# HCM (aka Scott Shilala) Beads/Molecular Sieve



## evenstill (Mar 2, 2012)

*HCM (aka Scott Shilala) Beads/Molecular Sieve*
www .hcmbeads. com/
www .scottsbeads. com/default. asp
www .shilalabeads. com/
www .shilalasbeads. com/default. asp
shilalahcmbeads. com/default. asp
www .shilalashcmbeads. com/default. asp
humidificationbeads. com/default. asp
cigarhumidificationbeads. com/default. asp
cigarbeads. com/default. asp
www .hcmcigarbeads. com/default. asp
mlbahcmbeads. com/default. asp

From reading Scott Shilala's posts on various threads and forums and doing quite a bit of research it sounds like the HSM beads are really 4A (four angstrom) sodium alluminosilicate molecular sieve. This is a pretty basic and common industrial dessicant. The MSDA safety data can be readily found online for the generic product and it appears to be at least as safe as silica beads. The HCM brand beads sell for around $50 a pound while the generic molecular sieve cost around $3.50 - $8 a pound. The difficulty is that the generic product is usually sold in bulk amounts in no less than 55 pound bags.

Molecular sieve are crystalline aluminosilicates (sodium alluminosilicate) that belong to the zeolite family . . . which simply means they are synthetic clay. There are four types of molecular sieves currently available: potassium aluminosilicate with a pore size of about 3 angstroms (3A), sodium aluminosilicate with a pore size of about 4A, calcium aluminosilicate with a pore size of about 5A, and sodium aluminosilicate with a pore size of about 10A (sometimes also called 13x). The pore sizes are very uniform and consistent. From reading Scott's descriptions of the HCM beads they appear to be the standard 4A size sodium aluminosilicate molecular sieve.

Since the size of a water molecule is approximately 2.8A the 4A pore size allows the molecular sieve to adsorb & desorb water and ammonia but not all the other molecules that cause silica beads and superabsorbant polymers (like Drymistat crystals) to discolor and sometimes start to smell.

The walls of the micro tunnels in the molecular sieve is exactly 1 molecule thick and these molecules have an electrical charge called covalence which means that each molecule has a natural affinity to attach itself to water molecules. Simply put, molecular sieve pull water molecules from the air until the force of their electrical charge is equally balanced with the force that the air uses to hold onto those water molecules, reaching equilibrium. According to Mr. Shilala these beads are special in that they have almost equal affinity at 65% relative humidity (RH) which means they can give off water at the same speed as they can take it up at 65%RH, whereas silica finds it's natural equilibrium around 45%RH.

These beads are not supposed to degrade as fast as silica and other products, they do not crack, explode, or disintegrate like silica can, and they can be "set" at any RH percentage (working best between 58% & 72%).

It has been said that the HCM beads want to give off water molecules 800% faster than any other bead product and want to gather water at an even greater rate, which is why you NEVER add water directly to the beads . . . the friction of them sucking up the water molecules into thousands of miles worth of tunnels so fast causes so much friction that the beads will literally melt and turn the water to steam!

Scott has said that since the HCM beads don't need to be treated with salts or glycols or anything it leaves more empty space for working with the water molecules causing them to work a minimum of 438% better than any treated bead product. The HCM beads are designed to work at 65% RH on a molecular, covalent level. There's no salting, adding denatured alcohol, or anything. They are smaller than typical silica gel beads, such as heartfelt, yet hold many hundred times more water while taking up less space in your humidor (you generally only need 1/3 -1/2 the amount compared to silica beads). They are as close to maintenance free as there is . . . some people report never having charged them even after years of use. The HCM beads are supposed to have MUCH faster recover times, tend to be more consistent than silica beads, require less monitoring (they're "set and forget"), and require less maintenance than silica beads (i.e. no water additions).

Despite all this information I have not yet had the chance to try any HCM beads and would like to ask those of you who have some questions. I've emailed Scott and several of the websites above with some questions but have not heard anything back yet.

1) With some humidor humidity control devices it's recommended to use a certain amount for the humidor itself and a certain amount for every so many sticks. For instance, in the past I've used 1 Drymistat tube for the humidor and 1 for every 20 cigars. Do any of you know if the HCM beads work similarly and if so, how much should be used for the box vs for the sticks and at what ratio?

