# Girlfriend not happy about me smoking cigars.



## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

So my girlfriend found out that i smoke cigars. She was to say the least very unhappy about it. She was quite mad, and rightfully so. I used to smoke cigarettes and other non premium tobacco last year(for several months) and i promised her i wouldn't smoke anymore. I did break her promise, which was absolutely wrong. I told her that I'd quit cigars because she means everything to me. I love her so much and i just want to see her happy! 

I do love cigars, the industry, the culture, and all of you guys. You all have been great to me. She says I can immerse myself in the culture without smoking, but it's still not the same. That being said, I'm willing to quit smoking for her-she means the world to me. 
She says it's that she's hurt from the actual smoking, but the broken promises and lies. she is absolutely in the right to be hurt and I'm sorry.
Any thoughts?

and Madeline, I love you!


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

If its her or the cigars and you are that happy with her......quit. If she cant accept that you are sharing in an occasional, so far, not addictive hobby that makes you happy, just think about down the road as you get closer and maybe married, what else will she have a say in? No drinking beers with the guys during football? No joining a pool league at the local tavern? No fishing trips,etc? Not saying she is that type of person but 2 questions come to mind.....1. How long have you been together? 2. I know you said you were in your early 20's if I recall. Is this the one you're going to hang your hat on forever?


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## NJW1979 (Aug 18, 2012)

Sorry to hear you are quitting. Have you tried introducing her to the culture? My wife use to get on me about smoking until one day I offered her dad a cigar and she tried to stop the both of us. Her dad told her to get off my back and to not bother me about doing something I enjoy. Maybe you should smoke with her pops.


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## Shemp75 (May 26, 2012)

dump her. get a girl that will put up with your demons as you would put up with hers.


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

See, I'm highly considering it, but I haven't decided if I'm going to quit for sure!


NJW1979 said:


> Sorry to hear you are quitting. Have you tried introducing her to the culture? My wife use to get on me about smoking until one day I offered her dad a cigar and she tried to stop the both of us. Her dad told her to get off my back and to not bother me about doing something I enjoy. Maybe you should smoke with her pops.


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## exprime8 (May 16, 2011)

well, that sucks, but only you can make that call...


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Andrew in your original post, you said you told her you would quit because you want to see her happy (at least that's how I read it). Now, if you don't quit, she will get hurt again because you lied to her. You are in the beginning stages of weaving a web that you may regret. St her down, tell her you will respect her enough to not smoke around her until she comes to terms with it. Or, if you did indeed mean that you'd quit, which is what you told her, stick with it or she will be hurt all over again. Or, quit while you're ahead and not too involved (engaged, married, kids, etc) and move onto another woman.

Mods......can we move this to the "domestic disputes" section?


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

You're right Scott, i did say two different things! I told i would quit, then later she said she wasn't mad about the fact that i smoked but more about the fact that i lied. And to answer a previous post, I could definitely see myself marrying this woman.


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## FWTX (Feb 9, 2011)

If that's your picture in the avatar - go for the girl - cigars are easy to to get - might be your last chance (with a girl)... :lol:


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## J. Drew (Aug 30, 2012)

Well man you did make a promise and broke it. You got to ask how important she is and whether or not those feeling will last and if so then it is kinda a no brainer.


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## tpharkman (Feb 20, 2010)

scottw said:


> Mods......can we move this to the "domestic disputes" section?


Roflmao!! Great stuff Scott. The indecisiveness expressed by the OP in this thread suggests he might not be so into her as he originally thought. It is next to impossible to quit something for somebody else--it has to be done for self or it isn't going to work very well.

Trust me on this...when I was a younger man I had a lot of habits and a lot of girlfriends and I could never give up one for the other and the other always left me for another. Does that make sense??


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

I look a little better in my pic in the "pictures of you smoking thread".








FWTX said:


> If that's your picture in the avatar - go for the girl - cigars are easy to to get - might be your last chance (with a girl)... :lol:


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

tpharkman said:


> The indecisiveness expressed by the OP in this thread suggests he might not be so into her as he originally though.


I don't feel it's that way at all. I absolutely love her.


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## stonecutter2 (Jul 12, 2012)

I like cigars a lot, but I like women way more. 

I know what I'd do. You must decide for yourself. Good luck!


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

I definitely choose her over smoking cigars.


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

ATCarp said:


> I don't feel it's that way at all. I absolutely love her.


So why start this thread. If you are that committed, quitting should be a no brainer.

BTW, does she do anything at all that you wish she wouldnt


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## Shemp75 (May 26, 2012)

scottw said:


> BTW, does she do anything at all that you wish she wouldnt


Like speak when not spoken to and have opinions?


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## V-ret (Jun 25, 2012)

Young love. :kiss:


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Shemp75 said:


> Like speak when not spoken to and have opinions?


Yup along with having the desire to cuddle and leaving the seat down.


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## Steel Talon (Mar 2, 2010)

Only you know whts in your heart and what your willing to change about yourself for her expectations of you.Cigars are in no way comparable to life risks as cigarettes or chew.(unless your inhaling) But there is a risk no matter how small. So you should be able to make the choice for yourself not others,she should be able to accept that esp. if her love is as strong. etc. Now how you go about smoking is greatly controlable by you, Outside Good Hygene so not to be "offensive" to others

Talk about it work it out,make a choice. Good Luck.

Oh and dibs on your stash!:biggrin:

Good Karma
Tal~


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## Jfred (Jun 7, 2012)

Shemp75 said:


> Like speak when not spoken to and have opinions?


 Leaving the kitchen? :noidea:


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## DarrelMorris (Feb 7, 2012)

Only you can answer these questions or make these decisions but I think you might start by promising not to do things behind her back rather than promise not to smoke cigars anymore. After all, you said that she wasn't all that upset about the cigars, she was upset about the lies. 

In the future, if you're going to do something behind her back...hide it better.


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## Engineer99 (Aug 4, 2011)

FWTX said:


> If that's your picture in the avatar - go for the girl - cigars are easy to to get - might be your last chance (with a girl)... :lol:


This might just be the best zinger I've read in ages...It's almost.....Carson-esque.


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## FWTX (Feb 9, 2011)

ATCarp said:


> I look a little better in my pic in the "pictures of you smoking thread".
> View attachment 41660


Go for the girl - TRUST ME!!!

(great picture Andrew - LMFAO!!! RG for you)


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## tpharkman (Feb 20, 2010)

By the time I met my wife I had been smoking cigars for 11 years so she obviously knew who she was saying yes to and exactly what she was getting into. If I had met my wife at the same or similar time that I had met cigars and this hobby, and she asked me not to smoke, it would have been a pretty easy decision to make between the two.

If you really love her then why are you even asking a bunch of cigar jockeys this question? The answer is so blatantly obvious the question didn't even need to be asked.

Good luck to you!


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## HIM (Sep 12, 2012)

I think if you truly enjoy smoking cigars then seriously express that to her and see if she can understand and just accept it. You should be able to be yourself and her still love you the same for who you are, whether or not that's a cigar smoker. You've obviously decided which of the 2 is more important and that's good, but its still your life so don't be a pushover. I also support the idea of trying to smoke some sticks with her dad lol. 

Best of luck to you brother!!


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## NoirNick (Oct 19, 2012)

It does se that the best advice is to discuss it with your significant other.

Quitting something for someone else is hard. Its never the right reason. So take a long look and have a serious discussion about this subject. Find out the reasons why she wants you toquit and find the reasons why you smoke.

Like it was said you need to make the decision on what is best for you. If she asks you to change this one thing, what's next? Do what you feel is rightmy fellow brother. May the gods of the leaf guide you.


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

If you quit smoking, I want my cigars back!

:smoke:


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## Fuzzy (Jun 19, 2011)

:whip:


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## Fuente 4 Me (May 8, 2012)

remind her that sly and arnold smoke and tell her your going to be built like them soon if you can continue. no man you give in to that and she will be telling you what color boxers to buy. once you give them the upper hand bro kiss ur ass good bye!


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## xSentinelx (Aug 16, 2012)

I tell her to deal with it if its something that will leave a bad taste in your mouth. You have already lied to her about it. Now your not sure about quitting. Plain and simple love me for me. Don't try to change me.. Just my 2€ents. If you do his like others say what's next? If you do quit make sure you never look back in regret.hwell::ask:


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## The_Chosen_One (Aug 18, 2012)

I think a few guys advice here has hinted at it, but no one's really said it. What you need to do is compromise. I've been with my wife for over a decade now and we've had our share of disputes, the trick is finding the common ground, for a relationship to work neither of you should have the 'upper' hand. Find out what bothers her about it and discuss ways to lessen or remove those components, don't just say I'll quit. /Dr. Phil


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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

scottw said:


> Mods......can we move this to the "domestic disputes" section?


Hysterical! RG bump for that line!! ound:


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## ssrobbi (Sep 12, 2012)

What doesn't she like about it? can you compromise and only say you'll smoke x times a month?


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## NavyPiper (Sep 24, 2012)

As one of my duties as a Pastor is counseling parishioners, I've found something pretty consistent over the years- that is women expect to change their 'man', and men never expect their 'woman' to change... So that's something I always bring up to a couple who are going through premarital counseling.

