# Johnny-O - History?



## 96Brigadier (Oct 20, 2009)

So I every once in a while I see these threads in the Habanos section about Johnny-O cigars. Through total ignorance on my part I keep wondering why these are being talked about in the Habanos section. i.e. as far as I am concerned these are not Habanos. What am I missing?


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

You are wrong here, they are Habanos.


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## asmartbull (Aug 16, 2009)

*This is what I got from Johnny.*

Alan....Most BOTL's smoke one or two to gauge how long they need to rest. Usually after a months time most like to begin aging them for a while. Most are telling me that they get best results around the 1 yr mark, some let it go 2-3 yrs just on a few. But that depends on your tastes. The leaf comes from Vuelta Abajo, Pinar del Rio and is medium-full bodied with hints of spice. To be honest with you a lot of BOTL's smoke these fairly quickly, but from time to time I get a message from someone that says: "hey I just smoked a torp you sent me 3 years ago...... So some are holding onto them longer, like I said just depends on your tastes. Hope this helps, John

who really knows,,,I like the tastes, and that is all that really matters to me


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## FiveStar (Jan 7, 2010)

Finally, a peak behind the curtain...


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## 96Brigadier (Oct 20, 2009)

scottw said:


> You are wrong here, they are Habanos.


Boy, that's a solid rebuttal. :yawn:

Why am I wrong? Are they made in Cuba? Can I buy them in Cuba? Are they marketed and sold by Habanos SA? Can you prove where the leaf comes from? Do you honestly think they have such a good smuggling operation that they can smuggle the leaf out of Cuba to the US and not get caught?

Let say the leaf actually does come from Cuba. What's the difference between Johnny-O and the cigars I can buy on the beaches of Cuba? There are lots of fakes that aren't bad smokes, but no one would try to say they are Habanos.


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## Rodeo (May 25, 2009)

You raise a number of valid points Steve. I will say that no matter where the leaf comes from, the blending and construction suit my tastes. Maybe its better to keep the whole thing shrouded in mystery ....


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## 96Brigadier (Oct 20, 2009)

Just for the record, I'm not trying to say they aren't good cigars. I have no personal experience with them but I have read mostly good things about them. I'm just trying to figure out why people think these are Habanos and what I'm missing.

Even by Puff's own standards I can't figure out why these are in the Habanos section.

From the description of the Habanos Review board:
Habanos means from Havana, and this category is all about the Cuban cigar. Our seasoned professionals give their two cents on the many brands of habano cigars, such as Punch, Quintero, Cohiba, El Rey del Mundo and more.

From the description of the Habanos Discussion board:
This section of our forums is dedicated to the Habanos cigar. We discuss legality issues, user experiences, and everything related to these fine, premium cigars. Uncover the truths – and myths, of the greatest cigars on the planet.

So again I ask, what am I missing?


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## harley33 (Mar 27, 2009)

I sort of have the same question. Luckily someone on this thread gifted me one. I haven't enjoyed it yet, but it looks and smells great. When I do ignite it (most likely this weekend) and like it.... how do you go about getting them - ancient Chinese secret? I noticed on other threads the guys name, so I googled a combination of that and johnny o - it returned forumn threads and no real answers. 

Then it goes back to Steve's question, why these and not the for certain real deals from across the pond? Personal preference or the mistique of getting something that few have access to?

This is like a game of Clue...

Jeff


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## KetherInMalkuth (Dec 17, 2009)

I've seen much discussion on these, and while I've yet to pull the trigger and prove it to myself, I've seen comments from enough BOTL who's palettes in ISOM cigars I'd trust that have said they are indeed Cuban. Whether they are rolled in Cuba or Boston or Guadalajara, if they are a puro comprised of entirely Cuban leaf, then in my book, that makes them Cuban. Whether or not they are "habanos" or "Cuban" or whatever is really just a matter of semantics, what matters is that they supposedly taste as if they are. So either this roller is actually using the leaf he purports to use, or he has accomplished something every other major manufacturer of cigars has been attempting for nearly 50 years. Either way, it seems pretty special.


