# Scotch



## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

So.... Ive never had a drop of scotch in my life and After hearing so much about it here and elsewhere im looking to take the first steps to enjoying it.

So my question is, what is a good starting point for scotch that wont kill my cigar/motorcycle/corvair/guns/otherstuff budget?


Thankss

Brad


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## OtterAKL4987 (Jun 4, 2007)

I'm no expert by any means, but a nice, easy to find single malt is Glenlivet. About $30 for 750ml. I'm sure other more experienced folks will chime in as well.


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## billybarue (Mar 20, 2006)

Personally, I think it might be how you start as opposed to where you start. If you are used to drinking other whiskey than disregard the first following paragraph.

"They" say Scotch is an acquired taste and for once I think I believe "them". It takes some getting used to. I started by drinking Rusty Nails (1/2 scotch, and 1/2 Drambuie). I still drink my share of them - they go well with a nice sweet Maduro. Don't waste your money on a good single malt when you are making Rusty Nails. Pick a good blended whiskey - chivas 12 yr, JW, Famous Grouse 12. Then wean yourself off the Drambuie little by little.

I still love blended whiskey, chivas 12 my standby and chivas 18 the best bang for the buck IMO. "Black Bottle" is a blend of all the Islay whiskies. Which gets me to my favorite single malt - hint, look at my sig line. Lagavulin 16 year. Islay blends are very "peaty", some say smokey, and some say tastes a little like Iodine or medicinal. I agree on some. Lagavulin I don't find as Peaty/"Iodiny" as many others. I think it is right down the middle of Islay whiskies.

Dalwhinnie, Caol Ila (Islay), Benrinnes, and Highland Park are other favorites. And the list could go on but I'll leave it at that. There will be other great recs. Some great threads on scotch here at CS as well. Here's a decent one: http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/showthread.php?t=40229

FWIW,

BillyBarue


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## JohnnyFlake (May 31, 2006)

OtterAKL4987 said:


> I'm no expert by any means, but a nice, easy to find single malt is Glenlivet. About $30 for 750ml. I'm sure other more experienced folks will chime in as well.


There are basically two types of scotch, single malt scotch and blended scotch.

Glenlivet is a great introduction into the world of single malt scotch. It's a Speyside Scotch (Region of origin) It's not very complex, very light and it offers some fruity nuances. $25/$30

Johnnie Walker Black, is not only a great blended scotch, because of it's reasonable price, it is also a great introductory scotch, into the world of blended scotch. $20/$25

The biggest favor you can do for yourself it to pick up a copy of "The Complete Guide to Single Malt Scotch" by Michael Jackson. It has great photos and great descriptions/Reviews of about 1000 Single Malt Scotchs. It also has great articles about the various regions in Scotland where they are produced.

I do not recall the name and author, but there is a similar book about blended scotch.


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## Pendaboot (Jan 2, 2008)

I rather think that if you have a completely virgin palate, you had better start out with one of the lighter blended Scotches, and then, once you find that agreeable, go out in the world of Scotch and enjoy!

The light blended Scotch I would recommend is Johnny Walker Red, or Dewars. Don't try it neat, but add a little water or Club Soda, or at least let some ice melt before starting to drink. If that agrees with you, you are off. If single malt is something you are bound and determined to start with, try Glenlivet, for the same reason.

IMHO, of course.


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## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

ok thanks ive heard it was an aquired taste. 

Think ill start with blended.

Thanks guys


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## adsantos13 (Oct 10, 2006)

Great info so far, but just an FYI there are a ton of threads about scotch. Try doing a search and reading up for a lot more good info.

Also, if you've never tried it before, IMO don't buy a bottle. Find a local bar that has a couple different blends and single malts. Try some of both and see if you like 'em then go from there. :tu

A great middle of the road (flavor-wise) scotch that wont break the bank I always recommend to scotch noobs is Highland Park 12 (a single malt). For a blend, Johnny Black is a good start.


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## RJT (Feb 12, 2005)

JohnnyFlake said:


> There are basically two types of scotch, single malt scotch and blended scotch.
> 
> Glenlivet is a great introduction into the world of single malt scotch. It's a Speyside Scotch (Region of origin) It's not very complex, very light and it offers some fruity nuances. $25/$30
> 
> ...


