# Temperature control in hot climates



## Del Fuego (Mar 29, 2017)

I tried to do some forum searching for this topic but for some reason the search feature doesn't seem to be working correctly. It might just be my browser. I'll figure it out

I live in Vegas. It's getting hot!! I'm now realizing that I'm going to have a hard time keeping the temp in my home below 72 degrees without sending my electric bill through the roof. I'm trying to come up with a solution. I have one idea. 

Again, I tried to search the forum for this as I assume it's been asked dozens of times.

I'm wondering if there will be any issues with keeping a tupperdor inside a wine fridge?

I notice that some wine fridges go up to 64 degrees. In theory, I could build an air-tight tupperdor and keep it in the wine fridge.

Anyone have any experience with this? Pros and cons? Or just never do it?

Edit: Also, if anyone has any other suggestions for keeping the temp down in hot climates I'd love to hear it


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## ADRUNKK (Aug 16, 2016)

It's quite a common thing that people do around here. I'll see if I can find some links for you.

Here's one link.

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/cigar-accessory-discussion/239513-magic-chef-wine-cooler.html

I'm apparently not smart, I can't seem to use yield many results either with the search function.


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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

Look on Craigslist for a wine cooler--at least 18 bottle. That's how large mine is, and I'm already out of room.

I got a steal of a deal on mine--$40 and it works like a charm. It goes up to 66, but 64 is fine. If money isn't an issue, just look on Amazon. You don't need to go full-on Wynter that comes with a hefty price tag. 

Wine coolers are nearly always thermo-electric, which means they won't suck out humidity. Although, if you're planning on tupperdores, that won't matter.

Get it plugged in and fill it with tupperdores. I measured the dimensions of the inside of mine, took out all of the shelves and shoved as many tupperware containers as I could find. All tups have 3 Bovedas inside.

You could get this all set up for around $100.


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## pwaggs (Jan 10, 2017)

If the temp is a solid 72 without fluctuating too much higher and the humidity is in the 65 to 70 range, you will be fine.

But yes, you can use a wine cooler.


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## Gummy Jones (Mar 30, 2017)

i think the only logical answer is to compost and drive a prius


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

It gets hot here in Atlanta as well in the summer and add some hellacious RH to the mix and it's a precursor just in case you don't get into the Pearly Gates. I have a 100 qt. cooler and this is what I did 6 years ago.....

1. 2 pounds of KL on the bottom.....2 pounds in the middle which sits on top of a cigar box ( take the top off and let the KL sit inside the box and strap 2 big blocks of blue ice to the inside of the lid ( put them in 2 freezer bags which are sealed and then duct tape those ziplocs to the lid and close with a hygro sitting on top.

2. for the first couple of days don't add any cigars to the cooler....let it settle and check the temp/RH after a few days and you'll see where your numbers are. 

After your numbers are where they are you can decide if you want to add DW to your litter....when I did this it was in the high 80's so the dry littler kept the RH right at 70% and the temperature was around 72...which is perfect. If the temp is higher add another block of blue ice.

Stack a row of cigars at the bottom ( I used freezer bags to put cigars into and then labeled what was inside and it helps keep things orderly...don't zip the bags and just leave them open ... then put an empty cigar box on top filled with KL ....then stack more cigars in their ziploc bags with another empty cigar box full of KL and then fill the rest with what you want to store. For 5 years I've only had to freeze the blue ice 3 times in a year and it's kept the cigars at 65%/72-74 degrees and have had no issues at all.


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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

The best search word is wineador...I pulled up about 50 threads

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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

I'm procrastinating at work and decided to browse Sin City's Craigslist. See if you can get this guy down to $75 and that'd be a great deal:

https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/hsh/6012597149.html

(I'm not responsible for any murders or kidnappings)


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## Del Fuego (Mar 29, 2017)

ADRUNKK said:


> It's quite a common thing that people do around here. I'll see if I can find some links for you.
> 
> I'm apparently not smart, I can't seem to use yield many results either with the search function.


