# Dear Citizens: Don't Smoke! Do Heroine!



## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

Dear Citizens: Don't Smoke! Do Heroine! CRA News Alert! New York City Department of Health Attacks Cigar Enthusiasts (NYC Health Dep't is wants you to be safe and healthy!)

Saw this and I literally almost s**t a brick. I can't believe the nonsense that is passing nowadays. We want to spend tens of thousands of taxpayer dollars teaching people how to shoot up properly, and then many more thousands campaigning against smoking?!?!

Smoking can lead to long term health issues. Fine. We get that. Lots of things we choose to do aren't the healthiest for us (our diets, our drinking, our physical hobbies, our stress levels). Whatever.

But please, PLEASE, let me know if you know anyone that's overdosed from cigars. Anyone? Bueller?

Sorry for the rant. So angry. So very angry about the continued nonsense from the anti-tobacco lobby. I could even somewhat understand if it was fairly enforced, but where are the health department signs warning you not to eat at McDonald's? Why doesn't Taco Bell come with a Surgeon General's warning? Why don't gas stations have to post pictures of the thousands of people that die from air pollution? Why don't bars have to post pictures of f'd up livers? Where are the commercials and signs and lobbies trying to shorten the work day because of the affect of stress on the heart?

*SIGH*

We gotta be louder about our opinions on this... in my humble opinion :boxing:


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## rajuabju (Sep 14, 2008)

This is Liberalism.

Massive hysteria.... just like Global Cooling, Global Warming, Climate Changing, Aids, and everything else. Its typical over-reaction based on feelings and emotions, not intelligence.


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## Stench (Aug 17, 2009)

The Nanny State lives!


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

Heroine? As in female hero?


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## GrtndpwrflOZ (May 17, 2007)

I'm surprised smoking of anything is allowed.
As far as I know there is not one physical benefit 
Now the mental benefits may be there for most of us social cigar smokers.
But even the cigar smokers that smoke like cigarette smokers [non stop most of the day]
It is no longer a relaxation thing but an addiction thing. Addicting mentally and probably physically to an extent.
Let's here it for Throat cancer.....YEAH.

Don't get me wrong, I smoked a couple cigars and a few cigarettes last night.
I AM A SMOKER

What does smack do to you?
I am not sure.

Smoke on my brothers.

one more thing.
Why is alcohol legal?
and marijuana not?
Now THAT confuses me.


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

scottw said:


> Heroine? As in female hero?


Heh Heroin. Spell check didn't catch it because yes, Heroine is a real word.

That's for pointing it out Scott. Did great things for my spelling-ego :kicknuts:

lol jk


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## Scott W. (Jul 10, 2008)

CheapHumidors said:


> Heh Heroin. Spell check didn't catch it because yes, Heroine is a real word.
> 
> That's for pointing it out Scott. Did great things for my spelling-ego :kicknuts:
> 
> lol jk


Sorry for the kick in the sack Sam, had to point it out though. :dizzy:


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> What does smack do to you?
> I am not sure.
> 
> Smoke on my brothers.
> ...


A) I don't know the health detriments of smack or most other drugs, since I've never done them and the extent of drug education in schools is "DON'T"!!!

B) As much as I'd love to weigh in on the marijuana thing, since I represent a company brand I can't really say what I think about that lol  :gossip:


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## GrtndpwrflOZ (May 17, 2007)

CheapHumidors said:


> A) I don't know the health detriments of smack or most other drugs, since I've never done them and the extent of drug education in schools is "DON'T"!!!
> 
> B) As much as I'd love to weigh in on the marijuana thing, since I represent a company brand I can't really say what I think about that lol  :gossip:


Understood.
We'll leave it at that.
I wonder though. Of coarse everything in excess will kill you. 
And it is illegal to operate moving vehicles while under the influence or While intoxicated.

The whole "DON'T" thing I agree with in school. I do believe there should be more education also BUT that would just lead into the "should condoms be allowed in school" debate where some say it's a good thing (preventative measures) and others say "NO! It says that we as parents are tollerating "that" behavior and are saing that as long as you are doing it be safe.

I believe it is better to have preventative medicine than to be ignorant.
I am also very opinionated.