:tpd: I can also say the Dalmor "cigar malt" is a decent scotch for the money. :tu


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## ridmaster (Jan 4, 2008)

My first scotch was Johnny Walker Gold Label. It's a fine introduction. But Don't go buy a bottle. Go to a bar with a good scotch selection and try some individual glasses. I think it's hard to beat Macallan.


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## awsmith4 (Jun 5, 2007)

OtterAKL4987 said:


> I'm no expert by any means, but a nice, easy to find single malt is Glenlivet. About $30 for 750ml. I'm sure other more experienced folks will chime in as well.


:tpd: This is a good place to start, The Balvenie is a good place to wind up:tu


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

I'm guessing some would argue that vatted malt is also a category. I'd say going to a decent bar and sampling a few items would probably be helpful. While I agree the common logic seems to be start with what some describe as less hearty, easier malts or blends, I found myself gravitating to Island and Highland malts more so than the easier un-peated gentler malts.

When I first experimented with scotch, I had tasted Glenlivet, the Walker blends, Chivas etc. minimally and they were o.k but the first malt that grabbed me and said *buy me* was an island malt.

You never know what gets your fancy. Try them all if you can LOL ...and make a note of what you like in comparison to prior tries. Making mental notes and physically writing down simple notes can be helpful in your journey.


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

You might also like to try some of the other whiskeys as well. Not everyone is a scotch guy. Scotch has the most intense flavors and variety which is probably why it is so well discussed. It is a VERY broad topic so you can spend your life searching for your favorite and enjoy the search.

Bourbon is on the sweeter side and can be very enjoyable as well as cheaper to delve into.

Bulleit
Bookers
Makers Mark
Buffalo Trace

Irish whiskey is cleaner and drier than scotch or bourbon an IMO somewhere between the two. This is also cheaper to delve into than scotch.

Jameson
Jameson - Redbreast
Tulamore
Dewars
Bushmills


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## KASR (Aug 2, 2006)

okierock said:


> You might also like to try some of the other whiskeys as well. Not everyone is a scotch guy. Scotch has the most intense flavors and variety which is probably why it is so well discussed. It is a VERY broad topic so you can spend your life searching for your favorite and enjoy the search.
> 
> Bourbon is on the sweeter side and can be very enjoyable as well as cheaper to delve into.
> 
> ...


All good picks, Brad! I concur!


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## zonedar (Aug 2, 2006)

okierock said:


> Irish whiskey is cleaner and drier than scotch or bourbon an IMO somewhere between the two. This is also cheaper to delve into than scotch.
> 
> Jameson
> Jameson - Redbreast
> ...


Like to add Midleton to the list of Irish. A good friend of mine describes it, "like a bowl of warm soup on a cold day'. It's amazing stuff. Not cheap though.


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## JohnnyFlake (May 31, 2006)

*Thought this was a Scotch Thread. What changed?*


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## Pendaboot (Jan 2, 2008)

okierock said:


> You might also like to try some of the other whiskeys as well. Not everyone is a scotch guy...
> 
> Irish whiskey is cleaner and drier than scotch or bourbon an IMO somewhere between the two. This is also cheaper to delve into than scotch.
> 
> ...


I never heard that Dewars had an Irish Whiskey. All I know is their Blended Scotch.


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

Pendaboot said:


> I never heard that Dewars had an Irish Whiskey. All I know is their Blended Scotch.


Sorry about that. You are completely correct, I like it for a blended scotch too not sure where my head was.

I didn't mean to sidetrack the scotch thread I just wanted to give the original poster some other options. He did say he is working on a budget so I thought Bourbon and Irish Whiskey might be an easier place to start.

If I find a bottle of Dewars Irish whiskey I'll send one to you.:tu


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## RJT (Feb 12, 2005)

JohnnyFlake said:


> *Thought this was a Scotch Thread. What changed?*


:tpd: I sure do agree with you a lot....:r


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## Pendaboot (Jan 2, 2008)

okierock said:


> .... If I find a bottle of Dewars Irish whiskey I'll send one to you.:tu


Great! I can't wait to have a taste!:chk


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## billybarue (Mar 20, 2006)

I didn't know Jameson made Redbreast? I don't have a bottle on me, and have only had a dram or two, but I love the stuff!


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## Dr_Trac (Nov 8, 2006)

I remember when I first began drinking scotch...it was $2 you call it's at the bar across the street from work. I ordered some Chivas, Johnny Walker Black, Macallan, Glenfiddich, Glenlevit.