2) Have any of you ever tried putting HCM beads in other kinds of containers and if so, what was your experience with that? I was thinking that putting them in some empty Drymistat tubes might be convenient due to their size and shape since they are made from a plastic which has microscopic pores in the walls that allow water vapor through, something like a permeable membrane. This way the process of humidity control actually occurs through the walls of the tube as well as the small holes in the cap. I think the website says that the plastic was originally developed to keep blister cards from sweating on the inside while in an air conditioned store by allowing the water vapor to pass through.

I'm no chemist or anything (just curious and experimental by nature) and am hoping to learn from you all a little more regarding the practical use of molecular sieves like the HCM beads for use in cigar humidors.

Thanks,
~ evenstill


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## dav0 (Feb 7, 2011)

evenstill - interesting facts. at the risk of angering Scott i might suggest someone put together a group buy of a 55 pound bag of 4a. i am good for 5 lbs!

also, many proponants/advocates of the silica based litter can tell you that an easy solution for a container is mesh fish filter bags. the trick here would be find one with mesh fine enough (to contain the smaller beads) and small enough (most filter bags come in 12"x4" or 8"x4") to account for a smaller amount of beads. I have found 4"x3" media bags but the mesh does not seem fine enough for smaller beads.

thanks to puff (a few years before I even joined) i learned of silica based litter. was lucky enough to even get the "pearls" which are round, but somewhat larger than heartfelt beads. I've been using them and can say yes, they split, and yes they do sometimes pick up odor.


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

I saw these as well and like E, very curious/persistent. Remembered zeolite from my aquarium days, they were just beginning to use it then and these HCM's sounded like that's what they are. Hey I am in for 5 lbs as well. KNee hi panty hose should work well, for containers, moldable around trays, etc.


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## socalocmatt (Dec 22, 2010)

I have HCM but have no answers to any questions. I use 3 - 8 oz bags in my winadors. I'm down for a GB. I'll test them in some tupperware with a bag of HCM.


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## gasdocok (May 14, 2011)

I'd be in for some of the "bag split" too if it happens. I'll take 5 pounds as well.

For the few bucks it would be worth it to see if it works like the HCM.

I would like Scott's take on this info as well as Mr. Shuckins.


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## nikonnut (Dec 4, 2011)

I'd give 5 lbs. a whirl too if it comes together.


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## aroma (Apr 12, 2010)

I wouldn't be surprised if you could also find the equivalent of Heartfelt beads for a few bucks a pound, if you knew what to look for.

I'd be in for a group buy of either one.


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## evenstill (Mar 2, 2012)

aroma said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if you could also find the equivalent of Heartfelt beads for a few bucks a pound, if you knew what to look for.


I can't post links to the thread but you'll find great info regarding a Heartfelt alternative if you search for the threads with these titles:
Kitty litter set- up.
ExquisiCat Crystals Cat Litter. MUST READ!!!

~ evenstill


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## evenstill (Mar 2, 2012)

Hey all, I think a group order is a great idea and I would definitely be in on it too except that I’ve got a guy already sending me a small sample to play around with. However, it sounds like you all have 15-20 pounds spoken for so it wouldn’t take many more people to organize this . . . then we can all experiment and compare notes.  

Also, you can purchase the molecular sieve in different sizes. It sounds like the most common diameter is the 2mm-5mm but I’ve also heard that you can get them in 5mm-8mm and even up to 12 or 13mm. This means they don’t have to be any smaller than silica beads if you want.

~ evenstill


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

Hey evenstill PM me with some of the info and I may take on trying to put something together, no guarantees, Stiil getting over ACDF and really need another disc fusion, but I'm still useful some days, that will be a lot of packing, weighing, sorting, dealing with reps, etc. Mostly just sit/stand here looking like this anyway, 'til planting time, then there will be rainy days.Mark


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## NomoMoMo (Feb 19, 2012)

I don't want to sound like a pessimist, but wouldn't the shipping charges be cost prohibitive? You first would have to ship a 55lb bag to a central location, and then ship off 5 pounds to each of the 11 members of the group, I think you'd be better off buying the Heartfelt beads or using Kitty litter. There have been members who couldn't give their kitty litter away due to the shipping cost.

