# cigar reviews are hilarious



## aviator300 (Jan 10, 2009)

I couldnt believe a particular review when i read it, so here is a small quote from it. (with a couple of my comments included)..

Prelight aroma consisted of sweet floral notes accompanied by fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum..

Upon lighting, I was welcomed with a glorious medley of spice and cinnamon, with just a hint of cloves..

As the smoke progressed, these flavors morphed (i guess like in magic morphin power rangers) into a cedar sweetness with creamy notes of MYRRH..(WHAT ?)..(I cant remember when i last sat down to a good dinner of myrrh)..what does myrhh taste like anyway??

Anyway, you get my point about the ridiculousness of most cigar reviews..

When someone asks me to describe the flavor of my Padrons, i say something like " THEY HAVE A GREAT OLD FASHIONED TOBACCO FLAVOR"
and leave it at that..


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## Pugsley (Jul 12, 2009)

..... it's a naive little cigar but I think you'll be amused by it's presumptions ....


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## GlassEye (Oct 25, 2009)

What cigar was the review from, sounds like the perfect Christmas smoke. I want one. Some people have the palate to taste such things and identify them, others may just know if they like it or not, as long as you like something though it shouldn't matter.


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## slyder (Mar 17, 2009)

my tobacco palate can only pick out..........good.....bad


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

Pretentious reviews are out there as well as in other venuesi of life. It does get pretty humorous when you read a cigar review that reads like Chinese arithmetic and to try and follow some of these reviews gets comical. fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum C'mon now!!!! lol


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## J.C. (Apr 4, 2009)

I know what you mean, I was reading a cc review a while back and someone said they found the stick had a hint of darjeeling tea...I mean wtf!! I'm with slyder, it's either a good or bad stick! 

The most I can say about the taste of a cigar is that it can have a creamy, woody, and sometimes "earthy" taste to it...but don't ask me to describe the latter to you, it's one of those things I can pick up but not describe well!! lol!


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## zeavran1 (Aug 18, 2009)

Maybe he was smoking a super fantastic incredible cigar. lol


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## Pugsley (Jul 12, 2009)

"fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum" .... If I tasted something like that in a cigar it would go straight into the trash.


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## redcannon (Jun 29, 2009)

You mean to say that you guys can't detect a subtle hint of Jasmine-Oolang tea complimenting a rich, almond chocolate-cream base with notes of orange blossom and sandalwood? 

The funniest thing is that at the base of all tastes and smells there lies a gray field of subjectivity. Tobacco to me might not taste like tobacco to you. In fact, they may be far off.

Why can't CA just say that something is a "damn good smoke, something I'd recommend to a close friend who likes full flavor and spice"?


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## scottwpreston (Oct 11, 2009)

I have so been tempted to write a review and post it using every word on this wheel at least
once, but have with held the temptation and am trying my best to be a GOOD NOOB!


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

i'm gonna go against the grain and say that cigar flavors are not subjective. they have machines that can actually detect flavors, and i'm sure that if you could hook a cigar to one of these machines, that they'll tell you what flavors to expect. i think most people who can't detect flavors just aren't thinking about it, are ignorant of flavors and cannot describe them, or just plain do not use their sense of smell; you cannot taste more complex flavors, but you can sure smell them.

my 2c.


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## Dom (Jan 19, 2008)

OP I'm assuming you've never done a sponsored review much less any in depth review.

I'm not saying this is necessarily the case in your example, but when a company sends you something, the idea is to be in-depth and to describe the cigar to the best of your abilities. If the guy knows what murr smells like and that's the best comparison he can make to the cigar then how is that overboard????

If i read an in-depth intelligent review vs. one that says "It has a good old fashioned tobacco flavor" I wonder which one is going to be more helpful?

That being said, some people do go overboard, and its best to try and find a happy medium, I think I do pretty well in mine:

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/non-habanos-reviews/256845-cuba-aliados-miami-edition.html

http://www.cigarforums.net/forums/vb/non-habanos-reviews/256975-felipe-gregorio-moroccan-series.html

Jst some examples, also DBCigar, and Rubix have done some nice ones. And the pictures are def. what turns a review from good to great


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## aviator300 (Jan 10, 2009)

Cigary said:


> Pretentious reviews are out there as well as in other venuesi of life. It does get pretty humorous when you read a cigar review that reads like Chinese arithmetic and to try and follow some of these reviews gets comical. fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum C'mon now!!!! lol


im still trying to figure out where to get some of that MYRRH to munch on..along with some gold and some frankenscense


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

eNthusiast said:


> i'm gonna go against the grain and say that cigar flavors are not subjective. they have machines that can actually detect flavors, and i'm sure that if you could hook a cigar to one of these machines, that they'll tell you what flavors to expect. i think most people who can't detect flavors just aren't thinking about it, are ignorant of flavors and cannot describe them, or just plain do not use their sense of smell; you cannot taste more complex flavors, but you can sure smell them.
> 
> my 2c.


dug up a wikipedia article:

Aroma compound - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

i'm sure if you were to isolate the many many aromatic compounds in cigar smoke, some of these would be found in there.

related article on flavors in wine:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aroma_of_wine

quote:
"The act of tasting wine is essentially the act of smelling these vaporized aroma compounds. Olfactory receptors cells, each sensitive to a different aromas, pick up these compounds and transfers the information to the brain by way of the olfactory bulb."

"In the 1980s there was renewed focus in studying the correlation between aroma/flavor compounds in grapes and the resulting quality of wine. Scientists were able to use chromatograph-mass spectrometers to identify volatile aroma compounds in various grape varieties."

