# Machine made cubans?!?



## dylanh (Aug 3, 2004)

How do machine rolled cubans stack up to non-cuban hand made cigars? I don't have a great deal of experience but I haven't had the dominican or nicaraguan cigar that compares to the cubans I've had. Just wondering about the amazingly cheap machine rolled cubans. Are they worth it for an average, every day sort of smoke?

-dylan


----------



## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

i've said it a few hundred times, i'm sure.

i'd take a cheapy Quintero over ANY non-cuban cigar i've ever had.

now, these cheapy Jose L Piedra Conservas i just got a few 5 packs of, they're not that great. i'm not a fan of short filler... but they are still a lot better than most non-cubans i've had, and you can find them for around $2/stick (when you buy a bundle).

i don't recall if the Fonseca Delicias are MM or not, but i've had a couple that were damn good.

here in a few days i'm going to order me a few different boxes of cheapies. not exactly sure which ones yet....


----------



## ronin (Dec 10, 2003)

An excellent MM to try for an everyday smoke is the Upmann Regalia


----------



## DocRKS (Aug 8, 2004)

La Flor de Cano "Predilectos" - wrapped in Cedar and packed in an aluminum tube ---Absolutely a DELICIOUS Cigar and all that flavor and great smoking experience comes at a GREAT price..

I second the suggestion for you to try the H. Upmann "Regalias" --there is nothing cheap or MM tasting about these Petit Coronas (5 1/8 X 42). An Outstanding cigar.


----------



## MoTheMan (May 24, 2003)

DocRKS said:


> La Flor de Cano "Predilectos" - wrapped in Cedar and packed in an aluminum tube ---Absolutely a DELICIOUS Cigar and all that flavor and great smoking experience comes at a GREAT price..


Mmm!! Yum, yum. :w


----------



## ricmac25 (May 13, 2003)

I'm a huge fan of both the Quinteros and Piedras. I prefer the Quinteros though.


----------



## ilikecigars (Mar 24, 2003)

la flor da canos ? guess i gots to try me one of them..


----------



## DocRKS (Aug 8, 2004)

Bro. Tim,

I'm on the Island later this week ---I'll bring one over for you.


----------



## jb- (Jul 27, 2004)

Let me throw out a vote for Raphael Gonzales Panatela Extra. Another inexpensive Cuban, ~$50 for 25. I've been told that these are not MM but instead hecho a mano. Still a nice inexpensive habano.

And IHT is right. I'd take a MM habano over a domestic any day.


----------



## hogg (Oct 13, 2003)

jb- said:


> Let me throw out a vote for Raphael Gonzales Panatela Extra. Another inexpensive Cuban, ~$50 for 25. I've been told that these are not MM but instead hecho a mano. Still a nice inexpensive habano.
> 
> And IHT is right. I'd take a MM habano over a domestic any day.


I believe they are hand finished, but I don't pay enough attention. Smoke them over most domestics and love the way MM never turn bitter and relight incredibly well, making them perfect for running around smokes. I nub these more than any other cigar right now. Next on my list is Por Larranaga panatela...


----------



## Herfzilla (Aug 9, 2004)

These are 3 cuban machine mades that I really enjoy:

Ramon Allones Mille Fleur (last box was ECA CCUG);
Por Larranaga Lolas en Cedro (EAR NOV 01); and 
Partagas Super Partagas (LOC OCT 00).

I find the MM's to have a good, straight cuban tobacco taste, but they are not as complex as a good handrolled longfiller habano. In other words, don't look for a big development in the flavor as you smoke them. They pretty much stay the same start to finish.


----------



## coppertop (Dec 29, 2003)

Yeah I have a box of Quinteros that are great everday or hand out to friends smokes. The PL Pantelas are another good cheapie. I'll have to check out some of the other suggestions. But like IHT said, I'll take a MM over a domestic anytime.


----------



## okie2 (Mar 16, 2003)

I'm in the other camp.

I've tried many MMs. I prefer a couple of Hondurans over the MMs. Cost is similar, but the flavor and complexity is much more satisfying.


