# Recomendations for mild CCs



## jjjoseph (Sep 10, 2011)

This may have been discussed but I'm looking to start making some purchases, hopefully 5-10 packs if they are sold like that, to get a better feel for the CCs that are out there. I'm not a fan at all for strong cigars that make you like headed / nauseous, especially since the majority of my smoking time is during working hours. The only CC I've smoked so far within the last few years was a Partagas Corona Junior which was great. I received a couple recommendations from andrprosh (not sure if hes a member here) to check out Rafael Gonzales perlas and Upmann half coronas. Just looking to see what other recommendations you all have.


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## avitti (Jun 4, 2011)

Havana cigars mostly tend to not be 'in your face' strong. Hoyo de Monterrey ,La Gloria Cubano may be the most mild marcas. Bolivar and Partagas are the strongest profile and most everything else in somewhere in between.


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## UBC03 (Nov 18, 2015)

avitti said:


> Havana cigars mostly tend to not be 'in your face' strong. Hoyo de Monterrey ,La Gloria Cubano may be the most mild marcas. Bolivar and Partagas are the strongest profile and most everything else in somewhere in between.


 @avitti @bpegler @curmudgeonista and a few other members are the guys I listen to when it comes to the ISOM. I'm a full flavor - full strength guy. So I'm not much help. The Montes I've tried , 2 & 4, seemed medium at best. My usual short filler , cheap add ons are also med-full at best. JLPS & Quints. You can get a box/bundle for the price of an nc 5er. So they're also worth an add on when you order your HDMs. Plus it won't break your heart if you gotta toss em.

Be afraid. It's the slickest slope of em all. Trust me I've slid down em all.

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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

I find that CC's run in a narrower range than NC's, both strength-wise and in flavor profile. To me, what the Cubans typically consider "light" is nowhere near as mild as many NC's. Same is true on the other end of the scale too, so @*avitti* is spot-on in that respect. But, IMO most CC's would fall in the Medium or Med-Full scale as applied to NC's.

Here's HSA's own assessment....

Flavours | Habanos s.a - Sitio Oficial

Can't say I agree with them in all cases, though. Most notably, Rafael Gonzalez and Quay D'Orsay are listed as "light" while I'm inclined to think solid "medium" on both. Most others I do agree with, though one could argue that H. Upmann is more on the Medium or even Med-Full side than Light-Med; and a few other such subtle differences. Then again, are they using a scale comparable to the wider range required of NC's? Very subjective, any way you look at it.

Fonseca is probably your best bet for the mildest CC experience. As for others that will suit you, I guess it all depends on just what you define as mild.


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

If you really want mild, Quay D'Orsay Coronas are where it's at. On the mild side, but still with plenty of complex flavor. Fonseca are like smoking air. 

If you just mean mild compared to the big dark maduros of the NC world, most of the Cuban marcas will work for you. Maybe check out Juan Lopez, the No 1 is excellent and very affordable.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Rather than go through all the Marcas and vitolas with you.
I'll make it easy.

Full Flavored
Cohiba
Partagas
Vegas Robaina
Monticristo
Bolivar
Some Romeo y Julieta example Casadores.
They newer releases of VEGUEROS they are also budget priced.
And even these are not that stomach turning non Cuban oh lord i am gonna puke nic hit cigars.
As has already been said, Any other marca pales these by comparison in turns of strength.


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## Joe Sticks (May 31, 2016)

You might try a RyJ Short Churchill


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## jjjoseph (Sep 10, 2011)

Thanks for all the recommendations. Looks like I've got plenty of shopping to do  That last opusx hit me pretty hard and I just want to make sure I don't go through that again lol


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## Engineer99 (Aug 4, 2011)

+1 on the Quai d'orsay...RG perlas/PC and Sancho Panza fall into the mild/medium camp for me.


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## WABOOM (Oct 15, 2015)

Can someone tell me how strong a Bolivar (habana) is compared to an Oliva V ? Just as a point of reference.


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## poppajon75 (Apr 10, 2016)

WABOOM said:


> Can someone tell me how strong a Bolivar (habana) is compared to an Oliva V ? Just as a point of reference.


I've only had one Bolivar but, several V's and, with my limited experience I think the V is stronger. I found it to be a bit more hearty. Both were great to me but, the V in the strength dept for me.

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## poppajon75 (Apr 10, 2016)

poppajon75 said:


> I've only had one Bolivar but, several V's and, with my limited experience I think the V is stronger. I found it to be a bit more hearty. Both were great to me but, the V in the strength dept for me. A side note: I had the Boli on an empty stomach with coffee first thing in the morning.
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## StogieNinja (Jul 29, 2009)

jjjoseph said:


> Thanks for all the recommendations. Looks like I've got plenty of shopping to do  That last opusx hit me pretty hard and I just want to make sure I don't go through that again lol


Have you tried drinking root beer or coke while smoking? The sugar will help counteract the nicotine kick.