Okay, good to know. It seemed like there shouldn't be a problem, but I thought it's better to ask first rather than buy a wine fridge only to find out it's a no-no.


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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

MidwestToker said:


> (I'm not responsible for any murders or kidnappings)


You sure? Then why won't you let anyone in the basement? Just askin.

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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

Dont know if anyone mentioned this..only thermoelectric..NO COMPRESSOR run coolers.

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## Del Fuego (Mar 29, 2017)

MidwestToker said:


> Look on Craigslist for a wine cooler--at least 18 bottle. That's how large mine is, and I'm already out of room.
> 
> I got a steal of a deal on mine--$40 and it works like a charm. It goes up to 66, but 64 is fine. If money isn't an issue, just look on Amazon. You don't need to go full-on Wynter that comes with a hefty price tag.
> 
> ...


Craigslist is the way to go. People are always dumping their wine fridges on CL. If I'm lucky, I'll find one that has room for a couple tupperdor's and some wine.


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## LeatherNeck (Feb 8, 2017)

UBC03 said:


> Dont know if anyone mentioned this..only thermoelectric..NO COMPRESSOR run coolers.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk


If he keeps everything in tupperdors this is a non-issue. Compressors work through heat exchange in the air. Since humid air is warmer, compressors are essentially a dehumidifiers. Thermoelectric or solid state, work by heat transfer from one metal to another therefore have no effect on humidity. As long as the cigars are in a sealed, self-contained, air tight, mini-climate container the external air exchange will have no effect on them.


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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

LeatherNeck said:


> If he keeps everything in tupperdors this is a non-issue. Compressors work through heat exchange in the air. Since humid air is warmer, compressors are essentially a dehumidifiers. Thermoelectric or solid state, work by heat transfer from one metal to another therefore have no effect on humidity. As long as the cigars are in a sealed, self-contained, air tight, mini-climate container the external air exchange will have no effect on them.


That sounds right. I'm not a wineador or tupperdor user. So I don't know.

But my suggestion was based on turning it into a wineador. IMO If your gonna spend the cash on something, spend it on something you could upgrade later. Slippery slope rules apply.

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## scott1256ca (Jan 4, 2017)

> If he keeps everything in tupperdors this is a non-issue. Compressors work through heat exchange in the air. Since humid air is warmer, compressors are essentially a dehumidifiers. Thermoelectric or solid state, work by heat transfer from one metal to another therefore have no effect on humidity. As long as the cigars are in a sealed, self-contained, air tight, mini-climate container the external air exchange will have no effect on them.


This pretty much agrees with my understanding. Also know that if you use thermoelectric, and the temp outside the wine fridge is fairly high, you will start to get condensation from the peltier device because it has to work harder to compensate for the higher outside temps. The condensation will flow to the bottom of the wine fridge if you seal the drain hole (which you should), so you will have to keep an eye on that until you know what kind of problem it is. So anything you put on the bottom should be raised to avoid it getting soaked. That includes boxes, loose cigars and whatever humidification solution you use. i.e. a bag of beads should be raised as should boveda packs.
The larger wine coolers tend to be compressor, at least here, so you'll need to account for the tupperware in your sizing.


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## LeatherNeck (Feb 8, 2017)

UBC03 said:


> That sounds right. I'm not a wineador or tupperdor user. So I don't know.
> 
> But my suggestion was based on turning it into a wineador. IMO If your gonna spend the cash on something, spend it on something you could upgrade later. Slippery slope rules apply.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk


Very good point! So yea, if someone plans to "display" cigars outside of a sealed box/tupperdor, the compressor type is out no question. Kinda catch 22.


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## xerogravity (Apr 19, 2017)

I'm having the same issues myself. I can't afford a wineador right now and here in Florida the humidity and temperature are always at odds. I'm having an issue keeping the temperature below 80F in my humidor even though I have it in a dark place away from windows and keeping my A/C running racks up $300+ each month. I thought about a coolidor, since I have several coolers, with a small battery powered fan, but would that be enough?


