit.


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## Mister Entertainer (Oct 7, 2009)

ChronoB said:


> The thread is way off topic, but I have to make a comment. I take offense to the idea that until you've amassed hundreds of posts you some how are inferior to other posters. That's like assuming no one young has wisdom, and that just because someone is old they must be wise. :der:
> 
> Way to foster new membership in the forum and help bolster the pipe community. :tsk:


Well put my friend. And I think to attempt to answer the original question of this thread: Its all about monies. If a big company doesn't think it can make a big profit off of something, then why risk it. But if they think they can, i.e. Peterson, then they will give it a shot. Granted I think that it would be easier for a big name pipe company to sell tobacco as well due to the name recognition, that same company might not want to drop a boatload of startup monies to begin producing tobacco. What do I know.... :|


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## dmkerr (Oct 27, 2008)

Mister Entertainer said:


> And I think to attempt to answer the original question of this thread: Its all about monies. If a big company doesn't think it can make a big profit off of something, then why risk it. But if they think they can, i.e. Peterson, then they will give it a shot. Granted I think that it would be easier for a big name pipe company to sell tobacco as well due to the name recognition, that same company might not want to drop a boatload of startup monies to begin producing tobacco. What do I know.... :|


If you ever get to one of the big pipe shows, talk to the folks from McClellands tobacco about what goes into starting a pipe tobacco company. I was amazed! It's a lot of work and requires a dedication to craft that I'm not sure the major pipe companies can afford to expend. Granted, McClellands is a little more involved in the tobacco from plant to tin than most of the others but the idea is the same. I truly had no idea how hard it was to make and sell pipe tobacco.


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## Mister Entertainer (Oct 7, 2009)

dmkerr said:


> If you ever get to one of the big pipe shows, talk to the folks from McClellands tobacco about what goes into starting a pipe tobacco company. I was amazed! It's a lot of work and requires a dedication to craft that I'm not sure the major pipe companies can afford to expend. Granted, McClellands is a little more involved in the tobacco from plant to tin than most of the others but the idea is the same. I truly had no idea how hard it was to make and sell pipe tobacco.


That makes a lot of sense. I was trying to say something like that in my last post but I probably failed. Thank you dmkerr for being more eloquent than I :nod: Producing pipe tobacco isn't as easy as producing something like canned corn... just a guess though.


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## PipeDreams (Mar 3, 2010)

I am new to this ocean as they say, but regarding the question about pipe makers making or offering tobacco, I'm sure you're aware that some do. Lane, for example, makes pipes and of course Captain Black tobacco. Granted these are both very inexpensive, but I would think the same would or should hold true for more expensive brands of both pipes and tobacco. The only difference might be that a more expensive, known line of either has more at risk when they venture into new territory. But if you like a certain line of pipes, would you stop buying them if that company's tobacco wasn't up to snuff? Hardly.


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## indigosmoke (Sep 1, 2009)

Welcome Lanie!


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## dmkerr (Oct 27, 2008)

Mister Entertainer said:


> That makes a lot of sense. I was trying to say something like that in my last post but I probably failed. Thank you dmkerr for being more eloquent than I :nod: Producing pipe tobacco isn't as easy as producing something like canned corn... just a guess though.


Correct. Corn is pretty stable from year to year with respect to taste... or at least, the differences aren't enough for the average consumer to complain about. Tobacco changes, and sometimes drastically, depending on multiple factors. Keeping the flavor consistent is a huge challenge. It's a tough business, and that's without all the heavy taxation and government intervention.


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## drastic_quench (Sep 12, 2008)

dmkerr said:


> Correct. Corn is pretty stable from year to year with respect to taste... or at least, the differences aren't enough for the average consumer to complain about. Tobacco changes, and sometimes drastically, depending on multiple factors. Keeping the flavor consistent is a huge challenge. It's a tough business, and that's without all the heavy taxation and government intervention.


Yes. It's my understanding that the crop from one year is blended with past years' crop before it is used to make a blend. This way, uniformity from year to year is a little easier to attain.


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## dmkerr (Oct 27, 2008)

drastic_quench said:


> Yes. It's my understanding that the crop from one year is blended with past years' crop before it is used to make a blend. This way, uniformity from year to year is a little easier to attain.


You are correct, Quencher. Interestingly, McClellands (and I think McCranie's) makes a blend that is simply one crop - the various Christmas Cheer's. This is their marque for blends that are consistent within the year that is noted but inconsistent from year to year. In other words, 1999 doesn't taste like 2000, and so on. It's an interesting experiment. It fails with me, though. I refuse to buy any Christmas Cheer. I'll find a year I like and then it'll all be gone, never to return again. I have enough faves that are out of production already, thanks.


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## Alpedhuez55 (Dec 16, 2005)

I would not be surprised it there were regulatory issues involved as well. Anyone can pretty much make a pipe and sell it. But Tobacco is heavily regulated by most governments. So if a company does want to market their own blends, it is probably just easier for them to source it to a business that already does so rather than to have to cut through the red tape themselves. 

One other idea may be that if they have a blend people do not like, then it could reflect poorly on their pipes. In general, a good pipe is a good pipe. But blends are subjective. For example, I think all Peterson's Aromatics are crap. I have had a couple of non aromatics like University Flake that I like, but for the most part, when I think of Peterson, I think of tounge roasting aromatics. I see a big display of Peterson Tobaccos, I generally ignore it. And probably in part to my negative experiences with their tobaccos, I do not hold their pipes in high regard.


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