# Peace pipe



## Argon Swift (Mar 27, 2011)

Anyone know the wood the peace pipes were made of and has anyone ever smoked one? I wonder if the peace pipe was so long for some cooling effect like you might get from a churchwarden. 

Argon Swift
wildwestninja.com


----------



## DirtyBlackSocks (Jan 6, 2011)

Depends on the region, I've seen them made of everything from red oak to dogwood to cherry wood.

The experience isn't anything great tobacco wise, it generally adds a large wood taste although they had techniques to try and carbonize the inside of the bowl to the best of their abilities.

Usually peace pipes were used to smoke peyote and sativa out of, rather than tobacco. Indians smoked cigars as well - peace pipes were more of a part of rituals than daily use. (My wife is an anthropologist obsessed with Native American culture)


----------



## shannensmall (Jun 30, 2010)

A lot of peace pipes also used soap stone or pipe stone for their bowl material.


----------



## DirtyBlackSocks (Jan 6, 2011)

shannensmall said:


> A lot of peace pipes also used soap stone or pipe stone for their bowl material.


Having some African soap stone arifacts around the house, I wouldn't smoke it haha - that stuff is as soft as the name indicates.


----------



## FiveStar (Jan 7, 2010)

DirtyBlackSocks said:


> Usually peace pipes were used to smoke peyote and sativa out of, rather than tobacco. Indians smoked cigars as well - peace pipes were more of a part of rituals than daily use. (My wife is an anthropologist obsessed with Native American culture)


Actually, sativa is the species name of a Genus of Cannabis. I believe you mean Salvia as in Salvia Divinorum. Salvia was actually chewed just as often as it was/is smoked, but it's would usually be rolled into a "cigarette" traditionally.

Peyote wouldn't be smoked either, but would rather be eaten.

And many Native American pipes would have been straight pipes that were smoked while lying on your back. Very helpful, considering the nicotine content of Nicotiana rustica, which was smoked by many tribes. I've smoked this stuff before, and it will give you the pukes in a New York minute! Truly a psychedelic drug.

It is true however, that tobacco wasn't the only thing smoked in "Peace Pipes". Sometimes baccy was mixed with the leaves of an evergreen called Bearberry, and possibly other herbs as well, and called _Kinnikinnick. 
_


----------



## DirtyBlackSocks (Jan 6, 2011)

FiveStar said:


> Actually, sativa is the species name of a Genus of Cannabis. I believe you mean Salvia as in Salvia Divinorum. Salvia was actually chewed just as often as it was/is smoked, but it's would usually be rolled into a "cigarette" traditionally.
> 
> Peyote wouldn't be smoked either, but would rather be eaten.
> 
> ...


Sativa was native to the United States once upon a time. Salvia was used by shaman's in New Mexico to the best of my knowledge and is related to a mint leaf.

While peyote only makes you trip when you eat it - indians thought ingesting it by any means helped to guide your spirit on a journey.

Tobacco was also blended into peace pipes (after asking my wife more about it), but was never the primary ingredient when using a peace pipe.

Like I said, Native American's smoked cigars for tobacco use. Not cigars by today's standards, but similar.


----------



## shannensmall (Jun 30, 2010)

Very interesting thread. Thanks for he history lesson you two.

On the sandstone, having done a bit of research on sandstone pipes. Also having tried to carve one out of "softer" sand stone. There is sandstone available that has a lower talc content that is still soft enough for carving with ease yet hard enough to be shaped into a usable pipe. 

Landis, Any ideas where one could get their hands on some Nicotiana rustica?


----------



## Max_Power (Sep 9, 2010)

shannensmall said:


> Very interesting thread. Thanks for he history lesson you two.
> 
> On the sandstone, having done a bit of research on sandstone pipes. Also having tried to carve one out of "softer" sand stone. There is sandstone available that has a lower talc content that is still soft enough for carving with ease yet hard enough to be shaped into a usable pipe.
> 
> Landis, Any ideas where one could get their hands on some Nicotiana rustica?


pm sent


----------



## Argon Swift (Mar 27, 2011)

That's very interesting information. Great responses! 
DirtyBlackSocks, maybe you can ask your wife which of the native tribes was the friendliest to strangers, and less likely to kill them on sight.


----------



## freestoke (Feb 13, 2011)

Argon Swift said:


> That's very interesting information. Great responses!
> DirtyBlackSocks, maybe you can ask your wife which of the native tribes was the friendliest to strangers, and less likely to kill them on sight.


The ones that hadn't run into palefaces yet.


----------



## DirtyBlackSocks (Jan 6, 2011)

Argon Swift said:


> That's very interesting information. Great responses!
> DirtyBlackSocks, maybe you can ask your wife which of the native tribes was the friendliest to strangers, and less likely to kill them on sight.


She's off at work now, but if I remember when she gets home I'll ask.

I do know that the Zuni were very friendly...most of the tribes were from my understanding. She could probably name of which tribes were hostile easier than which were peaceful.

Granted that a lot of them ended up fighting for their land, but that's a different context.


----------



## Johnny Rock (Jun 25, 2010)

I smoked dried peyote buttons in Havasu Canyon, like 1970. Wasn't in a genuine peace pipe though. Learned to make some nice silver jewelry also. Still have a few pieces from that adventure. My daughter wears a spoon ring I made there.


----------



## freestoke (Feb 13, 2011)

Johnny Rock said:


> I smoked dried peyote buttons in Havasu Canyon, like 1970. Wasn't in a genuine peace pipe though. Learned to make some nice silver jewelry also. Still have a few pieces from that adventure. My daughter wears a spoon ring I made there.