WABOOM said:


> Can someone tell me how strong a Bolivar (habana) is compared to an Oliva V ? Just as a point of reference.


If you had a 1-10 scale, Oliva V ranks about a 8.5, I would say the BFF is about a 7; it is one of the fuller-bodied Cubans in terms of flavor strength. The BBF has a slightly more well-rounded profile, where the Oliva V has that strong ligero punchiness to it.


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

@*jjjoseph* - Didn't cross my mind before, but the Montecristo Open series is supposedly designed to be mild. I never really think of those and have never tried one b/c of the poor reviews when they were first released. But, they seem to be getting better reviews lately. Were likely rushed to market when launched and now settled into the groove. Also worth noting that those early reviews were likely mostly by veteran CC lovers who don't typically gravitate toward lighter cigars.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

WABOOM said:


> Can someone tell me how strong a Bolivar (habana) is compared to an Oliva V ? Just as a point of reference.


Like apples and oranges. And that goes for any Cuban vs Non Cuban strength comparison. Cuban tobacco has no nicotine compared to the non Cuban cigars. Non Cuban smokers compare strength by the nic hit stomach turning sensation. Very rarely do i run across a Cuban that will flip my stomach. The few that come to mind are the RYJ Cazadores when fresh. And some of the custom rolls. Cubans are measured in Full Medium and Light bodied. Think of it as comparing wines the best California vintage. While in its own right a fine wine. Could never stand the body and character of a fine European wine. Although i will say this non Cubans are getting better. My curiosity every once in a while gets the best of me. So i grab one that is real hot at the moment at the cigar lounge. I have come across a few that really made me turn my head. Who knows if it keeps up maybe in another 100 years non Cubans can shine the shoes of Cuban cigars. Sorry you mentioned non Cubans in the Habanos section and i just couldn't help myself. That's sorta like ordering French Fries in a French restaurant.:vs_laugh:


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

curmudgeonista said:


> @*jjjoseph* - Didn't cross my mind before, but the Montecristo Open series is supposedly designed to be mild. I never really think of those and have never tried one b/c of the poor reviews when they were first released. But, they seem to be getting better reviews lately. Were likely rushed to market when launched and now settled into the groove. Also worth noting that those early reviews were likely mostly by veteran CC lovers who don't typically gravitate toward lighter cigars.


Now that you mention it i have found the opens to lean more toward a light almost medium body. Not a bad cigar sadly they lack the signature montie spice. I can't help but think that's why they get all the bad press. That being said there are better and worse cigars for the money.
:vs_cool:


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> Now that you mention it i have found the opens to lean more toward a light almost medium body. Not a bad cigar sadly they lack the signature montie spice. I can't help but think that's why they get all the bad press. That being said there are better and worse cigars for the money.
> :vs_cool:


Good info. I noticed the Regata you posted in "smoked". Wanted to ask you how it was.

And @*avitti* mentioned the Open Juniors favorably on another forum. I figure if you two guys like 'em it's about time I gave them a shot.


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

curmudgeonista said:


> Good info. I noticed the Regata you posted in "smoked". Wanted to ask you how it was.
> 
> And @*avitti* mentioned the Open Juniors favorably on another forum. I figure if you two guys like 'em it's about time I gave them a shot.


If you expecting a petite #2 in terms of flavor you will be very disappointed. Try this i have been doing this a lot lately an old timer at the lounge suggested it. Take the band off put it down go do a few things come back in an hour or two. Smoke it without thinking of what its supposed to be like. This has helped me fairly evaluate many a cigar. The only cigars it has never worked on for me. Is that damn Cohiba Maduro AKA Manuro line. Putting a Cohiba band on those is like putting a silk tie on a pig.:vs_cool:


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## Bird-Dog (Oct 16, 2009)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> If you expecting a petite #2 in terms of flavor you will be very disappointed. Try this i have been doing this a lot lately an old timer at the lounge suggested it. Take the band off put it down go do a few things come back in an hour or two. Smoke it without thinking of what its supposed to be like. This has helped me fairly evaluate many a cigar. The only cigars it has never worked on for me. Is that damn Cohiba Maduro AKA Manuro line. Putting a Cohiba band on those is like putting a silk tie on a pig.:vs_cool:


Ha! I thought you were about to tell me to swap bands and see if a dog-rocket can turn to gold with a better band on it. Obviously not! Not even a Cohiba band. :vs_laugh:


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## Champagne InHand (Sep 14, 2015)

curmudgeonista said:


> Ha! I thought you were about to tell me to swap bands and see if a dog-rocket can turn to gold with a better band on it. Obviously not! Not even a Cohiba band. :vs_laugh:


I don't know. Give the Maduro line 5 years in the humidor before running off to judgement. They certainly will not be similar to other Maduro cigars or regular cohibas, but I doubt they will be total dog rockets. I think habanos SA is smarter than that. With so many marques rushing to the anejado fad, it just may be that they are very different from classic CCs.

