# Holt's Catalog- Copy



## Padilla cigars (May 24, 2004)

THE COPY BELOW IS FROM THE UP-COMING HOLT'S FATHER'S DAY- CIGAR CATALOG

At one point in time, Ernesto Padilla was looked upon as a rising star in the cigar world. He was young and hungry, and he had a couple of lights-out, cutting edge cigars being manufactured by another rising star: Pepin Garcia. He also had a nice cigar being made in the Oliva factory. He received glowing ratings, lots of publicity, and all seemed to be going well for him. That was a couple years ago. Nowadays, the tide has taken an unfortunate turn for Padilla. Neither Pepin nor Oliva are making cigars for him anymore. We think this means one thing and one thing only: Padilla is on his way out... We have nothing against Padilla personally. In fact, we consider him to be a friend of ours. We simply do not want to get caught sitting on a ton of discontinued, sedentary, totally immobile inventory.

Therefore, we're cutting prices on all Padilla products bigtime! We're slashing prices on Padilla left and right, and blowing this stuff out from not 'till it's gone! Join in on the fun that is "Padilla Madness" and procure yourself some Padilla cigars today. Hey Ernie P., we've got one word for you and one word only: Buh-Bye.



From Padilla Cigars:
Cigar-Live Members, 

I was alerted to the recent Holt's catalog and wanted to reply. 

First, I want to thank everyone for their input on this thread.
Itís nice to see that most people can see beyond whatís written in a
cigar catalog. It is unfortunate that in their attempt to close out our
product that they had to write such incorrect and inflammatory copy.
While everyone is entitled to their opinions, there are many factual
inaccuracies in that copy that I would address.

As you all know, Pepin, Ashton and Holtís have become very close in
recent months. Because of their growing relationship, Padilla Cigars
knew that eventually we would have difficulty securing the cigars we
needed to grow as a company. We also knew that in order for us to take
the next step as a cigar company, we would have to manufacturer our own
cigars. That is why Pepin and Padilla mutually agreed to part ways.
This split has given us the opportunity to build our own factory so we
can better control both our blends and our inventory. Leaving the
Pepin factory was difficult, but as you will see, we believe this move
will result in better blends and better cigars. And you have my promise
that Padilla's existing blends will retain both the quality and the
flavor you have come to expect from us.

In the coming months, once the factory is complete, you will see
Padilla Cigars in the marketplace stronger than ever. We will have more
inventory than ever and will continue to create the best boutique blends
on the market. Despite what Holt's might think, we are definitely
NOT on our way out. 

Also incorrect is their description of our relationship with Oliva
Cigars. I continue to have a wonderful and productive relationship with
Jose Oliva and his family continues to have an impact on Padilla
Cigars. The Habano blend is still the product of our relationship with the
family. 

We are working with the Oliva family to formally address this issue
with Holt's. We don't know how this will resolve itself, but as was
stated in this thread earlier, take everything you read with a grain of
salt. 

The reports of our demise are greatly exaggerated. 

Ernesto Padilla 
Padilla cigars


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## baboruger (Jun 18, 2007)

Well, I say I never believe what those catalogs say anyway! I just tried the 1968 and it was a fantastic cigar! I cannot wait to see what is to come from your company.


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## Stogie (Feb 13, 2007)

I would say it is going to be stronger than ever. I recently spoke with Ernesto and we agreed upon me creating a new forum specifically for his cigars. As most know the creation of NUbLive.com was the first attempt to do this and it has worked wonderfully for Sam Leccia.

PadillaLive.com will be one of the next two forums that will follow the same format and rules as CigarLive.com and NUbLive.com. Ernesto will then be able to promote PadillaLive.com at his events and also we at CigarLive.com will gain members from PadillaLive.com as well. It works great and expands the CigarLive.com network. I will launch it as soon as I can and get some videos up as well.


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## iloveclmore (Jan 23, 2008)

Eh, I never believe anything that those catalogs print anyway. Its usually just marketing bullshit.


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## corbu12 (Apr 3, 2007)

way to take the high road!


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## vudu9 (Mar 7, 2005)

Bad form - plain and simple. OF COURSE they intended to print it because they meant EVERY WORD of it! The apology by Sathya rings hollow in my opinion. They don't regret letting it go to print. They regret the volume of outcry and negative attention it's brought to Holt's and, Ashton proper.


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## GreySmoke (Jan 11, 2008)

I look forward to your new factory and new blends. Personally I think Pepin's quality controll needs some looking after anyway. I enjoy your entire lline from the Habano's through the 32,48,68's and 8&11's.
As for you being on the way out, I am estatic to hear it taint so... Thanks for so many enjoyable smokes.


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## g8trbone (Apr 26, 2007)

Wow... I'm glad I don't get their catalog... that is just rude! 