"Wines served at warmer temperature will be more aromatic than wine served cooler due to heats ability to increase the volatility of aromatic compounds in the wine. Swirling, or aerating, the wine will introduce more air molecules into the wine which can capture the aroma molecules and carry them up to the nose. Some subtle aromatics can be overwhelmed by more dominant aromatics that are arise after swirling so most professional tasters will sniff the wine briefly first before swirling."

relating to cigar smoke:
"When wine is sipped, it is warmed in the mouth and mixes with saliva to vaporize the volatile aroma compounds. These compounds are then inhaled "retro-nasally" through the back of the mouth to where it is received by nearly five million nerve cells. The average human can be trained to distinguish thousands of smells but can usually only name a handful at a time when presented with many aromas. This phenomenon, known as the "tip of the nose phenomenon", is countered when a person is giving a list of possible choices through which they can often positively identify the aroma. Professional wine tasters will often mentally cycle through a list of potential aromas (and may use visual aids like the aroma wheel developed by Ann C. Noble of University of California, Davis) until one choice stands out and can be identified in the wine.[4]"


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## drake.c.w. (Feb 7, 2009)

People really shouldn't pick on people who have the ability to do something that you don't...that being said, some people get a little obnoxious. "Glorious medley" is a bit over the top. But everyone has their own writing style. And just because you don't know what myrrh is you shouldn't assume others don't. And a vast amount of people do know what myrrh is. The point of reviewing is to try and relate the flavors you're tasting in a way other's can understand (in hopes that this info helps them create a prejudgment). You say a cigar is old fashioned tasting? Well, I've never smoked a cigar in any other time period than now, so what does that mean to me? Get what I mean? I say leave the guy alone; sounds like he really enjoyed that smoke! Wish I had one! lol


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## scottwpreston (Oct 11, 2009)

Well, now I gotta say this is getting interesting...
Myrrh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Rubix^3 (Nov 10, 2008)

Dom said:


> OP I'm assuming you've never done a sponsored review much less any in depth review.
> 
> I'm not saying this is necessarily the case in your example, but when a company sends you something, the idea is to be in-depth and to describe the cigar to the best of your abilities. If the guy knows what murr smells like and that's the best comparison he can make to the cigar then how is that overboard????
> 
> ...


My My Dom, I am honored. 
I really enjoy cooking food, a lot--and this has greatly influenced my love for discovering flavors in cigar smoke. The gastronomic world is huge!
I would never intentionally go "pretentious" on anyone here, but I am the kind of person who loves to attempt to name names of flavors. No offense to those who prefer to speak in terms of merely good or bad, but I prefer specifics, even if they are subjective. If you smoked with me you'd understand, that at least....I'm crazy.
lol.


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## Qball (Oct 5, 2009)

REVIEW: Flor de Vagrant

I am enjoying my my first hand-rolled cigar made by a bum collecting cigarette butts from a bus station ash stand and rolled in used lottery tickets. Purchased from some scary fellow that mumbles to himself in the parking lot of my local Quickie Mart

Pre-light- the stick had the glorious faint aroma of Boone's Farm Strawberry Hill and Nyquil.

First-third- my palate is dancing in the aromas of chicken wings with a slight after taste of bad BO in the back of my throat. The stick produced copious amounts of wonderful aroma that I contains hints of what I can only describe as Eau de la Garbage'

The draw opens up in the middle third and the note changed from the Boone's Farm to Mad Dog 20-20.

Final third- the burn remains totally uneven and requires a blowtorch to keep lit! I don't know if it's the used chewing gum holding the cap on, or just the dirt, but this stick won't stay lit. As I burn it down to the last inch, I am reminded of a faint urine smell reminiscent of the subways cars of New York or the urinal troughs of the mens room at Fenway Park


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## Magnate (Nov 27, 2009)

There's Myrrh toothpaste available all around here... I hate it. 

With that said, I can pull a number of flavors out of cigars, and I'm still relatively new to them. It does take some time because at first, they all taste like cigars. It's once you've had enough of the that you can taste/smell the different flavor(s) that this cigar produces over the general, normal "cigar" flavor. Then you have to purposefully try to identify that difference. 

I've easily pulled coffee, dark chocolate, cream, cedar, raisin, vanilla, cinnamon and so on. 

It's there, but you've got to look for it.


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## Dom (Jan 19, 2008)

The bottom line is IF  I knew what Myrrh (or any ritzy flavor) tasted/smelled like, AND i tasted that in a cigar, I would undoubtedly report it in my review.

Any good reviewer can appreciate the act of describing the flavors to the best of your ability and relating them to the closest possibly example. If you can't appreciate it, try writing some reviews before you judge.


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## danmcmartin (Jul 25, 2009)

As in frankincense and myrrh? WTF? Why not just go completely off the deep end and say something like, "...reminded me of an extinct fruiting fern, favored by the stegosaurus, that only grew on a small island off the west coast of the great continent of Pangaea during the late Cretaceous..." Talk about a reference to an obscure source. I mean you might get the favor if you have a sophisticated palette (an know what the heck Myrrh is), but the average cigar smoker isn't going to know what the heck it tastes or smells like.


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## danmcmartin (Jul 25, 2009)

Qball said:


> REVIEW: Flor de Vagrant
> 
> I am enjoying my my first hand-rolled cigar made by a bum collecting cigarette butts from a bus station ash stand and rolled in used lottery tickets. Purchased from some scary fellow that mumbles to himself in the parking lot of my local Quickie Mart
> 
> ...


Classic!!


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## jsnake (Oct 6, 2009)

I have been asked to guest review on a website and I am kind of nervous about doing it. My friend says hey just do your own thing and don't conform to anyone else's way of reviewing. I am with the majority in saying I either like a cigar or I don't. 

I smoked a Gurkha Legend and told someone to me it was liking smoking Christmas. Makes no sense whatsoever but it reminded me of what Christmas smells like from when I was a kid. Everyone's palate is different and I like the down to earth realistic reviews that give me an idea of what might be good to try. These reviews that go way out there are silly but guys who give some realistic idea of what they are experiencing are alright. 

Funny stuff here.