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## harley33 (Mar 27, 2009)

harley33 said:


> I sort of have the same question. Luckily someone on this thread gifted me one. I haven't enjoyed it yet, but it looks and smells great. When I do ignite it (most likely this weekend) and like it.... how do you go about getting them - ancient Chinese secret? I noticed on other threads the guys name, so I googled a combination of that and johnny o - it returned forumn threads and no real answers.
> 
> Then it goes back to Steve's question, why these and not the for certain real deals from across the pond? Personal preference or the mistique of getting something that few have access to?
> 
> ...


The butler did it, in the pool house, with a candlestick...


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## swingerofbirches (Jan 12, 2010)

I clicked on this thread not knowing anything about Johnny-O cigars ... and now I'm just confused. I guess this is one of those mysterious cc-related things that I'll just find out in time? lol


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## 96Brigadier (Oct 20, 2009)

KetherInMalkuth said:


> snip... Whether they are rolled in Cuba or Boston or Guadalajara, if they are a puro comprised of entirely Cuban leaf, then in my book, that makes them Cuban. Whether or not they are "habanos" or "Cuban" or whatever is really just a matter of semantics, what matters is that they supposedly taste as if they are..snip


Semantics is all there is in a name, if that weren't the case then all cigars would just be called cigars and we wouldn't make a distinction between a Habanos and a non-Habanos.

It's just like how people say a cigar bought on the streets of Havana or the beaches of Varadero are fake. Most of those are made with 100% Cuban leaf. Many of them taste great. However, they are not a Habanos. So why is the Johnny-O a Habanos, especially when no one seems to be able to verify where the leaf comes from? Just because I say it is doesn't make it so.

I'm not saying they aren't good cigars and a guy shouldn't smoke them. I'm saying that they aren't Habanos, they're "cigars that taste great and are worth the buy". So far no one has proven me wrong.


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## Perfecto Dave (Nov 24, 2009)

> Do you honestly think they have such a good smuggling operation that they can smuggle the leaf out of Cuba to the US and not get caught?


You would be surprised(maybe you wouldn't) of what comes into this country illegally right along side of legal. Talk with anyone involved with the DEA, customs and/or any other agency that has a supposed watchful eye in this country and you'll be guaranteed a shocking earful. Having said that, I'm not condoning it, I just know for facts it happens on a daily basis in our beloved country. Living in AZ we are currently enthralled in a heated debate on this very subject.
Back to the J-0 mystic.......
I haven't smoked a boat load of CC's, but enough to be able to tell the difference. The J-0 aroma, construction, burn and ash are enough to convince me that if I had an extra grand lying around I wouldn't hesitate to use it up on them. For me, they are a pretty well liked burning stick. I could easily make these a daily affair if my wallet would let me. 
I have no idea where they come from but have my suspicions and that's all they really are. Honestly, I don't care as long as they continue to look, burn, taste and are enjoyed the same as they have been. I'll continue to shell out the dinaro for these tasty morsels of smoking enjoyment.


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## KetherInMalkuth (Dec 17, 2009)

96Brigadier said:


> Semantics is all there is in a name, if that weren't the case then all cigars would just be called cigars and we wouldn't make a distinction between a Habanos and a non-Habanos.
> 
> It's just like how people say a cigar bought on the streets of Havana or the beaches of Varadero are fake. Most of those are made with 100% Cuban leaf. Many of them taste great. However, they are not a Habanos. So why is the Johnny-O a Habanos, especially when no one seems to be able to verify where the leaf comes from? Just because I say it is doesn't make it so.
> 
> I'm not saying they aren't good cigars and a guy shouldn't smoke them. I'm saying that they aren't Habanos, they're "cigars that taste great and are worth the buy". So far no one has proven me wrong.


I'm not intending to "prove anyone wrong", just stating my opinion on the cigars and thier possible origins based on what I know about them. IMHO, what makes cuban leaf special is the flavor profile, not the name. A cigar bought on the beach is only a "fake" if it's purporting to be a Cohiba or HdM or whatever but it actually isn't, if it's just a privately rolled cigar of Cuban leaf with no label on it, then it's not a "fake" it's just a custom (albeit with unknown quality control). Johnny-Os don't claim to be any other brand, they only claim to be made of Cuban grown tobacco. As I said before, I don't know if that's true or not, but many have said they taste as if they are Cuban, so I'm inclined to believe those who have a palette good enough to tell the difference.