Thank you again, Ernesto for being part of CigarLive and I wish you continued success... I really need to get across the state to say hello!


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## ER Doc (Feb 8, 2007)

> We have nothing against Padilla personally. In fact, we consider him to be a friend of ours.


Wow - glad I don't have any friends like that.

I am very glad to have you here with CigarLive and look forward to the new stuff planned to come out of the new factory.


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## boomerd35 (Apr 24, 2007)

I would have believed that copy as much as I believe catalog stories that begin with something like: "I was touring XX factory, and Mr. XX said, 'I've got too much of this XXY on my hands.' I told him if he was willing to make a deal, I'd buy the entire lot. So I made the deal of a lifetime, and now I'm able to sell XXY direct to you at an unheard of savings."


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## Stogie (Feb 13, 2007)

boomerd35 said:


> I would have believed that copy as much as I believe catalog stories that begin with something like: "I was touring XX factory, and Mr. XX said, 'I've got too much of this XXY on my hands.' I told him if he was willing to make a deal, I'd buy the entire lot. So I made the deal of a lifetime, and now I'm able to sell XXY direct to you at an unheard of savings."


Haha Good point!


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## Toasted Coastie (Feb 16, 2008)

I haven't received my catalog yet, but the website has this:



> Padilla Madness
> 
> Discontinued brands, blowout prices!
> 
> Unfortunately, Ernesto Padilla is no longer having cigars manufactured by Pepin Garcia or the Oliva family. We have always been big Padilla supporters, so when we found out that the Padilla Miami, Padilla Signature and Padilla Habano were all being discontinued we became very dismayed. We are sitting on a large inventory of these 3 brands and now that they've been discontinued, we are left with no other option then closing them out ourselves. So, get in on Padilla Madness and procure yourself some Padilla cigars today at these basement prices. These gems are manufactured by esteemed cigar makers, Pepin Garcia and Oliva, so you know the quality is top-notch.


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## JonDot (Mar 7, 2008)

I have never ordered from Holt's.If this is the way they conduct business,I never will.


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## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

boomerd35 said:


> I would have believed that copy as much as I believe catalog stories that begin with something like: "I was touring XX factory, and Mr. XX said, 'I've got too much of this XXY on my hands.' I told him if he was willing to make a deal, I'd buy the entire lot. So I made the deal of a lifetime, and now I'm able to sell XXY direct to you at an unheard of savings."


very good point and one I whole heartedly agree with the only thing is this one that there pulling with padillia is a little different there atacking him personally the end comment of "one word for you buh bye" makes Ernesto apear to be a hard person to deal with. what holts did here is simply inexcuseable and flat out poor business I will not order from them again.


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## Rocky Rulz (Jan 5, 2008)

Just one more bad reason not to order from thompson's. Let them secure all the dogturds they can find, and let the premium stuff like Padilla to the people who truly appreciate it! DUMBASSES!


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## Rocky Rulz (Jan 5, 2008)

Rocky Rulz said:


> Just one more bad reason not to order from thompson's. Let them secure all the dogturds they can find, and let the premium stuff like Padilla to the people who truly appreciate it! DUMBASSES!


Sorry HOLTS!


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## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

ok so I just downloaded the fathers day catalog and it dosen't say alot of what your first post says I think someone is messing with you unless you saw the catalog than in that case they must be changing what they put out


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## cybervee-cl (Oct 24, 2007)

JonDot said:


> I have never ordered from Holt's.If this is the way they conduct business,I never will.


So who orders from Holts anyway?

:roflmao:


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## Ceedee (Jun 2, 2006)

Wow. That is simply incredible. It's hard to imagine in such a time as ours, that this type of crap is still happening. I mean, did they not realize that it's about as easy as going to read this forum to find out that their marketing bullcrap is just that, bullcrap? I am really astonished that they would have the nerve to stab Padilla in the back like that when all of us are watching.

I can say this, I will not be ordering anything from Holt's EVER again. Period.

CD


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## stig-cl (Nov 13, 2007)

They'll dump their inventory of Padilla's at low prices (great for us), and when they realize Padilla is still around, they'll have to order a lot more from you to resupply (great for you). Holt's will be embarrassed, and we'll all be happy! :redface:


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## AragornElessar86 (May 21, 2007)

jitzy said:


> ok so I just downloaded the fathers day catalog and it dosen't say alot of what your first post says I think someone is messing with you unless you saw the catalog than in that case they must be changing what they put out


Would you be willing to post a photo of the actual catalog page? I've always liked Holt's, so I'd be happy to see their rep reclaimed a bit, otherwise I'm gonna have to stop ordering there. That's not the way to run business. I hope this is all a misunderstanding.