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## GlassEye (Oct 25, 2009)

Qball said:


> REVIEW: Flor de Vagrant
> 
> I am enjoying my my first hand-rolled cigar made by a bum collecting cigarette butts from a bus station ash stand and rolled in used lottery tickets. Purchased from some scary fellow that mumbles to himself in the parking lot of my local Quickie Mart
> 
> ...


Funniest thing I've heard all day :rofl:

But what was the cigar that was reviewed, the description made me really want one for my Christmas day smoke.


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## Sirhuffsalot (May 8, 2009)

Have`nt you heard of the* romance of the cigar*?

Some of these guys get it right, and some dont. Thank god most of the cigars I smoke dont cost a gazzillion bucks, so I only have to smoke one. If they was right, I might listen to them again. Some of them are good writers. Some of them are only pushing the company line, capice?

FWIW, I *can* taste plum when its presented, I like it, I can relate to it. And meat, yaa meat, 
Thats not to say I wont be able to in a few years, things change. Cigars change. Maybe I burn my mouth out, who knows??

Cheers,
Randy


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## Sirhuffsalot (May 8, 2009)

Qball said:


> REVIEW: Flor de Vagrant
> 
> I am enjoying my my first hand-rolled cigar made by a bum collecting cigarette butts from a bus station ash stand and rolled in used lottery tickets. Purchased from some scary fellow that mumbles to himself in the parking lot of my local Quickie Mart
> 
> ...


Seriously funny, 

Are you sure mr scary did`nt kester that stick case he got rolled by the po-po?

Always know who youse are buying from, and wheres they pull it out from, LOLOLOL.


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## Magnate (Nov 27, 2009)

Seriously BOTL's, myrrh is not hard to locate...

Amazon.com: Tom's of Maine - Natural Propolis & Myrrh Toothpaste, 6 oz toothpaste: Health & Personal Care

I have had a number of cigars present an "off-mint" flavor during a decent snorking and myrrh is not a bad descriptor for that flavor.

You don't have to be a prissy, pretentious b*&%! to pick up on what makes a cigar unique.

I have to wonder, if you really can only taste "good" or "bad" why not go on a search for the very cheapest "good" cigar, and constantly strive to save money? Why bother with a new cigar on the market if it costs more than a $2 good cigar? I don't want to sound like a jerk here, I really don't. I REALLY enjoy this website and the community here - but it's strange to me that most of you don't seem to enjoy the nuances.

With all due respect, BOTL's.


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

i'm curious- to those who can't/don't pick out flavors, how do you decide what makes a cigar good?


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## smelvis (Sep 7, 2009)

aviator300 said:


> When someone asks me to describe the flavor of my Padrons, i say something like " THEY HAVE A GREAT OLD FASHIONED TOBACCO FLAVOR"
> and leave it at that..


(Sniped)
I have sat down took pictures as I smoked and tried to write a good review, I just can't write well. The one you copied was hilarious was it real seemed kinda snobbish, But all I know is what you said I can tell you light, medium, strong and if I liked it and by how much and that's about it. I can usually tell how much when I have about 50 to try that people sent me and I keep going back to the same smoke,

Not meant to offend anyone who can write well and really taste those things I just can't.

Dave


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## smelvis (Sep 7, 2009)

Dom said:


> OP I'm assuming you've never done a sponsored review much less any in depth review.
> 
> I'm not saying this is necessarily the case in your example, but when a company sends you something, the idea is to be in-depth and to describe the cigar to the best of your abilities. If the guy knows what murr smells like and that's the best comparison he can make to the cigar then how is that overboard????
> 
> ...


Dom
I just read your reviews you linked, I would have been helped by yours, it was thorough and I understood it, it was chronological with pictures. It was nothing like the OP sample, I was laughing to myself half way through it.

Keep writing you have a talent for it!

Dave


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## tx_tuff (Jun 16, 2007)

Hell I can pick up many flavors in a cigar including coca, nuts (even certain kinds like Almond, Hazel nut sometimes), grass, hay, tobacco, rich tobacco, pepper, other spices, moss, wood (even certain wood sometimes), even have picked up fig, licorice, and butter but think God not the same cigar! One thing that a lot of people pick up and I almost never do is leather. So to say somebody is full of it etc.. just because you can't taste a certain thing then thats just wrong. Do people go overboard, hell yes they do. But at the same time they are doing something they prob love to do and we all like reading them. So I say keep them coming!


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## smelvis (Sep 7, 2009)

tx_tuff said:


> Hell I can pick up many flavors in a cigar including coca, nuts (even certain kinds like Almond, Hazel nut sometimes), grass, hay, tobacco, rich tobacco, pepper, other spices, moss, wood (even certain wood sometimes), even have picked up fig, licorice, and butter but think God not the same cigar! One thing that a lot of people pick up and I almost never do is leather. So to say somebody is full of it etc.. just because you can't taste a certain thing then thats just wrong. Do people go overboard, hell yes they do. But at the same time they are doing something they prob love to do and we all like reading them. So I say keep them coming!


I should stay off these threads, I to can pick out some stuff, Like Lighting a Padron 80th very spicy and made me think for a minute, then it did change mellowed and changed a couple times through out, I don't pick them out or have the words, I do know I loved it and bought a box it was not aged either.

I will say those words remind me more of reading cigar aficionado, pretty pictures but they will not convince me to buy many Rolex's, That has nothing to do with not being able to tell a good cigar over a bad one.

By all means people just my opinion no offense just posting my thoughts,


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## mrsmitty (Jan 22, 2009)

When I first started I smoked probably 20 cigars before I could start to pick out certain flavors. I've tasted citrus/sweet fruity flavors, caramel, cream, wood, cedar, black pepper, hay/barnyard (aroma-taste), raw bread dough (just last night first time I ever picked it up but it stoke out like a sore thumb). And I'm sure the more I smoke, the more I pay attention, the more I get familiar with the flavors I'm tasting the more I'll be able to understand. This is what makes cigars so interesting to me.