Good luck with your decision, I'll keep you both in my prayers.

Doc


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## capttrips (Jun 25, 2012)

I tried for years to quit drugs and alcohol for my parents, friends, wife (now ex),etc. I can tell you it doesn't work. You get a resentment which is far worse.


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## cigarmax (Feb 23, 2011)

I would need to see a picture of her before offering advice. Hint, she better be smoking hot.


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## capttrips (Jun 25, 2012)

Okay, I've had my coffee and cigar so now I can think clearly. Besides I've hit a lot of people's ignore list so what's one more. Andrew, if you have to come to a public forum and ask a bunch of people you don't know (other than we smoke cigars) how to handle a personal issue of this magnitude you have far larger problems than whether or not you smoke cigars. I have no vested interest in the outcome of your situation. What do you plan to tell your girlfriend? "Capttrips (or any other screen name here) said........" how do you think she's going to feel then? We can all sit here and do the whole brother and sister of the leaf thing, but in the end, let's face it, we just come here to talk about cigars. If I want to talk about relationships, I have 3 friends going through divorces. And, if I have a problem in my relationship I speak to the only person who matters, my wife.


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## cigarmax (Feb 23, 2011)

Fuzzy said:


> :whip:


bump


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

I think this request would be inline for us to make a more informed opinion.:hmm:


cigarmax said:


> I would need to see a picture of her before offering advice. Hint, she better be smoking hot.


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## GoJohnnyGo (Nov 19, 2011)

capttrips said:


> Okay, I've had my coffee and cigar so now I can think clearly. Besides I've hit a lot of people's ignore list so what's one more. Andrew, if you have to come to a public forum and ask a bunch of people you don't know (other than we smoke cigars) how to handle a personal issue of this magnitude you have far larger problems than whether or not you smoke cigars. I have no vested interest in the outcome of your situation. What do you plan to tell your girlfriend? "Capttrips (or any other screen name here) said........" how do you think she's going to feel then? We can all sit here and do the whole brother and sister of the leaf thing, but in the end, let's face it, we just come here to talk about cigars. If I want to talk about relationships, I have 3 friends going through divorces. And, if I have a problem in my relationship I speak to the only person who matters, my wife.


Listen to this guy.

Also, you never even said if you in fact lied to her about smoking cigars. Did she ask you if you had been smoking and you replied no? Or did she ask you if you've been smoking and you said yes and now she feels like your lying because you said you'd quite smoking to get off the cigarettes? Because if it's the later she sounds like a psycho. IMHO, I don't take kindly to anyone telling me what I can and cannot do. I love my girlfriend with all my heart and have been with her over six years. We respect and honor each other. With that said if she told me I couldn't smoke I'd tell her to **** off. Not because I would care any less for her but because if she is telling me what I can and cannot do she isn't respecting me anymore and that doesn't add up to a healthy relationship. What does the future look like if I can't even smoke a cigar. Now, if she asked me to cut back or budget or any number of things like that I would absolutely oblige no questions asked.


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## Bondo 440 (Jul 24, 2012)

Comment Removed via Me
Fuzzy RG is easier


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## Guest (Nov 21, 2012)

Dude, she's a girlfriend, girlfriends are not wives and shouldn't be treated as such just because you could see yourself marrying them. Sure you promised her you would quit, but you aren't obligated to her, and she isn't to you either. So you give up cigars now, what happens when you break up in six months? 

Don't start down the slippery slope of acquiescence, it's troublesome in relationships but even more disastrous in marriage. It's about compromise, not rolling over.

Bottom line, she's just a girlfriend


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## chris1360 (Mar 15, 2012)

Hold on, wait a second...........

What was your girl friend doing out of the kitchen or bedroom in the first place?:hmm::eyebrows::nono:


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## rpb16 (Jan 4, 2012)

Seems you enjoy cigars quite alot( as do all of us here) and she cant accept that. Apologize for lieing and breaking your promise, but explain to her why you enjoy smoking and that its something you really want to do. If you be truthful, honest and open about this then it should work out. If she still wont budge, well then shes probably not the kind of girl who will be satisfied changing just one thing about you. 

Pale horse nailed it, compromise, not rolling over.


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## szyzk (Nov 27, 2010)

Pale Horse said:


> *Dude, she's a girlfriend, girlfriends are not wives and shouldn't be treated as such* just because you could see yourself marrying them. Sure you promised her you would quit, but you aren't obligated to her, and she isn't to you either. So you give up cigars now, what happens when you break up in six months?
> 
> Don't start down the slippery slope of acquiescence, it's troublesome in relationships but even more disastrous in marriage. *It's about compromise, not rolling over*.
> 
> Bottom line, she's just a girlfriend


This, this, this, more this, this and this.

If she loves you in return she'll be more than willing to accept that you're going to relax with fine tobacco every now and then. She should embrace the things that both bring you happiness and aid with your well-being, whether she fully understands them or not, and not put up a wall. The things that are important to you should be important to her.

This is not to say she's a horrible girlfriend or that you're wrong in your relationship, and this is certainly not an attack on her so please don't take it as such. But, the activities you both choose to engage in should further and grow your relationship with each other - and that means that you have to provide her with the same support because this is a two-way street.


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## stonecutter2 (Jul 12, 2012)

DarrelMorris said:


> In the future, if you're going to do something behind her back...hide it better.


:behindsofa:


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## Blue Raccoon (Mar 13, 2011)

first.. 'get a pair' 

if she is busting your balls over cigars what will be next? booze? poker? baseball? McDonald's? taking her shopping? if she isn't marrying material.. I would offer a deal that you won't smoke when you are with her and keep it.. if she walks she walks.


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## Ammo-Ed (Jul 1, 2012)

So this explains your other thread about not having any some smell on you, specifically cleaning your glasses with alcohol. If you are going to go that extreme to ensure there is absolutely no smoke smell on you then you are going to smoke again. So you need to be up front with her that you will smoke again, don't place an amount (baby I'll only smoke 2 cigars a month) because if you have 3 then you have broken another promise. If she doesn't want you smoking anymore period (because she watched her Grandma die of lung cancer) then you will have to either deal with it or find a new chick.


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## capttrips (Jun 25, 2012)

Blue Raccoon said:


> first.. 'get a pair'
> 
> if she is busting your balls over cigars what will be next? booze? poker? baseball? McDonald's? taking her shopping? if she isn't marrying material.. I would offer a deal that you won't smoke when you are with her and keep it.. if she walks she walks.


RG to you for saying what I was thinking. My wife and I have been happily married for ten years and she knows where to draw the line the same as ido with her. Besides my mother died 3 years ago and I didn't get married to have another one.

And, the racoon makes a good point. I'm kinda offended that you involved all of us in your deceipt to begin with. Therefore, you get what you get.


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## Feldenak (Aug 15, 2012)

I have no suggestions for you, unless you want to talk about selling off your stash to a local guy. 

Personally, I'd tell my GF to deal with it. I am who I am.


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## Bondo 440 (Jul 24, 2012)




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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

All I can say is from a woman's perspective I find this thread interesting. I can see both sides because I like to consider myself one of the guys and I have an appreciation for you crazy arse BOTL. 

There are some great points made. Simply put I like Pale Horse advice. 
She is a girlfriend. Yes you may have deep feeling for her and think she is greater than slice bread.  However I need to stress something here. In order to have a strong and wonderful relationship, one must love themself first. One must know who they are before they can enter into a relationship. Once in a relationship, you both have your autonomy but have respect for each other. There should be acceptance of who the person is and compromise when things need to be adjusted. 

From a woman's perspective watching my great guy friends get involve I can tell you when I start seeing girlfriends (not wives) badgering the guy to change, it never ends well. If the guy ends up marrying her, she will continue to emasculate him. This eventually leads to divorce. 

So the question here is again what is she upset about? You lying? You realize now in her mind she will be constantly testing you to see if your truthful. So now there is this shaky ground your on with her. 
The other question is she upset cause you are smoking cigars? If this is the case then dude you seriously need to look at this person. Sounds like control issues.

I like to add, early on when I started smoking cigars I was dating a dude that had issues with it. Funny thing is when we met he knew about it but later on it became a problem He was insistant I stop. Of course he was also insistant that I loose weight, that I didnt know how to cook and oh my favorite I really needed to make friends. Hmmm..... The reality of the whole thing was the guy had some serious control issues and had zero respect for women. Dumped him, moved on and I have been smoking for about 20 yrs. I have great friends, I am an awesome cook and well I am sexy. Once I realized he was the one with issues I was able to not only move on but RESPECT myself. My two cents....


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## Feldenak (Aug 15, 2012)

cigargirlie said:


> All I can say is from a woman's perspective I find this thread interesting. I can see both sides because I like to consider myself one of the guys and I have an appreciation for you crazy arse BOTL.
> 
> There are some great points made. Simply put I like Pale Horse advice.
> She is a girlfriend. Yes you may have deep feeling for her and think she is greater than slice bread.  However I need to stress something here. In order to have a strong and wonderful relationship, one must love themself first. One must know who they are before they can enter into a relationship. Once in a relationship, you both have your autonomy but have respect for each other. There should be acceptance of who the person is and compromise when things need to be adjusted.
> ...