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## Ceedee (Jun 2, 2006)

jitzy said:


> ok so I just downloaded the fathers day catalog and it dosen't say alot of what your first post says I think someone is messing with you unless you saw the catalog than in that case they must be changing what they put out


Jitz, I think that Ernesto is speaking directly about the printed catalog. Print catalogs have longer turn-around times and I think he means that the print catalog is going out with the language he quoted. I think that they decided to tone things down a bit with their online version, once people gave them enough poor responses, including Padilla cigars and Ernesto specifically. Still no excuse, and as Dion pointed out, I believe they knew exactly what they were doing - the only part they didn't figure on was the poor response to their fallacious statement.

CD


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## Padilla cigars (May 24, 2004)

Link below -to both old version and new version of Holt's catalog scroll down.

http://www.cigarpass.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=45474&st=80


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## CGARMAN23 (May 16, 2008)

Ernesto I can't wait for the new cigars to come out. I wish you continued success and as for Holt's it shows how much they know.


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## Skipper-cl (May 6, 2008)

Ernesto said:


> THE COPY BELOW IS FROM THE UP-COMING HOLT'S FATHER'S DAY- CIGAR CATALOG
> 
> ... We have nothing against Padilla personally. In fact, we consider him to be a friend of ours. We simply do not want to get caught sitting on a ton of discontinued, sedentary, totally immobile inventory.
> 
> Therefore, we're cutting prices on all Padilla products bigtime! We're slashing prices on Padilla left and right, and blowing this stuff out from not 'till it's gone! Join in on the fun that is "Padilla Madness" and procure yourself some Padilla cigars today. Hey Ernie P., we've got one word for you and one word only: Buh-Bye.


Am I the only one who sees a contradiction here?

By the way, a few weeks ago I had the pleasure or meeting Ernesto P and spend the day, more or less, with him & Jose Oliva at the CI Cigar Fest. I can tell you that Ernesto and Jose' were very close. In fact Padilla spent more time at the Oliva booth then at his own!


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## canney (Sep 2, 2007)

Ceedee said:


> Jitz, I think that Ernesto is speaking directly about the printed catalog. Print catalogs have longer turn-around times and I think he means that the print catalog is going out with the language he quoted. I think that they decided to tone things down a bit with their online version, once people gave them enough poor responses, including Padilla cigars and Ernesto specifically. Still no excuse, and as Dion pointed out, I believe they knew exactly what they were doing - the only part they didn't figure on was the poor response to their fallacious statement.
> 
> CD


Chris
You are correct
I received my Holts catalog today and they do dog Ernesto kinda badly.


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## Shelby07 (May 1, 2007)

I have bought quite a bit from Holts. They usually have some pretty good smokes and samplers. This is gonna make me think.

We'll see how it rolls out.

Ernesto, Just a quick note to you. Your cigars are among my favorites. I enjoy them quite often and I am pleased to hear that I will be able to continue doing so. Keep up the good work!


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## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

Ernesto I just got the print catalog at home and am floored by what they said its simply uncalled for and they owe you a public apology for that one that is bad for both you and them. I told my wife to read the catalog and let me know how she felt and she said she would buy any Padillia he sounds like someone I wouldn't want to do business with. This is a very bad thing for your company thats trying to grow he just kicked you back years with one catalog.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

Ernesto said:


> THE COPY BELOW IS FROM THE UP-COMING HOLT'S FATHER'S DAY- CIGAR CATALOG
> 
> At one point in time, Ernesto Padilla was looked upon as a rising star in the cigar world. He was young and hungry, and he had a couple of lights-out, cutting edge cigars being manufactured by another rising star: Pepin Garcia. He also had a nice cigar being made in the Oliva factory. He received glowing ratings, lots of publicity, and all seemed to be going well for him. That was a couple years ago. Nowadays, the tide has taken an unfortunate turn for Padilla. Neither Pepin nor Oliva are making cigars for him anymore. We think this means one thing and one thing only: Padilla is on his way out... We have nothing against Padilla personally. In fact, we consider him to be a friend of ours. We simply do not want to get caught sitting on a ton of discontinued, sedentary, totally immobile inventory.
> 
> ...


First of all, I am sorry that Holt's handled the situation so publicly, regardless of the TRUE reason for it.

But tell us, is there any truth to the multiple rumors from multiple sources that you aren't paying your bills? Even if it is true, I wouldn't expect a truthful answer written online as evidence for all to see. I hope that the rumors are not true, but I have heard them from multiple, seperate sources, as I, too, am in the business. Although I'm a small timer not even worthy of big-time respect, I do hear "inside" information quite regularly.

Clarification would be nice. Feel free to PM me if you don't wish to disclose here, altough I am just a peon and it really isn't any of my business. However, I would not wish to support someone who doesn't pay their bills while making money off the items that are unpaid for.

