# CIGAR RIGHTS QUESTION?



## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

Hi all:

Would you people out there be more apt to buy from a retail cigar website that is competitively priced, but, actively supports your individual cigar rights at the same time or not, meaning they gave a percentage of profits or sales to an organization such as CRA that supports cigar rights? 

Currently, there is none that I know of

Comments please.....

Thanks 

Randy

**NOT SELLING ANYTHING HERE - SIMPLE THOUGHT**


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## frankD (Apr 10, 2015)

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rjerome said:


> ........... be more apt to buy from a retail cigar website that is competitively priced, but, actively supports your individual cigar rights at the same time or not.........Randy


i wouldn't really consider it for a few reasons - 1) i don't see my rights in jeopardy and 2) i don't trust those kind of promotions

basically i remember the little UNICEF box we kids filled with coins during halloween and turned in that were supposed to save poor kids in AFRICA only to later find the do-nothing UN administrators paid enormous salaries with generous benefits, which even today the UN can't get simple bottled water to the most desperate refugees ANYWHERE in the world

just sayin


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

frankD said:


> .
> 
> i wouldn't really consider it for a few reasons - 1) i don't see my rights in jeopardy and 2) i don't trust those kind of promotions
> 
> ...


I agree with the fact that some promotions are not trustworthy, however, if it is for real why would you not promote it?

I disagree with the fact that our cigar smoking rights are not in jeopardy, otherwise, groups like CRA would have no support or would just not exist at all.

Thanks for the reply


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## NormH3 (Apr 20, 2015)

I think my individual cigar rights are up to me and not some political lobby that is pretending to have my rights in their best interest. I purchase from several online stores depending on price and availability. That's it.


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## SeanTheEvans (Dec 13, 2013)

rjerome said:


> I agree with the fact that some promotions are not trustworthy, however, if it is for real why would you not promote it?
> 
> I disagree with the fact that our cigar smoking rights are not in jeopardy, otherwise, groups like CRA would have no support or would just not exist at all.
> 
> Thanks for the reply


Just because a group says that any right is in jeopardy, and it gains support, in *no way* means that it has a legitimate argument.

Not saying I believe either way on this situation, but saying that groups only exist when there's a real threat or concern is cwazee. This is America, after all.

I wouldn't support it for similar reasons stated below. I'm pretty sure all the cigar websites I'm signed up for send e-mails about CRA, etc. but yeah, I doubt if they send portions of their profits.

But why would I want a portion sent to anyone else anyway? I'd rather just receive those monies as savings for myself, and I can use my extra dough to support whatever I choose.

Arguing that you can know a source is "trustworthy" is pretty hard. Especially if that source is just forwarding money to another association, such as CRA. Now you've got to claim that there's no wasted overhead there either, or you're in the same school as the UNICEF example.

Do you think big businesses don't enjoy a boon from big rushes, hoarding, etc. that occurs whenever people suddenly fear that a right may be taken away? Or do they profit from mass fear? Again, not arguing if it's warranted or not, but I'm not trusting anyone to be on "my side" if they make mad loot off of the fear and panic of the people they represent.

I feel the same about politics, which is why I'm not invested in anything people have to say about that either.


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## Rondo (Sep 9, 2015)

I don't have several B&Ms to choose from, and I'll buy online with the best price unless I know of a severe ethical breach. 

As far as the FDA wish list is concerned;

I get increases in taxes.
I get why flavored/infused sticks should be regulated. 
I wouldn't like the ban on walk in humidors and self service sales.


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

Most of the places I purchase from already support cigar rights in some way.


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

NormH3 said:


> I think my individual cigar rights are up to me and not some political lobby that is pretending to have my rights in their best interest. I purchase from several online stores depending on price and availability. That's it.


Fair enough.


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

StogieNinja said:


> Most of the places I purchase from already support cigar rights in some way.


That may be true I was just asking if you would be more apt to support a site that "directly" did all the time as supposed to now and again?


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

Rondo said:


> I don't have several B&Ms to choose from, and I'll buy online with the best price unless I know of a severe ethical breach.
> 
> As far as the FDA wish list is concerned;
> 
> ...


Thanks your answer and logic makes sense to me!


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

SeanTheEvans said:


> Just because a group says that any right is in jeopardy, and it gains support, in *no way* means that it has a legitimate argument.
> 
> Not saying I believe either way on this situation, but saying that groups only exist when there's a real threat or concern is cwazee. This is America, after all.
> 
> ...


