# ISO pappy van winkle



## thunderdan11 (Nov 15, 2010)

I know many are but figured I would check. I finally made my way up on my local vendors list and was in line to get some this year. Well unfortunately the warehouse where the distributor is in Kearny NJ got destroyed by hurricane sandy. What he told me is that everyone in my area of nj is not going to get it until next year. . Can anyone point me in the right direction. 

Thanks.


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## Milhouse (Oct 22, 2011)

i heard that rumor too. I asked the Van Winkles on facebook, and they confirmed that Fedway was hit hard by Sandy, but the good news is they had not yet received the shipment. They said it should be available soon.


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## thebayratt (Jun 4, 2009)

Wish I could help you out.
Me and my friends have been on the hunt for some for the last three years or so and everytime we are a day too late. I made friends with my neighbor who manages a liquor store in town. She is keeping me in mind on any if it becomes available to them. But she also has other customers who spend more there than me, so Im sure, Im not too high on the list.


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## Cigar Noob (May 22, 2011)

"like" them on facebook and wait until they have deliveries in your area. Find a place that usually gets it in and if you are a regular you may get one saved for you.


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## Milhouse (Oct 22, 2011)

Cigar Noob said:


> "like" them on facebook and wait until they have deliveries in your area. Find a place that usually gets it in and if you are a regular you may get one saved for you.


Great advice


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## thunderdan11 (Nov 15, 2010)

Thanks for idea. Will do that.


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## Terry Tempel (Oct 25, 2013)

I have 1 unopened bottle of 20 year old Pappy and 1 unopened bottle of 23 year old Pappy that I purchased 10 years ago. Saving for a special occasion but that occasion could be an offer to buy that I can't refuse.


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

Advice- Get to be a regular at a local good sized store. Get to know the staff by asking questions and asking for suggestions. Get on their mailing list. Find out who in the store does the ordering. Speak to them directly and express your desire to be put on the "Pappy List". Every shop who gets any, has one of these lists.

I was able to get 2 bottles of the stuff last year. I got the phone call and was told if I was not there within 2 hours, all of it would be gone. None was even put on the shelves. Good luck in your quest.


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## Hokie (Apr 11, 2008)

Tough to get any of the VW stuff. As mentioned, find a store or two, get to know the people there and let them know your interest (be genuine). Also if there are any waiting lists, get on them.

If you can find any of the Jefferson's Reserve Presidential Select (18yr)...GET IT. It is Van Winkle, and is amazing. ...I am a bit of a bourbon collector.


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## huynha (Feb 6, 2013)

If you ever end up in Philadelphia, check out the Ashton Cigar bar.


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

I got a call yesterday from my supplier to let me know the Pappy had arrived. My clutch went up in my Jeep the day before. No Pappy this year


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## LGHT (Oct 12, 2009)

Never tried it, but my bro owns a bar so I'm gonna try and get some.


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## lbiislander (Oct 15, 2010)

I've tried it a couple of times, various ages. IMHO, it's now all hype and fertilizer.


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Not only has it become ridiculous with Pappy but I can't even get my hands on ANY of the holiday releases anymore.


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## Str8ShooterEsq (Jul 5, 2013)

I had some Pappy 20 once. It was incredible. Probably the best bourbon I've ever had.


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## cubancigarshopper (Nov 28, 2013)

Hokie said:


> Tough to get any of the VW stuff. As mentioned, find a store or two, get to know the people there and let them know your interest (be genuine). Also if there are any waiting lists, get on them.
> 
> If you can find any of the Jefferson's Reserve Presidential Select (18yr)...GET IT. It is Van Winkle, and is amazing. ...I am a bit of a bourbon collector.


This is the bottom end one, correct? 18, 21 and 25 I think are the vintages. Are they all made by Van Winkle?


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## TAB (Dec 5, 2013)

Take it from a Kentucky boy. You boys are paying for hype or you don't like real bourbon. Wheated bourbon is like riding a bike with training wheels or smoking a Macundo Cafe and thinking you're a big boy. If you like wheat in your bourbon just drink Makers and spend the difference on tobacco. You will thank me, esp if you drink more than one in a sitting.


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

Hey Tab,

Can you school me a bit here? What is the difference between a Wheated bourbon and whatever variety you are speaking of? I have tried a bunch but would always like to lean more about the varieties.


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

How much is this Pappy that you speak of?

I might know of a place that has some.

I'm gonna give them a call.


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## Frodo (Oct 1, 2009)

cubancigarshopper said:


> This is the bottom end one, correct? 18, 21 and 25 I think are the vintages. Are they all made by Van Winkle?


Jefferson's is in effect an independent bottler brand - they source their whiskey from other producers. The 17 & 18yr bottlings had Stitzel-Weller juice in them - the same stuff that made the Pappy line famous. The stocks of S-W juice is running out so the supply for the Pappy line is being supplanted by Buffalo Trace whiskey. The Pappy 20 & 23 still has some S-W juice in the bottle - the younger variants have all BT juice.