Hammer. Nail.

Unfortunately, "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to cigargirlie again." Can someone drop some RG on the Mad Midnight Bomber that bombs at midnight?


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## Bondo 440 (Jul 24, 2012)

Feldenak said:


> Hammer. Nail.." Can someone drop some RG on the Mad Midnight Bomber that bombs at midnight?


Gianna .. done :lol:


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## Feldenak (Aug 15, 2012)

Bondo 440 said:


> Gianna .. done :lol:


Yep, I meant Gianna. I'm convinced her alter ego is the evil midnight bomber what bombs at midnight.

Evil Midnight Bomber - The Tick - YouTube


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## BKDW (Nov 7, 2009)

Let's see: girlfriend (and not wife--I will stress this) or cigars.....:hmm:

Cigars 10 out of 10 times for me.

No brainer.

It's the cigars now, then what's next?

Oh dear, I don't want you hanging around that guy anymore, I don't like him.
Oh dear, can you stop wearing that silly suit?
Oh dear, let's stop going to this restaurant, even though you've been going there for years.
Oh dear, can we go here instead?

Oh dear, this and that, this and that....

See where this is going?

Again, some of the posts here were spot on--lots of women want to change men, but it's rarely in reverse.

You start giving up control, then bad things will happen from there. 

Don't get me wrong, relationships are about compromise, but if your partner wants to change things like hobbies or the things that define you, it's time to go. 

Remember, she's only a girlfriend--let's not lose perspective.


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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

Feldenak said:


> Yep, I meant Gianna. I'm convinced her alter ego is the evil midnight bomber what bombs at midnight.
> 
> Evil Midnight Bomber - The Tick - YouTube


Lol.... Nikonnut Christopher has a pet name for me! Doh can't recall 
Thanks guy. Just giving some good for thought.


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## Buffalo_Pat (Dec 9, 2011)

Sorry about the situation. It definitely sucks. I get where she is mad about you not being honest, but she should also be supportive of you and your hobby. Unless you are blatantly being a jerk about how you enjoy cigars (ie smoking in her place when she doesn't want you to) then her demands of you to not smoke are unwarranted. Luckily I have a wife that lets me do my thing because she knows I enjoy it and it helps me relax. Personally if someone was giving me an ultimatum regarding relationship because of anything I enjoy, then the relationship would be over. That's me though. Just my two cents. Hope everything turns out ok.


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

We will let you keep her as a friend but we as a FAMILY will not let you make any serious commitments to her.

My wife don't care for it but I like it and she has accepted that.

Tell her that you are a damn grown man and you don't need another mother, let alone one that will decide your lifestyle.

Trust me, it will get worse if you let her take control now.

Plenty of fish in the sea.


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## Ozzy (Nov 16, 2012)

A lot of people in the thread have made good points, read them and take them on board. If control starts here on a hobby like smoking cigars you never know were it will end.
I wouldn't let me girlfriend try and change something I enjoy.


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## Feldenak (Aug 15, 2012)

Lots of good posts here.

My wife (girlfriend at the time), learned early on that I don't deal well with ultimatums and I will walk. Reasonable discussion and compromise I will do. "Do this (or don't do this) or else" doesn't fly with me...at all.

I have to ask, how old is the OP?


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

Ha.............Just had to throw this in. I am an avid hunter/shooter/fisher. When my wife and I were dating, I told her right up front "If you ever try to take those things away from me, your ass can hit the road." 

I'd rather be a happy bachelor then give up the things I love.


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## Feldenak (Aug 15, 2012)

huskers said:


> Ha.............Just had to throw this in. I am an avid hunter/shooter/fisher. When my wife and I were dating, I told her right up front "If you ever try to take those things away from me, your ass can hit the road."
> 
> I'd rather be a happy bachelor then give up the things I love.


Outstanding. RG for you!


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## Fuzzy (Jun 19, 2011)




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## Bondo 440 (Jul 24, 2012)

Fuzzy said:


> Fuzzy ..


and who could forget the classic ..

The Man song - YouTube


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## Steel Talon (Mar 2, 2010)

Bondo 440 said:


> and who could forget the classic ..
> 
> The Man song - YouTube


:biggrin:


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## nillorset (Sep 21, 2012)

The advice that has been given is spot on... but let me add.. DUDE this is your girlfriend.. and if you enjoy cigars then she should accept that.. if she doesn't then let her go.. 
there 10 women for every one guy in the US.
out of Ten...

2 are married
1 married but wished she was single because of the dude from her office that compliments her all of the time.
2 are man haters, unattractive, or ellen degeneres types
1 desperate Bio clock chicks that want to get married tomorrow and have kids next week. 
2 are the hot chicks that are cool but want to be wined and dined and entertained all the time.. <the types that expect to be flown to France for a meal> 
2 are the hot chicks... that enjoy some sports, down to earth, let you hang out with the guys occasionally, work on cars,and let you be the man that you are.

:lol:


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## the nub (Mar 24, 2006)

First off, you need to make it clear that you didn't lie. You changed your mind on smoking. There's a big difference, or at least that's how a lot of women might justify it. I often find it helpful to use the same approach that a woman uses, when dealing with disputes. Deal with their emotional side, not logic.

Why didn't you tell her that you were smoking cigars? Because you were trying to find the right words...to express how important it was to you.

Why can't you just be part of the cigar culture without smoking? Because you've discovered an emotional bond with all these people, a comraderie that you never expected and to be a part of, and that without smoking you would feel foolish and a fraud.

Those are just for starters. Finally, you really must pin down whether she is truly against smoking or whether you changed your mind. If she is not against smoking, then if she brings it up at a later date, tell her in no uncertain terms that you are "confusing me. You are giving me *mixed signals*. You told me that before that you didn't mind me smoking."

*I guarantee, 'mixed signals' works every time. It will blow your mind at how well it works.*


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

capttrips said:


> Andrew, if you have to come to a public forum and ask a bunch of people you don't know (other than we smoke cigars) how to handle a personal issue of this magnitude you have far larger problems than whether or not you smoke cigars. I have no vested interest in the outcome of your situation. What do you plan to tell your girlfriend? "Capttrips (or any other screen name here) said........" how do you think she's going to feel then? ... if I have a problem in my relationship I speak to the only person who matters, my wife.


This.

Look, Andrew, we're glad your here. But none of us knows the dynamics of your relationship.

A lot of guys here are chanting "dump her, she wants you to change, move on." But it's not always that simple. (Besides, do you really want to take relationship advice from someone who would rather smoke rotten leaves than be in a loving relationship with a woman?)

First, we know you lied and deceived her, by your own admission. Why you did that is irrelevant, the fact of the matter is, honesty is absolutely necessary in a relationship. As you said...


ATCarp said:


> I did break (my?) promise, which was absolutely wrong.
> 
> She says it's that she's (not?) hurt from the actual smoking, but the broken promises and lies. she is absolutely in the right to be hurt and I'm sorry.


...so, *it's not the cigars, its the dishonesty that's the issue.* 99% of what these guys were going on about doesn't apply here, and I'm sorry guys, but you're wrong about this one. It's not a "control" issue at play here, it's an issue she's taken with Andrew's integrity. Andrew lied, got caught, and now he needs to show he's willing to keep his word and stay away from tobacco.

Which brings me to the main point that most other people are making, but perhaps that we don't understand:



ATCarp said:


> So my girlfriend found out that i smoke cigars. She was to say the least very unhappy about it. She was quite mad, and rightfully so. I used to smoke cigarettes and other non premium tobacco last year(for several months) and i promised her i wouldn't smoke anymore.


The real question for you, Andrew, is why did she take issue with your cigarettes, and why did you promise to never smoke again? Despite what most people tend to say here ("She doesn't like your cigars? Dump her!"), you need to decide what's more important to you - a hobby, or your relationship. Relationships aren't _all _about compromise. *In relationships, there are compromises, and then there are legitimate non-negotiables.* It sounds like tobacco is a non-negotiable with her.

Guys here often want to portray _any _woman who wants her man to quit cigars as a manipulative, controlling bitch. But that's not always the case! There are two reasons I can think of right off the bat that her asking you to quit using tobacco are perfectly legitimate.

First, for a lot of people, tobacco use is something that has caused major damage in their lives, either for themselves or a family member, and they have a moral issue with tobacco. Similar to how a lot of people who have alcohol abuse in their history are morally opposed to drinking.

Second, do you have an addictive or compulsive personality, and if so, was your previous tobacco use beyond your control? By which I mean, was your use self-destructive or abusive? If I decide I want to start smoking crack, and my wife says "quit or I'm leaving", that doesn't mean she's controlling or manipulative, it means she loves me and doesn't want to see me involved in a destructive habit. Was her demand that you stop smoking designed to _help _you? Or, similarly, does she want to make sure she's with the kind of person who is self-disciplined enough to resist his impulses?

Those two issues, among others, are perfectly legitimate reasons for her to demand that you stop using tobacco in my opinion. It's up to you to decide if it's reasonable for her to make your tobacco use a non-negotiable.