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## Kidvegas (Oct 17, 2016)

xerogravity said:


> I'm having the same issues myself. I can't afford a wineador right now and here in Florida the humidity and temperature are always at odds. I'm having an issue keeping the temperature below 80F in my humidor even though I have it in a dark place away from windows and keeping my A/C running racks up $300+ each month. I thought about a coolidor, since I have several coolers, with a small battery powered fan, but would that be enough?


What where your thoughts on the small fan? Is it for circulation of your rh or an attempt to keep down the temps? Or both.

If it's only for circulation than IMO it's over kill. I know some guys use them but, my 100qt cooler keeps rh fine. I also have switched all media to KL and have had not a problem. Keeping my rh where i want it.

If your thinking about the fan for temp control than that's something i have no idea about. Although I'd be interested to see if some other Brother's are using a fan for that purpose.

I think @Cigary even mentioned the blue ice packs for food inside of a cooler to help with the temps rising. 
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## xerogravity (Apr 19, 2017)

Kidvegas said:


> What where your thoughts on the small fan? Is it for circulation of your rh or an attempt to keep down the temps? Or both.
> 
> If it's only for circulation than IMO it's over kill. I know some guys use them but, my 100qt cooler keeps rh fine. I also have switched all media to KL and have had not a problem. Keeping my rh where i want it.
> 
> ...


It would be purely for temperature control. The ice packs are a great idea, but I'm gone up to 18 hours a day so they would be melted by the time I got home I would think.


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## Kidvegas (Oct 17, 2016)

xerogravity said:


> It would be purely for temperature control. The ice packs are a great idea, but I'm gone up to 18 hours a day so they would be melted by the time I got home I would think.


I would agree with the packs melting! I have never attempted using them but, perhaps leave them in a plastic tray. If they melt atleast they wouldn't drip all over your stash. Just a thought!

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## SoCal Gunner (Apr 7, 2016)

Can someone tell me what exactly the Armageddon situation is if you store your smokes at, say, 78°F? (Assuming your humidity is under control)


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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

xerogravity said:


> It would be purely for temperature control. The ice packs are a great idea, but I'm gone up to 18 hours a day so they would be melted by the time I got home I would think.


Depending on the quality of the cooler, you'd be surprised. I've taken coolers to the beach and had ice not melt for the 5-6 hours I was there. I'm sure in a cool place those packs will keep.

Also, check Craigslist for wine coolers. They can get pretty cheap.


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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

SoCal Gunner said:


> Can someone tell me what exactly the Armageddon situation is if you store your smokes at, say, 78°F? (Assuming your humidity is under control)


I guess if you're freezing all your cigars when you get them, nothing. But for those of us who don't, it's pretty imperative to keep cigars below 65F for fear of beetles.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

xerogravity said:


> It would be purely for temperature control. The ice packs are a great idea, but I'm gone up to 18 hours a day so they would be melted by the time I got home I would think.


Blue Ice packs would work fine for all-day temp control in a coolerdor (or placing your humidor/tupperdor in a cooler with them). PITA swapping them out daily, though. I suspect that amount of upkeep will encourage you to find funds for a wineador pretty quickly. But, a viable temporary solution nonetheless.


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## SoCal Gunner (Apr 7, 2016)

MidwestToker said:


> I guess if you're freezing all your cigars when you get them, nothing. But for those of us who don't, it's pretty imperative to keep cigars below 65F for fear of beetles.


Have you ever personally seen/experienced beetles? If so, what were the circumstances?


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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

Mind you I don't live in a warm climate and my cigars never get above 65°. But my theory is watch the rh% , that's more important than temp. 

Do you think the warehouses where these are stored are air conditioned. It'd cost a mint..
The last I heard it was pretty warm in Nicaragua, the Dominican, and Cuba... 

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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

xerogravity said:


> It would be purely for temperature control. The ice packs are a great idea, but I'm gone up to 18 hours a day so they would be melted by the time I got home I would think.