Personally I like "doing female heros"....or just females......ok just one [the wife] but I can think about the others right? hahaha


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## Nurse_Maduro (Oct 23, 2008)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> I'm surprised smoking of anything is allowed.
> As far as I know there is not one physical benefit


Then prepare to be educated by Puff's Friendly Neighborhood Nurse (™).

1. A 2001 study by Michael Houlihan showed that nicotine has a positive effect on short-term memory. It also shows that smoking shortens response time.

2. Smoking also helps maintain your weight by slowing your digestion rate (which means you feel "full" longer than a non-smoker) and supressing your appetite (This isn't even disputed any longer, as the vast majority of people who smoke gain weight after quitting).

3. Nicotine contains anxiolitic and anti-depressive properties. In short, it relaxes you and makes you feel better. In some cases, just the very act of smoking can relax you and allow you to clear your head, allowing for a short-term reduction of stress.

4. A study published in the March 6, 2007 issue of Neurology shows that smoking _lowers_ the risk for Parkinson's Disease.

5. A study in the 2002 Journal of Clinical Periodontology shows that, not only _doesn't_ smoking increase the risk of gum disease, it actually _lowers_ it.

6. In 2001, the University of Central Florida stated that they had been conducting research that showed that nicotine could be an effective treatment against tuberculosis.

7. In 2001, Columbia University showed that carbon monoxide (which is produced by smoking) can help _decrease_ your risk for heart attack or stroke by helping to dissolve clotting. Dr. David Pinsky, associate professor of medicine at Columbia, wrote: "When you give very low levels of carbon monoxide, it actually causes the blood vessels to change some of their properties so that clots dissolve more readily. During an emergency -- like a heart attack or stroke or severe infections like sepsis -- clots form rapidly in small vessels, choking off blood flow. In this case, small doses of carbon monoxide turn off the protein which inhibits clot dissolution, therefore allowing clots to dissolve where they wouldn't."

8. A study published on May 20, 1998 in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute showed that women who smoked had a 54% _lower_ risk of developing breast cancer than women who were non-smokers. Even more amazing: All the members of the study group carried a gene which has a pre-disposition (80%!!!) for causing breast cancer.

9. There are literally dozens of studies that show that smoking _reduces_ the risk of Alzheimer's Disease. CLICK ON THIS: ALZHEIMER'S DISEASE IS ASSOCIATED WITH NON-SMOKING

10. A study published in the November 14, 2000 Alimentary Pharmacology & Theraputics Journal shows that nicotine can be of theraputic benefit to people suffering from Ulcerative Colitis.

There are many more benefits to smoking (and specifically, nicotine), and the information is out there for those willing to look for it.

*Don't be a sheep!* This is NOT directed at any one individual, it is a mandate by which we all (myself included) should live, especially in our current political climate.

/end :anim_soapbox:


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> Personally I like "doing female heros"....or just females......ok just one [the wife] but I can think about the others right? hahaha


ROFL. Man, "Doing Heroines" sounds like a video name of a certain, unnamed genre lol. :tape:


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## Nurse_Maduro (Oct 23, 2008)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> But even the cigar smokers that smoke like cigarette smokers [non stop most of the day]
> It is no longer a relaxation thing but an addiction thing. Addicting mentally and probably physically to an extent.


This one I have to call you out on, good Sir.

Cigar smoking is not, as far as I've ever seen, physically addictive. Two reasons lead me to this. (God, not another list! LMAO)

1. Cigarettes contain 599 chemical additives. My cigars contain tobacco leaf and sunlight.

2. Have you ever seen a group of smokers huddled outside in the freezing cold saying "man, I really needed that cigar!!"? Didn't think so. 

I don't care what Big Tobacco says, I can not believe that nicotine is addictive in the way they say it is. It's those chemical additives that are the _real _problem. Some BotL feel that we shouldn't distance ourselves from cigarette smokers, but just look at the above studies I've posted on the health _benefits_ of nicotine, and then ask yourself why we _should_ be lumped all together?

And now, I think I've used up all of my two cents for the rest of the year!


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## gjcab09 (Jul 12, 2009)

CheapHumidors said:


> ...but where are the health department signs warning you not to eat at McDonald's? Why doesn't Taco Bell come with a Surgeon General's warning? Why don't gas stations have to post pictures of the thousands of people that die from air pollution? Why don't bars have to post pictures of f'd up livers? Where are the commercials and signs and lobbies trying to shorten the work day because of the affect of stress on the heart?
> 
> *SIGH*


Be careful what you ask for...