Personally I enjoyed the JW Black most...but now a few years later, I'm more a fan of the Single Malts for their heartier flavor.


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## boonedoggle (Jun 23, 2006)

tasting some nice Famous Grouse on the rocks right now. It seems to be better after melted and swirled around together.


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## pistol (Mar 23, 2006)

I always have a bottle of Macallan 12 year and Balvenie Doublewood 12 year in my cabinet (as well as about 6 other single malts). IMHO, these are both solid offerings that won't break the bank. These are also two of the best "bang for the buck" single malts on the market (again, only my humble opinion!).


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## croatan (Mar 23, 2005)

pistol said:


> I always have a bottle of Macallan 12 year and Balvenie Doublewood 12 year in my cabinet (as well as about 6 other single malts). IMHO, these are both solid offerings that won't break the bank. These are also two of the best "bang for the buck" single malts on the market (again, only my humble opinion!).


I couldn't agree more. I'm never without those two, some Macallan Cask Strength, and a few Irish whiskeys.

I noticed a few people recommending Glenlivet. Personally, I've never cared for the stuff. I've always found it harsh and boring. May just be me, though.


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## pistol (Mar 23, 2006)

croatan said:


> I couldn't agree more. I'm never without those two, some Macallan Cask Strength, and a few Irish whiskeys.
> 
> I noticed a few people recommending Glenlivet. Personally, I've never cared for the stuff. I've always found it harsh and boring. May just be me, though.


I agree, Glenlivet does nothing for me. As a general rule, if it's too "harsh" to enjoy neat or with a tiny splash of spring water, I won't purchase a bottle. If price is an issue, I'd much rather drink less good scotch than a lot of average scotch. As far as JW's go (I'm not a huge fan, but if given a dram of gold or blue, I won't turn it down), I talked to the JW rep while I was on vacation in Banff, and he told me that 70% of JW gold label is comprised of sub $20 whiskey. IMHO, there are too many great single malts out there for me to spend $80 or so on a JW gold label that's compromised mainly of average whiskeys.


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## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

picked up some mini-single bottles of JW black, Chivas 18, and Glenvelt(SP? cant find the bottle)

All were quite tasty after the inital "learning" phase. Had them with a bit of water on the rocks. 

Glen whatcha ma call it was by far my favorite, followed by Chivas 18 and then JW black. Had 2 bottles of each(buck each, works for me.) Good with a nice cigar.

Thanks for the recommendations. Wish I could find a decent shop so that i could try some more single malts. For now il get a pint of glen whatcha ma call it and go from there. Thanks for the reccomendations.

Brad


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## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

any recommendations for something a bit smother too when drinking streight up? WHile Glenilevt was good with water, when i tryed it streight i was disapointed with how harsh it was. chivas 18 was ok but kind of bland for tastes, but JW was better here.


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

Glenmorangie


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## adsantos13 (Oct 10, 2006)

Darb85 said:


> any recommendations for something a bit smother too when drinking streight up? WHile Glenilevt was good with water, when i tryed it streight i was disapointed with how harsh it was. chivas 18 was ok but kind of bland for tastes, but JW was better here.


There are a ton of other suggestions in this thread. Did you try any of the other ones or just these two?


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## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

adsantos13 said:


> There are a ton of other suggestions in this thread. Did you try any of the other ones or just these two?


I just picked up a few more tiny bottles from the list here. in fact ive hit em al except Macallan. I found the burbons and Irish Wiskeys too.

My roommate thinks im nuts with all these tiny bottles. haha. And now the search begins for Macallan...


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## Darb85 (Jan 30, 2005)

is there a reason so many start with Glen?


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## dayplanner (Dec 11, 1997)

Darb85 said:


> is there a reason so many start with Glen?


It's a halfway decent scotch and available just about anywhere. And it's cheap! It's bit too edgy for my tastes though. I don't drink scotch often, but I was schooled by the scotch master of these boards (PaulMac) and i've found through much trial and error, as well as many drunken nights that my favorite line of scotch is Balmore. I like the 12 and 15 years, it's not super expensive but it isn't cheap, and it isn't impossible to find.


