# Washington tobacco law for online purchase



## SidRox7

Can I trade tobacco's with others online and receive and ship them since I am not paying for them? I just can't buy them online now through web sites :?:
I need more info on this law.


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## Hermit

As I understand the new law,
(just from what I've read on the forums)
that would be a felony. 
Is that stupid or what? :mad2:


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## commonsenseman

Hermit said:


> As I understand the new law,
> (just from what I've read on the forums)
> that would be a felony.
> Is that stupid or what? :mad2:


Wow that is stupid, what the hell is the reason for that?


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## jackolantern

because then big brother won't get his protection money. Thats definately a crime


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## zeavran1

Not able to buy online? Can that be true? I still get all kinds of emails for tobacco sales.


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## SidRox7

So if someone randomly sent me tobacco in the mail which one of us is the felon!?!?!?!? :mischief:


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## Hermit

SidRox7 said:


> So if someone randomly sent me tobacco in the mail which one of us is the felon!?!?!?!? :mischief:


Both of you.


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## Hermit

zeavran1 said:


> Not able to buy online? Can that be true? I still get all kinds of emails for tobacco sales.


Well, you don't live in Washington.
Don't worry, New York won't be far behind.


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## MarkC

Wait a minute...how the heck can a state decide what goes through federal mails? This so obviously steps on the interstate commerce clause that there must be a horde of lawyers out there salivating over getting the first case on this one!*





*Then again, I'm not a legally trained individual; I just play one on the internet...


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## Hermit

MarkC said:


> Wait a minute...how the heck can a state decide what goes through federal mails? This so obviously steps on the interstate commerce clause that there must be a horde of lawyers out there salivating over getting the first case on this one!*
> 
> *Then again, I'm not a legally trained individual; I just play one on the internet...


I hope it's sooner, rather than later,
before other states adopt this stupidity.


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## tobacmon

SidRox7 said:


> *Can I trade tobacco's with others online and receive and ship them since I am not paying for them? *I just can't buy them online now through web sites :?:
> I need more info on this law.


Who says it has to be known as a trade---I'd say it was a gift---settles that!

Is there any laws about receiving gifts from friends, family etc.?


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## Hermit

tobacmon said:


> Who says it has to be known as a trade---I'd say it was a gift---settles that!
> 
> Is there any laws about receiving gifts from friends, family etc.?


I don't think it matters.
Sending/receiving *tobacco* is a crime.


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## dmkerr

I am not typically a doomsayer by nature. That said, over the past year, I've been slowly and systematically building up my cellar stock of pipe tobacco in anticipation of tobacco becoming illegal in all forms... illegal to produce, sell, buy or own. I actually have a cellar with a hidden door where I will repair for a bowl when the mood seizes me. Ok, that part, while true, was incidental with my new house - I didn't create the hidden door. But it's WAY cool! 

Tobacco is EVIL, my friends! If you produce, sell, buy or otherwise acquire tobacco, YOU ARE A CRIMINAL!!!! 

Ridiculous? Ahhh... I don't think anyone thinks so anymore!


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## MarkC

I don't know if it will go that far, but even if it doesn't, I can see the taxes on tobacco shooting an average tin price up to an unbearable level, so I'm trying to "lay in supplies" as well. I feel like a loon preparing for the apocolypse sometimes, but heck, even if I'm wrong, it's not a bad investment. I just have to remember to stop before I have enough tobacco to last me until I'm 150...


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## RJpuffs

It is probably more of an incentive (or lack thereof) to online retailers - to NOT ship to WA State due to criminal liability. The State has no authority to seize Federal Mail (unless they have warrants and all the nice stuff), and since wire/mail fraud falls under the Feds purview, unless the State can present a strong case they will likely not be opening packages.

Its simply a tax collectors wet dream. What next, abolishing Amazon.com purchases so local sales tax gets paid? Or tax the air we breathe? Can you imagine bootleg air canisters being shipped from out of state? :doh:


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## Cigar Man Andy

Here is an article on the Washington State law.

Also go to Internet Tobacco Sales 

And here is the law as of 2003.
Washington State Legislation

I went to the state department of taxation and found nothing on cigars or pipe tobacco being sold on line. Only cigarettes. Latest law, 2003. I will do more research though.