For the record, I have nothing against you and I like your cigars (except the constantly plugged lanceros - hopefully fixed in your new factory). I would just like to clear up the rumors that have been running rampant for a little bit of time now.

Thanks.


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## Stogie (Feb 13, 2007)

I find it hard to believe most rumors like that. I personally have to say that Ernesto squared things with me right away for a sponsorship here and I feel that those are just rumors. People hate when others are sucessfull and sometimes those people start rumors just for that. Believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see.


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## The EVP (Dec 21, 2007)

Looks like Holt's just lost themselves a customer. It's not so much dropping a line of cigar that bothers me...business is business and it happens sometimes. However, there is a tasteful way to go about explaining the change. Guess Holt's hasn't figured that out yet....


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## canney (Sep 2, 2007)

I think there is a lot more to this than we know.
For Holts to bring out and grill 1 guy,
just seems kinda weird


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## tx_tuff (Jun 16, 2007)

Ernesto I love your cigars and the 32 is in fact one of my fav cigars right now. I have posted here from the very the first thread posted and you and Pepin spliting ways that I thought it was a good thing and shows how you are starting to grow. I have not ever bought from Holts, mainly because I try to buy all my cigars from B&Ms to support them even if the costs are a little higher. But I know for sure now that I will not buy anything from them, even if they where selling yours cigars for a dollar each I will not buy them. I look forward to trying any new blends that you come out with and am also glad that other blends are staying the same. Even though I know you don't need it here is wishing you luck on your new factory and I am proud that you are a sponser here on CigarLive!


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## tx_tuff (Jun 16, 2007)

SVB said:


> First of all, I am sorry that Holt's handled the situation so publicly, regardless of the TRUE reason for it.
> 
> But tell us, is there any truth to the multiple rumors from multiple sources that you aren't paying your bills? Even if it is true, I wouldn't expect a truthful answer written online as evidence for all to see. I hope that the rumors are not true, but I have heard them from multiple, seperate sources, as I, too, am in the business. Although I'm a small timer not even worthy of big-time respect, I do hear "inside" information quite regularly.
> 
> ...


Wow I am shocked and embarrased that you would ask him this right out in the open than say he can answer you in a PM because he may not want to disclose this here. You coments are very rude and coming from somebody that says he is in the business it would seem that you would not bring this kind of thing out in the open like this.


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## aljrka (Dec 3, 2007)

tx_tuff said:


> Wow I am shocked and embarrased that you would ask him this right out in the open than say he can answer you in a PM because he may not want to disclose this here. You coments are very rude and coming from somebody that says he is in the business it would seem that you would not bring this kind of thing out in the open like this.


I completely agree with you but on the contrary all rumors must be squashed between what we as consumers know as second hand knowledge and what actually has/is happening. Although I DO NOT feel that CL is the place to ask these type of questions!!!!!!!!


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## terrasco-cl (Mar 4, 2007)

Padilla makes some great cigars and I look forward to them establishing their own factory.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

aljrka said:


> I completely agree with you but on the contrary all rumors must be squashed between what we as consumers know as second hand knowledge and what actually has/is happening. Although I DO NOT feel that CL is the place to ask these type of questions!!!!!!!!


I don't feel I was rude at all. I am a long-time customer of Holt's and they wouldn't risk their entire good name reputation on a whim. Surely there is more to the story than we know/realize. One of the prominent rumors is the one I mentioned.

Rather than spread it as hearsay, I ask it directly and publicly, so Ernesto can address it publicly. As he is a sponsor of this site, I think we ALL have the right to know and what better opportunity to have the question asked publicly and answered publicly.

Would you follow or support someone blindly??? Certainly not I.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

tx_tuff said:


> Wow I am shocked and embarrased that you would ask him this right out in the open than say he can answer you in a PM because he may not want to disclose this here. You coments are very rude and coming from somebody that says he is in the business it would seem that you would not bring this kind of thing out in the open like this.


Why wouldn't I want customers and loyal supporters to know if it is the truth? I ask it publicly so he can address it publicly. I am not embarrassed, and if they are truly bad, false rumors, he should have no problem answering it publicly, as I am not the only one who has heard these rumors.

I asked the question like a man, rather than spreading the rumor as hearsay, I asked him directly, so that he can let everyone know the facts.

I am not going to walk on eggshells just because he is a sponsor of this site. It is a legitimate question that needs answering. I am sorry if that bothers some of you, but if the rumors are false, then there shouldn't even be an issue...Correct?


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## chip1922 (Jan 13, 2008)

Well, what ever the case we heard it from the horses mouth that it wasn't true. Hard to believe Holts would do something like that.