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

I believe *Glen* has to do with sources of water (river). Water sources are an important part of the whisky production process. (That's purely a guess) - no yellow flags and whistle blowing, please.
:w


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## SmokeyTheKid (Aug 23, 2007)

Pendaboot said:


> I rather think that if you have a completely virgin palate, you had better start out with one of the lighter blended Scotches, and then, once you find that agreeable, go out in the world of Scotch and enjoy!
> 
> The light blended Scotch I would recommend is Johnny Walker Red, or Dewars. Don't try it neat, but add a little water or Club Soda, or at least let some ice melt before starting to drink. If that agrees with you, you are off. If single malt is something you are bound and determined to start with, try Glenlivet, for the same reason.


This is the best advice I've seen. You don't have a palate, so there's little benefit if buying a $30-$40 bottle. Either JW Red or Dewers will give you a great introduction. One place I differ is that you should never add tap water to scotch. The chlorine will completely mess up the flavor. If you want to water it, use bottled water (or well water, if you're on a well). Though if you're accustomed to whiskey, you won't need to water it at all.

In time, you'll be wanting to taste Scotch neat, but I'd start with a cube or two of ice. Not too much, though.


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## rx2010 (Jan 4, 2007)

I disagree with the JW red

starting someone off with gasoline isn't a good intro to scotch IMO

start with the black if you're going to start with JW


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## jkim05 (Feb 26, 2007)

Scotch, scotch, scotch, i like scotch...on a real note, I can't go anywhere near JW Red or Dewars and the like, I just think it tastes horrible. Currently I have about 16 single malts and a few blends...for budget selections, I'd recommend Old Pulteney for a nice Islay single malt that won't overpower you with smoke and peat and White Horse as a blend that's so cheap you almost feel bad drinking it, except it tastes much better than many blends twice the price. If you're really feeling adventureous, go out and get a distinctive malt from the four major regions of scotch production, Highlands, Lowlands, Speyside and Islay. That will give you a good feel for what you like in Scotch and what you don't. 

Finally, just to throw a few more recommendations in there: Balvenie-they're all good, but start with the Doublewood because the line really gets good at that point, I like the 12yo even better than the 15yo, Talisker-it's just so good, you have to try one eventually, Macallan-because you can't drink scotch without trying it and Ardbeg-something different, but mighty tasty.

Hope you find something you like. Feel free to ask me any other questions you might have about Scotch, I love talking about it.


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

Not to be the single malt police but Old Putney is not a distillery of Islay. I think it is generally considered a "Highland" (at least by location).


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## JohnnyFlake (May 31, 2006)

Chè said:


> Not to be the single malt police but Old Putney is not a distillery of Islay. I think it is generally considered a "Highland" (at least by location).


Yes, Old Putney is a Highlands Distillery, actually a Northern Highland Distillery. I've only had one bottle of it and that was five or six years ago. I remember it as a very good Scotch. It's not available in my neck of the woods, or at least I've not been able to find it locally. Yes, very good as I recall!


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## leebert (Jan 20, 2008)

As you can see, this topic evokes many passions. Some I agree with, and others that are just plain wrong 

Seriously, after drinking this amazing spirit for over two decades, I'd recommend you _orient_ yourself to this diverse animal. Specifically, I'd pick up a malt from the four distinct domains where it's grown and distilled. Those regions are:
Lowlands
Highlands
Speyside
Islay
Of course, aficionados will quibble over this breakout, but it's hand-grenade accurate in my book, and will get your head in the right quadrant regarding the spirit.

There are several ways you could go about this. The easiest is to pick up United Distilleries' sampler offering, which is a six pack of air-line size bottles covering all the regions. Or, you could belly up to a local bar (with a friend) and taste your way through a pouring of each. Or, finally, you could say you're interested in dropping some cash on building a scotch library (which if you come to love the spirit, you'll no doubt do), in which case I'd be happy to recommend a few approaches.

I'll admit I've left out the blends here for reasons of personal bias. There are, however, many fine offerings in this genre, and at times there's nothing better. Regardless, it's a wonderful drink to pair with a good cigar, and I hope your early experiences are enjoyable.

Best of luck,

Lee


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

Do any of you scotch FOG's have some insite into what one might expect from the four regions?

Lowlands 
Highlands 
Speyside 
Islay 

Personally the scotches I have enjoyed most are Glenmorangie, Lagavulin (moreso with a cigar than without) and Maccallan 18. I have no idea what regions these are from.


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## jkim05 (Feb 26, 2007)

yep, i wrote too quickly, old pulteney is a highland scotch...it is near the water though...do I get any points for being close to an islay??? Seriously though, I just picked up a bottle of Old Pulteney the other day for $23, it's unbeatable at that price.