Now, as to your other comment:



ATCarp said:


> I do love cigars, the industry, the culture, and all of you guys. You all have been great to me. She says I can immerse myself in the culture without smoking...


To me, this feels like she's making tobacco use a non-negotiable because she loves you. *She doesn't want to take you away from friends, and is even willing to allow you to be part of the cigar culture. Those aren't the actions of a manipulative or controlling woman, at least not in my experience. *

But I would say that *if you are going to quit for her, do not come back here*. Not that we wouldn't welcome you, but let's be honest. If your cigar smoking is compulsive, and you're surrounded by cigar smokers, you're gonna smoke. Again. And break your promise to her. Again. It would be unwise for you do so, in the same way that a sober alcoholic hanging out at a bar on a nightly basis would be unwise. If you're going to quit, quit the culture too, or you'll wind up in the same predicament, only the trust might not be repairable next time.

Good luck to you, Andrew, and I hope you have the wisdom to make the right choice, for yourself, and for your relationship.


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## J. Drew (Aug 30, 2012)

Someone please hit ninja with some rep! I have to spread mine around.


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## nillorset (Sep 21, 2012)

Ninja - good answer!


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

nillorset said:


> The advice that has been given is spot on... but let me add.. DUDE this is your girlfriend.. and if you enjoy cigars then she should accept that.. if she doesn't then let her go..
> there 10 women for every one guy in the US.
> out of Ten...
> 
> ...


I have an alternative version, that I think is probably more accurate:

2 are married
1 is married, but because of our culture's acceptance of the "look but don't touch" idea, has allowed her fantasizing about another man to slowly poison her marriage, instead of focusing on improving it; or alternately, one who is being neglected by her irresponsible, absent husband and is unsatisfied with his bullying and/or neglect
2 were abused as children, and taken advantage of as they grew older, bullied, betrayed, and battered, and desperately need love from a man who is interested in loving them unconditionally, instead of only being concerned with how he can benefit from the relationship without having to make any sacrifices of his own
1 woman who wants to raise children in a loving family home, with a loving, present, responsible, and dependable man, so they can together raise women who aren't in the second, third, or last category
2 are women that were raised properly, who's fathers loved them, talked with them, supported them, were there for them, and taught them how women should be treated, and won't settle for a selfish misogynist, and is waiting for a man to prove he's a responsible provider who loves her and wants to cherish her 
2 are girls who, because their father was either absent, or else more concerned with watching the game than building a relationship with his daughter, think the only way to obtain a good man is to look pretty and ask nothing from the man in return, and who will eventually end up in the second or third catagory when said man either abuses, leaves, or simply neglects her because there is no expectation that he will do otherwise.


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## Johnpaul (Aug 15, 2011)

ATCarp said:


> So my girlfriend found out that i smoke cigars...
> 
> and Madeline, I love you!


Since you addressed Madeline I am going to assume that you made this thread more to appease her than to get serious advice. Therefore I think the best advice is that you BOTH need to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a couple of prepubescent teenagers. Adults learn how to talk threw their problems with each other and compromise, not post stupid threads to smooth over arguments.


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## jheiliger (May 12, 2012)

Done lots of counseling for what it's worth.

Just a simple "screw you, get out" is a little harsh when you're in love. BUT... Asking you to "abandon your personhood" is a little juvenile and also says something.

When a person makes demands (promise me you won't ever ____ ) they are usually driven out of a fear that is created because of their personal experience. Their experience creates a fear that they want to be sure to guard against.

In this situation, You lied... and that's the problem. I think you know that by now... LOL!

My wife was raised by an Alcoholic father. One day shortly after we were married, I came home from the golf coarse with my dad, and I had had a couple beers. She smelled the alcohol, and was devastated (keep in mind, I never promised her anything!!). She locked herself in a bedroom at my folks house and wouldn't come out. She was crying about how she thought I was going to be an alcoholic and she had married someone just like her dad, and... on and on. Because of her experiences (abuse and the like...) she was incapable of separating my actions from her fathers. Just the smell brought back a flood of emotional baggage that I didn't even know was there.

I grew up in a home where alcohol was consumed regularly, but was never abused. So for me, it was just a normal part of life, but she had never seen it consumed in moderation where it didn't consume the person drinking it! It was something we had to work through... We communicated about it, set realistic expectations, and COMPROMISED!

Now, WE drink beer, she nearly as often as I!!

It's possible that ALL SHE KNOWS about smoking period is that "IT'S GONNA KILL YOU", because that's all she's ever heard! And if you're a "pack a day" cigarette smoker, eventually it's going to affect your health negatively, it's true. While cigar smoking has it's own risks, they are MUCH different than a cigarette smoker. If you're burning an "excessive" (whatever that means for her...) number of sticks a day, then I see her need for worry.

When I started smoking cigars, my wife and I had some conversations about it because it concerned her a little. I told her why I enjoyed it, and shared with her the risks involved. I shared with her what I thought was "reasonable" without creating a set of laws/rules that I have to follow, but setting reasonable expectations for both of us.

*You see... The reason compromise works is because it leads to a set of "shared expectations". Disappointment in life (almost always) is a result of a lack of SHARED EXPECTATIONS! *

When 2 people can compromise and reach a point of shared expectation, then you're moving in the same direction TOGETHER, and no one has to be disappointed or feel devalued.

YOU HAVE TO FIND THE Win-Win!! What does it look like for both of you to "win" in this situation? If you have hopes of marrying, and you love this woman, then compromise asks the question: What would it look like for us both to win?? Because I can tell you... It's not going to go well if only one of you is the "winner". Because, if I win then my wife looses, and is that what I want? Do I want her to feel devalued and "unheard" because I have to have my way?

And in your situation... If she "wins", then do you feel valued as a person? Do you feel like your needs are being taken into consideration, or rather that you are being controlled/manipulated and emasculated because of her fear?

I know... All of this is a bit different because you are NOT married, but your words lead me to believe that it could be a possibility. If it is, then learn these skills NOW so that you will have them as tools in your relationship later! Best of luck!

Hope this helps,
Joe


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## WyldKnyght (Apr 1, 2011)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> This.
> 
> Look, Andrew, we're glad your here. But none of us knows the dynamics of your relationship.
> 
> ...


:tpd:

Great job Derek!!!


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## Bad Andy (Jul 16, 2011)

This thread reminded me of a funny story:


One evening last week, my girlfriend and I were getting into bed. Well, the passion starts to heat up, and she eventually says, 'I don't feel like it, I just want you to hold me.'

I said, 'WHAT??!! What was that?!'

So she says the words that every boyfriend on the planet dreads to hear...

'You're just not in touch with my emotional needs as a woman enough for me to satisfy your physical needs as a man.'

She responded to my puzzled look by saying, 'Can't you just love me for who I am and not what I do for you in the bedroom?'

Realizing that nothing was going to happen that night, I went to sleep.

The very next day I opted to take the day off of work to spend time with her. We went out to a nice lunch and then went shopping at a big, big unnamed department store. I walked around with her while she tried on several different very expensive outfits. She couldn't decide which one to take, so I told her we'd just buy them all. She wanted new shoes to compliment her new clothes, so I said, 'Lets get a pair for each outfit.'

We went on to the jewelry department wher e she picked out a pair of diamond earrings. Let me tell you... she was so excited. She must have thought I was one wave short of a shipwreck. I started to think she was testing me because she asked for a tennis bracelet when she doesn't even know how to play tennis.

I think I threw her for a loop when I said, 'That's fine, honey.' She was almost nearing sexual satisfaction from all of the excitement. Smiling with excited anticipation, she finally said, 'I think this is all dear, let's go to the cashier.'

I could hardly contain myself when I blurted out, 'No honey, I don't feel like it.'

Her face just went completely blank as her jaw dropped with a baffled, 'WHAT?'

I then said, 'Honey! I just want you to HOLD this stuff for a while. You're just not in touch with my financial needs as a man enough for me to satisfy your shopping needs as a woman.'

And just when she had this look like she was going to kill me, I added, 'Why can't you just love me for who I am and not for the things I buy you?'

Apparently I'm not having sex tonight either....but at least that b**** knows I'm smarter than her.


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## gscottfuller (Nov 8, 2012)

Here is how I handle that issue with my wife who is very anti-smoking. I have made "a deal" with her that I will typically only smoke 1 cigar per week -- on Sunday afternoon. That enables me to have humidors, cigars, etc. without having to sneak. Do I ever deviate from the 1 per week deal? You bet your bippy! After 25 years of marriage, I know her habits like the back of my hand and know when I have a window to grab a stogie. I only smoke outdoors so there is no lingering smell. And my dog never tells!


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## aaron72 (Jul 14, 2011)

Most all of the angles have been hit here, but there is one that I would like to point out here. If the biggest issue is her questioning your integrity based on the lying, then you are in for a long road of always trying to regain that trust and her always having something to hold over your head. In these types of relationships, where there has been infidelity or some other type of major wronging, I think the best bet is to part ways and start fresh with someone you don't have to either a) continually prove something to or b) keep an eye on and wonder about.

And JP, you need to signature your response as that could be used as a common response for a lot of General Discussion threads.