Also I like simple to point reviews. I've read somewhere that the best wine tasters are people who get to the point, with the littlest but most detailed words in their reviews. Something to think about for those of you who want to refine your reviewing skills.


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## Nurse_Maduro (Oct 23, 2008)

GlassEye said:


> What cigar was the review from, sounds like the perfect Christmas smoke. I want one. Some people have the palate to taste such things and identify them, others may just know if they like it or not, as long as you like something though it shouldn't matter.


It's been posited that somewhere between 6-10% of the population (I think it's probably more like 3-6%) have a hyper palate...they can actually taste things far more subtle than what the normal palate can taste...so it's possible that these are those people. Although, I suspect most are just cigar snobs trying to fit into the CA club.

I can taste woods, chocolate, nuttiness (but not individual nuts), hay / grass, pepper...and that's about it. Beyond that, I'll note characteristics of a stick (like creaminess)...but myrrh? Yeah...whatever!


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## Stench (Aug 17, 2009)

It's not been long ago that I took a puff and tasted CASHEWS..WTH? Next puff it was gone. Usually can taste the bolder flavors (cedar, earthy, etc), but every now and then I will get a taste of something new!

But for the most part, It either taste good or it don't! 

I really do smell plums in some pipe tobaccos..don't taste them, but I can smell them!


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

Heh great imagery in that writing. All you guys managed to do was make me hungry though. I'm gunna go raid the breakroom and see if I can find any sour plums or a Jasmine-Oolang tea with a rich, almond chocolate-cream base with notes of orange blossom and sandalwood lol.


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## Habanolover (Feb 22, 2006)

While I can taste a lot of things in my tobacco, I cannot tell you the difference between vanilla and 7 year old Madagascar vanilla.  A lot of the things that are described come from the sense of smell rather than taste. Take "earthy" for example. Of course most of us don't sit around and eat "earth" but certain tastes may remind you of the smell of being in the damp woods. The same with leathery, while I don't sit around eating leather certain sticks do bring to mind the memory of playing baseball and chewing on the leather strings from the glove.

For anyone that says they just can't taste some of these things I would recommend you start snorking (release a bit of the smoke out of your nasal passages) and it will help you to pick out more of the subtle flavors. And then there are some whose palate is never going to be able to pick these things out and will render you to either "like it" or don't. There is nothing wrong with that either as long as you are smoking the "like it" sticks.


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## Wiseguy1982 (Nov 17, 2009)

aviator300 said:


> im still trying to figure out where to get some of that MYRRH to munch on..along with some gold and some frankenscense


Myrrh Seeds

Frankincense Seeds

Gold

Now you can play three wise men too! :lol:


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

You know, when I was in Napa I saw this awesome kit that had distilled flavor chemicals common in wines that you could taste so you could "train" your palate to detect the various flavors and sensations. It'd be really cool if someone did that for cigars.


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## Dom (Jan 19, 2008)

smelvis said:


> Dom
> I just read your reviews you linked, I would have been helped by yours, it was thorough and I understood it, it was chronological with pictures. It was nothing like the OP sample, I was laughing to myself half way through it.
> 
> Keep writing you have a talent for it!
> ...


Thx Dave, those links were more to show that there needs to be a balance between OP's "Good Old Fashioned" and "Prissy".

The thing that I don't get is why are people judging those w/ more sophisticated palates?? I mean if you taste/smell myrrh in a cigar then give me 1 reason why you shouldn't report it in your review? Especially if you're getting paid to do so?

i jst dont understand all the bashing in the first couple pages of this thread


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## Dom (Jan 19, 2008)

madurolover said:


> A lot of the things that are described come from the sense of smell rather than taste. Take "earthy" for example. Of course most of us don't sit around and eat "earth" but certain tastes may remind you of the smell of being in the damp woods. The same with leathery, while I don't sit around eating leather certain sticks do bring to mind the memory of playing baseball and chewing on the leather strings from the glove.


Lol did u get that from the video on aficionado's website


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## chas1957 (Oct 8, 2009)

CheapHumidors said:


> You know, when I was in Napa I saw this awesome kit that had distilled flavor chemicals common in wines that you could taste so you could "train" your palate to detect the various flavors and sensations. It'd be really cool if someone did that for cigars.


great idea!


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## BigStun (Sep 23, 2009)

Many cigar reviews sound like a 7 course meal...I am not going to say that people are not picking up these flavors, but it is my opinion that as a whole cigar reviews have gone overboard which has fueled the fire of some of these over-the-top reviews.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

danmcmartin said:


> As in frankincense and myrrh? WTF? Why not just go completely off the deep end and say something like, "...reminded me of an extinct fruiting fern, favored by the stegosaurus, that only grew on a small island off the west coast of the great continent of Pangaea during the late Cretaceous..." Talk about a reference to an obscure source. I mean you might get the favor if you have a sophisticated palette (an know what the heck Myrrh is), but the average cigar smoker isn't going to know what the heck it tastes or smells like.


ROFL,,,,I know we all have different takes as to how we preceive cigar tastes and all and there are those who do some excellent reviews while others have their own styles and make it cut and dried. For those who like to embellish in their reviews that's fine too but don't let that dissuede you from doing anymore reviews. Have a sense of humor in that some people are going to use more adjectives in their assessments of how a cigar will smoke,,,,what tastes they draw from. It's all in good fun and for those who tend to be over the top,,that's fine as well because there is a vast audience for all the different ways to express yourself on here. Bottom line, we love reviews but we can find some humor in them as well so let's just remind ourselves that we're not all cut from the same cloth and embrace it,,,,I'd hate it if we were all alike so embrace the diversity.


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

Cigary said:


> For those who like to embellish...


no offense, but how do you know that they're embellishing? i don't think you can quite make that judgement, seeing as how cigar tastes are subjective and individualized. this once again comes down to the presumption that you know more about the individual's subjective taste in the cigar than the individual.