Just my $.02. If I'm missing something then just slap me :bitchslap:


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## gasdocok (May 14, 2011)

NomoMoMo said:


> I don't want to sound like a pessimist, but wouldn't the shipping charges be cost prohibitive? You first would have to ship a 55lb bag to a central location, and then ship off 5 pounds to each of the 11 members of the group, I think you'd be better off buying the Heartfelt beads or using Kitty litter. There have been members who couldn't give their kitty litter away due to the shipping cost.
> 
> Just my $.02. If I'm missing something then just slap me :bitchslap:


You do make a good point, but can we slap you anyway? Just for fun?


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## gasdocok (May 14, 2011)

Ok, so I was doing some online searching for 4A molecular seives and one site said their stuff will reduce the RH to "below 2%" when used properly. Maybe this isn't the best idea after all or is there more to the story?


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

NomoMoMo said:


> I don't want to sound like a pessimist, but wouldn't the shipping charges be cost prohibitive? You first would have to ship a 55lb bag to a central location, and then ship off 5 pounds to each of the 11 members of the group, I think you'd be better off buying the Heartfelt beads or using Kitty litter. There have been members who couldn't give their kitty litter away due to the shipping cost.
> 
> Just my $.02. If I'm missing something then just slap me :bitchslap:


no need for slapping, that's what these forums are for, you could be right, many lifetimes, I once ran logistics whse. Given the info and a little number crunching I will know in short order.

The other reason for the PM's, I'm like Matt, and still skeptical about getting a bulk replacement. These chemical companies make these items based on contract and patents, according to country, a similar "zeolite type" product may not exist in bulk, hadn't planned on getting this far into it ,but, appears evenstill saved me the time, we will see.


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## NomoMoMo (Feb 19, 2012)

gasdocok said:


> You do make a good point, but can we slap you anyway? Just for fun?


As long as you put the beads down before you do so...


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## bazookajoe (Nov 2, 2006)

Scott is no longer in the beads business, but it is in the hands of a friend of his. You can contact them, buy beads or whatever using the site http://www.shilalasbeads.com/


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## evenstill (Mar 2, 2012)

numismaniac said:


> Hey evenstill PM me with some of the info and I may take on trying to put something together . . .


Numismaniac,
I can't figure out how to send PMs on this forum . . . can you enlighten me? There are a number of companies that sell the product. I just did a couple of Google searches and settled on an American company that happened to be located not to far from me . . . Texas Technologies. If I ever figure out the PM thing I'll get you the guy's name and contact info I was working with.



gasdocok said:


> Ok, so I was doing some online searching for 4A molecular seives and one site said their stuff will reduce the RH to "below 2%" when used properly. Maybe this isn't the best idea after all or is there more to the story?


Gasdocok,
The Molecular Sieve is very effective dessicant is you want to keep moisture out of something. However, with just a little conditioning you can get the beads "set" wherever you want them. According to the instructions for raising the "set" RH you simply place the beads in a sealed container (like tupperware or a ziplock bag or your humidor etc) with a hygrometer and a sponge (or part of a sponge if it's a small container) soaked in DW overnight, take the sponge out in the morning, then check the hygrometer that afternoon. If it's not where you want it just repeat. I would assume that the initial conditioning might take longer than overnight but I haven't played around with it yet. If you need to lower the "set" RH you simply place the beads in the refrigerator for an hour (or the freezer for 25 minutes) then wait and check with a hygrometer. Basically, these things are so sensitive to moister that you NEVER add water directly to them, always simply allowing them to adsorb or desorb moister directly from the air using the method described above. You can find more information regarding this process at the hcmbeads website.

~ evenstill


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

You probably don't have enough posts or something to pm I will send you one with my e-mail


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

no, can't you will have to get your post count up i guess?


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## ekengland07 (May 20, 2009)

To get us back on track, if you want to try this idea out, I have a company I've worked with who'll ship you 5 lb. of this stuff for $50 shipped or 55 lb. for $150 shipped.