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

gjcab09 said:


> Be careful what you ask for...


Heh true. I meant that as an extreme example of the slippery slope... God forbid something think I'm serious and actually start doing that...


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## d_day (Aug 24, 2008)

CheapHumidors said:


> But please, PLEASE, let me know if you know anyone that's overdosed from cigars. Anyone? Bueller?


 I have. I'd wager 90% of the people posting in the forums here have as well. Ever got the shakes, the sweats, felt nasueated, vomitted? That's an overdose.

Now that that's out of the way, I think this is horrible. It's not that it's a misuse of money that makes it so bad, but that it was put in place by appointed officials, without the voting public's approval. It's a pretty clear case of "we know what's best for you" and I'm sick and tired of it. CRA will get money from me as long as I can afford to give. The more they get, the more power we have to protect our freedoms.


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## gjcab09 (Jul 12, 2009)

CheapHumidors said:


> Heh true. I meant that as an extreme example of the slippery slope... God forbid something think I'm serious and actually start doing that...


If we can hurt ourselves with it, somebody, somewhere, is trying to figure out how to outlaw it, right now.


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## d_day (Aug 24, 2008)

Nurse_Maduro said:


> This one I have to call you out on, good Sir.
> 
> Cigar smoking is not, as far as I've ever seen, physically addictive. Two reasons lead me to this. (God, not another list! LMAO)
> 
> ...


 As a cigarette smoker as well as a cigar smoker, I have to disagree. I have smoked additive free cigarettes for 10 years, and they are just as addictive as those with added chemicals. On top of that, a cigar _does_ satisfy my craving for a cigarette. On top of that, a friend who smokes 3 to 4 cigars daily (but not cigarettes) shows definite signs of physical addiction to tobacco.


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

d_day said:


> I have. I'd wager 90% of the people posting in the forums here have as well. Ever got the shakes, the sweats, felt nasueated, vomitted? That's an overdose.


Actually I haven't, but maybe it's because my nicotine tolerance is high because I smoke so much? I feel a little lightheaded sometimes if it's a strong one. You can "overdose" on water though, so perhaps that's a bad term. I don't know people who have died from smoking a really strong cigar, but maybe they have. To be more specific, when I say overdose I mean one with fatal or severe health complications.

Then again, I did once have a buddy that turned a pretty amusing shade of green when he first tried a cigar lol. Now he smokes like a chimney.


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

gjcab09 said:


> If we can hurt ourselves with it, somebody, somewhere, is trying to figure out how to outlaw it, right now.


Good! Someone really needs to do something about this paper epidemic! If I get one more damn papercut... 

Again, just kidding.


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## GrtndpwrflOZ (May 17, 2007)

Nurse_Maduro said:


> Then prepare to be educated by Puff's Friendly Neighborhood Nurse (™).
> 
> 1. A 2001 study by Michael Houlihan showed that nicotine has a positive effect on short-term memory. It also shows that smoking shortens response time.


That may be. but you can not just state the positive. If that is the case then it is a perfect drug.



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 2. Smoking also helps maintain your weight by slowing your digestion rate (which means you feel "full" longer than a non-smoker) and supressing your appetite (This isn't even disputed any longer, as the vast majority of people who smoke gain weight after quitting).


As far as I know this is just not true. Do some research and see that your body regulates 
and it is fact that smoking speeds up your metabolism. It does this because of the diminished oxygen levels being taken in. Less oxygen means your body has to work faster to get more oxygen into your lungs and to your brain. 
Do you smoke?
Becasue as many smokers will attest, as a smoker I can pretty much continue eating indefinately hahaaha. Until I have a smoke.



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 3. Nicotine contains anxiolitic and anti-depressive properties. In short, it relaxes you and makes you feel better. In some cases, just the very act of smoking can relax you and allow you to clear your head, allowing for a short-term reduction of stress.


I love this one.
And a smackhead will be calm and relax after he gets a fix
cocaine is very calming after you get a bump.
I have known people to become relaxed from cutting.
It definately makes you feel better and relaxed.

That's called addiction. Please believe me, I know all about addiction.



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 4. A study published in the March 6, 2007 issue of Neurology shows that smoking _lowers_ the risk for Parkinson's Disease..