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## boomerd35 (Apr 24, 2007)

Personally, I wouldn't answer those kinds of questions publicly if I were Padilla. Whose business is it how he pays his bills except his and his vendors'? Now if he's in financial trouble, why would he want to answer questions about that, either? If we're so concerned with the manufacturers' payment habits, let's get the cigar reviewers to start putting a credit score next to each cigar's rating. And if we're going to make Padilla answer these questions, let's ask all the boutique manufacturers to open their books so we can make sure they are all solvent too. Just my opinion.

BTW- even if Padilla stiffed Holts on some product or something, it just looks classless to post what they did in the catalog, and they'll see it will backfire on them.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

I am not saying that at all...If he made money off of cigars that he didn't pay for, don't you think that is wrong?

I am not saying that this is the case, just what the rumors are saying...

As a note, Holt's couldn't get stiffed by Padilla, as they don't manufacture cigars for him...But their close friend, Pepin, could have, and they have the vehicle to call him out. Just a thought...

As I said earlier, I like Padilla's cigars and have nothing against him. I think we as customers have a right know if we are supporting a bad businessman or not.


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## Yesenia-cl (Dec 29, 2007)

Real classy, Holt's! They just lost a customer. Bravo to Ernesto for handling the situation so graciously.


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## Wiseash (Jan 30, 2008)

SVB said:


> I am not saying that at all...If he made money off of cigars that he didn't pay for, don't you think that is wrong?
> 
> I am not saying that this is the case, just what the rumors are saying...
> 
> ...


It's easy to see from your first post why you describe yourself, aptly I might add, as "a peon." Your subsequent posts confirm it. Padilla's business is just that, his business. He's not obligated to you or anyone else to address rumors "a peon" chose to irresponsibly throw out. If you think he's "a bad businessman" then don't patronize his company, plain and simple. If you're not a shareholder in his company, how he conducts business is really none of your concern.

It was extremely bad form by Holt's. Period. And Sathya's apology stinks.

I already enjoy his cigars (the 32 gets most of the love on here, but I'm partial to the 48 myself), but Mr. Padilla has earned added respect by taking the high road on this one.


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## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

Wiseash said:


> It's easy to see from your first post why you describe yourself, aptly I might add, as "a peon." Your subsequent posts confirm it. Padilla's business is just that, his business. He's not obligated to you or anyone else to address rumors "a peon" chose to irresponsibly throw out. If you think he's "a bad businessman" then don't patronize his company, plain and simple. If you're not a shareholder in his company, how he conducts business is really none of your concern.
> 
> _Edited out._
> 
> ...


where I do agree with your point of its his business the rest of your post is completely out of line and completely un-called for


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## baboruger (Jun 18, 2007)

jitzy said:


> where I do agree with your point of its his business the rest of your post is completely out of line and completely un-called for


Ditto...


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## mitro-cl (Jul 5, 2007)

Wiseash said:


> If you're not a shareholder in his company, how he conducts business is really none of your concern.


It IS my concern. Its very easy to come out and say that a rumor is completely false. If ANY company is not acting in a way that is fair to all parties involved, I tend not to buy from that company. I'm not accusing Padilla of anything and I'm completely disgusted by Holts (and the part that Pepin plays in this), but I think the question is a fair one.

As for the rest of your ramblings, I think they are out of line.


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## Maduro PiPs (Jul 5, 2007)

jitzy said:


> where I do agree with your point of its his business the rest of your post is completely out of line and completely un-called for


LOL!!!!


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## Maduro PiPs (Jul 5, 2007)

I do not have any knowledge of what goes on behind closed doors, but on a personal level, I do enjoy Padilla Cigars and will continue to support Padilla. As Skip mentioned, the relationship with Ernesto and the Oliva Family seems very strong. We had the opportunity to meet and hang out with Ernesto for 2 days and he is a very down to earth, cool dude. I even asked him a few questions about his line and the new factory. He did not withhold any info and was happy to share.

I still have the new Padilla 68 Ernesto threw at me when I passed his booth at the Fest sporting my NUB shirt! I asked him what he was givin out....but in a fun way! LOL....We met the night before at Atlantic and we assisted Sam with bombing his Padilla booth with NUB stickers before the fest started. So as you can see, there is a tight relationship between the two families. 

I just wish Ernesto all the best - very low class move by Holt's - I rarely gave them any business.....now that rarely will turn into zero.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

_Edited out._



Wiseash said:


> It was extremely bad form by Holt's. Period. And Sathya's apology stinks.


Agreed on the form part.



Wiseash said:


> I...but Mr. Padilla has earned added respect by taking the high road on this one.


Agreed. I also have added respect for him, and based on the feedback I have been getting, the "rumors" are false (though I have heard neither from the horse's mouth).