I've used the Blue Ice Paks inside my Coleman coolerador with great success and as long as you get a quality cooler the block ice will last a month of more...even in summer. I had my 48 quart cooler in the garage where temps can get a bit high and put 2 Blue Ice Paks duct taped to the inside lid....kept my Accurite Hygro inside with a point of KL and swapped out frozen Blue Ice Paks about once a month and it kept a 65%/74 degree temperature. I also tested each igloo before I bought it...it had to be tight and make that "whoooosh" sound...no leaks allowed.


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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

SoCal Gunner said:


> Have you ever personally seen/experienced beetles? If so, what were the circumstances?


Nope. I guess I'm just cautious. I've read many times that temps above 75 degrees invites beetle hatching. It could be total BS.


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## MidwestToker (Sep 14, 2016)

Cigary said:


> I've used the Blue Ice Paks inside my Coleman coolerador with great success and as long as you get a quality cooler the block ice will last a month of more...even in summer. I had my 48 quart cooler in the garage where temps can get a bit high and put 2 Blue Ice Paks duct taped to the inside lid....kept my Accurite Hygro inside with a point of KL and swapped out frozen Blue Ice Paks about once a month and it kept a 65%/74 degree temperature. I also tested each igloo before I bought it...it had to be tight and make that "whoooosh" sound...no leaks allowed.


I'm just curious, do the packs get condensation, and does that affect the humidity?


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

MidwestToker said:


> I'm just curious, do the packs get condensation, and does that affect the humidity?


Have not had this happen to me....and I've been doing this for almost a decade. I ensure that I use a good freezer zip loc....squeeze all of the air out of it....then double bag it and squeeze the air out of that and it's good to go. There are vacuum bags out there where I've used those as well ( think FoodSaver bags ) and when I put KL inside the coolerador that fixes any fluctuations in RH. I tend to use a cedar cigar box to balance it all.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

MidwestToker said:


> Nope. I guess I'm just cautious. I've read many times that temps above 75 degrees invites beetle hatching. It could be total BS.


It's good to be cautious and the thing with beetles is that you'd have to have a high RH ( over 70% ) to encourage hatching beetles. Temps are pretty forgiving as I've had upwards of 78 degrees but I keep my RH around 65% which negates higher temps. There is a chart that we've all seen when where it concerns RH/Temps....if one knows they are going to have temps in the higher end of the 70's then you lower the RH to balance things. This doesn't mean you store your cigars at 80 degrees and your RH at 58%...somewhere along the lines of common sense lives us Cigar Enthusiasts...try for a logical combo.


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## xerogravity (Apr 19, 2017)

My rh is hanging about 64 with 2 bovida 72 packs, it's a 50ct humidor, and my temp fluctuates between 78-80. I just feel like I'm doing something wrong. No sun hits my humidor and it's in a dark place...granted I'm still really new at this so maybe I'm missing something.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

xerogravity said:


> My rh is hanging about 64 with 2 bovida 72 packs, it's a 50ct humidor, and my temp fluctuates between 78-80. I just feel like I'm doing something wrong. No sun hits my humidor and it's in a dark place...granted I'm still really new at this so maybe I'm missing something.


Your RH is fine...the temp is a bit high...if you can find a dark place where the air circulates well in that area you should be ok. Since your 50 count humidor is that size you could even put your humidor inside a Playmate or other type of cooler that will house your humi. If you can get the temp down to the mid 70's that would be good but I don't think you need to stress where you have it now. Usually having a small humidor you're going to smoke em up anyway.


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## Del Fuego (Mar 29, 2017)

Found an article online. Here is a snippit....

_
"A popular beetle myth is that the eggs don't hatch at temperatures below 75 deg. F. Wrong. The U.S. Department of Agriculture reports its entire growth cycle will occur, slowed but not stopped, at temperatures above 65 deg. F, assuming the humidity is above 40 percent."_

Assuming that the +40 Rh statement is true, then the only thing we are to be concerned about is temperature.


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## Ben1991 (May 30, 2017)

I also live in Atlanta and was wondering would I be fine if my humidor temps were 73-75 but a constant humidity of 65?


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