That could be. I know nothing of this.
I did hear today that cell phones may help and even reverse...Damn I can't remember.
I believe it was something like Parkinson's or similar inflictions....Damn, I wish I could remember.



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 5. A study in the 2002 Journal of Clinical Periodontology shows that, not only _doesn't_ smoking increase the risk of gum disease, it actually _lowers_ it.


Smoke cigarettes. The cons suck but you'll have a killer mouth haha.
How?
I initial responce has to be "I have to call shenanagans".



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 6. In 2001, the University of Central Florida stated that they had been conducting research that showed that nicotine could be an effective treatment against tuberculosis.


Then why does my TB keep flaring up DAMN IT.



Nurse_Maduro said:


> 7. In 2001, Columbia University showed that carbon monoxide (which is produced by smoking) can help _decrease_ your risk for heart attack or stroke by helping to dissolve clotting. Dr. David Pinsky, associate professor of medicine at Columbia, wrote: "When you give very low levels of carbon monoxide, it actually causes the blood vessels to change some of their properties so that clots dissolve more readily. During an emergency -- like a heart attack or stroke or severe infections like sepsis -- clots form rapidly in small vessels, choking off blood flow. In this case, small doses of carbon monoxide turn off the protein which inhibits clot dissolution, therefore allowing clots to dissolve where they wouldn't."
> 
> 8. A study published on May 20, 1998 in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute showed that women who smoked had a 54% _lower_ risk of developing breast cancer than women who were non-smokers. Even more amazing: All the members of the study group carried a gene which has a pre-disposition (80%!!!) for causing breast cancer.
> 
> ...


These are great. THANK YOU
I feel much better now
I am and have been a smoker for 31 years now.....wait 26 I cut down for 5 years along time ago. I went from 2 packs a day to approx. 6 smokes a year. But that was only for about 5 years.
I am currently a smoker of cigarettes and cigars.
I smoke Camel and I like smoking.
Now I can feel good about it.

Ya know leaches cure almost everything 
Garlic keeps away vampires
and 
Marilyn Manson was Mr.Greenjeans father

Thanks for the schooling


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## d_day (Aug 24, 2008)

CheapHumidors said:


> Actually I haven't, but maybe it's because my nicotine tolerance is high because I smoke so much? I feel a little lightheaded sometimes if it's a strong one. You can "overdose" on water though, so perhaps that's a bad term. I don't know people who have died from smoking a really strong cigar, but maybe they have. To be more specific, when I say overdose I mean one with fatal or severe health complications.
> 
> Then again, I did once have a buddy that turned a pretty amusing shade of green when he first tried a cigar lol. Now he smokes like a chimney.


 Yeah, I kinda figured that's what you meant, but sometimes I have to play the pedant.


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## CheapHumidors (Aug 30, 2007)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> Garlic keeps away vampires


That's actually 100% true. I saw it in a movie once


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## Nurse_Maduro (Oct 23, 2008)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> That may be. but you can not just state the positive. If that is the case then it is a perfect drug.
> 
> As far as I know this is just not true. Do some research and see that your body regulates
> and it is fact that smoking speeds up your metabolism. It does this because of the diminished oxygen levels being taken in. Less oxygen means your body has to work faster to get more oxygen into your lungs and to your brain.
> ...


I didn't say smoking increases metabolism, I said it decreases digestion. Different things. It also slows the production of saliva. In fact, this decrease in the digestive process can increase stomach acid, which can back up into the esophagous. The decrease in saliva production can cause erosion in said esophagous (saliva contains propeties that guard against this). See? Pros and cons to everything. The fact that there is a con to the decrease in digestion does not mean there isn't a pro, however.

I smoked cigarettes for 17 years and, trust me, I am NOT a holier-than-thou ex-smoker. My girlfriend smokes, and I have NO problem with smokers. I know how addictive it is, and I know how enjoyable it can be. But instead of going off on me about it, stop and read again what I wrote. In most cases, those studies were about nicotine, not about the other additives in cigarettes. I posted sources with most examples, and most of the studies I pointed out were published in respected clinical journals.

I never said nicotine was a miraculous substance. You stated you knew of no benefits to smoking, and I simply showed otherwise. Choose to see or choose to remain blind, it's yours to own either way.