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## chris1360 (Mar 15, 2012)

cigargirlie said:


> All I can say is from a woman's perspective I find this thread interesting. I can see both sides because I like to consider myself one of the guys and I have an appreciation for you crazy arse BOTL.
> 
> There are some great points made. My two cents....


Hey G, what are you doing out of the kitchen?????? LMAO! Just playin..... She makes some good points. People that like to force others to change, will never change!


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## smelvis (Sep 7, 2009)

ATCarp said:


> I don't feel it's that way at all. I absolutely love her.


Good Luck

I am a simple man if I ever hear a my way or else I grab her suitcases and ask if she needs help packing.. Not related to your situation just how my mind works.

My Best


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## lasix (Mar 25, 2012)

My philosophy is that problems: Half the people have problems, therefore their not interested in hearing yours, and the other half think you probably have what is coming to you.


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## Sumatra Samurai (Jul 16, 2012)

Wow I guess I'm lucky, my wife is totally cool with it, she won't have any herself, but she's cool wit me smoking a few times a week. And great story Bad Andy haha


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## chris1360 (Mar 15, 2012)

Bad Andy said:


> This thread reminded me of a funny story:
> 
> One evening last week, my girlfriend and I were getting into bed. Well, the passion starts to heat up, and she eventually says, 'I don't feel like it, I just want you to hold me.'
> 
> ...


I am printing this out for my wife, and taping it to her pillow tonight! RG to ya man, best damn story I have heard in a long time!


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## David_ESM (May 11, 2011)

smelvis said:


> Good Luck
> 
> I am a simple man if I ever hear a my way or else I grab her suitcases and ask if she needs help packing.. Not related to your situation just how my mind works.
> 
> My Best


:thumb:

When it is a girlfriend, especially one that isn't long term (like how I dated my wife for 6 years), when they try to change you, you need to make it clear that you are who you are and they can either accept it, or get out.


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## Bad Andy (Jul 16, 2011)

I wish I could take credit for the story..... It was emailed to me a few years ago, and I had forgotten about it, but saved it in my jokes folder. I thought it was funny and applied to this thread. 

In all seriousness to the OP... Look deep down inside and listen to what your heart says. Many people have given very good advice. It is up to you to do some "soul searching" and see if any of it applies. I remember when I was in my 20's and in love. It was very hard to listen to people's advice (everyone hated my girlfriend at the time.... turns out they were right), but I was in love and thought they didn't understand. Love is a powerful thing. The best thing is conversation... hopefully you will be able to talk about this issue (trust vs smoking) with your gal.

Hope the best for you whatever way it turns out. Remember to eat a lot of turkey and be thankful this weekend.

-Andy


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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

chris1360 said:


> Hey G, what are you doing out of the kitchen?????? LMAO! Just playin..... She makes some good points. People that like to force others to change, will never change!


Chris, because my boy toy is fixing me a nice dinner and later we are going to cuddle, after he has given me a pedicure and draws my bath. Lmao!!!


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## ssrobbi (Sep 12, 2012)

I did something like that to my girlfriend once. ONCE.


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## sweater88 (Jul 31, 2011)

stonecutter2 said:


> I like cigars a lot, but I like* women *way more.


me too, but A woman? no way.........HEYOH!!!


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## kapathy (Nov 20, 2010)

Wow this all seems so familiar......oh yeah that's right this exact topic comes up oh I don't know every 3-4 months.... And elicits the exact same response every time


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

kapathy said:


> Wow this all seems so familiar......oh yeah that's right this exact topic comes up oh I don't know every 3-4 months.... And elicits the exact same response every time


95 dudes hollering "Cigars before women! Kick her to the curb!", and one lonely Ninja singing Boyz II Men's "_On Bended Knee_"

:biglaugh:


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## ejgarnut (Sep 28, 2009)




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## Johnny Rock (Jun 25, 2010)

I haven't had a "Girl Friend" in about 36 years, but my wife, on the other hand, is contrary at times to most of my vices. Smoking is just one of them. She however has learned to live with me and all of my faulty vices. Love is the underlying factor here. With love, the contraries are minimized. Without love, they are amplified. Best of luck in love, my friend...:ss


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## rpb16 (Jan 4, 2012)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> To me, this feels like she's making tobacco use a non-negotiable because she loves you. *She doesn't want to take you away from friends, and is even willing to allow you to be part of the cigar culture. Those aren't the actions of a manipulative or controlling woman, at least not in my experience. *
> 
> .


Wut? He cant smoke, yet he can part of the cigar culture? That doesnt even make sense. How is that not manipulative? He can do something he wants, yet she sets the rules? ok.


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

rpb16 said:


> Wut? He cant smoke, yet he can part of the cigar culture? That doesnt even make sense. How is that not manipulative? He can do something he wants, yet she sets the rules? ok.


It makes perfect sense in the context of the rest of my post. Have you ever met an overly controlling or manipulative woman who allowed her man to remain part of a culture involved in an activity she didn't like? Of course not. That she wants him to be free to remain part of the cigar culture sounds like she's trying to compromise and work with him on the issue, despite his _use _of tobacco being a non-negotiable to her, something an overly manipulative or controlling woman would not likely do.


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## capttrips (Jun 25, 2012)

Does it strike anyone as a bit strange that this steaming pile of kaka was dumped in our laps and the OP is nowhere to be seen?


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

capttrips said:


> Does it strike anyone as a bit strange that this steaming pile of kaka was dumped in our laps and the OP is nowhere to be seen?


Based on the topic?

Nope.


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> Based on the topic?
> 
> Nope.


Agreed.


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## GoJohnnyGo (Nov 19, 2011)

I lost hope for a reply from the op at about 3:00.


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## Bondo 440 (Jul 24, 2012)

.... see that? 
now you guys got him in trouble........








lol


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## copper0426 (Aug 15, 2012)

I've been married 21 yrs they hate lies. Be straight talk about the fact that you were weak discuss the PRO SIDES OF IT.Beg forgiveness for the duplicity and this too shall pass. Always just be open, but not a door mat.


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## B.mamba89 (May 30, 2012)

capttrips said:


> Does it strike anyone as a bit strange that this steaming pile of kaka was dumped in our laps and the OP is nowhere to be seen?


There is prolly a time set in which he is allowed to get online?


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## ssrobbi (Sep 12, 2012)

capttrips said:


> Does it strike anyone as a bit strange that this steaming pile of kaka was dumped in our laps and the OP is nowhere to be seen?


I'm just sure he wants to come back to a topic where everyone told him he needed to grow a pair :biglaugh:


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## Arizona Dave (Nov 5, 2012)

I'm with ya' on that one. Yes, honesty is the way to go with her. Try one of the Acid cigar line and see if it goes over better?



ssrobbi said:


> I'm just sure he wants to come back to a topic where everyone told him he needed to grow a pair :biglaugh:


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## nillorset (Sep 21, 2012)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> 95 dudes hollering "Cigars before women! Kick her to the curb!", and one lonely Ninja singing Boyz II Men's "_On Bended Knee_"
> 
> :biglaugh:


Aye this made me spit my seris r out of my mouth... Lol it made me start singing boyz to men songs with my wife.. +1... :lol:


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## Hermit (Aug 5, 2008)

"If your wife doesn't like the aroma of your cigar - change your wife."
-- Zino Davidoff


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

The way I see it, you are in an enviable position. Either you actually quit or you don't. So either you have to stand up to your girlfriend and tell her to deal with it, or you have to stand up to the guys here and tell them that your girlfriend is more important than their advice. Either way, you finally have to stand up to somebody...


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## xSentinelx (Aug 16, 2012)

Really are we still on this subject. It's a girlfriend this is the tie to see if they are trainable. If not on to the next. Or get on all fours and follow her around. It really is rocket science. I agree we need to send this post o domestic disputes


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

Update! I'm not quitting, I'm just cutting back! And ninja, I've already tried the first one! i ll let yo know about it!


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Oh, thank god.....I hardly slept last night.


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## ATCarp (Sep 24, 2012)

har har har.....:tongue1:


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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

xSentinelx said:


> Really are we still on this subject. It's a girlfriend this is the tie to see if they are trainable. If not on to the next. Or get on all fours and follow her around. It really is rocket science. I agree we need to send this post o domestic disputes


You know Arnel women are trying to train men during this time too!!!
:biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh:


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## xSentinelx (Aug 16, 2012)

cigargirlie said:


> You know Arnel women are trying to train men during this time too!!!
> :biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh::biglaugh: :biglaugh:


Touché some women have stronger Jedi mind tricks where men will not see what woman is doing. But the force in this man is somewhat strong for he has seen the dark side trying to turn him. 
:fencing:


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## jphank (Apr 29, 2012)

I look at it this way: Every man needs a chance to switch gears. You guys are physiologically built to focus on the task at hand and to put your very best into what you're doing at that moment. Therefore, in my not so humble opinion, every guy needs a few things to pour himself into as a transition to what comes next. Books on tape, woodworking, riding a motorcycle, yard work, pipes or cigars, time at the gym, computer games- the list is as varied as the guys on the planet (I appreciate the yard work and the cigars, though  ). Like Tony said, there's benefits to a man having hobbies that help him refocus. Just look at NCIS, Gibbs loves his wood shop and thinks of the best things down there 

Not letting a man have some free time away from the couple to enjoy a hobby that helps him refocus on what's important at home-- it's kinda self-defeating and not the kinda woman I like to hang out with. And women don't have Jedi mind tricks, but they sure wish they did  It's more about learning how to speak the same language men do!