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

Hey evenstill, got busy ,just noticed all the poopoo, e-mail me at numismaniacmsc at gmail dot com


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

ekengland07 said:


> To get us back on track, if you want to try this idea out, I have a company I've worked with who'll ship you 5 lb. of this stuff for $50 shipped or 55 lb. for $150 shipped.


Pm me with some details, I would like to do some math first, check some s/h costs, etc. then I could give everyone an idea. I just had someone ship me a lb of beads, wasn't cheap, not sure of volume of 5# to see which flat rate to account for, etc.


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## bazookajoe (Nov 2, 2006)

evenstill said:


> Well, asmartbull . . . maybe you should let folks talk with each other privately then, huh?


Nice. You roll in here and challenge the way things are done without any knowledge of why things are the way they are, like posting and time requirements that discourage spammers from coming in here and spamming members by PM. Kinda hard to take your comments seriously when you put so little thought into them...


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## asmartbull (Aug 16, 2009)

Gents
As a courtesy to members that have participated in this thread, I just want to let you know that
Evenstill may be back in 7 days...


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## Blaylock-cl (Apr 28, 2006)

...and hopefully with a better attitude and awareness of how things operate around here.


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## ekengland07 (May 20, 2009)

numismaniac said:


> Pm me with some details, I would like to do some math first, check some s/h costs, etc. then I could give everyone an idea. I just had someone ship me a lb of beads, wasn't cheap, not sure of volume of 5# to see which flat rate to account for, etc.


Some time back I purchased 5 lbs. of silica from them and it came in a normal sized paint can to give you a rough idea of volume. I'd think you could get close to a pound in a small flat rate box. PM incoming.


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

asmartbull said:


> Gents
> As a courtesy to members that have participated in this thread, I just want to let you know that
> Evenstill may be back in 7 days...


 Thanks, brother, seems like he wants to help, was away from the computer awhile and lookout, some of us newbs get carried away.


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

Blaylock said:


> ...and hopefully with a better attitude and awareness of how things operate around here.


Just got going today, pain a little rough with these storms around, just got an e-mail with some tech details, and apologies for the drama, we'll chat, I'm a newb, but not young, have 4 twenty somethings, etc. He means well,I think, I feel he will become a good contributor, just maybe wanting to help a little too hard, the wrong way, I sorta missed it, just as well. Thanks


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## dav0 (Feb 7, 2011)

So what was the outcome, is there a consensus on if it's worth the hassle of a 55lb bag, or should we just be looking to buy 5lbs individually for the higher price?


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## numismaniac (Jan 14, 2012)

I go kinda slow, give me a couple weeks and I will have a fair logistical sense of what the best value, etc. might be, anyone else feel free to outrace me to the answer, hehe


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## evenstill (Mar 2, 2012)

I got the samples in. I received two sizes (see attached photo). The smaller size is labeled 8x12 mesh while the larger size is labeled 4x8.








I've got the larger size in my 50 count humi and the smaller size in my 100 count humi. I went ahead and used more than the HCM site says is needed and just threw about 6 ounces into the larger humi and maybe around 4-5 ounces in the smaller humi. Both humidors are holding steady at 65%RH. They do seem to fluctuate a point or two every day according to the Hygroset hygrometers but not so much fluctuation according to the Caliber III hygrometers.

At first I was adding water vapor with a wet sponge placed in the humidor as the HCM website suggested, then I started adding water with a small glass spray bottle that produced a very fine mist. The mist did seem to make the beads warm and borderline hot but I added slowly and let them cool and there were no problems with melting or anything like that. I actually found that dropping them in water or adding water directly to them in liquid form was better than the mist spray . . . maybe the extra water cools them or something. Anyway, I ended up soaking about 1/2 - 3/4 of the beads in distilled water then shaking the excess water from them, mixing with the dry beads and placing them all in .99 media filter bags from Petsmart. If I think the RH is too low I'll just add about 3 droppers of distilled water from my small glass dropper bottle and presto, the RH goes up 1-2 degrees RH.