And thanks for the sarcasm, that was super-cool! :thumb:


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## Mante (Dec 25, 2009)

:focus: Similar things happen in Oz. You can walk into any one of numerous places in the city centre and get free needles to shoot up but under the by laws you better not be smoking as you walk through the door! Unbelievable. LMAO. Also the keepers of our souls have passed that many laws about tobacco packaging that the graphic warning stickers cover nearly half the front & rear of our boxes. They are friggin hard to get off too. Nothing like a nice dress box with all this sticky glue all over it. :-(


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## GrtndpwrflOZ (May 17, 2007)

Nurse_Maduro said:


> I never said nicotine was a miraculous substance. You stated you knew of no benefits to smoking, and I simply showed otherwise. Choose to see or choose to remain blind, it's yours to own either way.
> 
> And thanks for the sarcasm, that was super-cool! :thumb:


Just when I thought this was a pretty cool thread........
I stated I knew no benefits to smoking. 
Nothing about nicotine. 
Smoking....which means you are taking in carcinogens. Please show me how taking in of carcinogens is beneficial.

I'm curious why you made this statement? (Choose to see or choose to remain blind, it's yours to own either way.)


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## thesingingfrog (Nov 6, 2009)

Yeah, heard about that on Rush the other day...pretty outrageous. To my knowledge, some European countries are even further down this road -- they provide free drugs to addicts through pharmacies.

(I'm confused, though, don't heroin abusers know how to shoot up? One of my Minneapolis buddies is an ex-junkie, and he always had really tricky veins. Whenever he'd be in rehab, he'd find his veins faster than any of the phlebotomists.)


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## nativetexan_1 (Jan 1, 2008)

Nurse_Maduro said:


> Then prepare to be educated by Puff's Friendly Neighborhood Nurse (™).
> 
> 1. A 2001 study by Michael Houlihan ...
> 
> ...


Absolutely fasinating post. Thanks.


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## Nurse_Maduro (Oct 23, 2008)

GrtndpwrflOZ said:


> Just when I thought this was a pretty cool thread........
> I stated I knew no benefits to smoking.
> Nothing about nicotine.
> Smoking....which means you are taking in carcinogens. Please show me how taking in of carcinogens is beneficial.
> ...


Yeah, I thought it was a pretty cool thread too, at one time.  No sarcasm there, right?

Look, how do you take in nicotine? By smoking. You keep acting like I'm saying cigars and cigarettes are the same thing, and they're not. There_ are _carcinogens in cigarette smoke, but nicotine has never been proven as a carcinogen in any independent study. From Wikipedia (italics are mine): "The carcinogenic properties of nicotine in standalone form, separate from tobacco smoke, have not been evaluated by the IARC, and it has not been assigned to an official carcinogen group._ The currently available literature indicates that nicotine, on its own, does not promote the development of cancer in healthy tissue and has no mutagenic properties._ However, nicotine and the increased cholinergic activity it causes have been shown to impede apoptosis, which is one of the methods by which the body destroys unwanted cells (programmed cell death). Since apoptosis helps to remove mutated or damaged cells that may eventually become cancerous, the inhibitory actions of nicotine _may _create a more favourable environment for cancer to develop, _though this also remains to be proven_."

We're arguing semantics now, and it's fairly futile, imo. It all just feels like baiting at this point. I never said smoking was 100% beneficial, but I wanted to point out that it's not 100% detrimental either. Nothing is that black and white, and this is no exception.

Why did I make the above statement? Well, I regretted it after. What I really meant to say was more along the lines of "believe it, or don't; it's fine either way" but your barrage of sarcasm felt like such a personal attack, that I went on the defensive. I do regret that.

Having said that, let me say this: I truly admire your passion on the subject. Too many people are on the fence, and it's good to see someone take a stance.


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## Nitrosportman (Oct 26, 2009)

Nurse_Maduro said:


> This one I have to call you out on, good Sir.
> 
> Cigar smoking is not, as far as I've ever seen, physically addictive. Two reasons lead me to this. (God, not another list! LMAO)
> 
> ...


nicotine is a toxin and addicitive sorry science has proved that the difference as you say is the 599 other even more addicting chemicals added to the cigarette but yes nicotine is addictive

oh yeah my god this ish is fuggin reedickulous next thing you know we'll have to hang the banners around our necks while where smoking


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