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## NavyPiper (Sep 24, 2012)

Well I'm glad it got resolved, and happy for both of you. Brief us in when you get a chance, inquiring minds wanna know...

Have a 'smoky' Happy Thanksgiving!

Doc


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## cigargirlie (Jul 18, 2012)

Jessica is sooooo right. 


I told my Mom about this thread. She has been married to my Dad for now over 50 years. Her advice to all this is dump her. If someone you are dating is already trying to change you, nothing good will happen out of this. There is someone out there who will appreciate you for you. It just takes time.


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## cigarmax (Feb 23, 2011)

:bathbaby:My wife is not happy about me thinking for myself. So what do you guys think. As I can no longer think for myself, I think, well no I don't think.


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## xSentinelx (Aug 16, 2012)

cigargirlie said:


> Jessica is sooooo right.
> 
> I told my Mom about this thread. She has been married to my Dad for now over 50 years. Her advice to all this is dump her. If someone you are dating is already trying to change you, nothing good will happen out of this. There is someone out there who will appreciate you for you. It just takes time.


That is so the truth we west coasters are a different breed. Your mom is sooooo right.:whoo:


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## Rays98GoVols (Sep 22, 2008)

ATCarp said:


> So my girlfriend found out that i smoke cigars. She was to say the least very unhappy about it. She was quite mad, and rightfully so. I used to smoke cigarettes and other non premium tobacco last year(for several months) and i promised her i wouldn't smoke anymore. I did break her promise, which was absolutely wrong. I told her that I'd quit cigars because she means everything to me. I love her so much and i just want to see her happy!
> 
> I do love cigars, the industry, the culture, and all of you guys. You all have been great to me. She says I can immerse myself in the culture without smoking, but it's still not the same. That being said, I'm willing to quit smoking for her-she means the world to me.
> She says it's that she's hurt from the actual smoking, but the broken promises and lies. she is absolutely in the right to be hurt and I'm sorry.
> ...


Keep smoking Cigars in moderation. I'm sure there are things that she does that you do not like, but put up with. Example: Maybe shopping, or spending too much. If you cave on this, she we make you cave on everything for the rest of your life. If she started smoking Cigerettes, would you leave her? I doubt it. It's a two way street. There is always going to be things that each spouse doesn't like about the other. She needs to be concerned about the BIG things. Example: DO you beat her? (Hope not) Do you have a job and contribute? Do you cheat on her? (hope not). These are three VERY BAD things. IF you are doing these three right, she should thank her lucky stars, because alot of guys are not............


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

Not all change is bad change, and not all demands are bad demands. And not all women who try to demand change are bad women.

Change doesnt always make you someone you're not. Sometimes change just makes you a better version of yourself, one without the bullshit. And sometimes it takes a good woman challenging you to help you see that.

Those of you who want a woman who's a patsy, who "lets you be you", who won't stand challenge you, or be a helpmeet... I feel bad for you. You're missing out on one of the greatest blessings of being with a woman.


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## rpb16 (Jan 4, 2012)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> It makes perfect sense in the context of the rest of my post. Have you ever met an overly controlling or manipulative woman who allowed her man to remain part of a culture involved in an activity she didn't like? Of course not. That she wants him to be free to remain part of the cigar culture sounds like she's trying to compromise and work with him on the issue, despite his _use _of tobacco being a non-negotiable to her, something an overly manipulative or controlling woman would not likely do.


Actually i dated such a "woman" who did exactly that to me(albiet with a different subject), and she was the mist contrilling and manipulative person ive ever met. Shame on me for allowing her to be that way, but thats a discussion for another time. Being part of the cigar culturlre and not smoking cigars is bass ackwards. you can try to justify some womens need for control anyway you want, thats not comprimise.



Aninjaforallseasons said:


> Not all change is bad change, and not all demands are bad demands. And not all women who try to demand change are bad women.
> 
> Change doesnt always make you someone you're not. Sometimes change just makes you a better version of yourself, one without the bullshit. And sometimes it takes a good woman challenging you to help you see that.
> 
> Those of you who want a woman who's a patsy, who "lets you be you", who won't stand challenge you, or be a helpmeet... I feel bad for you. You're missing out on one of the greatest blessings of being with a woman.


Again, all due respect but your logic seems very flawed in this subject. Someone who DEMANDS changes in OTHER people, is controlling and not healthy for either person. Someone who suggests and discusses change is better, but demanding, howboutnobear.jpg. what gives someone else the right to decide whats good or bad for ME? Especially on something so menial.


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## capttrips (Jun 25, 2012)

ATCarp said:


> Update! I'm not quitting, I'm just cutting back! And ninja, I've already tried the first one! i ll let yo know about it!


Great,does that mean she gave your balls back too?


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

rpb16 said:


> Actually i dated such a "woman" who did exactly that to me(albiet with a different subject), and she was the mist contrilling and manipulative person ive ever met. Shame on me for allowing her to be that way, but thats a discussion for another time. Being part of the cigar culturlre and not smoking cigars is bass ackwards. you can try to justify some womens need for control anyway you want, thats not comprimise.
> 
> Again, all due respect but your logic seems very flawed in this subject. Someone who DEMANDS changes in OTHER people, is controlling and not healthy for either person. Someone who suggests and discusses change is better, but demanding, howboutnobear.jpg. what gives someone else the right to decide whats good or bad for ME? Especially on something so menial.


It sounds like your personal experience is clouding your perspective. I'm not saying women can't be controlling or manipulative, merely that not all women demanding changes are so.

We men can be quite blind to our own shortcomings. Polite suggestion may work sometimes, but we men aren't nearly as mature and receptive to constructive criticism as we think we are. Some of us arent receptive to criticism or suggestions for change of _any kind_, as many responses in this thread makes clear. Sometimes our women need to call us out to get our attention. In those cases, theyre trying to help us because they love us.


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## Kruz (May 4, 2012)

I see where you're are coming from Dereck and I agree.

Demanding change from someone is not being controlling in my opinion. Its being assertive. What makes all of the world of difference is the intentions behind that demand (and I think this is what Dereck is getting at).

We all have choices to make. The guys here choose to smoke cigars and a lot of us are lucky to have women who accept it or even join us. Having said that, any woman has the right to say she doesn't want to be with a guy that smokes cigars. Do any of you disagree with this?



Aninjaforallseasons said:


> It sounds like your personal experience is clouding your perspective. I'm not saying women can't be controlling or manipulative, merely that not all women demanding changes are so.
> 
> We men can be quite blind to our own shortcomings. Polite suggestion may work sometimes, but we men aren't nearly as mature and receptive to constructive criticism as we think we are. Some of us arent receptive to criticism or suggestions for change of _any kind_, as many responses in this thread makes clear. Sometimes our women need to call us out to get our attention. In those cases, theyre trying to help us because they love us.


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## rpb16 (Jan 4, 2012)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> It sounds like your personal experience is clouding your perspective. I'm not saying women can't be controlling or manipulative, merely that not all women demanding changes are so.
> 
> We men can be quite blind to our own shortcomings. Polite suggestion may work sometimes, but we men aren't nearly as mature and receptive to constructive criticism as we think we are. Some of us arent receptive to criticism or suggestions for change of _any kind_, as many responses in this thread makes clear. Sometimes our women need to call us out to get our attention. In those cases, theyre trying to help us because they love us.


My personal experience isnt clouding any sort of judgement. Being with someone like that certainly didnt leave a pleasant taste in my mouth, but i grew away from that and learned, certainly my views are no where near clouded because of it and if anything ive found the middle ground so many seem to look right over. I find it quite funny that you claim my views cloudy, then lump men in a group as immature and ignorant whho need a woman to mommy them through life and its decisions.

Demanding change in someone is controlling, plain and simple. "Demanding" something leaves no room for negotiations by definition, thus one person has all the power or control. Can it be good sometimes? Sure if OP was addicted to drugs or abusive or had some serious issues that were affecting other people in his life, then yea i think someone would need to assert their dominance. But for something as petty as smoking cigars, i dont think thats right.

But then again my balls belong to myself, so what do i know....


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

I didn't lump all men or all women into any category. 

Which is precisely my point. Not all situations are your situation. Not all demands for change are the work of a manipulative or controlling woman.


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## ssrobbi (Sep 12, 2012)

You all are hilarious, a cigar forum arguing about how to ensure a happy long term marriage... :biglaugh:


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## Arizona Dave (Nov 5, 2012)

Maybe we're asking the "wrong" question? Maybe we should ask "how many years have you been married?" "How many divorces?" etc....


ssrobbi said:


> You all are hilarious, a cigar forum arguing about how to ensure a happy long term marriage... :biglaugh:


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## SeanBen (May 31, 2012)

Aww that is so sad to know that you will have to quit it just because of this...


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## jphank (Apr 29, 2012)

You can demand change all you want, but what if the change doesn't happen, ultimatums? How is that healthy for a relationship?