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## Esoteric (Jun 15, 2009)

The one thing that really irks me about the possibility of buying some is that you cannot buy like a 5 pack or small sampler to try them. I want to try some but can't just throw over 125 bones to find I don't like them, ya know?

If I did like them, no problem lol but someday perhaps I can just throw caution to the wind haha

Concerning the fact they are Cuban baccy but rolled in the USA (from what I understand), I am fairly certain before the embargo, weren't most CC's rolled in Tampa from Cuban tobacco? That is why after the embargo, most cigar factories closed?

I do see how someone could be skeptical as there is seemingly no real way to determine whether the leaf is from the place it is said it is from but I trust my awesome BOTL's here. As Rodeo said, maybe the mystery is best left unsolved? 



Perfecto Dave said:


> You would be surprised(maybe you wouldn't) of what comes into this country illegally right along side of legal. *Talk with anyone involved with the DEA, customs and/or any other agency that has a supposed watchful eye in this country and you'll be guaranteed a shocking earful.* Having said that, I'm not condoning it, I just know for facts it happens on a daily basis in our beloved country. Living in AZ we are currently enthralled in a heated debate on this very subject.
> QUOTE]
> 
> Amen brother...I have also heard that some people even smuggle CC's via the mail to the US from certain overseas suppliers LOL


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## 96Brigadier (Oct 20, 2009)

KetherInMalkuth said:


> ...snip... A cigar bought on the beach is only a "fake" if it's purporting to be a Cohiba or HdM or whatever but it actually isn't, if it's just a privately rolled cigar of Cuban leaf with no label on it, then it's not a "fake" it's just a custom (albeit with unknown quality control).


Actually that's a really good point.

The only but left is "but no one knows for certain whether Johnny O's use Cuban leaf, they only know they like them and compare them to other Cuban cigars."


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## x man (Oct 21, 2009)

For what its worth, i was told by some 30 and 40 yr. smokers of
cc`s that they are authentic leaf. I recently traded for 6 of them
and have smoked one so far, the small one. I liked it, i am not in love with it. Lots of people swear by them, but they are not blended like any
known brands. My GUESS is, some maverick rollers have got it together 
enough to keep them coming.


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## Tarks (Mar 3, 2009)

I have heard from several people who think that the JO's are rolled by a "popular" custom roller in Havana. Not going to mention names here. I wonder if this point has any validity? I don't know much about the JO's. Are they rolled in Havana? Or are they rolled elsewhere?


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## Esoteric (Jun 15, 2009)

Tarks said:


> I have heard from several people who think that the JO's are rolled by a "popular" custom roller in Havana. Not going to mention names here. I wonder if this point has any validity? I don't know much about the JO's. Are they rolled in Havana? Or are they rolled elsewhere?


No one knows for sure but if they aren't rolled on the thighs of virgins as other CC's are...are they REALLY habanos? hahaha :caked:


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## Tarks (Mar 3, 2009)

scottw said:


> You are wrong here, they are Habanos.


Not saying your wrong Scott and I'm not sure of the definition of "Habanos" but my thoughts are this. Habanos are cigars rolled in Cuba using the Cuban leaf. A cigar rolled in another country using the Cuban leaf is not a Habanos. Again, this just my opinion.


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## asmartbull (Aug 16, 2009)

After reading this thread, I wondered if a seasoned veteran could shed some light on this. I have the palate of a goat. My buddy, who ownes a B&M has the most refined palate, I know. I also need to say that the only CC he has ever smoked was a Cohiba Robusto. At lunch I brought him a JO pig-tail short. An hr later I asked him what he thought and could he identify it. His words, "Not a Dom or Nic for sure". It's either a new blend or CC. The grassy barnyard essence make me think it's a CC. He then asked for a bundle.

Things that make you go Hummmmmmmmmmmm


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## Perfecto Dave (Nov 24, 2009)

96Brigadier said:


> Actually that's a really good point.
> 
> The only but left is "but no one knows for certain whether Johnny O's use Cuban leaf, they only know they like them and compare them to other Cuban cigars."