However, if there was a common legitimate rumor out there about me spreading around multiple cigar (or other) circles that I didn't know about (not the "I hear he has two wives" or "I heard his d*ck is tiny" multiple bullcrap rumors), I would like to have someone call me on it publicly, so that I could squash a particular rumor publicly, especially if it were 1 common rumor held by many groups. That way, there would be written evidence of my squashing the rumor, not just someone's hearsay. But apparently that's just me.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

Wiseash said:


> If you're not a shareholder in his company, how he conducts business is really none of your concern.


Based on this logic, I guess that companies who are rumored to directly/indirectly support terrorism are "really none of [my] concern", as long as I am not a shareholder, and I quit buying my 1 or 2 items from that multi-million dollar company (as if losing my 1 or 2 sales will make a difference or will even be noticed) :nerd:


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

Aww tekeeladude, I thought Wiseash's chicken rumor comments were funny!!! Truth is, I DO have feathers stuck in my zipper


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## Webmeister (Jun 12, 2007)

Maduro PiPs said:


> I just wish Ernesto all the best - very low class move by Holt's - I rarely gave them any business.....now that rarely will turn into zero.


Couldn't have said it better myself Mario. Just had my last Miami Tuesday night, and I need more. I'll be buying them elsewhere thank you very much.

Keep on kicking out those delicious stogies Ernesto!


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## Stogie (Feb 13, 2007)

Ok Guys this is getting close to that line that I personally find offensive. Tone it down or I will end it. I like open discussion but it is a bit like a broken record at this point. Our goal of the forum is not to give members a crack at the manufacturers and I will not let it happen. Everyone has made thier points so just find something else to talk about. I am not going to waste anymore time on this thread. I spent about 8 hours with Ernesto Padilla and I can honestly say he is a pleasure to be around. When we went to Domino park the old men were talking his ear off. Those men smoke $1 avg cigars but they all had the BOTL attitude. I will get the videos up for sure by this weekend so you guys can see the man he is. Rumors are BS.....good example is people make all kinds of rumors about this website and they are not further from the truth.


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## svb (Jan 12, 2008)

Stogie said:


> Ok Guys this is getting close to that line that I personally find offensive. Tone it down or I will end it. I like open discussion but it is a bit like a broken record at this point. Our goal of the forum is not to give members a crack at the manufacturers and I will not let it happen. Everyone has made thier points so just find something else to talk about. I am not going to waste anymore time on this thread. I spent about 8 hours with Ernesto Padilla and I can honestly say he is a pleasure to be around. When we went to Domino park the old men were talking his ear off. Those men smoke $1 avg cigars but they all had the BOTL attitude. I will get the videos up for sure by this weekend so you guys can see the man he is. Rumors are BS.....good example is people make all kinds of rumors about this website and they are not further from the truth.


I trust your judgment and will consider as authority on the subject. Please excuse me if my comments were borderline, as that was never my original intent. Thanks for the site, as I thoroughly enjoy it (just not the maintenance part, when I think my work is conspiring against me by somehow blocking me from viewing it the last few days!!!)


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## Bullybreed (Jun 25, 2007)

I could careless about any rumors or the horses mouth, all I care about is a good cigar and as long as there good im happy, when they start turning bad then ill bitch and ask WTF?


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## Wiseash (Jan 30, 2008)

SVD, the fact that your entire premise is based on something as nefarious as a "common legitimate rumor" was my issue. As a trained journalist, "common legitimate rumor" just makes me cringe, that's all. Rumors, by definition, have no legitimacy, common or otherwise. But I'm glad you saw the humor in my feather comment because that's all it was meant as, a gentle poke in the ribs. I'm perfectly willling to agree to disagree with you and the others who think Mr. Padilla owes anyone a public accounting of any rumor. 

Stogie, sorry. I'm done.


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## Stogie (Feb 13, 2007)

No problem, I believe that we are all big boys and nothing says we have to agree about everything. I think sometimes people tend to think that just because they are your friends you will get mad at them for a disagreement. I do not believe this. I often disagree with things with my best buddy but we are grown ups now and that is OK. To each is own and we all have our different views.


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## Fishhound (Mar 14, 2007)

Here is a copy of a E-mail I sent to Holts.

Dear Sir,

I'm sending this E-mail in regards to the low blow you took at Ernesto Padilla in the fathers day catalog. I have to say that I was shocked and disappointed to see the Holts company write something like this about Ernesto. Just to be clear I have supported your company in the past and recommended many other cigar smokers to your web site as well. You have always had good pricing, a amazing catalog, and fast good service. However your companies behavior in the last catalog was inexcusable.