I have 2 boxes and will let them sit in the tupperdor, but with the boxes cracked open. I hate coated boxes by any cigar maker, Fuentes included.

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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Champagne InHand said:


> I don't know. Give the Maduro line 5 years in the humidor before running off to judgement. They certainly will not be similar to other Maduro cigars or regular cohibas, but I doubt they will be total dog rockets. I think habanos SA is smarter than that. With so many marques rushing to the anejado fad, it just may be that they are very different from classic CCs.
> 
> I have 2 boxes and will let them sit in the tupperdor, but with the boxes cracked open. I hate coated boxes by any cigar maker, Fuentes included.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I beg to differ i had a box of Genios years back when they first where released. Those suckers sat for 7 almost 8 years. They sucked just as bad only now they where flat. The morrow to the story i guess. You can't polish a turd.:vs_laugh:


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## Champagne InHand (Sep 14, 2015)

TonyBrooklyn said:


> I beg to differ i had a box of Genios years back when they first where released. Those suckers sat for 7 almost 8 years. They sucked just as bad only now they where flat. The morrow to the story i guess. You can't polish a turd.:vs_laugh:


Fair enough, but I have known several people who have had boxes of Parti shorts that sucked or Mille Fleurs that were crap. RyJs that were sub standard. Tobacco leaves vary from year to year as they are a crop. As with wine you are bound to have bad years/poor vintages, yet the product is still produced. One box doesn't give a full representation of an entire line up from Cuba's tobacco flagship. At least the one that Cuban tobacco is best known for.

I love Partagas yet have had some almost unsmokable Mille Fleurs. I still chose Partagas and Bolivar as my choice marques in Habanos. In wine I have had a totally awful 1986 Chateau Margaux, but I certainly would not pass up a chance to buy a 1996, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2009-2010 bottle if I could afford it.

Besides people have very different palates. I like to look at FOH when it comes to each years batches of CCs as they rate the top 25 that were imported and it changes regularly. For example in boxes marked with a 2014 date stamp, not one Montecristo made it into the top 25, which was very rare. This just goes to show that with agricultural products, there is a ton of variation.

I don't mean to cut your one box judgement down by any means, but I take it as that one box wasn't up to the billing. I would be quite hesitant to rule all bad based on one box. Provenance, etc.

In the end I may agree with you, but I will have to work my way through the 2 boxes of 10 before I can make any judgements. 
Generally I think Cohiba are massively overrated, but that's a general statement as my best two cigars from Cuba, one was a Cohiba Presidente, back in the mid 1990s, while the other was a Bolivar sublime vitola. I have also had many RyJs that sucked but also an absolutely wonderful Churchill, many years ago. Still I have been quite shy about buying RyJ.

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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Champagne InHand said:


> Fair enough, but I have known several people who have had boxes of Parti shorts that sucked or Mille Fleurs that were crap. RyJs that were sub standard. Tobacco leaves vary from year to year as they are a crop. As with wine you are bound to have bad years/poor vintages, yet the product is still produced. One box doesn't give a full representation of an entire line up from Cuba's tobacco flagship. At least the one that Cuban tobacco is best known for.
> 
> I love Partagas yet have had some almost unsmokable Mille Fleurs. I still chose Partagas and Bolivar as my choice marques in Habanos. In wine I have had a totally awful 1986 Chateau Margaux, but I certainly would not pass up a chance to buy a 1996, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2009-2010 bottle if I could afford it.
> 
> ...


It was not a one box judgement! If i represented it as such i apologize for my improper representation. I took for granted that you knew the long history between myself and the Manuro 5 line. That's how they earned that name its a free standing joke Manuro as in Manure get it:vs_laugh: I have had many boxes over the years, all a disappointment. I singled in on the first box because i held on to those the longest. As for Cohiba's they are the best of the best IMHO never had a bad stick or box. This whole Manuro line is a bunch of BullSh*t IMHO and in the opinion of many FOG'S. Obviously there is a market for them or they would have stopped making them. I am glad that someone enjoy's them. The 90's where very hit or miss most of the cigars from that era where tent pegs with flameproof wrappers. Still every once in a great while there was a Marca or Vitola that would shine.
Peace my Brother!:vs_cool:


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## Champagne InHand (Sep 14, 2015)

Gotcha Tony. Bummer. I wish I had bought regular robusto. Still they have only been sitting a year. Maybe I will smoke them up. Can't be much worse than some AJF that have constriction problems then went flat before the one year mark. I won't buy AJF for this reason and their insanely big cigar bands. 