At any rate, they seem to be working really well. I can't tell much difference between the efficiency of the smaller ones vs the larger ones but honestly I haven't done too much experimentation with them yet.

~ evenstill


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## KaChong (Jan 1, 2012)

I think you're going to see a faster recovery time with the smaller beads assuming similar mass of bead pile since the smaller beads are going to have a higher surface area to volume ratio than the larger beads. More surface area means more area exposed to your humidor atmosphere which means more exposed area available to emit or absorb water vapor.

I'd be interested in trying out 5lb if a group buy turns out to be cost effective.


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## socalocmatt (Dec 22, 2010)

Very nice results. I agree with what Carl stated as to the smaller bead having the faster recovery. A GB would be great!


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## aroma (Apr 12, 2010)

KaChong said:


> I think you're going to see a faster recovery time with the smaller beads assuming similar mass of bead pile since the smaller beads are going to have a higher surface area to volume ratio than the larger beads. More surface area means more area exposed to your humidor atmosphere which means more exposed area available to emit or absorb water vapor.


I agree, if the beads are in a very flat layer, however, if the beads are in a thicker layer, the small bead size may reduce air flow through the mass of beads.


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## Danfish98 (Jun 5, 2011)

Interesting that adding water directly worked. Just started trying to season some that were completely dried out last week and after several days I'm still only in the 30%s. If I'm not up to 65% by this weekend I'm trying the spray bottle!


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## avrus (Sep 19, 2011)

Any thoughts on Montmorillonite Clay? I'm wondering if it produces less dust than the Silica compounds.

Here's an interesting article comparing Bentonite Clay / Monmorillonite Clay, Silica and Molecular sieves. According to this article molecular sieves are not reusable.

Bentonite Clay - Comparing Commercial Desiccants - Silica Gel, Clay and Molecular Sieve


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## avrus (Sep 19, 2011)

A lot more research has turned up Montmorillonite Clay beads might be a better solution than Silica Gel beads. You can buy it in bulk, but there's a company called GreenSorb that sells it through Walmart for next to nothing.

4lbs for $12.99

Walmart.com: GreenSorb Eco-Friendly Sorbent, Clay, 4-lb Shaker Bottle: Safety Equipment & Gear

20bs for $25.99

Walmart.com: GreenSorb Eco-Friendly Sorbent, Clay, 25-lb Bucket: Safety Equipment & Gear


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## bbasaran (Mar 20, 2011)

Thank you *avrus* for the research and share over here. Do we know anyone who has experience with those Montmorillonite Clay beads ?


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

avrus said:


> A lot more research has turned up Montmorillonite Clay beads might be a better solution than Silica Gel beads. You can buy it in bulk, but there's a company called GreenSorb that sells it through Walmart for next to nothing.
> 
> 4lbs for $12.99
> 
> ...





bbasaran said:


> Thank you *avrus* for the research and share over here. Do we know anyone who has experience with those Montmorillonite Clay beads ?


The article says that it creates a lot more dust than either silica or molecular sieves, and also hold far less moisture than scilica, so I doubt that would be a good solution. The article is primarily discussing its use as an absorbant, not it's use in regulating rH, so I'm not sure it's particularly helpful in any respect to the use we're applying.


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

Danfish98 said:


> Interesting that adding water directly worked. Just started trying to season some that were completely dried out last week and after several days I'm still only in the 30%s. If I'm not up to 65% by this weekend I'm trying the spray bottle!


Dan, I've been interested in switching to beads for a while, just due to the smaller space requirements... let me know how it goes for you!


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> Dan, I've been interested in switching to beads for a while, just due to the smaller space requirements... let me know how it goes for you!


Why use these everyone knows Heartfelt beads are the best!:lever:


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

lol, Tony, I know nothing about beads at this point. I've only ever used KL beads!!!


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## bbasaran (Mar 20, 2011)

So any progress or results for share?


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> lol, Tony, I know nothing about beads at this point. I've only ever used KL beads!!!


Remember its not kitty litter till the cat uses it LOL!


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## Rick Hendeson (Apr 8, 2014)

bbasaran said:


> So any progress or results for share?


After a lot of research and experimentation I've been using 4A sieves and they work great


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