----------



## funnybunny (Aug 10, 2004)

I smoked a Troya last night, one of my go-to weekday smokes, and it was very nice. Nice, smooth flavor. My only beef with it is that after about half of it is smoked, I end up with little mouthfuls of tobacco after every draw. There seems to be no help for that. At least nothing that I have done has worked. Still, the flavor was lovely.


----------



## Fredster (Jan 26, 2004)

IHT said:


> i've said it a few hundred times, i'm sure.
> 
> i'd take a cheapy Quintero over ANY non-cuban cigar i've ever had.
> 
> ...


I don't think there are any domestics in the same price range as the Cuban MM cigars that are even worth smoking. I mean a 2 or 3 $ domestic is going to be crap. 
There's probably no Domestics that cost the same as a Quintero that are even worth smoking. However to say a Quintero is better than any Domestic is a bit of a stretch. Some of the Opus's and Padrons I've smoked are nice cigars, and I would take over a MM Cuban anyday. Do I think they are better than the best Cubans? Hell no, and often they cost twice as much.
MM Cubans are fine for beginners, but after tasting whats out there, I don't see why anyone would smoke them. I think it was Poker that said "life is too short to smoke crappy cigars." I couldn't agree more. If money is an issue, I would rather smoke 1-2 Monte #2's a week than 1-2 MM's a day. For just a little more there are some nice small HM smokes out there that rock. I think someone already said it, but they just don't have any complexity. It's the same taste start to finish. The short filler does tend to end up in your mouth also.


----------



## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

but for those of us without kickass jobs and tight budgets who have to take money from what they get paid to eat on when out of town on business trips and a bit of their overtime, machine mades are great.

as someone said, they don't cost but about $2-4 per cigar, and they taste a lot better than non-cubans that cost 2-3 times as much.

the ashton cabinet i just had was nice... but i still would've preferred a Quintero or even the JLP Conservas...

now, if only smoking 2 cigars a week were what i did, then i don't think i'd have a problem smoking hand rolled cigars only. i'd probably still run out of them very quickly, but i smoke about 1 cigar a day... the machine mades are great when you don't have much time but want a cigar pretty bad.

also, i'm planning on building up my stock pretty soon, and i want to smoke some cheapy machine mades to allow my hand rolled cigar to age a little bit. i don't want to get a box of <whatever> in and just smoke 'em all within a month. so, my next purchase is going to be some fonsecas, a box of the La flor de Cano's you guys were talking about, and a box of HdM hand rolled (du Gourmet). i'll probably smoke the fonsecas, the LFdCs and my JLPs while i let the few other hand rolled and my new HdMs mature a little bit. then next month, i'll probably get another box of fonsecas or something else, and a more expensive box of something else i've been wanting... and in a few months, i think i'll have enough MMs (or cheaper smokes) to last me until my others start coming around...

at least, that's my plan.


----------



## Fredster (Jan 26, 2004)

IHT said:


> but for those of us without kickass jobs and tight budgets who have to take money from what they get paid to eat on when out of town on business trips and a bit of their overtime, machine mades are great.
> 
> as someone said, they don't cost but about $2-4 per cigar, and they taste a lot better than non-cubans that cost 2-3 times as much.
> 
> ...


Sounds like a good plan. I don't know about 2 dollars, but when you get in the 4 dollar range you find some killer HM Cubans, if you shop around. Such as Bolivar CJ,Bolivar petit,Cuaba Divinos,petit Upmanns, and Partagas shorts. I'm making about 3 times what I did when I first started smoking Cubans 8 yrs ago, and I'm still smoking pretty much the same cigars. Only difference is I smoke more of them and I have enough $ to stock up and age cigars. I just couldn't smoke a MM after smoking some of Cubas finest. If you enjoy them, then thats all that matters.