These are all great points! I guess it boils down to whether you trust the source or not and want to support it, otherwise, you are completely right you may as well invest your money directly in a cause or person you personally feel that trust with and not depend on anybody elses word or opinion. Thx


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## frankD (Apr 10, 2015)

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rjerome said:


> I agree with the fact that some promotions are not trustworthy, however, if it is for real why would you not promote it? I disagree with the fact that our cigar smoking rights are not in jeopardy, otherwise, groups like CRA would have no support or would just not exist at all.Thanks for the reply


Randy, per my sources, including THE CIGAR LAWYER Frank Herrera (1), and others (2), the threats that exists today are really from the cigar tobacco source countries, like Nicaragua and Honduras, where China is claiming land for a new canal and the instability of those governments are UNstable

Otherwise a large market demand is met today by KENTUCKY and PENNSYLVANIA and TENNESSEE cigar tobacco and of course my "home" state CONNECTICUT has historically now for decades produced top-quality cigar tobacco and Connecticut YANKEEs aren't easily dissuaded or intimidated, which is why i see no real domestic threat

IF i get involved i do it personally and not just write a check which is how today i have access to much of the original and ancient equipment used by FD GRAVE Cigar Company (if you are ever in the NEW HAVEN / YALE area let me know)

CRA and many groups like them come to have bias and various agendas not contemplated when the groups were established and i just don't like manufactured problems to raise funds that typically get misapplied and misappropriated

just my $ .02
frankD

(1) As the Cuban Embargo Fizzles, the Battle for the Cigar Industry Smolders | Miami New Times

(2) i was in calle ocho just yesterday and spoke to some people at PADRON CIGARs who have seen rebellion and revolution UPturn an entire industy - maybe YBOR CITY will be revived again !


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

Points well taken!

Thank you for your input.


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## tonyzoc (Jul 25, 2015)

Whether or not a retailer supports CRA or not is of little concern to me. I personally support CRA and any effect they have against government agencies that are trying to cash in on cigars will only be the result of the numbers of individual members that join. The power of the NRA is not due to support from Remington etc..it's due to the volume of induvidual members they have. As for the CRA, they don't ask for much and they do a good job of providing information on current legislative efforts to interfere with the premium cigar marketplace. I'm not aware of any mis-information coming from them, or abuse of funds they collect. I think they're legit and provide a valuable service, so I fully support them.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


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## rjerome (Mar 26, 2014)

tonyzoc said:


> Whether or not a retailer supports CRA or not is of little concern to me. I personally support CRA and any effect they have against government agencies that are trying to cash in on cigars will only be the result of the numbers of individual members that join. The power of the NRA is not due to support from Remington etc..it's due to the volume of induvidual members they have. As for the CRA, they don't ask for much and they do a good job of providing information on current legislative efforts to interfere with the premium cigar marketplace. I'm not aware of any mis-information coming from them, or abuse of funds they collect. I think they're legit and provide a valuable service, so I fully support them.
> 
> Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


I fully agree with your statement here!


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## argonaut (Oct 6, 2015)

No disrespect intended Norm, but unless you're working with a different definition of the term, I think our "cigar rights" as individuals are determined by local, state, and/or federal law, and not our personal preference. For instance, a person could decide that it's their right to smoke a cigar in their hospital room if they so choose, but we all know that'll fly about as far as a dead bird. Your response seemed a bit pointed toward organizations "pretending to have my rights in their best interest", so perhaps you have a more specific beef with the politics involved rather than the principle, or a personal experience that I'm not aware of.

In any case, I can't claim that I haven't been shopping for smokes with price and availability being the determining factors, but that's partly because I don't know too much about any cigar vendors, pro or con. If and when I gain enough experience to make judgment calls about which business has more preferable practices (to my mind), then my choices may differ. For instance, with one or perhaps two exceptions, I haven't bought anything from Wal-Mart in the past 15 years because they have horrible business practices. I watched them destroy local retail (and even production/manufacturing) businesses in North Carolina, only to build another Wal-Mart in that area 6 months or a year later, employ the newly unemployed workers they pushed out for about 20% to 50% less pay, and then run tv ads boasting about how they'd help contribute to and/or save that local economy. Some people call that free-market capitalism (ignoring, or ignorant of, how the U.S. brand of capitalism is anything but free market), but I call it outright immoral douchebaggery, and so I would never knowingly support that kind of crass and slavish devotion to making a buck.

That being said, I agree that you have to be careful of folks who bang the drum for "your rights" and such but are really only in it for the money. Frank mentioned in this thread about how he gets involved personally and doesn't just "write a check", and I think that's the best way of making sure that your time, money, and endorsement are going to the right causes.


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## DonMerlin (Oct 26, 2015)

I have never considered the politics of the vendor in the past and doubt I ever will in the future. Price and availability is the name of the game.


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