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## adsantos13 (Oct 10, 2006)

okierock said:


> Do any of you scotch FOG's have some insite into what one might expect from the four regions?
> 
> Lowlands
> Highlands
> ...


How about this:

Glenmorangie - Highland
Lagavulin - Islay
Macallan - Speyside

I guess each could represent a rough estimation of the characteristics of their regions. I would say however, that scotch from the Highland region (especially if you include malts from the islands, the various seaside distilleries, and Cambeltown malts) varies quite a bit more than the other regions.


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## TripleF (May 16, 2007)

I'm a newbie when it comes to scotch as well.


This is a great and helpful post.


Just out of curiousity......why do so many gorillas have the Knob Creek Scotch pictured in their sig? Is it good or are there financial rewards for doing so?


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

fishforfree said:


> I'm a newbie when it comes to scotch as well.
> 
> This is a great and helpful post.
> 
> Just out of curiousity......why do so many gorillas have the Knob Creek Scotch pictured in their sig? Is it good or are there financial rewards for doing so?


Knob Creek is a Bourbon... a pretty tasty one too.


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## fizguy (Jul 26, 2006)

Darb85 said:


> So.... Ive never had a drop of scotch in my life and After hearing so much about it here and elsewhere im looking to take the first steps to enjoying it.
> 
> So my question is, what is a good starting point for scotch that wont kill my cigar/motorcycle/corvair/guns/otherstuff budget?
> 
> ...


My dad used to have a corvair (and a corvette) and our neighbor had like 12 of them. He raced on the weekends.

Oh, and I like Glenlivet.


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## obey3one (Jan 7, 2008)

Im pretty new to the scotch world as well, but Im really enjoying my first bottle of Glenfiddich 12 yr. Wasnt that pricey either. :2


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## leebert (Jan 20, 2008)

okierock said:


> Do any of you scotch FOG's have some insite into what one might expect from the four regions?
> 
> Lowlands
> Highlands
> ...


Lowlands: light, grassy/floral, refreshing
Highlands: rich, mineraly, spice & rugged characteristics
Speyside: oy - heartland of whisky production and great variation, from rich, wood married malts (Macallan) to light, sweet, subtle malts (Glenlivet)
Ilay: fun, peaty, sea & rich malt; again, great variation (Laphroaig to Talisker to Highland to Bowmore to...)

So, while each of these regions have canonical profile, there are variations that are significant enough to warrant copious research 

FWIW, when I do an introductory scotch tasting with my friends, we sample from each region at the same time. The first step is to look at hue of the malt, which is typically met with an understandable 'so what shrug.' But when you get to the nose, then eyes light up; without a taste, they can discern the differences and are amazed by the variety found in four glasses that look almost identical. From there, the fun begins.

Best,

Lee


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## rumballs (Mar 15, 2005)

Darb85 said:


> is there a reason so many start with Glen?





Chè said:


> I believe *Glen* has to do with sources of water (river). Water sources are an important part of the whisky production process. (That's purely a guess) - no yellow flags and whistle blowing, please.
> :w


Glen means valley. From Gaelic "Gleann".


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## okierock (Feb 24, 2006)

leebert said:


> Lowlands: light, grassy/floral, refreshing
> Highlands: rich, mineraly, spice & rugged characteristics
> Speyside: oy - heartland of whisky production and great variation, from rich, wood married malts (Macallan) to light, sweet, subtle malts (Glenlivet)
> Ilay: fun, peaty, sea & rich malt; again, great variation (Laphroaig to Talisker to Highland to Bowmore to...)
> ...


Nest time I'm in Chicago I need to stop by and participate in one of these "introductory scotch tastings".

Thanks for the insight.:tu


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## Che (Dec 4, 2003)

mmblz said:


> Glen means valley. From Gaelic "Gleann".


Yes the original Gaelic term does mean valley. In terms of why it comes up so often as a distillery name, my guess remains that it has as much if not more to do with water sources than the original term's meaning:



> A glen is a valley, typically one that is long, deep, and often glacially U-shaped; or one with a watercourse running through such a valley. The word comes from the Irish language/Scottish Gaelic language word gleann, or glion in Manx. In Manx, glan is also to be found meaning glen. As the name of a river, it is thought to derive from the Welsh language glan meaning clean, or gleindid meaning purity. In the Finger Lakes Region of New York State, the southern ends of Seneca and Cayuga in particular are etched with glens.


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