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## Royale Duke (Aug 14, 2009)

Pugsley said:


> "fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum" .... If I tasted something like that in a cigar it would go straight into the trash.


Agreed LOL.


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## eyesack (Jul 19, 2009)

I agree with everything that's been said. Some cigars I can only say "yes I liked it" or "no I will not be buying that one again". However, I can be a very particular person who pays a lot of attention to detail. Must be why I'm a car detailer... That being said, I've taken some advice on expanding my palate and been eating strange foods that I might normally overlook, just to see what it tastes like. I agree with what Donnie said about smell and to piggy back, smell is the sense most closely linked to memory. I can assure you you'll never forget what rotting corpse smells like if you've ever smelled it.

Leather to me, for example, tastes like the inside of a hot, stifling luxury automobile, that never knows what open windows are, seats coated in body oils and dandruff. Needless to say, I don't usually like that taste. I have fewer memories of leather tasting like my wallet than sitting in a hot car.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

eNthusiast said:


> no offense, but how do you know that they're embellishing? i don't think you can quite make that judgement, seeing as how cigar tastes are subjective and individualized. this once again comes down to the presumption that you know more about the individual's subjective taste in the cigar than the individual.


No offense taken but if you read what I posted,,,,"For those who like to embellish,,,,," by definition means elaboration of an interpretation by the use of decorative (sometimes fictitious) detail;it is not a word that means anything negative. I actually can make that judgement based on what the real definition states,,,I often embellish my own reviews on a cigar but have not as yet compared the tastes to any of the aforementioned properties of plums. If I do come across one that has that taste you can bet I will bring it up just like I would if the cigar tasted like pumpernickel bread or corned beef and cabbage. I don't know how you can make the jump that I know more about somebodys tastes than their own as I wasn't even in the same zip code. I only know my tastes and don't even suggest to know what somebody else tastes in their cigar smoking. I am pretty sure you misunderstood what I said or misread because the phrase of "For those who like to embellish" doesn't even remotely say anything as to what you are saying. :mrgreen:


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## LibertyToad (Jul 27, 2008)

Cigary said:


> Pretentious reviews are out there as well as in other venuesi of life. It does get pretty humorous when you read a cigar review that reads like Chinese arithmetic and to try and follow some of these reviews gets comical. fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum C'mon now!!!! lol


Yeah, I thought it was a bit over the top, but having said that, I wish I was a better taster.

On a good day, I can taste earth, leather, spice, coffee, dark chocolate, hay, dirt, and that's about it--and that's on a good day (say 1 cigar out of 8-10). Usually I just taste tobacco and some other things I can never quite identify.

:shock:


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

Cigary said:


> I often embellish my own reviews on a cigar but have not as yet compared the tastes to any of the aforementioned properties of plums.





> I don't know how you can make the jump that I know more about somebodys tastes than their own





> to try and follow some of these reviews gets comical. fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum C'mon now!!!!





> I only know my tastes and don't even suggest to know what somebody else tastes in their cigar smoking. I am pretty sure you misunderstood what I said or misread because the phrase of "For those who like to embellish" doesn't even remotely say anything as to what you are saying. :mrgreen:


following from your quotes here, it seems as if that if someone were to taste "sour plum", that you would catagorize that as "embellishing", as a lot of other posters would. your quote that these reviews are comical seem to me that you would discredit them, thus my argument.

my quote:


> this once again comes down to the presumption that you know more about the individual's subjective taste in the cigar than the individual.


when i said you, i didn't mean you specifically, but as a whole that anyone would challenge an individual's subjective taste.


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## Rubix^3 (Nov 10, 2008)

I will happily throw down the proverbial glove and challenge anyone's subjective taste to a duel. 

lol,

Seriously though, do cigars have any objective characteristics of flavor/aroma at all?


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

Rubix^3 said:


> Seriously though, do cigars have any objective characteristics of flavor/aroma at all?


honestly, i believe they do. if you read my earlier post in this thread about aromatic compounds you'd find that certain aromatic compounds have specific tastes. it is only when human interpretation comes to play that it is subjective. but for the most part, the compound vanillin will taste like vanilla.

if you were to mass spectrograph the many aromatic compounds in cigar smoke you'd find a lot of different flavors, and those can be used as objective "tastes" or flavors.


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## Wiseguy1982 (Nov 17, 2009)

Ok, I know this is _technically_ not really a "review" thread, but what I have to say really ties into the whole principle behind this thread.

I just finished smoking an Oliva Connecticut Reserve Robusto.

Holy crap...it was amazing. I hadn't smoked a cigar at all today, and I'm glad I chose this one.

The very first 5-7 puffs were pretty leathery.
After the first third really got going it was just a very good tobacco flavor, very rich and flavorful.
The 2nd third, this is what matters, I'm not joking but at a few points I tasted what I think was pear. Weird, but awesome!
The final 3rd went back to the leathery tobacco flavor.
All in all, this was extremely underpriced IMHO. I paid $2.75 for it, and would gladly pay it 20x.

I just figured the pear bit really tied in here...sorry. :mrgreen:


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## KetherInMalkuth (Dec 17, 2009)

I by no means have the palate of a "cigar afficianado" but I'd have to agree with LibertyToad. Based on the variety of cigars I've sampled, the predominant flavors of spice (yeah it's generic, there must be a thousand spices), pepper, leather, chocolate, "nutty", and just plain ol' tobacco are about the only ones I can specifically pick out.

I've seen people say things like "a nutty flavor, more of a hazelnut than a walnut" etc, perhaps that kind of discerning observation will become apparent to me in time, but as of yet that's well beyond my scope. On the topic, I also sometimes laugh at the focus lended toward ash, to the point that someone would give a cigar a mediocre review after describing how it has an even burn, good draw and pleasing flavor, but the ash was "ugly" or fell off too early. I guess we all have different priorities.


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## TimNRA757 (Nov 9, 2009)

In all honesty I don't think this review is too over the top. Some can be but it is in depth, it's all up to the individual with their palate .