The most healthy way to approach behaviors that bother you is stating what the action is, how it makes you feel, and either an alternative to that behavior, or a boundary for you. "When you do x, it makes me feel y, and if that doesn't change, I will need to do z for my own well being."

That's the right way to challenge someone to change, not demand it.


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## smelvis (Sep 7, 2009)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> Not all change is bad change, and not all demands are bad demands. And not all women who try to demand change are bad women.
> 
> Change doesnt always make you someone you're not. Sometimes change just makes you a better version of yourself, one without the bullshit. And sometimes it takes a good woman challenging you to help you see that.
> 
> Those of you who want a woman who's a patsy, who "lets you be you", who won't stand challenge you, or be a helpmeet... I feel bad for you. You're missing out on one of the greatest blessings of being with a woman.


Some truth in this for sure.

As long as the conversation is a two way street. I hate the what should be a two minute argument that turns into hours even if you agree with her. I say just do the make up sex first and screw the arguing. Trying to change someone is wrong in my book if after trying they sat no Thanks it should be dropped. Like someone above said NEXT!!


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## Mante (Dec 25, 2009)

smelvis said:


> Some truth in this for sure.
> 
> I say just do the make up sex first and screw the arguing.


 LMAO. Works for me. :thumb:


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## rpb16 (Jan 4, 2012)

Aninjaforallseasons said:


> I didn't lump all men or all women into any category.
> 
> Which is precisely my point. Not all situations are your situation. Not all demands for change are the work of a manipulative or controlling woman.


Well i can see this is going nowhere fast, but i figured "we men" meant most men. Again, not sure why your trying to make this about MY situation when multiple times ive actually agreed that some demands are good when someone(wether it be man or woman) is doi g something destructive tto either themselves or others, and i have stated there needs to be communication between both parties before any decision is made. It just grinds my gears when i hear someone say men arent mature or responsible enough to handle critisizing(sp?), or day to day decisions regarding their hobbies(such as smokig cigars). Something so menial shouldnt even be an issue, and if it then their needs to be honest and open conversation about it what to do, and what both sides want. If one side does all the talking(like demanding change for instance), that is first and foremost wrong, and second is damaging to a relationship.

Anway its been fun Derek, in the end tho, i could.t give any less of a flying you-know-what about what other people do. No harm, no foul.


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## jorben1990 (Nov 23, 2012)

I think I am going to let her find out on her own. Currently in different states! I am new guys, just trying to get a few posts before i start posting myself!


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## El wedo del milagro (Jul 3, 2012)

This thread is a train wreck!

It's really very simple:

1) Never lie.

2) Never tell an adult what to do. It IS ok to say what ya think or how you feel, but if ya need to tell someone what to do yer probably a jerk.

3) Never let someone tell you what to do. If they feel that they NEED to tell you what to do they are probably a jerk.

4) The "right" person for you will like YOU, not what they imagine you to be with enough prodding.


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## Hotpocket (Sep 26, 2011)

Old thread but had me in pieces at some of the responses. I say you need to Eric Cartman this situation (see club houses episode)


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

UPDATE?


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## jeepman_su (Mar 8, 2012)

huskers said:


> UPDATE?


I am betting she let him smoke for a few weeks until he did it in front of her a few times....she complained the entire time and would not kiss, hug, or do anything else after he smoked. At that point he did was we all would do and stopped smoking to make her happy lol.


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## Ruben_Ayala (Jun 9, 2013)

My girl is the same way, she says its alright. But if i light up, she will not go near me for the day... I can live with that.  Its like having an exciting affair once a week. lol!


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## GoJohnnyGo (Nov 19, 2011)

Funny this got bumped. I was just thinking about this "epic?" thread the other day.


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

jeepman_su said:


> I am betting she let him smoke for a few weeks until he did it in front of her a few times....she complained the entire time and would not kiss, hug, or do anything else after he smoked. At that point he did was we all would do and stopped smoking to make her happy lol.


Not I!

If it was just a girlfriend, I'd have kicked her to the curb unless she was Rachel Mcadams hot and she made up for my sacrifices in other ways.

Suppose his relationship is like the movie norbit?


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## jeepman_su (Mar 8, 2012)

huskers said:


> Not I!
> 
> If it was just a girlfriend, I'd have kicked her to the curb unless she was Rachel Mcadams hot and she made up for my sacrifices in other ways.


Me and my gf had a deal.....I hate cigarette smoke so I convinced her to quit smoke them and I would keep smoking cigars. All and all I felt it was a good deal lol.


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## jazzboypro (Jul 30, 2012)

ATCarp said:


> So my girlfriend found out that i smoke cigars. She was to say the least very unhappy about it. She was quite mad, and rightfully so. I used to smoke cigarettes and other non premium tobacco last year(for several months) and i promised her i wouldn't smoke anymore. I did break her promise, which was absolutely wrong. I told her that I'd quit cigars because she means everything to me. I love her so much and i just want to see her happy!
> 
> I do love cigars, the industry, the culture, and all of you guys. You all have been great to me. She says I can immerse myself in the culture without smoking, but it's still not the same. That being said, I'm willing to quit smoking for her-she means the world to me.
> She says it's that she's hurt from the actual smoking, but the broken promises and lies. she is absolutely in the right to be hurt and I'm sorry.
> ...


I say you're off to a bad start with this girl, now i'ts cigars and the next thing you know she controls everything you do.....find another girl ASAP


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

jazzboypro said:


> I say you're off to a bad start with this girl, now i'ts cigars and the next thing you know she controls everything you do.....find another girl ASAP


As old as this thread is, it's no longer a start.

I'd hope he parted ways with her.


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## Emperor Zurg (May 6, 2013)

huskers said:


> As old as this thread is, it's no longer a start.
> I'd hope he parted ways with her.


Me too. Sounds like a controlling bitch.

SOP of the controlling bitch...
1) find something to bitch about
2) nag the hell out of you to comply
3) you lie to her just to shut her the f**k up
4) she finds out 'you lied' and flips out over it
5) nagging now resumes replete with a measure of distrust

Sorry man, even if she IS Rachael Mcadams hot, it still wouldn't be worth it, IMO


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## RJ-Harder (Apr 23, 2013)

lol I can sense some sensitivity to this issue. Obviously you guys don't like a wife/gf having a say in your smoking habits.

I can relate to both sides. On the one hand, I can understand because I don't like it when my wife smokes a cigar. She almost never does, but she has shared one with me twice. I didn't tell her not to, but I did tell her I don't like it when she does. I dunno why, I just don't. I also know I never would have talked to her when I met her if she was a cigarette smoker. And if she ever did try to take up cigarettes, which she wouldn't, I would have a serious problem. Now, there's a big difference between casual cigars, and frequent disgusting cancer sticks. Nonetheless, I can understand the other side.

I think the thing for the OP here is that you were a cigar smoker when she met you, and then she decided she needed to fix you. We all have our vices, and a few cigars is a long way from a cigarette addiction. The important thing here is to be honest - I have a friend who smokes behind his wife's back, and it's worse than just being honest about it.


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## quincy627 (Jul 2, 2010)

I bet the OP's girl took away his computer too, due to all the bad influences around here. lol.


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## huskers (Oct 2, 2012)

quincy627 said:


> I bet the OP's girl took away his computer too, due to all the bad influences around here. lol.


no doubt............my wife blames all of you and I let you guys take the blame.

:rotfl:


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## MarkC (Jul 4, 2009)

I'm 55 and I will NEVER get involved with a woman who wants to 'fix' me again. If that's all women, fine; I can do without them. Rosie is still around...


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

Im not far behind you at 51 but I am happily married. Ive never been in an argument with my wife, ever. We simply agree to disagree.

For the whole episode that started this here is my .02

Firstly any woman that excepts you with conditions isnt worth having. She either takes the whole shebang as is or she doesnt. I have always been and always will be true to myself. Its not that I have an attitude problem, people who dont like me just have a problem with my attitude and quite honestly you can measure my concern about what others think about me in microgivashits. Dont ever let anyone tell you what you can and cant do.....EVER! They start off with small ultimatums then they grow one by one. Also be aware that most women are great score keepers. If you have a disagreement and think its settled...well thing again because they will bring that crap back up 20 years later. Im so happy my wife isnt like that and its the only reason she is my wife. Ive been around the block with gals enough times to know that if she is starting in on you now its only going to get worse.

Now for the other side of the fence. I have to agree with the girlfriend on the lying part. Its one thing to break a promise but never lie about it. If you cant be open and honest in a relationship and have to lie then you either A) need to grow a pair and stand up for yourself no matter the consequences or B) you dont have very much of a relationship at all and its time to move on.


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## BurnOne (Feb 26, 2012)

my own experience
I was with my GF for 10 y before we got married, at some point she wanted me to quit stogies. I agreed to all but a few times a year and kept my word. She then decided my friends were no good( cut back on hanging with them), and i played too many video games (cut back on those) and had a crappy job (got a new job that sucked out my soul) smoked too much pot (quit altogether) ate too much junk (salads and tofu for me). then we get divorced after 4 years of marriage "you aren't the man you were when we first met".
I will admit i let myself be whipped all in the name of love. I thought i was doing the right thing. Truth is we wouldn't have lasted no matter what when i had given her everything she wanted she wasn't happy about that either.
Now i do what i want and will not change for someone else. I take my relationship as a lesson learned and lost a few friends in the process and i take the blame for letting it happen.
if only someone would have pulled a "Saving Silverman" on me years ago.........