I didn't make anything, but a friend sent me some dried peyote back about then. There was a big party one night, so I swallowed them with a lot of water, late in the afternoon. Being something of an astronomy fan, I had to bring everybody at the party out into the yard to show them the startling and unusual things that were happening in the heavens that night. They were not impressed. The penny eventually fell that maybe the sky looked a bit different to me.


----------



## Johnny Rock (Jun 25, 2010)

freestoke said:


> I didn't make anything, but a friend sent me some dried peyote back about then. There was a big party one night, so I swallowed them with a lot of water, late in the afternoon. Being something of an astronomy fan, I had to bring everybody at the party out into the yard to show them the startling and unusual things that were happening in the heavens that night. They were not impressed. The penny eventually fell that maybe the sky looked a bit different to me.


+1

I still have dreams about shit like this...no lie. Fn amazing stuff.


----------



## freestoke (Feb 13, 2011)

Johnny Rock said:


> +1
> 
> I still have dreams about shit like this...no lie. Fn amazing stuff.


The Age of Aquarius. And here we are on a peace pipe thread. How weird is that?


----------



## FiveStar (Jan 7, 2010)

shannensmall said:


> Landis, Any ideas where one could get their hands on some Nicotiana rustica?


A buddy of mine had some seed, and dried and cured the stuff like burley would be done. I suspect the Native Americans would have simply dried and smoked it ( much like burley).

I believe seeds and possibly raw tobacco are merely a google away. I wouldn't look for it to be a pleasant smoke. I rolled it up mixed with some American Spirit and smoked it as a cig when I smoked those. Even with a high tolerance to nicotine in my ciggy days, it put me on my ass!


----------



## dbreazeale (Apr 6, 2008)

for the most part, woods having a soft core were used for the stems. it was easier for a hot stick or metal rod to be pushed through. The harder wood took considerably longer to hollow out the stems with use of a whittled down stick and sand. Prior to using the pipes with stems separate from the stone bowls they just used the stick and sand method to hollow out the smoke and tobacco chambers. that takes FOREVER!

today all of us heathen indians use power drills to drill through the catlinite, soapstone or whatever and the same with the stems. we even came across a wonderful invention called wood glue. you can hollow out a small channel on one side of a flat piece of wood and glue it to another similar piece of wood. when that glue dries you can shape the stem and make it whatever length you'd like. the idea and use of longer stems simply makes it easier to pass the pipe. 

as far as smoking cannabis (i'm assuming, forgive me, that you're speaking of marijuana?) I've never seen another tribal member of any tribal nation smoking pot from a ceremonial pipe. personal pipes are totally different. smoking pot out of a ceremonial pipe would be a desecration of a spiritual object along the lines of ripping the pages from a bible or whatever holy scripture you subscribe to and burning it and that's what we would describe as, heap-em bad medicine :rofl:.

FWIW


----------



## FiveStar (Jan 7, 2010)

dbreazeale said:


> for the most part, woods having a soft core were used for the stems. it was easier for a hot stick or metal rod to be pushed through. The harder wood took considerably longer to hollow out the stems with use of a whittled down stick and sand. Prior to using the pipes with stems separate from the stone bowls they just used the stick and sand method to hollow out the smoke and tobacco chambers. that takes FOREVER!
> 
> today all of us heathen indians use power drills to drill through the catlinite, soapstone or whatever and the same with the stems. we even came across a wonderful invention called wood glue. you can hollow out a small channel on one side of a flat piece of wood and glue it to another similar piece of wood. when that glue dries you can shape the stem and make it whatever length you'd like. the idea and use of longer stems simply makes it easier to pass the pipe.
> 
> ...


Thanks for this! Is the offering consumed in a ceremonial pipe a mixture of tobacco and other herbs, or is it straight tobacco?

I am still wondering what "Sativa" exactly is being spoken of here. Sativa is not a plant, but it is a specific epithet used in lots of plant scientific names ie. _Cannabis sativa (marijuana) _or _Aruca sativa (arugula). _


----------



## freestoke (Feb 13, 2011)

dbreazeale said:


> ...smoking pot out of a ceremonial pipe would be a desecration of a spiritual object...


What about the documentary, _Shanghai Noon_? Now I'm confused.


----------



## dbreazeale (Apr 6, 2008)

FiveStar said:


> Thanks for this! Is the offering consumed in a ceremonial pipe a mixture of tobacco and other herbs, or is it straight tobacco?


There are ceremonial mixtures that don't contain any tobacco such as Kinnickinnic that commercially has Bear Berry, Osha Root, Mullein, Red Willow & Yerba Santa. Some people add other things more or less to make their own.

There's also ceremonial tobacco that's all tobacco. The tobacco goes through several steps in a process to make it worthy of being used for the purpose.


----------



## dbreazeale (Apr 6, 2008)

freestoke said:


> What about the documentary, _Shanghai Noon_? Now I'm confused.


getting information from a "hollywood type" source is never 100% accurate. Even if Geronimo himself wrote, directed and acted the whole thing....he's going to make up some crap and put in there. Indian ceremonial practices are not something that they just put out there for every bodies enjoyment. these things are usually only taught in confidence. Otherwise, you get flakes that will take the practices as they think they're supposed to be and use them the wrong way and make a mockery of them. a good case in point is that fruit loop that killed several people in his "sweat lodge ceremonies" recently.


----------



## freestoke (Feb 13, 2011)

dbreazeale said:


> getting information from a "hollywood type" source is never 100% accurate.


"It's a joke! Ah say, son, it's only a JOKE!" -- Foghorn Leghorn

Honest, I really don't believe Owen Wilson dug himself out with a pair of chopsticks, either. :hippie:


----------