BTW, what cigar was this?


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## Jumes (Jul 29, 2009)

I've seen valid points on both sides of this discussion. There will always be some people, the minority, who can detect more flavors in a cigar than others. The same is obviously true of food, coffee and wine. I do not have a lot of depth in my palette, but can pick up the stand outs as others have said. I buy many varieties of coffee and roast my own. I can tell the difference between the varieties and the different effects that different roast profiles have on them. I cannot pick out the flavors that the merchant describes in his tasting profiles but I do purchase some coffees based on those things, not because I can sense them, but because when he uses certain descriptors I can relate those to coffees I have enjoyed, regardless as to whether I can pick out the details or not.

I used the comparison to point out that while I may not pick out the things being described in a cigar, if I have smoked something that had a similar description and I enjoyed it, then I may decide to give it a try. 

All that said, I do roll my eyes at certain reviews. Whether they can really sense the the things they describe or not, in the end I think they diminish their target audience. I get more out of "fruity notes" than I do specifics like myrrh.


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

Jumes said:


> in the end I think they diminish their target audience. I get more out of "fruity notes" than I do specifics like myrrh.


Well put. If the point of a review is to convey to someone the experience of the cigar before they try it, using descriptors that we don't know doesn't contribute to the value of the review.

I have no idea what myrrh tastes like, and if I'd like it or not, so that doesn't help me decide if I want to try that cigar.


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## eyesack (Jul 19, 2009)

Wiseguy1982 said:


> Ok, I know this is _technically_ not really a "review" thread, but what I have to say really ties into the whole principle behind this thread.
> 
> I just finished smoking an Oliva Connecticut Reserve Robusto.
> 
> ...


Heeeey... I've got a piece of the Brooklyn Bridge for sale... lol really? 20?! I'd have you know that's more than an OpusX or ANejo... 20 bucks better be a damn fine and rare smoke!


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## Trev (Nov 4, 2009)

I guess it takes a lot of training to pick out the things some of the reviewers are describing, hence the need to educate the palate. I find the more I smoke the more I can pick out. There were some things that were already there, but not many, like vanilla, coffee/chocolate and leather. Now there are more, like cedar, earth and some fruit/sweet, which I couldn't detect as easily earlier. I appreciate that aspect much more than I did before, and now I see what the fuss is all about. I think it's true that going over the top can alienate part of the audience, but if these folks are trying to justify their expertise then I also see their point. It's a sweet job and who amoungst us wouldn't want it? Myrr? I don't know, but I'd be willing to fake it!


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## RazzBarlow (Dec 8, 2009)

My palate is still rather unsophisticated. I'm expanding my palate with each and every experience.

If your palate is sophisticated enough to pick out all of the subtler nuances, then I tip my hat to you. But...a review for the masses is not the venue to show off just how sophisticated your palate is. (The myrrh reference is a classic example) If you can taste myrrh, that's fantastic. But, realistically...how many people even know what myrrh tastes like? Is there NOTHING else in your vast experience that you can use as a reference besides a dried tree sap that is native to Yemen?

I believe a reviewer has a duty to his audience to relate his experience to something that is more common and the mass audience can identify with. That way, the reader/viewer can say to themselves "I know what that tastes like and it is something I think I might enjoy"

I think some of these reviews come across as pretentious and pompous. The reviewer is trying to show how sophisticated they are. Bully for you! But you haven't helped me make an informed decision about the product you're reviewing.

I do want something more than "Liked it/hated it", but keep it in the realm of what I can identify with.


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## 2Curious (May 30, 2009)

*Brain exercize is fun...*

To anyone who has never attempted to write a review, I can tell you it was quite intimidating and difficult the first time I tried. In the end, I decided it was "my" review, so ultimately my own view of what I could smell, to the best of my ability to describe it.

I do enjoy trying new cigars, and among friends I trust, trying to figure out or describe (on some cigars) what "that hint of something is". Sometimes it will take the whole cigar, until I can go through my mind listing things it is similar to, to find something that makes sense to me, and hopefully someone else. Then we compare. As we continue to exercize our minds and put the effort into thinking it through, it gets easier. The most amazing moment, is when you pick the name for "that something" and your friends all go, YEAH! Exactly! Like we were all stuck, on the tip of our tongue so to speak, and bam... thats it. Good description. 
In the end it's fun. And a little brain exercize every so often keeps me young.

I do remember one example recently. The Cuban shop owner gave me something to try (Montecristo 75th Anniversario - think I had the Churchill), which he also was smoking, trying out for the first time. We both worked our way through it, and almost down to the end, neither of us could pin point a certain something we could smell distinctly, but couldn't name.
Later on, it hit me... nutmeg. Pumpkin pie is what it reminded me of, which is how I got to nutmeg. Then we all ran around trying to translate nutmeg into Spanish, so we could see if the shop owner got same thing or not. Turns out it's "nuez moscada", and he did smell the same thing, or at least the closest description we both could think of.

At the end of the day, since we are all unique, and our experiences are unique to us, and our minds all exercize differently... what we taste/smell is simply the best word we could think of to describe something, at that moment and time.


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## aviator300 (Jan 10, 2009)

Im still trying to get a hold of some MYRRH to eat...is it best baked, broiled, or barbequed..


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## Rubix^3 (Nov 10, 2008)

aviator300 said:


> Im still trying to get a hold of some MYRRH to eat...is it best baked, broiled, or barbequed..


Actually I have never heard of myrrh being eaten, but it is a component in some middle-eastern perfumes, essential oils, and incense. According to the bible, it was one of the expensive perfumes presented by the wise men to Jesus at his birth. 
If you went to your local headshop, you could probably find some myrrh incense.