----------



## WACigar (Feb 17, 2003)

This topic raises an interesting issue to me. If you smoke a machine made cigar, something that is of inferior quality, it seems you are smoking a cigar just for the sake of smoking a cigar. Why smoke a cigar if you can't smoke a high quality, complex, great tasting, hand made cigar every time? As stated earlier: "Life is too short to smoke crappy cigars." I am not rich so, rather than waste my time on inferior cigars, I spend my hard earned money on 1-2 high quality cigars a week. It seems to me that if you smoke anything less than the best, you are not doing it for the cigar; rather, you are smoking because you need a smoke. My question is this: regardless of income, why smoke anything but the best even if it means limiting the number of cigars you smoke?


----------



## Fredster (Jan 26, 2004)

WACigar said:


> This topic raises an interesting issue to me. If you smoke a machine made cigar, something that is of inferior quality, it seems you are smoking a cigar just for the sake of smoking a cigar. Why smoke a cigar if you can't smoke a high quality, complex, great tasting, hand made cigar every time? As stated earlier: "Life is too short to smoke crappy cigars." I am not rich so, rather than waste my time on inferior cigars, I spend my hard earned money on 1-2 high quality cigars a week. It seems to me that if you smoke anything less than the best, you are not doing it for the cigar; rather, you are smoking because you need a smoke. My question is this: regardless of income, why smoke anything but the best even if it means limiting the number of cigars you smoke?


Amen brother, your preaching to the choir. I mean if your budget is $30.00 a week, I would rather smoke a couple Monte #2's (9.00 ea in from Spain) And a couple Partagas shorts (5.00ea) per week, rather than smoking 2 MM cigars a day. If you don't really say wow after smoking a cigar, what the hells the use. There is also the health issue that I've never seen anyone here talk about. It's probably got to due with genetics and luck of the draw whether or not you have health issues ( cancer, etc) smoking cigars. The more you smoke the more your chances of having a problem go up. If I'm going to roll the dice and smoke cigars it's going to be ones that I thoroughly enjoy. I think quality over quantity makes more sense reguardless of income, but like I said before if you enjoy them, thats all that matters.


----------



## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

WACigar said:


> If you smoke a machine made cigar, something that is of inferior quality, it seems you are smoking a cigar just for the sake of smoking a cigar. Why smoke a cigar if you can't smoke a high quality, complex, great tasting, hand made cigar every time?


i didn't know cuban tobacco was inferior? and i'm not smoking just to "smoke", i never said i didn't enjoy those cigars, because i do enjoy them a lot more than non-cubans that are twice the price (just more available). the machine mades i've had taste great, may not be complex, but they still taste great to me.

so, if you had time to smoke a cigar, your buddy comes over and wants to have a cigar as well, and you don't want to smoke one of your "aging" ELs or a big ol' double corona (or your last PSD4/JL #2/MC #3), would you grab a machine made that's still a 45 minute smoke that you'll get plenty of enjoyment out of??

i would, and i do.


----------



## WACigar (Feb 17, 2003)

Just to be clear, I wasn't callilng Cuban tobacco inferior, I was calling Cuban machine made cigars inferior to Cuban hand made cigars. I assume most people agree with this. If not, the point is moot. 

As to your question, if my buddy came over and wanted to smoke a cigar, I would smoke my normal stash. That might mean I can't afford to smoke another cigar for a week or two, but I'm willing to make that trade to ensure every smoke is top notch.


----------



## Fredster (Jan 26, 2004)

Dylans original post here was, how do the MM Cubans stack up against non-Cuban Hand mades? Dollar for dollar a Cuban MM will be better than any Domestic handmade comparably priced, IMO. Some of the expensive Domestic sticks are going to better than a Cuban MM though. I'd take an Opus X over a MM Cuban anyday.

Second question was ,are they woth it for a cheap everyday smoke? Not to me, but I'm not saying my way is wrong or right, Just giving my opinion after smoking mainly Cubans for the last 8 years. For a few $ more you can have a small HM Cuban that is much better. Yes MM Cuban tobacco is inferior shortfiller tobacco. The good stuff gets used in the HM smokes. Like I said ,if I only had 15 or 20 bucks a week to spend on cigars, it would be on 2 or 3 of Cubas finest, not 8-10 MM smokes..