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## RJ-Harder (Apr 23, 2013)

JustinThyme said:


> Firstly any woman that excepts you with conditions isnt worth having. She either takes the whole shebang as is or she doesnt. I have always been and always will be true to myself. Its not that I have an attitude problem, people who dont like me just have a problem with my attitude and quite honestly you can measure my concern about what others think about me in microgivashits. Dont ever let anyone tell you what you can and cant do.....EVER! They start off with small ultimatums then they grow one by one. Also be aware that most women are great score keepers. If you have a disagreement and think its settled...well thing again because they will bring that crap back up 20 years later. Im so happy my wife isnt like that and its the only reason she is my wife. Ive been around the block with gals enough times to know that if she is starting in on you now its only going to get worse.


I don't totally agree with you there. Every relationship has conditions - there are tons of conditions on any loving relationship. Neither my wife nor I are allowed to start smoking cigarettes, drink every day, or shoot heroine for that matter. We also can't start flirting with members of the opposite sex. A big one is that we don't lie to eachother. These are the conditions my wife and I place on each other, and whil they may seem obvious, but they're still conditions. After all, plenty of people I know have no problem with their partner flirting with somebody as long as that's where it stays. My wife and I definitely do have a problem, so neither of us do it. The key, for me, is that the conditions your partner place on you are out of love, and are compromises you are willing to make to be with that person. Some compromises are easier to make, and everyone has different conditions. But to imply that a good relationship should be completely void of conditions is to say, in my opinion, that you have no behavioral obligation to your partner whatsoever.


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

I have to respectfully disagree with you. If someones flaws are so great that they cant be trusted they need professional help outside of the relationship. I have been married for over 20 years and there is NO TOS that came with my marriage. A great deal of what was mentioned again are not relationship problems. Nobody tells me what to do EVER! But then again my flaws are not so great that I need to be corrected by anyone. There is a distinct difference between relationship problems and lack of morals. I don't lie to my wife, matter of fact I don't lie to anyone, nor do I sugar coat things. I tell it like it is period. Being completely honest with my wife is not a condition, its just who I am and I do it willingly without it being demanded. I'm also not a jealous person. My wife gets hit on all the time (the 38G boobs do it every time!) and I ignore it, especially when we are out on the town. Hell if you want to buy her a drink that she is only going to share with me all the more power to you, saves me money. Bottom line is I know she is going home with me and I have the utmost trust and respect for her and it is reciprocated. On my end I don't flirt with other women, Im happy with the one I have. I do talk with other women without fear of reprisal as I know my wife trusts me. I do look though and my wife doesn't have an issue with that. Matter of fact when we were still dating I busted her checking out a surfer dudes butt and I just leaned over and said "Nice butt huh?" She turned 20 shades of red because she knew she was busted then she just blurted out "Darn right that's a nice butt!" I just chuckled and said to myself "I'm going to marry this woman!" I've had friends try and get me to go out to a strip club which for 99.9% of women this is a huge NO NO! Whats my wife say...Hell Ill go with you and stuff the bills in their G strings for you so long as you bring the wood home. I told her like I tell anyone else. I don't do strip clubs. Do I like looking at nekked women, well hell yes but not under the guise of their only interest being emptying my wallet in as short a time as possible. That's a huge turn off for me! If you don't have behavioral issues there is no obligation needed. I don't have behavioral issues and my take on it is, and no offense intended, if you have to have restrictions placed on you then you should get square with yourself first before attempting to have a relationship. Im not perfect by any means, I know that and so does my wife but there are no restrictions placed on me as our love is UNCONDITIONAL

There is also a distinct difference between your significant other asking you to do something and giving an ultimatum. Sure there are always compromises in any relationship but in a good one with two people who are living their lives the right way the compromise is are we watching NCIS or CSI and that's about the extent of our compromises. We don't argue, period. That's just the way we are. There is no rule book that says we have to have the same opinion on things. She has hers and I have mine and we both respect that.

I went a long time before getting married. I was past 30. Why? Because I wasn't about to get into a permanent relationship where there were conditions. I've dated more women than I can remember and as soon as beotch showed its ugly face I ended it on the spot. I don't have time for that mess. Treat me with courtesy and respect and you will get the same back ten fold. Treat me like trash or like I'm a child by dishing out ultimatums or restrictions and Ill walk in a NY minute. I cant tell you how many women I have really PO'd over the years from refusing to argue with them. Anyone, male or female starts that mess and all they are going to see is my backside as I'm walking away. Want to have an intelligent conversation and respect each others point of view, I'm all ears. Want to make it into a pissing match, I'm outta there!

IMO a good relationship is not about being conditional and having to change who you are (or at least put up false front to that effect), its the exact opposite. If you love, trust, respect and are honest with one another nothing else is needed, if you don't then you don't really have a relationship at all, just a coexistence. HUGE difference.:mrgreen:


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## Mante (Dec 25, 2009)

> are we watching NCIS or CSI ?


Who won?


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## f4milytime (May 15, 2013)

*There are worse things than cigars !!! :lol:*


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## JustinThyme (Jun 17, 2013)

Tashaz said:


> Who won?


LOL She did, I usually give in as either is fine with me and she doesnt suggest shows that she enjoys but knows I despise. Thats what Im talking about when it comes to relationships. We click, no conditions necessary.


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## RJ-Harder (Apr 23, 2013)

JustinThyme said:


> I have to respectfully disagree with you. If someones flaws are so great that they cant be trusted they need professional help outside of the relationship. I have been married for over 20 years and there is NO TOS that came with my marriage. A great deal of what was mentioned again are not relationship problems. Nobody tells me what to do EVER! But then again my flaws are not so great that I need to be corrected by anyone. There is a distinct difference between relationship problems and lack of morals. I don't lie to my wife, matter of fact I don't lie to anyone, nor do I sugar coat things. I tell it like it is period. Being completely honest with my wife is not a condition, its just who I am and I do it willingly without it being demanded. I'm also not a jealous person. My wife gets hit on all the time (the 38G boobs do it every time!) and I ignore it, especially when we are out on the town. Hell if you want to buy her a drink that she is only going to share with me all the more power to you, saves me money. Bottom line is I know she is going home with me and I have the utmost trust and respect for her and it is reciprocated. On my end I don't flirt with other women, Im happy with the one I have. I do talk with other women without fear of reprisal as I know my wife trusts me. I do look though and my wife doesn't have an issue with that. Matter of fact when we were still dating I busted her checking out a surfer dudes butt and I just leaned over and said "Nice butt huh?" She turned 20 shades of red because she knew she was busted then she just blurted out "Darn right that's a nice butt!" I just chuckled and said to myself "I'm going to marry this woman!" I've had friends try and get me to go out to a strip club which for 99.9% of women this is a huge NO NO! Whats my wife say...Hell Ill go with you and stuff the bills in their G strings for you so long as you bring the wood home. I told her like I tell anyone else. I don't do strip clubs. Do I like looking at nekked women, well hell yes but not under the guise of their only interest being emptying my wallet in as short a time as possible. That's a huge turn off for me! If you don't have behavioral issues there is no obligation needed. I don't have behavioral issues and my take on it is, and no offense intended, if you have to have restrictions placed on you then you should get square with yourself first before attempting to have a relationship. Im not perfect by any means, I know that and so does my wife but there are no restrictions placed on me as our love is UNCONDITIONAL
> 
> There is also a distinct difference between your significant other asking you to do something and giving an ultimatum. Sure there are always compromises in any relationship but in a good one with two people who are living their lives the right way the compromise is are we watching NCIS or CSI and that's about the extent of our compromises. We don't argue, period. That's just the way we are. There is no rule book that says we have to have the same opinion on things. She has hers and I have mine and we both respect that.
> 
> ...


That's great that she lets you go to strip clubs - so does my wife, but it doesn't mean there are no conditions on either your relationship with your wife or my relationship with mine. All that means is that you don't break your wife's conditions, and she doesn't break yours. It might require no sacrifice on your part to meet her conditions, but it doesn't mean they aren't there.

Do you think if you took off one night and spent a month shooting heroine and hiring hookers that she would be elated to welcome you back home? I think you'll find out pretty quickly she has conditions. The key to a strong relationship is finding somebody who shares the same values, and is likely to place the same conditions on a relationship as you.

As for never arguing, that's great for you...but I couldn't stand a relationship with no tension. I dated a girl once where we never argued about anything, and it was an awful relationship. There was no arguing, no disagreeing, no tension...nothing - because there was no passion. Tension and arguments are something that makes a relationship stronger, as long as it's done right and it's not happening all the time.


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## beercritic (Feb 13, 2011)

Guess I'm lucky. Shacked up for 17 years, married for 15. Very seldom argue about anything. We allow each other to do what we each want. Very seldom are we on different pages. I married my best friend.


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## TerFox (May 17, 2013)

Guess you better find a new hobby or a new girlfriend.


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