I am a member of Stogie Chat, Cigar Live, Cigar Pass, and a few others as well. I'm sure you are aware of the opinion of your company after your latest catalog went out. Here is a link to one of the threads I am referring to. http://www.stogiechat.com/cigar-forum/view_topic.php?id=10392&forum_id=2

Sathya Levin's apology rings hollow in my ear, I feel it was only written in an effort to control the damage that the back cover of your catalog had done to the image of Holts amongst the large community of the many cigar boards. Which we all know are in the tens of thousands of members and just as many people who just read the boards. I don't speak for any of the boards or the many members that will be reading this when I post it. However I do speak for myself when I do say to you, if I don't see a printed retraction in your next catalog I will never purchase anything from your company again. I will not recommend you to any of my fellow BOTL who are looking for recommendations of online websites to buy cigars from.

In closing I hope you make a sincere effort to correct the wrong you have done to Ernesto. I would like to be able to purchase cigars from Holt's again in the future, but until this is resolved I just can't.


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## tx_tuff (Jun 16, 2007)

Really great email! I hope they take it to heart!


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## happy1 (Jun 29, 2007)

tx_tuff said:


> Really great email! I hope they take it to heart!


Ditto,they ain't the only retailer out there


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## Ceedee (Jun 2, 2006)

Bob, that was very well stated. I really hope that the people at Holt's take your comments to heart. Well done Sir, well done!

CD


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## jitzy (Jan 7, 2007)

Bob very well stated I'm going to send one too and would encourage others to do the same


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## smokinj (Jan 16, 2008)

jitzy said:


> Bob very well stated I'm going to send one too and would encourage others to do the same


I'm in. I am becoming a Padilla whore!! Love the blends.Keep up the good work


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## Reverend Mike (Sep 4, 2007)

Well, the best way to deal with this is for Padilla to bring this next step in his history to the point of popularity in his own right. I'm a little floored by the wording of the Holts marketers. It's a small business and you shouldn't take that type of tone with anyone. Padilla is taking a risk in this move, but he's proved he's good at doing business.

As a retailer, I don't ever want to get caught with product that we can't sell. I'm certainly not saying this will be the case with the new Padillas, but you have to try the product before you can make a judgment whether to invest in it. To take a shot across the bow of a new line that isn't even really available isn't fair and Holts (hopefully) is making a bad move here.

My Mother always told me "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all." My Grandfather told me "Keep your mouth shut and people won't know how dumb you are." From that advice, I'd say that Holts should have just let their stock run-out and not said a word other than "Out of stock".


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## Doogie (Oct 15, 2007)

today is the first time i read this thread. I don't do business with holts so i never opened the thread. i can't beleave holts would do this to such a fine gentleman. if i was padilla i would never let them sell my cigars again. no after the fact apolligy is any good. the damage is done.


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## silentjon (Apr 19, 2007)

I received the Holts Summer 2008 Catalog today and in the middle was this letter form Sathya Levin:

"Holt's Cigar Company would like to issue a humble apology to Ernesto Padilla, Padilla Cigars and the entire cigar community for the comments made in our Father's Day 2008 Catalog. These comments were rude and embarrassing to both Padilla and Holt's. The printing of these comments was an inexcusable error; however, they do not accurately represent the view of Holt's, or the Levin Family. For over 100 years, Holt's name has been synonymous with high quality products, premier customer service and a high level of respect for both our customers and suppliers. As industry leaders, we have a responsibility to promote and maintain a certain level of respect and camaraderie within the cigar community and these comments failed greatly in meeting those standards. We have undertaken measures within our company to ensure hat something of this nature never happens again."


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## canney (Sep 2, 2007)

thanks for the info, they never replied to an email I sent them


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## g8trbone (Apr 26, 2007)

Interesting... wonder if they canned someone over the printing of that original book.


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## mitro-cl (Jul 5, 2007)

It should have never happened in the first place, but I feel thats a sufficient apology. Of course I'm not the one they were talking about.


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## kenstogie-cl (Apr 29, 2008)

First time I read this thread and am surprised at Holt's comments. I think it was good that they posted an apology but did they do it because it's the right thing to do or because of backlash from the poor comment? Another question I have is do they not have editors that review these things? I would think they do.


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## boomerd35 (Apr 24, 2007)

But they don't say what the error was. Did a 20 year old intern hijack the copy and they made an error in not catching it? Or was the copy exactly what they meant to print, and their error was that they underestimated the backlash that their comments would cause?


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## boomerd35 (Apr 24, 2007)

Wow, Ken. We must have posted at the same time and were thinking about the same thing.


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## sseagle (Jun 5, 2008)

it smells of CYA syndrome...


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## ER Doc (Feb 8, 2007)

Well, at least they apologized. For what? Who knows...but at least they apologized.