It wouldn't be a bad idea to keep some around if you have friends that aren't that cigar savy and tend to mooch a lot.  
Seriously though, the guys I hang out with aren't as into cigars as I am, but I would still give them a good smoke. If they come over and didn't bring a cigar, they are not going to get a monte #2 or Partagas Serie D#4 though, unless they are bringing a nice bottle of wine or single barrel bourbon. They probably are going to get a Monte #5 for $4.00. I had a Cuaba Divinos (4x43) a few days ago that was a couple years old, courtesy of Bruce5. He said they were $4.oo ea. It only lasted about 25 minutes, but it tasted awsome. Worlds apart from any MM cigar.

Dylan, youll just have to try a few and see if you enjoy them or not. Unfortunately for my wallet I have expensive tastes. :w


----------



## okie2 (Mar 16, 2003)

IHT said:


> but for those of us without kickass jobs and tight budgets who have to take money from what they get paid to eat on when out of town on business trips and a bit of their overtime, machine mades are great.
> 
> as someone said, they don't cost but about $2-4 per cigar, and they taste a lot better than non-cubans that cost 2-3 times as much.
> 
> ...


Sounds like your going to have some fun trying the MMs. Thats the great thing about our hobby, always something else to try. Its really the only way to find out which smokes you enjoy. Mo, Doc and Herfzilla threw out some good ones to try. 
I would also encourage you to occasionally try some smokes from other countries, especially if you read a good review from someone you trust. You never know when one might trip your trigger. 
Hell, I've had a 40 plus years love affair with tobacco from all over. I've still enjoy the "Albinos", the occasional can of Kodiak, a good chew (especially Beechnut), some Cuban and some Honduran cigars. I love tobacco and have always enjoyed the journey. This is only my opinion on what I have grown to like over the years. My opinion and 15 cents still won't buy you a cup of coffee! 
Let me know how you enjoy the MMs. If you find some that "blow your skirt up" don't forget to send me a couple!  
You know you are always welcome to try anything I have in my humidor. If you don't like what I send you just let them dry out and use them for tent pegs or throw them at a stray dog! There are many good guys on this board who are willing to share. Send them a PM about buying a couple of singles. Their generous response will surprise you.
Good luck on your journey and continue to try whatever seems right to you. Your personal satisfaction from whatever you smoke, regardless of my opinion or those of others, is all that matters.


----------



## Fredster (Jan 26, 2004)

okie2 said:


> Sounds like your going to have some fun trying the MMs. Thats the great thing about our hobby, always something else to try. Its really the only way to find out which smokes you enjoy. Mo, Doc and Herfzilla threw out some good ones to try.
> I would also encourage you to occasionally try some smokes from other countries, especially if you read a good review from someone you trust. You never know when one might trip your trigger.
> Hell, I've had a 40 plus years love affair with tobacco from all over. I've still enjoy the "Albinos", the occasional can of Kodiak, a good chew (especially Beechnut), some Cuban and some Honduran cigars. I love tobacco and have always enjoyed the journey. This is only my opinion on what I have grown to like over the years. My opinion and 15 cents still won't buy you a cup of coffee!
> Let me know how you enjoy the MMs. If you find some that "blow your skirt up" don't forget to send me a couple!
> ...


Throw them at stray dogs? That would literally be a dog rocket! When I first read that, I laughed so loud I scared my kids. Very funny.


----------



## okie2 (Mar 16, 2003)

Fredster said:


> Throw them at stray dogs? That would literally be a dog rocket! When I first read that, I laughed so loud I scared my kids. Very funny.


Thanks for the flowers Fred! Always glad to inject a little humor in someones day.


----------



## IHT (Dec 27, 2003)

thanks for the encouragement, bob.

i still smoke non-cubans i enjoy... i'm not a total "snob" type of cuban cigar smoker... i've got some connies, a trilogy here and there... picked up a CAO today, along with a padron, Joya De Nicaragua antano 1970 and an opus x...


----------



## Wetterhorn (Apr 1, 2004)

The two I like are Fonseca Delicias and anything by Jose Piedra.


----------