I have never smoked a NC that compared to a CC....yet. J-0's compare to CC's for a reason and it's not a mystical one. Unless the code has been deciphered and cuban leaf can now be grown in other parts of the world I'd say the chances are pretty darn good it's real cuban leaf......BUT.

I suppose a scientific analysis would tell us for positive BUT I'd rather let my flavor buds decide.
They could possibly be the best fakes in the entire world!


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## Magicseven (Oct 17, 2009)

Please send me 10 of your favorite cubans and I I'll smoke those 10 and 10 Johhny-o's and compare! LOL

I have had 2 closed poker runs and i thought they were fantastic. Like nothing I have ever tasted.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

asmartbull said:


> After reading this thread, I wondered if a seasoned veteran could shed some light on this. I have the palate of a goat. My buddy, who ownes a B&M has the most refined palate, I know. I also need to say that the only CC he has ever smoked was a Cohiba Robusto. At lunch I brought him a JO pig-tail short. An hr later I asked him what he thought and could he identify it. His words, "Not a Dom or Nic for sure". It's either a new blend or CC. The grassy barnyard essence make me think it's a CC. He then asked for a bundle.
> 
> Things that make you go Hummmmmmmmmmmm


Been doing a lot of research on the Johnny O's and what information that is out there is always subjective. I have never had the chance to smoke one but have been in touch with the guy and maybe one day will pull the trigger on getting a bundle as that is how they want to be sold from my research.

First thought as to the process of taking a cuban seed and growing it in another part of the world and still have the same taste. This has been ongoing since growers came up with idea. There are certain characteristics as far as the process of how tobacco is grown, harvested, cured and so forth. While all of these practices can be duplicated what can't be is the soil and that is a key aspect of why they are different. I'm not a chemist nor am I a pedologist but if one could duplicate the same exact soil in another country like cuba where the climate and humidity were relatively the same you can expect the same outcome. Growers are making strides in how they condition the soil, how they grow the tobacco and putting different wrappers on their cigar to obtain a better taste.

I like that growers are challenging themselves in this area...it's a win win for them and for the consumer. Will they ever manage to create a duplication of a Cuban Cigar grown in another part of the world? I think so because of science and the study of soil ( pedology) and it's only a matter of time before the two combine to make it happen.


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## asmartbull (Aug 16, 2009)

*I have never had the chance to smoke one but *

Gary,,,,,,that's a solvable situation.....incoming


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

asmartbull said:


> *I have never had the chance to smoke one but *
> 
> Gary,,,,,,that's a solvable situation.....incoming


Be careful...I hear the mail runs 2 ways Al!


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## salmonfly (Nov 11, 2009)

swingerofbirches said:


> I clicked on this thread not knowing anything about Johnny-O cigars ... and now I'm just confused. I guess this is one of those mysterious cc-related things that I'll just find out in time? lol


Charlie if ya really nice to me I might send you one in a years time, when their are ready to smoke. :yo:


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## BigRay023 (Apr 11, 2009)

I once heard that they are the product of a rolling school of sorts. I find this hard to believe because all mine are just about flawless in construction and burn. Does Habanos SA have the trademark on the word Habanos? If so then no they are not Habanos but just Cuban Cigars. Now I do believe they belong in this forum because even just the notion that they may contain any of the forbidden fruit would keep them from being discussed from anywhere else in the forums:usa2:


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## Cadillac (Feb 28, 2007)

I was curious as to the history (story) behind this smoke as well. I've spoken to a few who have smoked these in the past. One said he wasn't too impressed. From what I have learned, the issue of whether they are Cuban or not, is simply hearsay. Technically I would a agree and question why it is discussed in the Habanos section.


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## swingerofbirches (Jan 12, 2010)

salmonfly said:


> Charlie if ya really nice to me I might send you one in a years time, when their are ready to smoke. :yo:


I suppose that means I have to be extra nice to you for a year? lol 
It would appear that you have me between a rock and a smiley face (so to speak, lol) as I'm rediculously curious about these cigars. Well played sir.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Don't know much about history.
Don't know much about biology.
Don't know much about that science book.
Don't know much about that French i took.
All i know is those frickin Johnny-O's are great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:bump:hone::biggrin1:


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