Older Jefferson's bottlings have been rumored to be Heaven Hill whiskey, or rye from Alberta Distillers for their rye bottling.


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## Frodo (Oct 1, 2009)

TAB said:


> Take it from a Kentucky boy. You boys are paying for hype or you don't like real bourbon. Wheated bourbon is like riding a bike with training wheels or smoking a Macundo Cafe and thinking you're a big boy. If you like wheat in your bourbon just drink Makers and spend the difference on tobacco. You will thank me, esp if you drink more than one in a sitting.


This holds true assuming you like a rye flavour profile. If you like the suppleness and honeyed character of wheated bourbon it may be just your thing and there isn't alot of high age wheated bourbons out there.


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## Frodo (Oct 1, 2009)

TAB said:


> Wheated bourbon is like riding a bike with training wheels or smoking a Macundo Cafe and thinking you're a big boy.


Kinda like saying if you don't drink Laphroaig/Ardbeg/Lagavulin, you don't like real scotch...


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## TAB (Dec 5, 2013)

Okay, first let me say this. I think some people are taking me a bit too serious. Drink what you like and like what you drink. It doesn't matter if it's liquid gold or Scottish dishwater (are those one in the same?).

To answer quincy, if he's serious, you're my new BFF. If you lived nearby, I'd bring a couple stogies over and we could chat about the finer points of bourbon and other distilled spirits.

Basically, there are a few main parts to making a whiskey.

The water
The Mashbill (recipe) 
Yeast strain
Age
Type of barrel

You can get more technical like type of filtration, but I'm trying to keep it simple for now.

ALL of this stuff matters big time, but for now, let's focus on mashbill (the recipe).

Guess what...there's only three "main" types of recipes for bourbon. 

With bourbon, the three "basic" mash bills are...traditional, wheated, & rye.

They are what you think they are.

Traditional is most bourbons. Wheated is the "softer" stuff and rye mash bills are the spicier types.

The main thing is, in order to be called bourbon, any mash bill has to be AT LEAST 51% corn...outside of that you can use any combination of rye, wheat, barley, etc. So, Pappy, Old Rip, any of the Wellers, Makers, Rebel Yell, Old Fitzgerald...those are all wheated bourbon. I'm not saying they are as good as Pappy or Old Rip, but they are in the same family.

Going back to my original comment, wheated bourbon is not "traditional" bourbon. Doesn't mean there is anything wrong with it, but it was designed to be smoother or more mellow (in the same way Bud Light is designed to have "superior drinkability" because it is brewed with rice). I'm not trying to knock wheated bourbons, but they just don't have much of a flavor profile to me...they are too smooth. Sort of like Woodford Reserve (which is not a wheated bourbon but is exceedingly smooth). Some people like that...like they like 1Q pipe tobacco or Macanduo Cafe...nothing wrong with that, just too mild for my taste. Not trying to offend or insult anyone.

I think to be fair, you should try to compare equally aged sprints. Compare an Elijah Craig 18yo next to a Winkle of the same age and see how you feel. Maybe you'll still like the Winkle product, and that's perfectly fine. I just feel like sometimes people are drawn to the Winkle line because of the age statement and what little they know about whiskey comes from their knowledge of scotch. Bourbon gets a lot of flavor from the barrel, so you can have a magnificent bourbon at 8 or 12 years old...you don't have to wait 23 years, but a lot of people don't realize that because so many single malts are 16yrs+.


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

Thanks Tab,

I picked up a couple bottles of Rip a few years ago. Nice but not really the end all in my book. I think it's more about the elusive hunt that drives the desire. Thanks for the insight of the basics of bourbon, and yes, I will leave a light on for ya in case you stop by.


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Except that a high heater wheater like William Larue Weller will not be as exceedingly smooth as say an Elmer T. Lee or other BT Mashbill #2 product. Proof has a lot to do with it. I happen to think that a wheater in that 100-115 range is one of the best bourbons out there and tends to have a more viscous, and for me more enjoyable, mouthfeel. The Pappy 15 is the true nectar of the gods.

However, I do not discriminate. I love the BT #2 stuff and I love a hot Four Roses OB- recipe as much as I enjoy the sweeter and crisper OE- stuff. I just truly find Pappy to be something other than bourbon. It is nothing like the 30-40 other bourbons I've tried.


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

Went to my local liquor store today to pick up a couple beers, and saw a bottle of 23 year in their locked cabinet... with a nice price of $999.99 on it.


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## tedski (Oct 1, 2004)

ezlevor said:


> Went to my local liquor store today to pick up a couple beers, and saw a bottle of 23 year in their locked cabinet... with a nice price of $999.99 on it.