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## ericb13 (Jul 15, 2009)

RazzBarlow said:


> My palate is still rather unsophisticated. I'm expanding my palate with each and every experience.
> 
> If your palate is sophisticated enough to pick out all of the subtler nuances, then I tip my hat to you. But...a review for the masses is not the venue to show off just how sophisticated your palate is. (The myrrh reference is a classic example) If you can taste myrrh, that's fantastic. But, realistically...how many people even know what myrrh tastes like? Is there NOTHING else in your vast experience that you can use as a reference besides a dried tree sap that is native to Yemen?
> 
> ...


I think Razz hit it right on the head. For me, I just want to understand what I'm reading. I'll often read a review of the cigar that I'm smoking to help me identify "why" I like it, i.e. "What are these flavors?" I can't really pinpoint a lot of flavors off the cuff, but if I read someone else tasted something, then I may be able to pick it out as well. As others have said, the "taste of myrrh", doesn't help and is uninteresting to me. That said, maybe that reviewer wasn't writing to the mass public, maybe he was writing to his "Cigar Tasting Club," in that case, the description makes sense.



eNthusiast said:


> no offense, but how do you know that they're embellishing? i don't think you can quite make that judgement


I think Gary was more talking about excessive use of adjectives. That's what I thought when I read his post anyway. You may like that type of writing, but to me it's annoying and a waste of my time. That's probably a reflection of my analytical personality (vs. an artsy type) and not an indictment of the way anyway writes. There are certain people that post reviews here that I'll read because I like the way they write, and others that I'll skip because they waste words (please don't flame me, that's just a description of what *I* like and not meant as a slight on anyone).

Eric


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## 2Curious (May 30, 2009)

After re-reading this thread... I have some additional thoughts... sharin' em, like it or not. Ha.

1. How is a person supposed to "know" their target audience for a review, and "know" what their realm of understanding is?

- My vote is that a person assume I have some intelligence, and/or the ability to google a word or two (we are on the internet, no?) in case I don't already know what myrrh smells like. Heaven forbid I learn a new word or referance. 

- I definately do not think it is showing off. (Granted, I still suck at writing reviews, but I will keep trying until I get better. I also cannot pick out as much complexity in some cigars as others, yet. Key word is yet. I will continue to try.)

- I also believed Puff.com to be a place to share knowledge and learn from each other. This site is the very place I learned that exhaling cigar smoke through my nose allowed me to "smell" much more complexity that I could before. Try it, see if you find something you didn't notice before.


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## RazzBarlow (Dec 8, 2009)

2Curious said:


> - My vote is that a person assume I have some intelligence, and/or the ability to google a word or two (we are on the internet, no?) in case I don't already know what myrrh smells like. Heaven forbid I learn a new word or referance.


I can google chocolate until I'm blue in the face. It doesn't give me any taste or smell at all.

I'll be honest, when I did google "Myrrh", I did learn some things I didn't know. But I'm still not any closer to knowing what that cigar might taste like, in reference to myrrh.

Your own experience with that nutmeg/pumpkin pie flavor was reachable for me. I DO have an indication of what that smoke might have tasted like.

Writing a review is not easy, I'm very sure of that. But that doesn't change the fact that it needs to appeal to the masses. If that means it needs to be "dumbed down" a little bit, then I think that's a necessary evil.


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

c'mon razz, there is no need to dumb it down for anyone- if anyone is unfamiliar with a specific flavor/armoa, it gives them the chance to explore it, if they wish. i also disagree that one should limit themselves as to the amount of descriptors one should use- if anything, we should use more descriptors. whether or not someone wants to dumb themselves down to please the masses should be up to the individual, don't you think? instead of attacking them and calling them pretentious or pompous.

in fact, i would argue that anyone who advocates this way of thinking is doing us a great disservice. the wonderful thing about this hobby is that there _are_ so many tastes and flavors; imagine if a blender just dumbed down his blend to please the masses, citing that they'll never be able to experience more complex flavors anyway, it would get boring pretty fast, would it not?


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## ericb13 (Jul 15, 2009)

eNthusiast said:


> in fact, i would argue that anyone who advocates this way of thinking is doing us a great disservice. the wonderful thing about this hobby is that there _are_ so many tastes and flavors; imagine if a blender just dumbed down his blend to please the masses, citing that they'll never be able to experience more complex flavors anyway, it would get boring pretty fast, would it not?


Great point! You may be making me change my mind on this one...bring on the adjectives! :hug:


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

THANK YOU! i was serverly starting to get more apathetic about this subject.


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

LibertyToad said:


> Yeah, I thought it was a bit over the top, but having said that, I wish I was a better taster.
> 
> On a good day, I can taste earth, leather, spice, coffee, dark chocolate, hay, dirt, and that's about it--and that's on a good day (say 1 cigar out of 8-10). Usually I just taste tobacco and some other things I can never quite identify.
> 
> :shock:


What I wouldnt give to be able to "taste" all of the flavors that everybody else is able to taste. I am able to get quite a bit but some,,,,just can't taste it.



eNthusiast said:


> following from your quotes here, it seems as if that if someone were to taste "sour plum", that you would catagorize that as "embellishing", as a lot of other posters would. your quote that these reviews are comical seem to me that you would discredit them, thus my argument.
> *I think we all know what happens when we "assume" something that we aren't 100% sure of. If somebody says they can taste plum in a cigar that is what the definition of the term "embellishing" means. A lot of people tend to think that the word embellishment is a negative term in the description of another item and it is not. What I find comical about some terms is that they are not ordinary terms that you would find when categorizing the taste of a cigar. Surely you aren't suggesting that I can't find humor in a cigar review? I'm pretty sure that I did not discredit nor would I discredit anyones review unless they just were so negative about everything in that review. Let's not get so caught up in doing reviews that we cannot bring some humor into them or take it so seriously that we'd have to walk on eggshells when reading a review on anything put on here.*
> 
> my quote:
> ...