I guess I have that same kind of animosity towards the several AJF boxes that you have towards the Manuro life. 

Were they all crap or one vitola? I think mine are the mid sized. I have them in the cellar in an all Cuban tupperdor. 

Thank you for the clarification. I totally agree on 90s era habanos. A few decent sticks but a ton of crap sticks. Maybe I will have to give RyJ another try. 


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## TonyBrooklyn (Jan 28, 2010)

Champagne InHand said:


> Gotcha Tony. Bummer. I wish I had bought regular robusto. Still they have only been sitting a year. Maybe I will smoke them up. Can't be much worse than some AJF that have constriction problems then went flat before the one year mark. I won't buy AJF for this reason and their insanely big cigar bands.
> 
> I guess I have that same kind of animosity towards the several AJF boxes that you have towards the Manuro life.
> 
> ...


I tried all three releases Genios Magicos Secretos if memory serves me correct. I recall the smallest ones being the best of the lot the secretos. You see the problem is that IMHO they are more N.C than Cuban. When i purchased them i was expecting a very rich tasting Cuban Cohiba nothing could be further from the truth. I guess for those that smoke mostly N.C or never had a Cuban. Without a Cuban Cohiba as a reference point ,to for lack of a better term taint their impressions they are smokable. :vs_cool:


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## avitti (Jun 4, 2011)

Cohiba Maduro line. Might sound a bit strange but its like smoking a non-Havana/Havana Cigar.
The Genios has some deep rich flavors but the tobacco has zero characteristics with the rest of the Havana portfolio. Time has not been generous in evolving this line. For those who smoke Havanas and non-Havana cigars i can see where you may think these maduros will shine one day. After nearly a decade i laugh when i see them in my humidor and tell them to go hide somewhere when they raise their hand and say smoke me today.
Taste is subjective and to each their own -with the hefty Cohiba price tag attached,the maduros aren't worth the purchase...at least not for me


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## Champagne InHand (Sep 14, 2015)

Okay. I see where you guys are coming from.

I drink many kinds of wines, and Burgundy is probably the one area with the heftiest price tags as well as very distinct terroir, a term that is inclusive of the soils below, the way the vineyards face the sun, the way the winds blow, the slope, and even the microbes. It's all in a few hundred kms of an specific area but one vineyard across a highway can cost 10x what the next vineyard costs, no matter the producer or wine maker.

Serious burghounds to pretty much novices can taste the better terroir in the glass, when compared blind.

I guess if all you do is smoke habanos, then I can see how you might very much not like the trend, but it would probably extend to the newer anejado marketing, which is really what this is.

The Maduro line was to try to retain Cuban only smokers from drifting towards Nicaragua.

I have many friends in Europe and Asia that can't understand the Cuban obsession, as the greatly prefer Nica cigars. Especially the Chinese. I think much of that is more a rejection of communism and less about a palate, but that's another story. China is massively brand conscious.

Anyhow, I smoke all sorts of cigars and really only like maduro cigars in cold weather and agree that the process takes out the subtle flavors that make a distinct area based cigar.

I pulled a Maduro Cohiba just to see what I thought this morning. 









Given that I smoke cigars from all over and that I really enjoy Caldwell's and RoMa craft almost as much as a good Habano, I don't hate it. It's certainly different than other NC maduro cigars. Much more soft. Surely it's not that distinct tobacco used in specific vitolas of different marques, but I can see why Habanos SA built up the line. They are much more elegant than the many in your face Maduro sticks. DE Liga Privada, Camacho and LFD all come to mind. They use ligero a ton and are much more bold and in your face.

These Cohiba really were not that much more than the higher priced Maduro cigars of Illusione, Drew Estates, especially LP and specialty LFD from the DR. I think the Cohiba are
Much more of a graceful smoke.

But like Burghounds or Pinuts as some Pinot only red wine drinkers are, I can see why you would disapprove.

As I said before, I am a Partagas and Bolivar guy. If I could only smoke one Cuban it would be the Bolivar Libertador or the Lusitania from Partagas.

I really haven't found the only Nica or Dominican that I would choose. I do like Nicas that rely on a lot of binder/filler from the Jalapa Valley. Perhaps it would be an Illusione Epernay in the Le Monde size or the smaller Le Ferme. Probably the closest Nica cigars to any Habano.

I guess this shows why Puff is so fun. Different reactions, palates and opinions with polite discourse and explanations to boot.

I'm headed to Nicaragua in late January, so maybe my choice will chance but I have Cuba on the list of countries and cigar areas to visit as well.

Salud!

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## crash-wizard (Sep 14, 2013)

Maybe I will have to give RyJ another try. 

I haven't tried many CC's, but had the opportunity to enjoy a RyJ Churchill. I savored it until my fingertips were burning, then stuck a toothpick into it and enjoyed it some more.

I think you should, IMHO.


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