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## Huskysibe (Apr 7, 2008)

Still unexcusable in my book, someone took the time to write that. It didnt appear as a joke, even if it was it was a poor one. Padilla blends are awesome and I will continue to buy them when I find them. 

Billy


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## kenstogie-cl (Apr 29, 2008)

boomerd35 said:


> Wow, Ken. We must have posted at the same time and were thinking about the same thing.


Jinx, you owe me a cigar.


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## kenstogie-cl (Apr 29, 2008)

sseagle said:


> it smells of CYA syndrome...


Is that what that smell is?


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## Lighthouse (Sep 5, 2007)

My guess is Holt's knew all along what they were doing. Copy like that simply does not "slip by" the copy editor's. That copy was wirtten by/and/or at least approved by management. If not, Holt's is completely rudderless and adrift in the marketplace with no direction at the top. 

I would guess their response is more than a CYA. It's most likely a response to a letter from a Padilla attorney which laid out the fact that Holt's can be held liable for the negative impact/loss of business Padilla experienced.

Clearly there is some bad blood in the system. However, Ernesto took the high ground on this situation and I think he will be fine in the long run as his brand and product have been great. Holt's is the one with egg on thier face. JMHO


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## baboruger (Jun 18, 2007)

I think Chuck is 100% on the mark with this one. There could be a lawsuit there very easily and the response is either a CYA or what was agreed upon.

I also agree that something like that could just not "slip by" There would be so many sets of eyes on the copy prior to it going out that no one noticed? Please.

This in my mind, all comes back to Holts and Ashton getting into bed with Pepin and Ernesto being the one push out. I think the Holts was just trying to thumb their nose a Padilla and say look at what happened we won out with Pepin, ha ha. Very childish if you ask me.



Lighthouse said:


> My guess is Holt's knew all along what they were doing. Copy like that simply does not "slip by" the copy editor's. That copy was wirtten by/and/or at least approved by management. If not, Holt's is completely rudderless and adrift in the marketplace with no direction at the top.
> 
> I would guess their response is more than a CYA. It's most likely a response to a letter from a Padilla attorney which laid out the fact that Holt's can be held liable for the negative impact/loss of business Padilla experienced.
> 
> Clearly there is some bad blood in the system. However, Ernesto took the high ground on this situation and I think he will be fine in the long run as his brand and product have been great. Holt's is the one with egg on thier face. JMHO


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## tx_tuff (Jun 16, 2007)

I don't think it was a mistake. They thought it would be something they would get away with and probaly have done it before to other people. They just didn't expect use the cigar smokers to get pissed and say anything, they thought we would just be happy to get a good deal and buy the cigars!

I don't think Pepin has anything at all to do with it, and my gult feeling is if Padilla still wanted Pepin blending and making his cigars he would be. I think Padilla pulling away and doing his own thing is awesome and can't wait to give some new blends a try!


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## baboruger (Jun 18, 2007)

I think there were some hard feelings there. Go back and review the post about Pepin selling his soul, and at the end there are some interesting quotes from Ernesto...I think they were all nice in public, but behind closed doors there were some issues, just going by those quotes.

Here is the link:
http://www.cigarlive.com/forum/showthread.php?p=272654&highlight=pepin+sell+soul#post272654



tx_tuff said:


> I don't think it was a mistake. They thought it would be something they would get away with and probaly have done it before to other people. They just didn't expect use the cigar smokers to get pissed and say anything, they thought we would just be happy to get a good deal and buy the cigars!
> 
> I don't think Pepin has anything at all to do with it, and my gult feeling is if Padilla still wanted Pepin blending and making his cigars he would be. I think Padilla pulling away and doing his own thing is awesome and can't wait to give some new blends a try!


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## Rah55 (Feb 13, 2008)

It would have taken a mighty poor editor at Holt's to have missed that. It was lowbrow all the way and I don't beilieve it was a mistake. I don't believe they thought it was a mistake either until the negative feedback started coming in. I have never smoked many Padillas but there are some I have been curious about. I guess it's about time to try a few....from anyone but Holt's.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

Wow!!! This is a very interesting post and the talk about it after the fact is just as stimulating. I actually have been a customer of Holts for quite some time and to see how they handled this situation is very surprising to say the least. I will probably continue to be a customer as they have some very good pricing and hopefully the guy who let this episode get into their Cigar Mag is now looking for another job. It is unbecoming and very unprofessional to air things like that in print about a company that you have done business with and they did the right thing by issuing an apology.

I can't help but think this is a blessing in disguise for E. Padilla because now he can take up the challenge for his company and his product and make it better than it was before the story broke. I for one will purchase any new product of his just to see if they have risen to the occasion. As someone said before: I don't care what they say about me as long as they spell the name right,,,,any press is good press,,,etc. etc.


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