*You are right on point here,,,taste is completely subjective and that is the beauty of it. If a cigar that I smoke tastes like barnyard residue and another person thinks it tastes like pomegranites that were grown and raised by 21 year old virgins in the Netherlands I'd have to say a smile is going to cross my face and I'd probably even laugh but at the same time I'd be wishing that I could taste that as well. Moral of the story here is to not react so quickly to something that we might not have the whole story to. Being reactive is not something any of us should do but rather investigate what the real story is as I think the OP at the beginning was not trying to put someone down just to do a "smackdown" but rather that "some" can be pretentious in how they embellish some reviews.*


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## Ironmeden (Feb 24, 2007)

As someone who has a review site now for over 5 years, i'm not the most polished writer when it comes to reviews, but I try my best to break the cigar down. I read earlier in this conversation about 'romancing' the cigar and thats a great term. When I sit down to review a cigar I take my time with a bottle water so not to taint the cigar smoking experience. 

Most of the time cigar smokers are with other guys and don't have the attention span at that point to really pick out flavors. 

I try to break a cigar down to the initial flavors I taste when lighting up, then on to what I experienced at the 1/4 mark, 1/2, 3/4 and finish. All reviewers have their own breakdown of how they enjoy a cigar. Some will do it by 1/3's, others will give you a whole overall experience. I truly believe a cigar can change from the start to the end and put you on a ride that will keep you coming back. 

I think reviews give the reader a head start on what they may smoke or even keep them away from a cigar, but you should always try the cigar for your own experience and gather your opinion. Everyone has their own unique palate. 

Paul


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## eNthusiast (Dec 4, 2009)

i think this is a matter of semantics; to me the word _embellishment_ connotates extreme exaggeration, and some degree of falseness. i think there is a line between a relatively "accurate" description of subjective taste and that of pure sarcasm. for example, your description of pomigranates raised by 21 year old virgins i would classify as facetiousness, or sarcasm. "sour plum" however, i don't believe could be catagorized as embellishment, and indeed how could you even classify it as such, unless you would be calling the person a liar, in which case you would purport to know more about the person's individual taste more than the individual.


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## dennis569 (Jan 16, 2007)

I agree with everything said here on even numbered days.
On odd numbered days I think everyone is full of shit.
I love all the bashing, stick with it!
When I taste a particully earthy smell I will check the bottom of my shoe, then the
dictionary to check my spelling.
I get very distinctive taste and aroma when that damn cat has pissed on my Swishers.
And the "Romance of the Cigar" has always given me a woody.


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## jsnake (Oct 6, 2009)

dennis569 said:


> I agree with everything said here on even numbered days.
> On odd numbered days I think everyone is full of shit.
> I love all the bashing, stick with it!
> When I taste a particully earthy smell I will check the bottom of my shoe, then the
> ...


Oh crap man you made me spit Dr. Pepper on my laptop. It hurts from laughing. This is the best damn response to any thread I have ever read. :laugh:


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## Cigary (Oct 19, 2007)

eNthusiast said:


> i think this is a matter of semantics; to me the word _embellishment_ connotates extreme exaggeration, and some degree of falseness. i think there is a line between a relatively "accurate" description of subjective taste and that of pure sarcasm. for example, your description of pomigranates raised by 21 year old virgins i would classify as facetiousness, or sarcasm. "sour plum" however, i don't believe could be catagorized as embellishment, and indeed how could you even classify it as such, unless you would be calling the person a liar, in which case you would purport to know more about the person's individual taste more than the individual.


Take it easy,,,I put in the dictionary term for the word _embellishment_ and that is what it said. If you have an issue with the rendering of their meaning of the word I'd say take it up with them as I was using their actual wording. It isn't semantics if the definition is plainly stated.

I think for the purpose of neutrality I am going to use the "brothers" post here,,,love it.

Originally Posted by *dennis569*  
_I agree with everything said here on even numbered days.
On odd numbered days I think everyone is full of shit.
I love all the bashing, stick with it!
When I taste a particully earthy smell I will check the bottom of my shoe, then the
dictionary to check my spelling.
I get very distinctive taste and aroma when that damn cat has pissed on my Swishers.
And the "Romance of the Cigar" has always given me a woody._


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## Rubix^3 (Nov 10, 2008)

aviator300 said:


> I couldnt believe a particular review when i read it, so here is a small quote from it. (with a couple of my comments included)..
> 
> Prelight aroma consisted of sweet floral notes accompanied by fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum..
> 
> ...


So then, back to these great age old cigar forum questions. Here's where we're at in this thread so far if I'm not off track:

Cigar Reviews;
Ridiculous or Articulate? Sarcastic or Sincere? When is a review exaggerated as to be pretentious, and when is a review merely rudimentary or novice?


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## baba (Nov 5, 2007)

aviator300 said:


> I couldnt believe a particular review when i read it, so here is a small quote from it. (with a couple of my comments included)..
> 
> Prelight aroma consisted of sweet floral notes accompanied by fruit flavors reminiscent of sour plum..
> 
> ...


I disagree. If you pay attention to what you are smoking, you will pick up these flavors in cigars. It is all about noticing what you are smoking. Some cigars are distinctive for flavors like Cinnamon - ceder and spices etc.
It may seem ridiculous to you because you can not pick up these flavors - but work on it.


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## Flux (Oct 19, 2009)

dennis569 said:


> I agree with everything said here on even numbered days.
> On odd numbered days I think everyone is full of shit.
> I love all the bashing, stick with it!
> When I taste a particully earthy smell I will check the bottom of my shoe, then the
> ...


Best post yet.

If you read the back issues of CA dating some 7-8 years back, you'll notice that the descriptors used are fairly basic: leather, wood, nuts, earth, etc... If you happen to read it now it's almost like they sit with a food thesarus and try and cram some of everything into their reviews. I think the OP's point is that some of the reviews seem to be unneccesarily loaded with obscure (and not so obscure) nuances.

I'll let you know when I find that once in a lifetime stick that combines Bolivian chestnut extract with bluefin tuna liver. :happy:


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