At that (not so nice) price they can keep it locked up! There are plenty of other good + readily available bourbons that don't require a credit check before purchase.


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## Frodo (Oct 1, 2009)

ezlevor said:


> Went to my local liquor store today to pick up a couple beers, and saw a bottle of 23 year in their locked cabinet... with a nice price of $999.99 on it.


Sounds like they're cutting out the flippers. On the secondary market that price is kinda low...


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

I think there was a Jefferson's presidential 25 year for $120-$150 in there as well. I just saw the PVW label and had to take a look to see if I was going to be lucky enough to find a bottle of 12 year sitting on the shelf.


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## lbiislander (Oct 15, 2010)

My local store had a bottler of 12 earlier in the week. I went back today (Friday) saying if it was still there I would go for it. GONE!


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

I would have snagged it as soon as I saw it. I have that mindset for the 12 year. The wife and I got a gift card to a restaurant that has all of the pappys behind the bar. We're going to get some cash together along with the gift card and have a nice date night that will end with a glass of the 20 year.


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## ejewell (Feb 19, 2013)

I meannnnnnnnnnnnnn. A thread is useless without pictures! :smoke:

I picked up both of my bottles of 20 and 23 for 600 total. I scored a nice blade at 20% off (BM Infidel 3350) so I figured I'd put all my birthday/christmas presents to myself in. haha. added the NYE smoke because it was just laying around.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

ejewell said:


> I meannnnnnnnnnnnnn. A thread is useless without pictures! :smoke:
> 
> I picked up both of my bottles of 20 and 23 for 600 total. I scored a nice blade at 20% off (BM Infidel 3350) so I figured I'd put all my birthday/christmas presents to myself in. haha. added the NYE smoke because it was just laying around.


That's some score as supplies of Pappy are very scarce this year!
Enjoy Happy New Year!


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## ejewell (Feb 19, 2013)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> That's some score as supplies of Pappy are very scarce this year!
> Enjoy Happy New Year!


Same to you Tony!

Scarcity as a result of someone making off with what, something like 65 cases of 23yr?
Lucky devil...


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

Posted this is another thread, but might as well put it here. Got the Pappy 15 ($79 retail) and Van Winkle Lot B ($100 off Craigslist) for Christmas. This was my bourbon haul for the year. The JPS18 actually thanks to Erik.


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## KcJason1 (Oct 20, 2010)

UTKhodgy said:


> Posted this is another thread, but might as well put it here. Got the Pappy 15 ($79 retail) and Van Winkle Lot B ($100 off Craigslist) for Christmas. This was my bourbon haul for the year. The JPS18 actually thanks to Erik.


Great collection you have there. The 4R125th is great stuff... all of it is really.. I just wish i would of found some EC21 or JPS18 when it was available.


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

I've seen 2 bottles of EC21 and 1 bottle of EC20 in the wild in stores here. Both for $140.


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

how much does the jefferson presidential reserve stuff usually go for? my store has a bottle right next to the extremely marked up pappy 23 year.


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## Blue Raccoon (Mar 13, 2011)

2 bottles of Pappy at $600 or 2 bottles of Bookers for $100.. I'll take the Bookers.


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## ejewell (Feb 19, 2013)

ezlevor said:


> how much does the jefferson presidential reserve stuff usually go for? my store has a bottle right next to the extremely marked up pappy 23 year.


Those 18yrs managed to slip through the cracks at the liquor store I worked for. So they appeared to be overstock when they weren't. The whole box of 6 was shelved in the back. 95 a bottle and taxes. I didn't know the rarity at the time but got @UTKhodgy three bottles. The other three are long gone.

EDIT: The store I used to work for is also kind of pricey. Manager is on a power trip, being the best liquor store in the city so her prices are a little higher.


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

I only ask because there is a bottle... forgot the age on it... for I think $125. I thought it was older than 18, but I could be wrong. I think it was the 21.


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## UTKhodgy (Jan 4, 2012)

ezlevor said:


> I only ask because there is a bottle... forgot the age on it... for I think $125. I thought it was older than 18, but I could be wrong. I think it was the 21.


Red White & Bourbon covered the issue of Jefferson's since it can get confusing with them being a NDP.

Clarifying the Jefferson's Presidential Select Lineup | RW&B


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## ezlevor (Oct 29, 2012)

Thanks! I'm glad I'm not the only one confused by Jefferson's bottles. They all look the same and the age is on that tiny corner label. Plus, at the time I was distracted by the pappy 23 year that they have on sale for a grand. I'm assuming it's just because of the rarity of it, so they marked the pappy up near the secondary market price. Otherwise, the place has some of the most reasonable prices on all the standard stuff. Maybe if it's still there next weekend I'll pick it up after I figure out if it's worth it or not. Looking at the website I'm fairly certain it was the Jefferson's presidential select 21 year bourbon.


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