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## zeavran1

Cigar Man Andy said:


> Here is an article on the Washington State law.
> 
> Also go to Internet Tobacco Sales
> 
> And here is the law as of 2003.
> Washington State Legislation


These articles make no mention of cigars. They specifically say cigarettes. Does this apply to cigars as well?


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## Cigar Man Andy

zeavran1 said:


> These articles make no mention of cigars. They specifically say cigarettes. Does this apply to cigars as well?


That's what I am saying. No mention of cigars or pipe tobacco.


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## indigosmoke

RJpuffs said:


> What next, abolishing Amazon.com purchases so local sales tax gets paid? :doh:


I'm in internet marketing and technically either the buyer or the seller (neither the lawyers nor the gov seems to clearly know which one in any given case) _is _supposed to collect sales tax and remit it to the state based on a complicated, little understood formula on where you have a physical location or 'presence'. This itself is the subject of lawsuits and much discussion and debate. When you consider that there are thousands of different sales tax rates all across the country this is an incredible burden on business. Some legislators have tried to proposed simplified systems or banning sales tax on internet sales entirely but of course most can see no reason to limit their ability to enslave...err...tax us. I'd post some links if my post count was high enough, but the issue is so unclear and confused that groups have been formed just to try and figure out how a business could comply if it wanted too.



RJpuffs said:


> Or tax the air we breathe? :doh:


Don't give them any ideas...wait a minute, I'm sure we've got an Air Tax Czar now who is looking into the most attractive way to phrase this. Hmmmm how about the Green Respiration Cap and Trade Act? People seem willing support anything with the word green in it. Besides I'm sure the rich are using much more than their fair share of air. I think it could all be included in the omnibus Redistribution of Oxygen Act of 2009. Since we are going to name the Health Care bill after Ted Kennedy, maybe we could name this one after Mary Jo Kopechne?

John


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## MarkC

Well, I think it's more than just the tax angle. I think it's a kneejerk reaction to the thought of minors being able to lie simply and score tobacco. Surely you're aware of the hordes of teenaged pipe smokers that have recently decended upon the nation, poisoning our culture with strange music, weird clothing and oddball aromatics...


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## indigosmoke

Mark, 

Now that's funny! Where there is a will, there's a way as they say. I still remember buying cigs from a vending machine in a strip mall when I was about 14 and look how bad I turned out. Those cigs were a gateway drug for me. Sure I never really took up cig smoking, but now, only 22 years later, I've taken up pipe smoking. 

John


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## Ray

Cigar Man Andy said:


> That's what I am saying. No mention of cigars or pipe tobacco.


Hi all,
Unfortunately I have read the legislation that took effect on July 26, 2009.

The law specifically exempts cigars that weigh more than 3 lbs per thousand. So basically all but the tiny cigars are exempted.

Unfortunately pipe tobacco was not exempted.

They actually have the nerve to classify a violation of this law as a FELONY.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2009-10/Pdf/Bills/Senate Passed Legislature/5340-S.PL.pdf


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## dmkerr

indigosmoke said:


> Mark,
> 
> Now that's funny! Where there is a will, there's a way as they say. I still remember buying cigs from a vending machine in a strip mall when I was about 14 and look how bad I turned out. Those cigs were a gateway drug for me. Sure I never really took up cig smoking, but now, only 22 years later, I've taken up pipe smoking.
> 
> John


Next you'll be jaywalking or parking too far from the curb!

You scofflaws are all alike! :biggrin1:


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## mike t

please don't give em any ideas then someone would cry diet air


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## Gigmaster

I can't say much to that. I've been smoking a pipe since I was 13 (I am now over 50), but I was the only one in my age-group that I was aware of that did so. Everyone else that smoked, smoked cigarettes. And, a few dipped snuff.

I don't see how they can enforce this law? I'm not even sure if it is constitutional. I sort of doubt it.

If it was me, I would pull up stakes and move to another state. And tell them why. Also, my elected officials would get an earful from me, as well as being unemployed come next election.



MarkC said:


> Well, I think it's more than just the tax angle. I think it's a kneejerk reaction to the thought of minors being able to lie simply and score tobacco. Surely you're aware of the hordes of teenaged pipe smokers that have recently decended upon the nation, poisoning our culture with strange music, weird clothing and oddball aromatics...


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